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post #1291 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by a77cj7 View Post
You can use a forstner bit in a drill. Depth control will require a delicate touch.

Chris
Ok thanks. Will look into it. Any recommendations on the glue situation
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post #1292 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 07:54 AM
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Ok thanks. Will look into it. Any recommendations on the glue situation

Pl3x works great on Devastators. Does a good job of sealing seams. I recommend wearing gloves, it bonds very well to hands.
Has a 24hr cure time.

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post #1293 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Pl3x works great on Devastators. Does a good job of sealing seams. I recommend wearing gloves, it bonds very well to hands.
Has a 24hr cure time.

Chris
+1 it also has a longer working time than Titebond. I would say you have half hour or so depending on humidity and temperature for panel adjustments before it starts to get gummy.

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post #1294 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 08:06 AM
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+1 it also has a longer working time than Titebond. I would say you have half hour or so depending on humidity and temperature for panel adjustments before it starts to get gummy.
Thanks John. I am using it to build my DEV but I wanted to know if there was a way to safely remove dried up excess glue without damaging plywood. I believe it dries hard and removing excess from baffle rail seems might be a difficult task.
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post #1295 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 08:07 AM
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Pl3x works great on Devastators. Does a good job of sealing seams. I recommend wearing gloves, it bonds very well to hands.
Has a 24hr cure time.

Chris
Thanks a77cj7. PL3 is what I am using. How to remove dried up excess glue from tight spaces without damaging plywood is my concern.
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post #1296 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 08:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks John. I am using it to build my DEV but I wanted to know if there was a way to safely remove dried up excess glue without damaging plywood. I believe it dries hard and removing excess from baffle rail seems might be a difficult task.

With PL3 you wait for it to harden for about 24 hours and then you cut it. Sanding it is not a good option.

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post #1297 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 08:08 AM
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Thanks a77cj7. PL3 is what I am using. How to remove dried up excess glue from tight spaces without damaging plywood is my concern.

Wipe when wet or scrape when dry. I would only bother in visible areas, leaving the extra helps to seal the seams.

Chris
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post #1298 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 08:13 AM
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Wipe when wet or scrape when dry. I would only bother in visible areas, leaving the extra helps to seal the seams.

Chris
Thanks Chris and @Red Five
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post #1299 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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@Nalleh what do you think?



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post #1300 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Shallow BMD DF is tight, but it should work from the looks of it. That is roughly the size of the SAN214.50 in there.


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post #1301 of 1585 Old 05-05-2020, 02:57 PM
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@Nalleh what do you think?



Me like

Should be a very cool stacking option

Dual AVR 13.1.8 SWAtmos - Atmos 13.1.8/DTS X 9.1.8/Auro 3D 13.1 - Denon AVCX8500H+AVRX7200WA - Klipsch+KEF - 4xSI18" - 12x12" w/6xSLAPS M12 VNF - 4x12"HB+2x18"CLHB - 6x Crowsons - 4xBK-LFE - 2x12"BB - 2x "4DX" fans- 6xNU6K - Minidsp 10x10HD-Vertex2-Oppo UDP203-XB1X-ATV4K-JVC RS600-Dreamscreen V2 120"-Samsung QE82Q60.
>>>>Nalleh’s HT<<<<
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Chris
That pretty @$$ sub deserve to be seen...Baby got back!

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That pretty @$$ sub deserve to be seen...Baby got back!

That one is hidden, only visible from the front.

Its twin, however:


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Question

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Why not have the peak around 80-90hz?

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Why not have the peak around 80-90hz?
The woofers are not the best for a 6th order bandpass as you can see from the peak. The peak will have 2nd and 3rd order distortion attached to it when a signal hits that frequency. This round I am trying to push it a little out of the main passband, the LPF should be taking the signal down some by then if content hits the peak the distortion will be less. Subjective tests the Quad does not sound as good as one of the more expensive pro woofers. I am trying to make it sound a little better.

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post #1306 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 09:03 AM
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The Devastator Index

The building begins 2x Mini Dev 21s 3xHT12s


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Question about the Nano 12" dev, for music listening:
What if ported to 30Hz and using LAVOCE SSF122.50L (120usd) or LAVOCE WAF124.01 (190usd)? Wouldn't give that some serious midbass output or would port velocity become too high?

Or even a smaller Pico dev with Lavoce SSF102.50L (100usd)

I know, just thinking for the living room...

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Originally Posted by Jan3 View Post
Question about the Nano 12" dev, for music listening:
What if ported to 30Hz and using LAVOCE SSF122.50L (120usd) or LAVOCE WAF124.01 (190usd)? Wouldn't give that some serious midbass output or would port velocity become too high?

Or even a smaller Pico dev with Lavoce SSF102.50L (100usd)

I know, just thinking for the living room...

