CRT ceiling projectors still the bomb with HD - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #151 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 06:48 AM
 
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Originally Posted by redfox001 View Post
Do you have some measurements to back that up? That JVC has been able to drastical improve on MTF in lcos?

Apart form that I only have seen the older cheaper models and they look terrible wrong. Might be that the newer models do it better but they will always have pixels that have sharp edges and that is not natural. 4k does improve on that. To aa normal guy like me however they are far to expensive and I do not like to change bulbs all the time so no digital for me anymore.

A modified CRT can show perfect MTF. Yes you did not know that? It is true. CRTi is still developed further.

Anyway about DLP they say that ansi contrast will overrule on/off contrast if ansi is very high.
I don´t have any measurments to back it up, but as you see from the old article you posted a link to (witch I read in 2009 the first time) they have improved every year and the X500/700/900 also improved on this among many other things. I have not owned a JVC since the RS25 because I thought Sony did a better job, but last year with the Xx00 series JVC made something good and it made me go back to them again. I still own my VW1100 as I think it does a better job in bright movies and it is native 4K.

A DLP has sharper edges than a LCOS because of lower fillrate. And we will have pixels in the future also, all digital media has pixels and not lines. And if you are tired of changing bulbs all the time, it will not be problem in the future as laser/LED is going to be mainstream in the near future and it will not cost as much as today, a LED or laser module does not cost much. To me bulbs are not much of a problem as I use my cinema about 3-400 hours a year and this makes me change every 3-5 years, and lamps are quite cheap so it is not a problem. But if you use your projector as a TV it can be a problem, I use my Sony HW55 as a TV for sports and some normal TV watching and for gaming, but I only use it about 1000 hours a year so in theory I could change every 3 years on that as well.

Then please show me a perfect example of a CRT showing perfect high resolution MTF. I have seen modified CRT´s and they are far from showing perfect high resolution MTF.

Ansi contrast does not overrule on/off contrast alone, if that was the case how would a CRT look with its max 100:1 ansi contrast. A good DLP measures around 6-700:1 ansi contrast and max 6000:1 on/off (I think the best Sim2 3 chip DLP measure that high), a good LCOS measures 400+:1 ansi contrast and 30-100000:1 on/off (Cine4home measured the X900 over 100000:1 in its best contrast mode). This makes the DLP look a little bit better in very bright material (and I mean a little bit and very bright) and the LCOS very much better (and I mean very much better) in low APL scenes.

This I have tested side by side by myself many times and I have not read about it somewhere. If DLP could get the same on/off as a JVC I would probably prefer the DLP, but I would need to side by side test them in my own cinema to make a decision.

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post #152 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 09:15 AM
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Hello mister Foxy boy
YOU wrote. ...

A modified CRT can show perfect MTF. Yes you did not know that? It is true. CRTi is still
developed further. Anyway about DLP they say that ansi contrast will overrule on/off contrast if ansi is very high.

Let Curt answer that question about a CRT showing perfect MTF i asked him that but I'm trolling remember. I can Garanti that it's far from that compared to a JVC X500 and any 1080P digital projector today:joy:

And Ansi contrast will not outrun ON OFF contrast. Where do u get all this ********?

I hate this phone spelling corrections.

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post #153 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 09:53 AM
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Show me something better or even close on a CRT then i rest my case.
This is a 1080P photo from my ipad.
From my JVC X500 after fixing the convergence as good as I managed . If anyone like to try and convince me here is the pattern to. Try it and see yourselves.
And see who to believe.
still wait to hear your answer Curt, or maybe prove it like I do here. But this is just trolling if i remember.
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post #154 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 09:54 AM
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:sweat_smile:
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post #155 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 03:25 PM
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:sweat_smile:
LOL we have been posting these pics so many times I do not feel like posting them again to a troll
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post #156 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 04:10 PM
 
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Talking

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Originally Posted by Curt Palme View Post
Sheesh you guys, stop feeding the troll. Let DJ Dee win the argument and the whooole internet, like he did over 2 weeks before Chambers posted.
Some people have nothing better to do. @djdee:


Back on topic: While we may be on the verge of other technologies passing the fidelity of CRT, there is no arguing with the fact that you get fantastic picture quality for the money.
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post #157 of 186 Old 01-07-2015, 11:10 PM
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Answer my question Curt who is trolling LOL
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post #158 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 12:27 AM
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Cool

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While we may be on the verge of other technologies passing the fidelity of CRT, there is no arguing with the fact that you get fantastic picture quality for the money.
Fantastic picture quality yes If you accept Something that does not look more than low resolution in my eyes, And have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015.
Prises will drop more and more on CRT And soon you get it for free.
When the companies and simulators throw out the last of CRT price will drop dramatically. This because companies pay big money for parts.

