the "help me choose an LCD" thread - Page 512 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #15331 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by piper_chuck View Post
The limit I've set is $2K before tax. Unfortunately, this rules out the Q80R or the X950G, which both look much better on paper than the ones I've been considering.

In the above 80" sizes, the Samsung Q60 82", LG 8070 82" and 86", Sony X850 85", Samsung 800D 82", and Samsung 8000 82" have dropped down into my range. Of these, the 86" LG 8070 seems to have the best viewing angle due to it being IPS. From what I can tell, none of the others provide a wide angle. I briefly reviewed the seating again this morning and I think people sitting anywhere other than the main sofa would not be happy if I don't choose one with a wide viewing angle.

I've seen many people here express concern/negative opinions about IPS, but I've also seen many say they are happy with it. I would classify myself as only moderately critical and the other viewers are much less fussy. Given this and our tendency to not have the room very dark, would IPS be a bad choice?
The only place for an IPS panel is a lighted room. There the short comings of the black levels will not be that noticeable. The UM8070 has some limitations in addition to being IPS, it does not have local dimming and no WCG. Higher end LG NanoCell IPS panels have better colors and WGC, and 8-series have edge dimming and 9-series have FALD.
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post #15332 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
The only place for an IPS panel is a lighted room. There the short comings of the black levels will not be that noticeable. The UM8070 has some limitations in addition to being IPS, it does not have local dimming and no WCG. Higher end LG NanoCell IPS panels have better colors and WGC, and 8-series have edge dimming and 9-series have FALD.
Thanks, I think. I did some more reading to better understand the backlight options. Unfortunately my head is now spinning when I think of things like quantum dots, YAG, phosphors, RGB LEDs, WLEDs, and a bunch of other stuff! Perhaps I'm over analyzing this...
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post #15333 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by piper_chuck View Post
Thanks, I think. I did some more reading to better understand the backlight options. Unfortunately my head is now spinning when I think of things like quantum dots, YAG, phosphors, RGB LEDs, WLEDs, and a bunch of other stuff! Perhaps I'm over analyzing this...
Yes I guess we all have been guilty of that at some point. Take a deep breath, maybe have an adult beverage, decide what's important to you, and what will fit into your budget. It's only a TV after all.

Just don't get to the paralysis by over analysis point of no return.
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post #15334 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 02:21 PM
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It sounds like you need an IPS panel.
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post #15335 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 04:02 PM
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It sounds like you need an IPS panel.
I think that's where I'll end up. The price on the 86" LG 8070 has dropped to a level that's low enough to justify spending a bit more than the 75" I thought would be enough. I know there are other choices which offer a better picture, but they're more than I'm willing to spend.
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post #15336 of 15364 Old 01-13-2020, 09:27 PM
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Hi I am buying a new TV this week and am looking for 82-85." Based on a budget around $2k, which of below two are better? I haven't bought a new TV in awhile so I am not familiar with a lot of the new technology. Thanks in advance

Sony XBR85X850G 85" Class - LED - X850G Series
Samsung QN82Q60RAFXZA 82" Class - LED - Q60 Series
Thanks for the input so far. A little more info- this TV will be used mainly for watching movies, often at night and in low lighting.

I am upgrading from an XBR65X850C and my main goal is a large size as we are looking for a theater-like experience. Reading some posts about the Sony though has me worried about clouding/"flashlighting." Is that something that will be easily noticeable and/or distracting during film viewing?

I am being told that this issue is not as prevalant in the 75" Q70 (QN75Q70RAFXZA) but I really like the larger size of the 85"

Any further input is greatly appreciated!!!
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post #15337 of 15364 Old 01-14-2020, 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by davethomasowns View Post
Thanks for the input so far. A little more info- this TV will be used mainly for watching movies, often at night and in low lighting.

I am upgrading from an XBR65X850C and my main goal is a large size as we are looking for a theater-like experience. Reading some posts about the Sony though has me worried about clouding/"flashlighting." Is that something that will be easily noticeable and/or distracting during film viewing?

