UM 15-22 vs SI SQL-15 in a Marty 15 by GSG - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 03:30 PM - Thread Starter
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UM 15-22 vs SI SQL-15 in a Marty 15 by GSG

Hey everyone, was just wondering which of these two subs would perform best in the Marty 15 by GSG?

https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/1...ducts/marty-15
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post #2 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 04:20 PM
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Don’t know much about the SQL yet.

The SQL should have more xmax and RMS.


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post #3 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 04:30 PM
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Have you modeled the SQL? From what I’ve seen on the 12 they’re made for sealed enclosures and only been tested that way so far.


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post #4 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 06:13 PM - Thread Starter
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UM 15-22 vs SI SQL-15 in a Marty 15 by GSG

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Originally Posted by imrf View Post
Have you modeled the SQL? From what I’ve seen on the 12 they’re made for sealed enclosures and only been tested that way so far.


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My modeling skills are weak. I will wait until the sub is released and see what the opinions ons are then


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Last edited by Buddylee123; 09-12-2019 at 06:25 PM.
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post #5 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 06:23 PM
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Keep working at it and you'll get better.

Automation: Alexa- Harmony Hub- Wemo Dimmer Switch- Wemo Smart Plug BatCave: SY Triple Black
Video Image: JVC RS500- Sony UBP-800X- Chromecast- 125" wide 16x9 white over black spandex screen
Audio: 5.2.4 Marantz SR7011- (LCR) Stage Right 15" PA- (Surrounds) (4) BIC FH6-LCR- (Atmos) (4) Dayton Audio B652 6-1/2-Inch- (Subs)2 23ishcuft ported HS24s 14-15Hz tune- 4 PA460 in ported cabs 40Hz tune- FP20000Q- 2 Sanway FP10000Q- Crown XLS1500- . To be continued...
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post #6 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 08:13 PM
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I modeled both in a Marty and the SQL-15 wipes the floor with the UM15. The UM15 becomes very excursion-limited while the SQL-15 has plenty throughout the passband.

The SQL-15 works really well in a Marty or MiniMarty.

Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4

Last edited by aron7awol; 09-12-2019 at 08:17 PM.
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post #7 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 09:17 PM
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I've been modeling the SQL's for a few days now and they model great for sealed and ported. Better than the UM15 no doubt. I'm about to preorder a pair of 12's for my car.
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post #8 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 09:22 PM
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Was going to get a SQL for my car but I have a um18 and am going to use it instead... and purchased two Eminence 21’s for the house lol.


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post #9 of 29 Old 09-12-2019, 11:17 PM
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I am on linux (no winisd) and would love if someone here could post what they model with the SQL drivers

My 2.1: Minidsp2x4 HD,Hypex UCD400HxR,SI HT-18,HTM-10
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post #10 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 07:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Nice, glad to hear the SQL drivers model so well. Looks like I will be selling my Mini Marty’s with 18’s and building some with these.


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post #11 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 08:36 AM
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I've been modeling the SQL 12 with the prototype specs. Nick has mentioned that he is shortening the coil a little bit on the production run to lower inductance just a bit more. But the inductance was already pretty damn good for a sub in this price range. So it should be even better now.
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post #12 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 09:41 AM
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In my opinion, I'd just skip the 15s and go to the 18" if you're doing a marty. The size is too similar while the 18 will have substantially more output.

Unless you absolutely HAVE to do the 15", just get the 18s and do a mini marty.
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post #13 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STL D View Post
In my opinion, I'd just skip the 15s and go to the 18" if you're doing a marty. The size is too similar while the 18 will have substantially more output.

Unless you absolutely HAVE to do the 15", just get the 18s and do a mini marty.
They aren't doing an 18 in the SQL series unfortunately.
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post #14 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
They aren't doing an 18 in the SQL series unfortunately.
There's an 18" ultimax. No need for an 18" SQL.
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post #15 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STL D View Post
In my opinion, I'd just skip the 15s and go to the 18" if you're doing a marty. The size is too similar while the 18 will have substantially more output.

