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post #61 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:13 AM
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@Red Five , @hd0823 , @tarponater

I just talked to nick while discussing some things for my 18’s.

The already-built 24’s use the surround clamps instead of glue. Removing the clamps will destroy the subwoofer. This warning comes with them:


For 24’s ordered during the sale, or future orders, he can glue them while building. You will need to contact him on a case-by-case basis.

Chris

Last edited by a77cj7; 12-11-2019 at 09:16 AM.
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post #62 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Spoiler!



It looks like two variants of the box are required then. One for the per-existing 24"s and one if you had the sub made for front mounting, since that will take away some box complexity and weight.

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post #63 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Five View Post


It looks like two variants of the box are required then. One for the per-existing 24"s and one if you had the sub made for front mounting, since that will take away some box complexity and weight.


Is the slight volume change actually going to affect any other dimensions,

Chris
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post #64 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a77cj7 View Post
Is the slight volume change actually going to affect any other dimensions

Chris

External box dimensions should remain the same, from the spacer to the back of the box is 15.5", that is some breathing space if the subs depth is based from the back of the motor to the back of the flange. The center of the sub is down another 1.5" from the top of the manifold, so a slight change in the upper response is expected. Displacement lost might be around 10 to 20 liters, that is not much on a 500 liter chamber so the tune should still be under 17Hz.

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post #65 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:40 AM - Thread Starter
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This is what the box currently looks like. It is still 27" deep.

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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
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post #66 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:46 AM
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I'm very much looking to build 2x Mini 21".

1. I don't think anyone has built that one yet, right ?
2. I will be using 18mm MDF, which is 1mm smaller than 3/4" MDF. Is there an automated way to re-calculate the cut sheet ? I can't figure this out manually, so I would have to calculate and then cut every sheet on the fly while building, which doesn't seem optimal. Any tips ?
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post #67 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorisdriesen View Post
I'm very much looking to build 2x Mini 21".

1. I don't think anyone has built that one yet, right ?
2. I will be using 18mm MDF, which is 1mm smaller than 3/4" MDF. Is there an automated way to re-calculate the cut sheet ? I can't figure this out manually, so I would have to calculate and then cut every sheet on the fly while building, which doesn't seem optimal. Any tips ?

Unless @johnson636 has made progress without posting it to a thread, no one has built one yet. You can use Excel and just copy what @superkyle did on his BMDs. I can also send you the CAD file if you want to adjust that. Set the units of measure to mm in the preferences and then make the pieces 18mm. FreeCAD is not too hard to learn after watching a few videos. Everything was done using the Parts bench.

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post #68 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 09:59 AM
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OK would love to get the CAD file, that will be easiest I assume. Will pm you my email address.
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post #69 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 10:13 AM
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I haven't started my build yet. I have to build new ported cabs for my 24s first

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post #70 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 12:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a77cj7 View Post
Is the slight volume change actually going to affect any other dimensions,

Chris

It is just dawning on me with the removable manifold you can easily switch between different subs of different sizes. Should I model the HST18MKIII later?

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post #71 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Five View Post
It is just dawning on me with the removable manifold you can easily switch between different subs of different sizes. Should I model the HST18MKIII later?


Yes
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post #72 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 12:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Jk7.2 View Post
Yes

Do you have the MKIIs? I can run that too later provided I have the TS parameters

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post #73 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 12:43 PM
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Do you have the MKIIs? I can run that too later provided I have the TS parameters


Yes I do. I’ll dig them up
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post #74 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Five View Post
It is just dawning on me with the removable manifold you can easily switch between different subs of different sizes. Should I model the HST18MKIII later?


I really doubt I’ll build them, but it might help someone else. I believe the specs on the website haven’t been updated yet. Here’s the test data posted on Facebook. Sorry it’s hard to read.



I assume its way bigger than necessary for the 18” anyways.

Now if you can design one in a 20”x36” footprint, firing out the 20” side, I’m interested.

Chris
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post #75 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 02:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I really doubt I’ll build them, but it might help someone else. I believe the specs on the website haven’t been updated yet. Here’s the test data posted on Facebook. Sorry it’s hard to read.



I assume its way bigger than necessary for the 18” anyways.

Now if you can design one in a 20”x36” footprint, firing out the 20” side, I’m interested.

Chris

Sadly 21" is needed to fit the driver inside the cabinet. Ported is the best bet for that!

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post #76 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a77cj7 View Post
@Red Five , @hd0823 , @tarponater

I just talked to nick while discussing some things for my 18’s.

The already-built 24’s use the surround clamps instead of glue. Removing the clamps will destroy the subwoofer. This warning comes with them:


For 24’s ordered during the sale, or future orders, he can glue them while building. You will need to contact him on a case-by-case basis.

Chris
It's funny, the first four things on that list are the things I want to do the most. He takes all the fun out of it.
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post #77 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Five View Post
Sadly 21" is needed to fit the driver inside the cabinet. Ported is the best bet for that!


Details, lol. If its doable at 21”, I can probably make it work.

Chris
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post #78 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorisdriesen View Post
I'm very much looking to build 2x Mini 21".

1. I don't think anyone has built that one yet, right ?
2. I will be using 18mm MDF, which is 1mm smaller than 3/4" MDF. Is there an automated way to re-calculate the cut sheet ? I can't figure this out manually, so I would have to calculate and then cut every sheet on the fly while building, which doesn't seem optimal. Any tips ?
@jorisdriesen
Unless you already have the drivers... you may wish to consider the RSS460HO in a standard Mini..... [ the extra box size of the Mini XL does not change the response of the 460HO]

The 21" Mini is the black line, the 18" in a standard Mini is the grey.....
I have a Mini with the 460HO and it slams... on the MAX SPL charts... the 460HO gives up about 3Db @ 30Hz.... other that that, they are just about even..

https://i.imgur.com/Axpupe9.jpg

Just a thought...


