B&C 21ds115 Horn recommendation - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 01:53 PM - Thread Starter
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B&C 21ds115 Horn recommendation

Evening lovely people
got myself a B&C 21ds115 and wondering which enclosure is most suitable for it, was checking the G-horn, HZ horn as tapped horns, and the submaximus as a Front loaded Horn. but since all these enclosures were designed for completely different drivers i'm not sure if they're the best pick for this B&C.
I'm trying to avoid designing and folding a horn..
what advantages to Tapped horns have over front loaded besides the smaller size? and can you guys recommend me the best enclosures that i can use?
Size is NOT an issue.
Build simplicity is always preferred,but again NOT an issue.
would like to be flat down to 15-16 hz if possible.
already have 6 FLH with an f3 of 16 hz in my 2000 cubic foot room and hoping to place this horn nearfield.
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post #2 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zallou3 View Post
Evening lovely people

got myself a B&C 21ds115 and wondering which enclosure is most suitable for it, was checking the G-horn, HZ horn as tapped horns, and the submaximus as a Front loaded Horn. but since all these enclosures were designed for completely different drivers i'm not sure if they're the best pick for this B&C.

I'm trying to avoid designing and folding a horn..

what advantages to Tapped horns have over front loaded besides the smaller size? and can you guys recommend me the best enclosures that i can use?

Size is NOT an issue.

Build simplicity is always preferred,but again NOT an issue.

would like to be flat down to 15-16 hz if possible.

already have 6 FLH with an f3 of 16 hz in my 2000 cubic foot room and hoping to place this horn nearfield.
I actually have 4 submaximus v3s with bc21ds115s in them and the output is jaw dropping and I haven't even came close to tapping in to there full potential. Also the quality of the distortion less bass is great

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post #3 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zallou3 View Post
Evening lovely people
got myself a B&C 21ds115 and wondering which enclosure is most suitable for it, was checking the G-horn, HZ horn as tapped horns, and the submaximus as a Front loaded Horn. but since all these enclosures were designed for completely different drivers i'm not sure if they're the best pick for this B&C.
I'm trying to avoid designing and folding a horn..
what advantages to Tapped horns have over front loaded besides the smaller size? and can you guys recommend me the best enclosures that i can use?
Size is NOT an issue.
Build simplicity is always preferred,but again NOT an issue.
would like to be flat down to 15-16 hz if possible.
already have 6 FLH with an f3 of 16 hz in my 2000 cubic foot room and hoping to place this horn nearfield.
skram

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post #4 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:15 PM
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I also believe a few guys used them in the skhorn even though it was designed for the ipal

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post #5 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:17 PM
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Yeah, honestly I'd make something a bit larger so you don't have to drop down to a single port to get a low tune, but keep similar design.
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post #6 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:26 PM
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B&C 21ds115 Horn recommendation

Wow. Your really going for it! Nearfield 21” horn.
I would say lately, the devastator lfe is being designed and works great with the B&C woofer. I’ve also heard them in 4 V3’s, and 4 slot ported 20cf cabs. Those setups are insane. In a good way that I am in love with. Any of the above options will beat you literally to death nearfield.

Funny story, I was demoing Jeremy’s V3’s, and he had John Wick on, I thought the gun fight was over, stuck my head into the mouth area of the V3’s, and another shot was fired. I pooped my pants and jumped a mile high. Lol those drivers are very impressive. @hd0823
Edit: I see you beat me to this thread.
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post #7 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post
Yeah, honestly I'd make something a bit larger so you don't have to drop down to a single port to get a low tune, but keep similar design.

Would that be the LFE version of the Devastator?

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-d...l#post58074988
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post #8 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Jk7.2 View Post
Wow. Your really going for it! Nearfield 21” horn.
I would say lately, the devastator lfe is being designed and works great with the B&C woofer. I’ve also heard them in 4 V3’s, and 4 slot ported 20cf cabs. Those setups are insane. In a good way that I am in love with. Any of the above options will beat you literally to death nearfield.

Funny story, I was demoing Jeremy’s V3’s, and he had John Wick on, I thought the gun fight was over, stuck my head into the mouth area of the V3’s, and another shot was fired. I pooped my pants and jumped a mile high. Lol those drivers are very impressive. @hd0823
Edit: I see you beat me to this thread.
That was it, couldn't remember. I knew there was another one after the skram.


https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-d...l#post58074988
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post #9 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:33 PM
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If space is an issue you can probably also get away without front loading and just put it in a ported enclosure. The efficiency up top with these is crazy. Just re-read your post and you said size wasn't an issue, but if you want to go simple, just toss it in a ported box tuned where you want.