Unless you absolutely HAVE to do the 15", just get the 18s and do a mini marty.
I have 18's now but the boxes are too big for my room. The width forces me to place them under the screen and I want my floating screen feel back. If I do 15's in the Martys I can place them on the sides of the screen and have a little room left. I will take the floating screen look over maximum bass.
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post #16 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aron7awol View Post
I modeled both in a Marty and the SQL-15 wipes the floor with the UM15. The UM15 becomes very excursion-limited while the SQL-15 has plenty throughout the passband.



The SQL-15 works really well in a Marty or MiniMarty.


I modeled them today as well and I don’t see them wiping the floor at all. They’re maybe up a little here and there, but they’re not a substantial upgrade, they’re very comparable to the SI HT15s. Maybe I’m missing something.


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post #17 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddylee123 View Post
Nice, glad to hear the SQL drivers model so well. Looks like I will be selling my Mini Marty’s with 18’s and building some with these.
I only said the SQL-15 is better than the UM15, not UM18 or similar. The way your message reads it suggested you were going to replace UM18 MiniMarty with SQL-15 MiniMarty, which would be a downgrade in the same size.

Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4
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post #18 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imrf View Post
I modeled them today as well and I don’t see them wiping the floor at all. They’re maybe up a little here and there, but they’re not a substantial upgrade, they’re very comparable to the SI HT15s. Maybe I’m missing something.
I suppose "wiping the floor" is a bit hyperbolic.

Rather than require one's interpretation of my choice of words to discern meaning, I'll just post the graphs



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Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4

Last edited by aron7awol; 09-13-2019 at 11:18 AM.
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post #19 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aron7awol View Post
I only said the SQL-15 is better than the UM15, not UM18 or similar. The way your message reads it suggested you were going to replace UM18 MiniMarty with SQL-15 MiniMarty, which would be a downgrade in the same size.


I wasn’t questioning you, that was someone else lol


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post #20 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddylee123 View Post
I wasn’t questioning you, that was someone else lol
I know, what I was saying is your message seemed to suggest that you were going to replace MiniMartys with 18s with MiniMartys with SQL-15s, which would obviously take up the same amount of space. I'm guessing you meant replacing full Martys with MiniMartys or MiniMartys with something smaller?

Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aron7awol View Post
I know, what I was saying is your message seemed to suggest that you were going to replace MiniMartys with 18s with MiniMartys with SQL-15s, which would obviously take up the same amount of space. I'm guessing you meant replacing full Martys with MiniMartys or MiniMartys with something smaller?


I see, I have 18’s in Mini Marty’s right now but they are too wide to fit on the sides of my screen. The 15’s in Full Marty’s would be 20 inches wide instead of 25 which will fit perfectly. I’m fine with giving up some bass to get them on the sides of my screen.


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post #22 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 12:04 PM
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The beauty of the SQL series is that it doesn't need a huge enclosure. 9ft is quite a bit bigger than that sub needs.
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post #23 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 12:08 PM
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There is no reason to put the SQL in any of the "Marty" enclosures. Why not just design an enclosure to spec that benefits the design of the subwoofer and the needs of the overall system?
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post #24 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 12:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
There is no reason to put the SQL in any of the "Marty" enclosures. Why not just design an enclosure to spec that benefits the design of the subwoofer and the needs of the overall system?


Because I want to buy the enclosure from GSG and they don’t have anything smaller for 15’s. I might see if they will do a Marty Cube for the SQL, that would be awesome. I need an excuse to take a vacation to LA and going to their shop is the perfect one lol


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post #25 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
The beauty of the SQL series is that it doesn't need a huge enclosure. 9ft is quite a bit bigger than that sub needs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
There is no reason to put the SQL in any of the "Marty" enclosures. Why not just design an enclosure to spec that benefits the design of the subwoofer and the needs of the overall system?
Sub drivers don't have "needs". The response of the model is the response of the model, and that response in 9cf tuned to 15Hz should be pretty fantastic in any room. For someone who likes to run a good house curve, that response in 11cf might be even better for them. Different strokes for different folks, and that's the beauty of DIY subs, the response can be tailored to whatever someone wants. You might prefer a smaller box, and that's fine too, but saying there's "no reason" to put that driver in 9cf or 11cf is just wrong. People could certainly have their reasons to want the additional output around tune.

Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4
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post #26 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aron7awol View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
The beauty of the SQL series is that it doesn't need a huge enclosure. 9ft is quite a bit bigger than that sub needs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
There is no reason to put the SQL in any of the "Marty" enclosures. Why not just design an enclosure to spec that benefits the design of the subwoofer and the needs of the overall system?
Sub drivers don't have "needs". The response of the model is the response of the model, and that response in 9cf tuned to 15Hz should be pretty fantastic in any room. For someone who likes to run a good house curve, that response in 11cf might be even better for them. Different strokes for different folks, and that's the beauty of DIY subs, the response can be tailored to whatever someone wants. You might prefer a smaller box, and that's fine too, but saying there's "no reason" to put that driver in 9cf or 11cf is just wrong. People could certainly have their reasons to want the additional output around tune.
I just said to build an enclosure suited to the sub and the goals. What's the problem with that. If a nice flat response curve is your goal, you can achieve it with a smaller enclosure without sacrificing much, if any SPL. With the larger enclosures you start having that dip in the response as seen in both graphs.

You are right, different strokes for different folks I guess.
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post #27 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameron King View Post
With the larger enclosures you start having that dip in the response as seen in both graphs.
It's the Max SPL graph, it's just showing headroom. The response can be tailored to anything under that curve, and what you're calling a "dip" is ~1dB. There are many benefits to a larger box: it supports a lower tune, increases overall efficiency, increases port gain. Again, if you're tight on space and don't like big boxes, that's fine, but there are many reasons for people to prefer large boxes.

My subs are 31+cf with HT18s in them. You'd certainly say there was "no need" for me to build them that large, but I built them vertically so they only have a 24" diameter footprint, and in my huge room, I need every bit of output around tune (11Hz) they can give, which is a TON.

Take the Red Pill (BassEQ) BassEQ Demo Clips
Video: Sony 85" X900F @ 80" eyes-to-screen (49.4° viewing angle)
Audio: Denon AVR-X4400H 7.2.4 Atmos
Mains: Fusion-15 LR, Custom Tapered Ported Volt-6 Center, Ported Volt-10 Surrounds, Custom 45°/45° Double-Angled Ported Volt-6 Atmos
Subs: The Two Towers (HT18 32cf 11.5Hz x 2), UM18 4cf x 2, Crowson MAs x 4
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post #28 of 29 Old 09-13-2019, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddylee123 View Post
Because I want to buy the enclosure from GSG and they don’t have anything smaller for 15’s. I might see if they will do a Marty Cube for the SQL, that would be awesome. I need an excuse to take a vacation to LA and going to their shop is the perfect one lol


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Looking at the specs for the GSG Marty 15, I think its smaller than the typical mini Marty. Just going off the dimensions on GSGs site, 20.0” wide, 23.5” deep, 36.0” tall, I would guess it's between 7 and 8 cubic feet once you take the port and bracing into account. The Marty 15 is also tuned to 18 hz, so between box volume and tune it would have a slightly different response from the one posted above.

If I didn't already have all the parts for 4 VBSSes, a pair of SQL-15s in Marty boxes would be really tempting.
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post #29 of 29 Old 09-16-2019, 07:39 AM
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Got my hands on a windows pc and modeled both the sql-12 and 15. For small footprint boxes these drivers seem to work very good.
Modeled the sql-12 in a flex-12 size (ish) enclosure tuned to 20hz and it had flat response until 23hz ish and was 3db down at 18hz.
But I guess you can still get more bang for the buck getting some other driver and box combo.

My 2.1: Minidsp2x4 HD,Hypex UCD400HxR,SI HT-18,HTM-10
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