I did not look at the 10", but I did look at the two 12"s. The first one is okay, the suspension and motor are not the greatest for a Devastator. The second 12" has all the issues of the 18DS115, the motor is very strong and so is the suspension. It actually gets pretty peaky and velocity is just out of hand. I went through the Lavoce list, not seeing anything with a Fs around 30-35Hz and a Qts around .3. Does B&C have something?

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post #1309 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 01:33 PM
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I did not look at the 10", but I did look at the two 12"s. The first one is okay, the suspension and motor are not the greatest for a Devastator. The second 12" has all the issues of the 18DS115, the motor is very strong and so is the suspension. It actually gets pretty peaky and velocity is just out of hand. I went through the Lavoce list, not seeing anything with a Fs around 30-35Hz and a Qts around .3. Does B&C have something?

Costs more, but maybe try the eminence kappalite lf.

https://www.parts-express.com/eminen...river--290-590

Chris
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post #1310 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Costs more, but maybe try the eminence kappalite lf.

https://www.parts-express.com/eminen...river--290-590

Chris

This is 200 watts into it with a 70 liter rear chamber and a 36in front QW tuned to 30Hz roughly. It is pretty flat. Power is pushing rated Xmax.
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post #1311 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 02:08 PM
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This is 200 watts into it with a 70 liter rear chamber and a 36in front QW tuned to 30Hz roughly. It is pretty flat. Power is pushing rated Xmax.

Wow, that’s pretty. Just doesn’t have the displacement for more power.

Might be the good living room Devastator he was looking for though.

Chris
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...Does B&C have something?
Thanks!
B&C 12" don't go below fs 42Hz.
I can search for other models, but maybe you can guide me first with the following preferences:

- Narrowness of box is most important (want to put between sofa and the window behind. Nano 40"x16.5"x20": 16.5" is absolute max, narrower is even better. (I'll but the dev on it's back)
- Second is midbass output (40-90Hz). I plan to xover them to bookshelf speakers around 90. I'm ready to tune up to 40Hz if that can make the box <16.5 shallow or wide.
- 10/12" doesnt matter
- Generally speaking, here in Europe the cheapest drivers i can get are Lavoce. Then B&C, Faital pro and Eminence etc about 20% more expensive.

How important is Xmax if we keep tune high enough?
Eminence BETA-12A (Fs 47Hz and 98db sensitivity, QTS 0.46) is only $10 more expensive here as the JBL (dont have JBL's Thiele parameters). What if the Nano is just tuned much higher?

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Costs more, but maybe try the eminence kappalite lf.

https://www.parts-express.com/eminen...river--290-590

Chris
It's really expensive here. Best I can find is Eminence DELTALITE II 2512 for $170
Edit: found the Kappalite 3012LF for $255. hm...

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This is 200 watts into it with a 70 liter rear chamber and a 36in front QW tuned to 30Hz roughly. It is pretty flat. Power is pushing rated Xmax.
Wow, output is perfect. Just thinking if there could be a cheaper driver than this $255 one. But very good.

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It's really expensive here. Best I can find is Eminence DELTALITE II 2512 for $170
Edit: found the Kappalite 3012LF for $255. hm...

Ahh yes, Europe prices.

@Red Five , try the LaVoce wan123.00.
https://www.parts-express.com/lavoce...8-ohm--293-719

Or the mentioned deltalite:
https://www.parts-express.com/eminen...river--290-593

Neither will be as good as the kappalite, but much cheaper.

Chris
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great, could find the Kappalite 3012LF for $215, I won't search further, seems to be great price quality.
Do you think the box can still be made 2 inches more narrow or is 16.5 the limit? Length can be > 40".

NAD T758v3, 2x 21DS115 ported, QSC 1150 LCR, QSC SR-1020 surrounds, moving by the end of the year to a new 15Wx18Lx10.8 concrete basement.
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Soon JBL 4722n LCR with updated 2453SL CD
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LaVoce WAN123.00 = 170usd
Kappalite 3012 LF = 215usd
Deltalite II 2512 = 200usd (previously didnt see shipping was not included)

Seems the Kappalite will be best
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The b&c driver cut out for the 21 is 508mm, my cutout is approx 506mm, is this likely to cause any issues, drivers won’t be here for a few weeks so can’t check, but also want to get building? Cheers


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post #1319 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan3 View Post
LaVoce WAN123.00 = 170usd

Kappalite 3012 LF = 215usd

Deltalite II 2512 = 200usd (previously didnt see shipping was not included)



Seems the Kappalite will be best
I am done with sims and stuff for the day. The Dual 12 is as narrow as I can go if I remember correctly. I will into tweaking something in the upcoming days.

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post #1320 of 1585 Old 05-06-2020, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monty6400 View Post
The b&c driver cut out for the 21 is 508mm, my cutout is approx 506mm, is this likely to cause any issues, drivers won’t be here for a few weeks so can’t check, but also want to get building? Cheers


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2mm should be pretty close to the margin off error on the cutouts. Worst case scenario is some hand sanding. I had to do that on my DS cabinet, the outer baffle was just a little too tight to fit the woofer on the inside.
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