I just setup 4 of the 21ds115s in a room recently, came out awesome.. https://imgur.com/Bn5zAzY
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post #10 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 02:38 PM
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The kinks are worked out of the Devastator LFE, I am planning on building one in the not too distant future. A 21DS115 just ported is an impressive subwoofer. Just the single driver in 11cuft 18Hz tune makes me worry about my projector, the room is 6000cuft. There really is not a way to screw up, anything you choose will be awesome!

Edit: I would look for something with a lower tune, at least 20Hz, lower would be ideal.
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Stormbreaker a B&C 21DS115 Subwoofer Solution | Wisconsin Home Theater Meet Thread
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.1.4 | Yamaha A3070 | Crown XLS 1502 | iNuke 3000 DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Sub 21" Stormbreaker | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen
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post #11 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 03:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by hd0823 View Post
I actually have 4 submaximus v3s with bc21ds115s in them and the output is jaw dropping and I haven't even came close to tapping in to there full potential. Also the quality of the distortion less bass is great

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Awesome! thank you for the feedback
will post some comparisons between the submaximus and some other designs and see who's king
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post #12 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 03:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, honestly I'd make something a bit larger so you don't have to drop down to a single port to get a low tune, but keep similar design.
so basically the devastator LFE is an improved version of the Skram?
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so basically the devastator LFE is an improved version of the Skram?
not better, just different. It's tuned lower
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post #14 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Wow. Your really going for it! Nearfield 21” horn.
I would say lately, the devastator lfe is being designed and works great with the B&C woofer. I’ve also heard them in 4 V3’s, and 4 slot ported 20cf cabs. Those setups are insane. In a good way that I am in love with. Any of the above options will beat you literally to death nearfield.

Funny story, I was demoing Jeremy’s V3’s, and he had John Wick on, I thought the gun fight was over, stuck my head into the mouth area of the V3’s, and another shot was fired. I pooped my pants and jumped a mile high. Lol those drivers are very impressive. @hd0823
Edit: I see you beat me to this thread.
Awesome story! Going to Get John wick and try that scene.
i Simulated both submaximus and the devastastor LFE ,will attach the screenshot
what's your preferance between them two?
Black line submaximus, Light grey Devastator
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post #15 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 03:46 PM - Thread Starter
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The kinks are worked out of the Devastator LFE, I am planning on building one in the not too distant future. A 21DS115 just ported is an impressive subwoofer. Just the single driver in 11cuft 18Hz tune makes me worry about my projector, the room is 6000cuft. There really is not a way to screw up, anything you choose will be awesome!

Edit: I would look for something with a lower tune, at least 20Hz, lower would be ideal.
are you familiar with any design tuned lower that 20hz?? and thank you for chiming in!
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The Devastator was a horn John designed after I asked a few questions on a similar design for a PA460. It is a little larger than a full Marty which offered flexibility in most spaces. Tune is 18.8Hz on that sub. www.gsgad.com should have the flat pack out soon for it if reduced work is of interest.

The LFE added volume on the rear chamber just to push up the left corner. Tune is 19.1Hz calculated. The external volume is 29.75ft3, so less than a big horn and two can usually fit side by side under an AT screen. Both have good useable bandwidth
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Stormbreaker a B&C 21DS115 Subwoofer Solution | Wisconsin Home Theater Meet Thread
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.1.4 | Yamaha A3070 | Crown XLS 1502 | iNuke 3000 DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Sub 21" Stormbreaker | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen
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post #17 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Zallou3 View Post
are you familiar with any design tuned lower that 20hz?? and thank you for chiming in!
An LFE can easily be tuned lower if desired The v1 has a lower port velocity than the LFE. Plugging a port will put you close to 15Hz on the v1. The LFE will chuff more if you do that, again tune is down 3.5 to 2.5 Hz if memory serves me.

Edit: Flared horns as discussed in another thread will start getting a resonance in a part of the pass band you might want to use once they get tuned low. Sub Max v3 is the one you will probably be the most interested in. I haven't played with the LOWARHORN in Hornresp yet, there is a 23Hz 21DS115 horn you can look up.

Stormbreaker a B&C 21DS115 Subwoofer Solution | Wisconsin Home Theater Meet Thread
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.1.4 | Yamaha A3070 | Crown XLS 1502 | iNuke 3000 DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Sub 21" Stormbreaker | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen

Last edited by Red Five; 05-23-2019 at 04:03 PM.
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post #18 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Zallou3 View Post
Awesome story! Going to Get John wick and try that scene.

i Simulated both submaximus and the devastastor LFE ,will attach the screenshot

what's your preferance between them two?

Black line submaximus, Light grey Devastator
Click on Le on the input window until it is red for a 21DS115. It is a little bit more accurate. Check the first post of the Devastator thread, John had the inputs of the sub very locked in. Also, he has overlays of measurements vs his sim.