Juju

Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html


Last edited by jujuman200; 12-11-2019 at 05:04 PM.
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post #79 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
@jorisdriesen
Unless you already have the drivers... you may wish to consider the RSS460HO in a standard Mini..... [ the extra box size of the Mini XL does not change the response of the 460HO]

The 21" Mini is the black line, the 18" in a standard Mini is the grey.....
I have a Mini with the 460HO and it slams...

https://i.imgur.com/Axpupe9.jpg

Just a thought...


Juju
Juju, did you figure out how much power the 460HO can handle? Just curious.

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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
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post #80 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
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Juju, did you figure out how much power the 460HO can handle? Just curious.
Not yet... I have not been able to go to full war mode yet... but I will say that they are very efficient. The second light blinking on an iNuke 3K is pretty darn loud just playing the ONE Mini...


Cutting loose that LFE will just be crazy. With all the subs going, " Normal" listening levels don't even blink the first LEDs on the iNuke...lol. Remember, the bass section of my 3way mains are 31Hz VBSS boxes so getting loud is not an issue....


Juju
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post #81 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
Not yet... I have not been able to go to full war mode yet... but I will say that they are very efficient. The second light blinking on an iNuke 3K is pretty darn loud just playing the ONE Mini...


Cutting loose that LFE will just be crazy. With all the subs going, " Normal" listening levels don't even blink the first LEDs on the iNuke...lol. Remember, the bass section of my 3way mains are 31Hz VBSS boxes so getting loud is not an issue....


Juju
Does the sound signature stay very similar to the 214.50 in the LFE?

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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
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post #82 of 219 Old 12-11-2019, 05:55 PM
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Does the sound signature stay very similar to the 214.50 in the LFE?
Yes... they play well together, the sound is very full but not in an "in your face" kind of way. Having a "mixed bag" of subs[two Devs + two Martys] gives my soundstage a nice front to back dimension to the sound with the Devs being laid back in the mix but belting out their low growl when needed.

Don't get me wrong, the Devs are definitely loud and forceful but unlike how direct radiators that "can be" boomy or bloated sounding..... the Devs are just clean notes from top to bottom.

I really like my current setup after all the tweaking to get the Devs to play nice, they sound AWESOME in my space [regardless what the charts say...]. If anything, I MAY change out the 18" Marty for a Mini.... time will tell..

Juju
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Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
@jorisdriesen
Unless you already have the drivers... you may wish to consider the RSS460HO in a standard Mini..... [ the extra box size of the Mini XL does not change the response of the 460HO]

The 21" Mini is the black line, the 18" in a standard Mini is the grey.....
I have a Mini with the 460HO and it slams... on the MAX SPL charts... the 460HO gives up about 3Db @ 30Hz.... other that that, they are just about even..

https://i.imgur.com/Axpupe9.jpg

Just a thought...
Juju
How come the 18" is above the 21" basically on all frequencies ?

The RSS460HO is slightly more expensive here than a 21DS115. The SAN184.03 for example is almost half the price of the 21DS115.
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The Devastator Index

Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
@jorisdriesen
Unless you already have the drivers... you may wish to consider the RSS460HO in a standard Mini..... [ the extra box size of the Mini XL does not change the response of the 460HO]

The 21" Mini is the black line, the 18" in a standard Mini is the grey.....
I have a Mini with the 460HO and it slams... on the MAX SPL charts... the 460HO gives up about 3Db @ 30Hz.... other that that, they are just about even..

https://i.imgur.com/Axpupe9.jpg

Just a thought...


Juju


Uhh juju, what are your input voltage/wattage for that graph? The 460HO voltage looks way high.

Chris
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post #85 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 06:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a77cj7 View Post
Uhh juju, what are your input voltage/wattage for that graph? The 460HO voltage looks way high.

Chris

This is 900 watts, pushing a little over 14mm of excursion. Not sure what 2/3 gap is on this beast, I would imagine at least 17mm. 20Hz 2nd Order HPF.


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post #86 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
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This is 900 watts, pushing a little over 14mm of excursion. Not sure what 2/3 gap is on this beast, I would imagine at least 17mm. 20Hz 2nd Order HPF.




That seems more believable. Still a good looking graph.
I don’t know that I’d put much more than rated to a dayton, I know quite a few people have smoked UM’s with around rated power.

Chris
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post #87 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 07:07 AM - Thread Starter
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That seems more believable. Still a good looking graph.
I don’t know that I’d put much more than rated to a dayton, I know quite a few people have smoked UM’s with around rated power.

Chris

I wonder if the RMS power is most pro woofers program power. I see nothing about pink noise and AES...

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post #88 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
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Uhh juju, what are your input voltage/wattage for that graph? The 460HO voltage looks way high.

Chris
87 Volts


Juju

Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #89 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 09:45 AM - Thread Starter
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bmd omega v2 24"

BMD OMEGA V2!!! The key difference is the removable manifold for using an existing HS24 or if you like to change drivers later down the road. There is probably more info hidden in those darn attachments... Response is so close to the V1, no need to post it. HR input is in the attachments. Note - when attaching the manifold be careful where you place the screws.
















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Stormbreaker | WI HT Meet Thread | The Devastator Index | Mini Devastator Build
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators
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post #90 of 219 Old 12-12-2019, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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@tarponater , the v2 is posted. You should be able to use an existing HS24 with this

Stormbreaker | WI HT Meet Thread | The Devastator Index | Mini Devastator Build
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators
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