Regards troll hehe
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post #159 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 04:03 AM
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There has been a meat at Williams place. You can find the thread somewhere here or on Curts, where people among other things compared a X500 with a modified Marquee blend. Everyone there found the Marquees better except for the guy that brought the x500. They all said the crt's had much more 3d like depth in the image.
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post #160 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 07:41 AM
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Jepp you win the whole fight hehe.

Enjoy SD.

What your referring To was not i side by side. The CRT was turned off and then the X500 on. After what I heard from Segs. So might be Fanboys involved, just a guess hehe
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post #161 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 08:16 AM
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Still debating on this!! No doubt CRT has its own signature look. Some get it.

It is all about quality. That is the picture.
NEC XG-1352LC 8" CRT, 106" wide StudioTek 130 screen
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post #162 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 08:41 AM
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Crt had IT yes many years ago I owned many and know many that had and some i know still have it and prefers it over a digital. I still cant see why in any part of HD material at all. I think adjusting is what they like more than picture quality. But today in 2015 CRT can't compete anymore in any possible way, sorry for breaking you're CRT hart's.
But when people that do not know how a picture is built up in any way and just listen to other that have no clue, and have not seen a jvc x500 side by side settup i just like to troll with you guys. This is just totally B U L L S H I T T talk.
You can say that you like crt but it has nothing to do with picture quality at all today.
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post #163 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 09:39 AM
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Ok now it is time to sign off.
Dj Dee likes this.

It is all about quality. That is the picture.
NEC XG-1352LC 8" CRT, 106" wide StudioTek 130 screen
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post #164 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 10:04 AM
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Ok now it is time to sign off.
The truth is to hard to handle I understand.
I'm trolling again.
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post #165 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 10:34 AM
 
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There has been a meat at Williams place. You can find the thread somewhere here or on Curts, where people among other things compared a X500 with a modified Marquee blend. Everyone there found the Marquees better except for the guy that brought the x500. They all said the crt's had much more 3d like depth in the image.
One of the biggest differences is 3D depth to the picture when comparing CRT and a good digital and it is not in favor of the CRT. But to discuss this with people who are CRT fans is very difficult and I find them to wear CRT glasses no matter what they compare. I have even heard CRT guys say the VW1000/1100 has a flat picture compared to a good CRT, yeah right!

But this discussion can go on for the next cenury and I don´t have the time, so enough of this bull.
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post #166 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 02:02 PM
 
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Post Ray

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Answer my question Curt who is trolling LOL
Says the person who has nothing better to do than troll this thread and double post. Didn't you see the coupon? You won the internet; what else do you want?

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Fantastic picture quality yes If you accept Something that does not look more than low resolution in my eyes, And have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015.
Maybe you need glasses if HD video doesn't look good to your eyes anymore. High resolution video is still very much relevant.

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Prises will drop more and more on CRT And soon you get it for free.
When the companies and simulators throw out the last of CRT price will drop dramatically. This because companies pay big money for parts.
Like I said, "bang for your buck".

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Regards troll [hethe]
Nobody here is called "troll hethe", it's not nice to call names.
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post #167 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
Answer my question Curt who is trolling LOL
Says the person who has nothing better to do than troll this thread and double post. Didn't you see the coupon? You won the internet; what else do you want?

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Fantastic picture quality yes If you accept Something that does not look more than low resolution in my eyes, And have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015.
Maybe you need glasses if HD video doesn't look good to your eyes anymore. High resolution video is still very much relevant.

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Prises will drop more and more on CRT And soon you get it for free.
When the companies and simulators throw out the last of CRT price will drop dramatically. This because companies pay big money for parts.
Like I said, "bang for your buck".

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Regards troll [hethe]
Nobody here is called "troll hethe", it's not nice to call names.
Enough kindergarten and trying to escape from the topic and the reality.
This is well said and the absolute fact.

So, the title of the thread "HD- CRT Still Da Bomb," might play very well to the faithful here but it is deliberately blind to the industry, the marketplace and, ultimately, to reality.

and just a hint you might need glasses Curt called me a troll so tell that to him it's not nice to call names. Does it look like I care i wrote regards troll. That was me i was referring to.
God night VHS boys.

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post #168 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 05:32 PM
 
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Talking VHS Boys

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This is well said and the absolute fact.
Thank you.