I am being told that this issue is not as prevalant in the 75" Q70 (QN75Q70RAFXZA) but I really like the larger size of the 85"

Any further input is greatly appreciated!!!
Most of the reviews of the Sony X850G are of the smaller edge-lit IPS panel models. IPS panels are prone to clouding and flash lighting both of which were mentioned in Rtings review of the 65" X850G IPS model. These issues don't apply to the 85" X850G which is a direct lit VA panel.
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post #15338 of 15364 Old 01-15-2020, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
Most of the reviews of the Sony X850G are of the smaller edge-lit IPS panel models. IPS panels are prone to clouding and flash lighting both of which were mentioned in Rtings review of the 65" X850G IPS model. These issues don't apply to the 85" X850G which is a direct lit VA panel.
Oh really? SO the 85" 850G doesn't have near the blooming as the review videos ive seen in the 65/75" class?

It really sucks i cant go compare the 3 displays in the size i want in an actual store anymore. 85 850G, 85 950G and 82 Q90. My best buy has the 850 in 85 but neither of my other two options.
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post #15339 of 15364 Old 01-16-2020, 12:52 AM
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Oh really? SO the 85" 850G doesn't have near the blooming as the review videos ive seen in the 65/75" class?

It really sucks i cant go compare the 3 displays in the size i want in an actual store anymore. 85 850G, 85 950G and 82 Q90. My best buy has the 850 in 85 but neither of my other two options.
The 850G won't have as deep black levels as the 950G due to the lack of local dimming. It's your call whether the extra $ is worth it. Based on the current BB prices, I'd say no way. If you can find an 85" 900F at a good price, that might be the best choice.
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post #15340 of 15364 Old 01-16-2020, 03:01 PM
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I'm looking to buy a TV for my living room and wanted some suggestions on what size and model I should go with. I currently have a 8 year old panasonic plasma which has none of the tech and goodies of todays TV's so I'm new to all of this stuff..

For background, The TV will be 11 feet away from my seating position and its usually just me who will be watching so viewing angle isn't a big point. My room is well lit during the day: 4 panel window adjacent to the TV wall (4 ft away) and patio door on the other adjacent wall about 15 ft away, but I do most of my TV watching at nighttime. I watch a mix of Movies on Netflix/Prime Video/Youtube and TV shows and sports on cable TV. No gaming at all.

I value:
brightness and color volume
Great black levels
good UI
4K upscaling due to verizon fios cable
great HDR picture for movies( Basically want the wow factor).
I also need to be able to turn off motion interpolation (really hate the soap opera effect).

First: Should I go with a 65" or 75" TV? (is 75" too big for my seating distance of 11ft?)

Second: Which TV do you suggest? My budget is around $3K give or take a few hundred bucks.

Thanks in advance!
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post #15341 of 15364 Old 01-16-2020, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Raz52 View Post
I'm looking to buy a TV for my living room and wanted some suggestions on what size and model I should go with. I currently have a 8 year old panasonic plasma which has none of the tech and goodies of todays TV's so I'm new to all of this stuff..

For background, The TV will be 11 feet away from my seating position and its usually just me who will be watching so viewing angle isn't a big point. My room is well lit during the day: 4 panel window adjacent to the TV wall (4 ft away) and patio door on the other adjacent wall about 15 ft away, but I do most of my TV watching at nighttime. I watch a mix of Movies on Netflix/Prime Video/Youtube and TV shows and sports on cable TV. No gaming at all.

I value:
brightness and color volume
Great black levels
good UI
4K upscaling due to verizon fios cable
great HDR picture for movies( Basically want the wow factor).
I also need to be able to turn off motion interpolation (really hate the soap opera effect).

First: Should I go with a 65" or 75" TV? (is 75" too big for my seating distance of 11ft?)

Second: Which TV do you suggest? My budget is around $3K give or take a few hundred bucks.

Thanks in advance!
First: A 75" to 85" TV is the size to get.

