Ultimate 12” or alpine type r with dual passive radiators? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 13 Old 07-03-2019, 11:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi all. Saw these on parts express today and am thinking of doing something different and doing a passive radiator build. Power would be around 600 rms for my tv room. Nothing hardcore; I have a dedicated theater room. How would something like this model up and would it be worth it to give it a try. I’m looking for really small size which would be around a 14” cube or maybe a 14x14x 16 sized shape. Trying to keep it as small as possible while still getting good performance. Thoughts or suggestions?

Here’s the passive radiators:
https://www.parts-express.com/define...ator--299-4054

Low cost and 20mm of excursion

May even go to a 10” woofer or a pair of 8’s to keep the box even smaller. Something with a ton of throw... need a small box to have the wife allow it in the family room.
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post #2 of 13 Old 07-04-2019, 04:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rr14 View Post
Hi all. Saw these on parts express today and am thinking of doing something different and doing a passive radiator build. Power would be around 600 rms for my tv room. Nothing hardcore; I have a dedicated theater room. How would something like this model up and would it be worth it to give it a try. I’m looking for really small size which would be around a 14” cube or maybe a 14x14x 16 sized shape. Trying to keep it as small as possible while still getting good performance. Thoughts or suggestions?

Here’s the passive radiators:
https://www.parts-express.com/define...ator--299-4054

Low cost and 20mm of excursion

May even go to a 10” woofer or a pair of 8’s to keep the box even smaller. Something with a ton of throw... need a small box to have the wife allow it in the family room.
Creative Sound Soluions SDX12.

https://www.css-audio.com/online-sto...fer-p110031759

Much pounding in little box. They have passive radiator kits with this too.
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post #3 of 13 Old 07-04-2019, 05:50 AM
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Passive radiators only replace the port in a ported box. You won't be changing much in box size for considerable increase in price.


Keep in mind in order to properly tune the box you have to model using the T/S of the PR's and add weight till you get to the tuning you want.
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post #4 of 13 Old 07-04-2019, 06:04 PM - Thread Starter
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[/quote]
Creative Sound Soluions SDX12.

https://www.css-audio.com/online-sto...fer-p110031759

I really like that kit but I wish they had a version in the 1.2 cu ft model. This one is 2 cu ft. I’m willing to give up some performance for size in this application.

They have some open box passives for $45 and have 29mm of Xmax. I’ll keep those in mind.
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post #5 of 13 Old 07-04-2019, 07:53 PM
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I like PR's for a low tune in a small box. If you want a port that's big enough to not have compression and chuffing be a big deal, many times a PR will make for a significantly smaller enclosure. Tangband 1139 is a good example of a driver (albeit 6-1/2") that wants a tiny box and a low tune, perfect for a PR. Have fun!
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post #6 of 13 Old 07-05-2019, 12:48 PM
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You will need two of those passives per 12" driver since both the UM and Alpine subs are capable of 20mm Xmax. I believe both drivers are actually capable of a bit more.

As to your original question, I couldn't find the specs for the BL (motor strength) of the Alpine but the SWR 15 had a far stronger motor than the UM15.

The UM12 has lots of copper in the motor and a lower inductance working in its favor. I think the UM12 looks better but that's subjective.
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post #7 of 13 Old 07-07-2019, 02:32 PM
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I can sign off on using an alpine type R for its db output. Its effectively meant to run in any box you throw it in no matter how small (huge motor strength).
I've made almost all the types of enclosures with the SWR series. Its just such a versatile subwoofer series because of the motor strength and xmax (and price bracket). Closed, ported, 4th order, 6th order, 8th order, quasi 8th order (6th order with the rear window acting as the final chamber and mega big port). Hell a transmission line enclosure as well, and that eventually became a front-loaded horn enclosure with the entire back of the wagon acting as the final sections of the horn.
I would however not put it into a passive radiator enclosure. I'd instead just make an 8-sided closed enclosure down-firing on 2" feet and buy this. and put the subwoofer in that. Make two or more. Be clever with the choice of your speaker wire color and routing for WAF.

cms, aka driver diaphragm suspension mechanical compliance: 0.000065 meter/Newton or in standard form 6.5e-05 m/N. (smaller number is better)
rms, aka driver diaphragm suspension mechanical resistance: 6.41 Newton.sec/meter. (higher number is better)
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post #8 of 13 Old 07-07-2019, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ronny31 View Post
Closed, ported, 4th order, 6th order, 8th order, quasi 8th order (6th order with the rear window acting as the final chamber and mega big port). Hell a transmission line enclosure as well, and that eventually became a front-loaded horn enclosure with the entire back of the wagon acting as the final sections of the horn.
I would however not put it into a passive radiator enclosure. I'd instead just make an 8-sided closed enclosure down-firing on 2" feet and buy this. and put the subwoofer in that. Make two or more. Be clever with the choice of your speaker wire color and routing for WAF.
Ported and passive radiator are the same concept. Why would it not work with passive radiators?
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post #9 of 13 Old 07-08-2019, 02:54 AM
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It would work but in the same enclosure you could put two SWRs and use a MiniDSP to avoid a huge peak.

cms, aka driver diaphragm suspension mechanical compliance: 0.000065 meter/Newton or in standard form 6.5e-05 m/N. (smaller number is better)
rms, aka driver diaphragm suspension mechanical resistance: 6.41 Newton.sec/meter. (higher number is better)
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post #10 of 13 Old 07-09-2019, 12:10 AM
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Originally Posted by ronny31 View Post
It would work but in the same enclosure you could put two SWRs and use a MiniDSP to avoid a huge peak.
It works as well as ported but you don't have to increase the box size to account for port volume. Passives also allow for a deeper tuning when the length of the port for a given frequency becomes prohibitive. In the end you get greater extension in a smaller box which was his goal.
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post #11 of 13 Old 07-09-2019, 08:21 AM
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Creative Sound Soluions SDX12.

https://www.css-audio.com/online-sto...fer-p110031759

I really like that kit but I wish they had a version in the 1.2 cu ft model. This one is 2 cu ft. I’m willing to give up some performance for size in this application.

They have some open box passives for $45 and have 29mm of Xmax. I’ll keep those in mind.[/QUOTE]


We couldn't physically fit the SDX12 and dual passives in a 1.2 cu ft box. The magnet on the SDX12 is so big that the passives will slap against it at high excursion. The box is roughly an 18" cube, so it's still fairly small for what it does (basically flat to 20 Hz anechoic and about 110-116 dB of output). If you want smaller, our sealed cabinets can be ran with boost to make the response look almost identical, but then you will need some type of DSP and a more powerful amp.

If you are willing to build your own box, you could probably get the SDX10 into a 1.25 cu ft box with a pretty nice response with two APR10s.

Regards,

Kerry Armes
Owner
Creative Sound Solutions
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post #12 of 13 Old 07-09-2019, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for chiming I’m. That makes sense now that you mention it. That is a huge magnet on the driver. I’ll checkout the 10” gear
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post #13 of 13 Old 07-09-2019, 12:27 PM
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PE offers this:
https://www.parts-express.com/powere...-in---300-7152
Michael

Did you really need to quote that entire post in your reply?
Welcome to AVS - Get out while you still can!
Don't guess, measure: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/91-au...l#post22789786
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