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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
So, the title of the thread "HD- CRT Still Da Bomb," might play very well to the faithful here but it is deliberately blind to the industry, the marketplace and, ultimately, to reality.
I don't see anything wrong with the title of the thread.

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and just a hint you might need glasses Curt called me a troll so tell that to him it's not nice to call names.
He was justified because he spoke the truth. This is not always acceptable, but in this instance, I would say it was justifiable. And to reiterate what I said before, you were the one who said "have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015", so I think you are the one who needs glasses because of the fact that HD is in fact still very relevant in 2015, if not mainstream.

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God night VHS boys.
Sounds like an interesting movie. Since HD doesn't seem to be of great concern to you, I can see why you'd enjoy a film about the "VHS boys" .
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post #169 of 186 Old 01-08-2015, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
This is well said and the absolute fact.
Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
So, the title of the thread "HD- CRT Still Da Bomb," might play very well to the faithful here but it is deliberately blind to the industry, the marketplace and, ultimately, to reality.
I don't see anything wrong with the title of the thread.

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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
and just a hint you might need glasses Curt called me a troll so tell that to him it's not nice to call names.
He was justified because he spoke the truth. This is not always acceptable, but in this instance, I would say it was justifiable. And to reiterate what I said before, you were the one who said "have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015", so I think you are the one who needs glasses because of the fact that HD is in fact still very relevant in 2015, if not mainstream.

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God night VHS boys.
Sounds like an interesting movie. Since HD doesn't seem to be of great concern to you, I can see why you'd enjoy a film about the "VHS boys" .

Let's stick to the topic. From now on kiddo.

Prove me wrong, then I stop.

Curt still way ting for the answers.
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He was justified because he spoke the truth. This is not always acceptable, but in this instance, I would say it was justifiable. And to reiterate what I said before, you were the one who said "have absolutely NOTHING to do with HD picture quality at all in 2015", so I think you are the one who needs glasses because of the fact that HD is in fact still very relevant in 2015, if not mainstream.

I think you misunderstand DJ Dee, he says that a CRT can not show a full HD picture in the correct way and in that statement he is correct. And you might think it is correct to call him a troll, but if he should call anyone a troll that would be an offence I find vey strange. He might be harch in his statements, but he is not a troll and then we have the language barrier. I know DJ Dee and he is just trying to say what he has experienced and he has owned and seen many different CRT´s (modified and original) and so have I (we have side by side tested them with good digitals like the Sony VW1000, HW55 and JVC X500 a few times), and to say it is better then a good digital is bull. To say you like the CRT picture is of corse OK, but it is time to wake up and smell the reality as we live in 2015 not 2003. And I must say I am happy that the world of electronics is evolving and going forwards not backwards.
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post #171 of 186 Old 01-09-2015, 07:22 AM
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There has been a meat at Williams place. You can find the thread somewhere here or on Curts, where people among other things compared a X500 with a modified Marquee blend. Everyone there found the Marquees better except for the guy that brought the x500. They all said the crt's had much more 3d like depth in the image.


Everyone? Please tell me where I said that either here or on Curt's site.

Since I was there, I can definitely say not everyone preferred the CRTs. There were several guys that still liked CRT over digital, but that is to be expected at a CRT meet. The rest of us see that both techs have their advantages and disadvantages.

Andreas and DJ,
Now, why do you care about dredging this up? Are you on some crusade to save some poor lost soul from "wasting" maybe $500 to $1000 on a CRT projector?

Having fun playing the new mobile game Volley Village
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post #172 of 186 Old 01-09-2015, 07:50 AM
 
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Post Back on topic

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Let's stick to the topic. From now on kiddo.
Is "on kiddo" part of the lens system or a different component?

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Prove me wrong, then I stop.
Wrong about what? Not needing glasses? Stop what?

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Curt still way ting for the answers.
Again, it's not nice to call people names. "Ting" is not Curt's name.



Back on topic. like others mentioned, there are advantages and disadvantages to different types of image technologies. Some of the obvious advantages of technologies other than CRT are ease of setup and image quality. One of the advantages of CRT projection today is value for your money.
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post #173 of 186 Old 01-09-2015, 08:28 AM
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Again, it's not nice to call people names. "Ting" is not Curt's name.

WAY!