Stormbreaker a B&C 21DS115 Subwoofer Solution | Wisconsin Home Theater Meet Thread
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.1.4 | Yamaha A3070 | Crown XLS 1502 | iNuke 3000 DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Sub 21" Stormbreaker | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen

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post #19 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 04:11 PM - Thread Starter
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An LFE can easily be tuned lower if desired The v1 has a lower port velocity than the LFE. Plugging a port will put you close to 15Hz on the v1. The LFE will chuff more if you do that, again tune is down 3.5 to 2.5 Hz if memory serves me.

Edit: Flared horns as discussed in another thread will start getting a resonance in a part of the pass band you might want to use once they get tuned low. Sub Max v3 is the one you will probably be the most interested in. I haven't played with the LOWARHORN in Hornresp yet, there is a 23Hz 21DS115 horn you can look up.
greatly helpful thank you, i am pretty interested in submaximus and the simulations in hornresp and outperforming other subs, using one nearfield should be pretty amazing
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greatly helpful thank you, i am pretty interested in submaximus and the simulations in hornresp and outperforming other subs, using one nearfield should be pretty amazing
Devastator end tables have crossed my mind on an occasion.
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Stormbreaker a B&C 21DS115 Subwoofer Solution | Wisconsin Home Theater Meet Thread
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.1.4 | Yamaha A3070 | Crown XLS 1502 | iNuke 3000 DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Sub 21" Stormbreaker | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen
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post #21 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 04:53 PM
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greatly helpful thank you, i am pretty interested in submaximus and the simulations in hornresp and outperforming other subs, using one nearfield should be pretty amazing
One nearfield would be very intense to say the least.my four sit about 12ft from the front row. I'll be following to see what you decide you'll be the only other person I believe with a submaximus v3 with a 21

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post #22 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 07:00 PM
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One nearfield would be very intense to say the least.my four sit about 12ft from the front row. I'll be following to see what you decide you'll be the only other person I believe with a submaximus v3 with a 21

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I think he should come to our gtg and experience your setup. Sitting in front of the V3’s mouth is unbearable. Nearfield would be hard to take for an entire movie, even at low levels.
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What are the external dimensions of the submaximus? When loaded with a driver, any idea what it weighs? And what kind of power do you need to throw at it to have fun?
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What are the external dimensions of the submaximus? When loaded with a driver, any idea what it weighs? And what kind of power do you need to throw at it to have fun?


They are huge. Here’s me with one of Jeremy’s
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What are the external dimensions of the submaximus? When loaded with a driver, any idea what it weighs? And what kind of power do you need to throw at it to have fun?
There 36 deep 25.5 wide and 80 tall guessing weight is around 300 lbs. 5 sheets of wood plus driver each.

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I think he should come to our gtg and experience your setup. Sitting in front of the V3’s mouth is unbearable. Nearfield would be hard to take for an entire movie, even at low levels.
Yeah it would be to intense for most people

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post #27 of 36 Old 05-23-2019, 08:14 PM
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There 36 deep 25.5 wide and 80 tall guessing weight is around 300 lbs. 5 sheets of wood plus driver each.

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Ok. I knew they were huge, but just curious whether or not they fit through doorways or if they have to be assembled it place.



What kind of power for a single submaximus?
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post #28 of 36 Old 05-24-2019, 12:47 AM - Thread Starter
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One nearfield would be very intense to say the least.my four sit about 12ft from the front row. I'll be following to see what you decide you'll be the only other person I believe with a submaximus v3 with a 21

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Do you have any measurements for the four in your room? are you peaking 130 db at 20 hz? how big is your room btw?
My room is made of concrete and the tactile response isn't as huge as i like it to be, my horns peak at 130 db at some places but doesn't do it below 30hz,
the submaximus nearfield should increase the tactile response and give me a significant SPL boost, it's either nearfield or 2.5 meters in front of me
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post #29 of 36 Old 05-24-2019, 12:48 AM - Thread Starter
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There 36 deep 25.5 wide and 80 tall guessing weight is around 300 lbs. 5 sheets of wood plus driver each.

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was checking the submaximus thread and john said it's doable with 4 sheets of wood, or is it not?
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post #30 of 36 Old 05-24-2019, 01:59 AM
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Do you have any measurements for the four in your room? are you peaking 130 db at 20 hz? how big is your room btw?

My room is made of concrete and the tactile response isn't as huge as i like it to be, my horns peak at 130 db at some places but doesn't do it below 30hz,

the submaximus nearfield should increase the tactile response and give me a significant SPL boost, it's either nearfield or 2.5 meters in front of me
No I'll have to get some but I'm guessing its gotta be right there or higher. My rooms rather large. Counting the area behind the baffle wall its 32x18x10

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