No DJ, I am not answering or engaging you in any way. My point in you being a troll is that you're on a CRT forum bashing CRT. that's like me going to a digital forum, and bashing digitals for being a throwaway product, with a typical lifespan of 3-7 years. What's the point? There are a number of digital forums both on avs, and many more online elsewhere. You prefer digital. that's great! Go enjoy it. Just leave us ignorant dinosaur CRT people alone. We really don't care what you have to say.

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Everyone? Please tell me where I said that either here or on Curt's site.

Since I was there, I can definitely say not everyone preferred the CRTs. There were several guys that still liked CRT over digital, but that is to be expected at a CRT meet. The rest of us see that both techs have their advantages and disadvantages.

Andreas and DJ,
Now, why do you care about dredging this up? Are you on some crusade to save some poor lost soul from "wasting" maybe $500 to $1000 on a CRT projector?
I am not on a quest I just say my meaning and I also say if you like CRT it is of corse OK, but to say it is throws a better more 3D like picture than a good digital like the X500 is not correct in any way. And og corse people can buy what they want and if it is a CRT feel free.

And to Curt Palme: A digital has an expected lifetime of 3-7 years is of corse not true, I know people whos have 7-8 years old JVC still going strong with many thousands of hours on them. And CRT´s stop working also, but you guys care so much for them and actually fix them and that is respectable. This can also be done with a digital if people wanted to, me persnoally have not owned a projector longer than 3 years (VW1000/1100) and I like trying out new things and will buy and sell in the coming years as well. I now own two Sonys and one JVC, what the future brings I don´t know. And here in Norway we have a very good customer law saying all consumer producs must have a 5 year warranty no mather what, so if a projector brakes when 4,5 years old you get it fixed or you get a new one if it can´t be fixed.

And there is a reason DJ Dee gets exited here and on your forum: there is treads popping up with how CRT is still the King and so on, I personally don´t care what you guys mean, but sometimes it just gets to stupid for me to not care. And to just call Dj Dee a troll I find immature. Answer his question or stop calling him names, you should know better!

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post #175 of 186 Old 01-09-2015, 09:52 AM
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Everyone? Please tell me where I said that either here or on Curt's site.

Since I was there, I can definitely say not everyone preferred the CRTs. There were several guys that still liked CRT over digital, but that is to be expected at a CRT meet. The rest of us see that both techs have their advantages and disadvantages.

Andreas and DJ,
Now, why do you care about dredging this up? Are you on some crusade to save some poor lost soul from "wasting" maybe $500 to $1000 on a CRT projector?
Tell me Eriglo at this forum can't I say what I see on a CRT forum compared to a digital without being a troll?
Or do I have to be a fan of CRT?

500 dollar fair price . But I know people that buy mods and tubes for 4000-5000 dollar to CRT from a man that says this"" don't worry we will make the best picture in the world just pay"" even on 808 to around 4000 dollar and 909 even more.
it's that wort it? Be honest...
Then compared up to what you get today.

What is then the problem of facing and admitting the fact, that a high end digital today 2015 is better at everything. Except some things nearly not seen when watching movie.
I had CRT for extremely manny years but the days are over for me completely.
But to pay more than a normal digital today is not wort it at all.

Then a question to you. What Advantage have a high end CRT 9" today over a JVc x500?
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post #176 of 186 Old 01-09-2015, 10:09 AM
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WAY!

No DJ, I am not answering or engaging you in any way. My point in you being a troll is that you're on a CRT forum bashing CRT. that's like me going to a digital forum, and bashing digitals for being a throwaway product, with a typical lifespan of 3-7 years. What's the point? There are a number of digital forums both on avs, and many more online elsewhere. You prefer digital. that's great! Go enjoy it. Just leave us ignorant dinosaur CRT people alone. We really don't care what you have to say.
I can guarantee you that you do not engaging me I know the fact, you will just bring a lights to the fact, and can be positive to you members of this forum. Or others will.
So by not saying positive things about CRT, you only are welcome? when you talk Untrue things about CRT? why to sell ot the rest on the marked before its to late, or before its free.

The point of this life plan on a digital so what 7 years? Or up to 7 years or more. I do not see the problem. Prices go down and product gets better. You sell and buy new better product. And thank God for that.
And you also have a sense of humor that's good: just leave us ignorant dinosaur CRT people alone. We do not care... I SEE THAT...hehe

By the way I got a hdmi dr. From your guys web shop. Worked perfect in my setup. o

Sorry my English im Norwegian.

Last edited by Dj Dee; 01-09-2015 at 10:30 AM.
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post #177 of 186 Old 01-13-2015, 07:09 AM
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You guys are free to say whatever you want, whether it is the truth or not.

How many people have you "saved" from spending $4k on mods? At this point, if someone wants to spend the money without any research, then that is there problem.

Does a CRT still have an advantage in absolute black level and motion? Yes I do. A little less with on/off cr compared to a JVC with a DI and still a pretty good bit with motion.

The problem with you two is that after I state my conclusions you two immediately ask how I arrive at my conclusions. When I say that I have viewed multiple projector set ups, you two quickly question the set up. If that isn't good enough, then you start to question the my knowledge base of video. You did the same thing with Kris Deering and Darinp.

Again, let it go. The only people that buy CRTs usually do a lot of research on the machines before they buy and still decide they want to either save money on a projector or like the technology itself.

Having fun playing the new mobile game Volley Village
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post #178 of 186 Old 01-13-2015, 09:16 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post
You guys are free to say whatever you want, whether it is the truth or not.

How many people have you "saved" from spending $4k on mods? At this point, if someone wants to spend the money without any research, then that is there problem.

Does a CRT still have an advantage in absolute black level and motion? Yes I do. A little less with on/off cr compared to a JVC with a DI and still a pretty good bit with motion.

The problem with you two is that after I state my conclusions you two immediately ask how I arrive at my conclusions. When I say that I have viewed multiple projector set ups, you two quickly question the set up. If that isn't good enough, then you start to question the my knowledge base of video. You did the same thing with Kris Deering and Darinp.

Again, let it go. The only people that buy CRTs usually do a lot of research on the machines before they buy and still decide they want to either save money on a projector or like the technology itself.
The VW600 Kris and Darin tested had a flaw in the iris that was fixed with a factory reset and it worked better after that. And in the discussion with Kris we say the JVC is totally destroying the Sonys when it comes to very low APL scenes. With CRT´s this is not the case and I see no benefits to the CRT other than 0IRE and motion resolution. And you say it has an advantage in contrast over a JVC with the DI on, what CRT measures 350000:1+ in on/off contrast with correct gamma and no black crush? I would say any CRT would have problems with matching the JVC X700 without the DI engaged, Cine4home measured it at 101000:1 on/off with about 380 lumens with the manual iris closed down.

I have not questioned anything with your setups and where have I questioned you knowledge? To me CRT has no advantage in blacklevel performance(other than 0IRE) and motion is not visible when watching movies, it is only visible when watching motion resolution test patterns. That you guys like CRT´s is fine with me, but to say it is still king or still the bomb with HD I find rather funny. I am not the one with the big headlines claming to still be the bomb or still king.

And it is no problem for me to let go, but is it for you CRT guys?
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post #179 of 186 Old 01-13-2015, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post
You guys are free to say whatever you want, whether it is the truth or not.

How many people have you "saved" from spending $4k on mods? At this point, if someone wants to spend the money without any research, then that is there problem.

Does a CRT still have an advantage in absolute black level and motion? Yes I do. A little less with on/off cr compared to a JVC with a DI and still a pretty good bit with motion.

The problem with you two is that after I state my conclusions you two immediately ask how I arrive at my conclusions. When I say that I have viewed multiple projector set ups, you two quickly question the set up. If that isn't good enough, then you start to question the my knowledge base of video. You did the same thing with Kris Deering and Darinp.

Again, let it go. The only people that buy CRTs usually do a lot of research on the machines before they buy and still decide they want to either save money on a projector or like the technology itself.
Thank you so much that you informed me that I could speak freely on this forum.

And about saving people from research or moding all CRTs in the world I give a ****, just don't say that it's better in any way that's bull talk.

If you still think that a CRT Is absolutely best in black level you are right, but it's very very very close to the new JVC series and then I talk about NO info in picture at all. With info over black 16, then the JVC is much better. Have you done a side by side test of this with a 909? I have many times. And I do not favor the JVC, Sony, Epson or CRT.
I just pick the Vinner in a test.

Here again, motion resolution better on CRT, correct.
But in a side by side test on different fast moving films. The JVC looked better in Blu-ray material.
Have you done a test of this side-by-side? Again I have many times.
So believe what you want I have seen it.

part about Chris testing what happened really if I recall correctly he said that there was something wrong with the projector just like we saied before you Guys started harassing us.
Thanks for sharing your opinion.
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post #180 of 186 Old 01-15-2015, 04:42 PM
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OMG,

I did not realized CRT projector still exist out there. I used to own a Sony 1072 in think. The second was NEC CRT something with bigger lenses. I still have the DVDO processor that does 480P. That was the bomb when it first release.
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