Second: You want a FALD VA panel TV for deep blacks and great HDR. For upscaling, Sony has been the best but LG and Samsung have pretty much caught up. The worst for upscaling 720p cable is Vizio, so avoid that brand. For some options, the 85" Sony 900F is a great deal now at $2,800. The Samsung equivalent would be the 82" Samsung Q70R priced at $2,500 which is a "QLED" with more color volume. The 75" versions of these models come in under $2K.

Higher end FALD VA panels with more dimming zones and wide angle viewing are the 75" Sony Z9F at $2,800 and the 75" Samsung Q80R for $3,000.
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post #15342 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
First: A 75" to 85" TV is the size to get.

Second: You want a FALD VA panel TV for deep blacks and great HDR. For upscaling, Sony has been the best but LG and Samsung have pretty much caught up. The worst for upscaling 720p cable is Vizio, so avoid that brand. For some options, the 85" Sony 900F is a great deal now at $2,800. The Samsung equivalent would be the 82" Samsung Q70R priced at $2,500 which is a "QLED" with more color volume. The 75" versions of these models come in under $2K.

Higher end FALD VA panels with more dimming zones and wide angle viewing are the 75" Sony Z9F at $2,800 and the 75" Samsung Q80R for $3,000.
I am curious as to your value recommendation for the 900f vs the 950g for $200 more. Everything i have read says hands down the 950g is a far superior panel especially for HDR. Have you had other experiences?
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post #15343 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 07:58 AM
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I ended up ordering the 82" Q70R today, I have it scheduled to be delivered next Friday!
Please update us after you spend the weekend with it.

I'm presently debating the 75Q80R vs the 82Q70R and your feedback could be helpful.
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post #15344 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 08:16 AM
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I am curious as to your value recommendation for the 900f vs the 950g for $200 more. Everything i have read says hands down the 950g is a far superior panel especially for HDR. Have you had other experiences?
The larger size X950G 75" and 85" panels are very different from the smaller 55" and 65" ones. They have the X-wide angle layer which lowers contrast ratio significantly to provide a wider viewing angle. For these larger sizes, the X900F has deeper blacks, while the X950G has brighter highlights, so it a push. At Rtings their respective HDR ratings are virtually identical. It's up to you which you like better. Both have similar numbers of FALD zones, fewer than competing Samsungs and so they are more prone to blooming. As far as DV goes, it seems the early production run of X900Fs are problematic while the current inventory does fine with DV. You need to look at them both and decide for yourself which is better to your eye.
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post #15345 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
First: A 75" to 85" TV is the size to get.

Second: You want a FALD VA panel TV for deep blacks and great HDR. For upscaling, Sony has been the best but LG and Samsung have pretty much caught up. The worst for upscaling 720p cable is Vizio, so avoid that brand. For some options, the 85" Sony 900F is a great deal now at $2,800. The Samsung equivalent would be the 82" Samsung Q70R priced at $2,500 which is a "QLED" with more color volume. The 75" versions of these models come in under $2K.

Higher end FALD VA panels with more dimming zones and wide angle viewing are the 75" Sony Z9F at $2,800 and the 75" Samsung Q80R for $3,000.
Thank you for the suggestions. The Sony 950G is definitely on my list as I've read about its upscaling ability. Good to know that samsung and LG have caught up though. If I'm going FALD VA, it seems Sony and Samsung are really the only options here. LG is really only an option if you go OLED from what I've read (too expensive in 77" and burn in scares me).

Would it be fair to say I should be deciding between the Sony 900G / 950G and Samsung Q70 / Q80?

I just can't see myself going upto 85". I think it would look a little overwhelming on my wall.

Last edited by Raz52; 01-17-2020 at 09:48 AM.
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post #15346 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 09:48 AM
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Would it be fair to say I should be deciding between the Sony 900G / 950G and Samsung Q70 / Q80?
Yes, you should look at them and decide for yourself. Keep in mind that the 75" X950G and Q80R have wide angle viewing, while the 75" X900F and Q70R have typically narrow VA panel viewing angles. Sony's HDR algorithms are tuned for shadow detail, while Samsung's are tuned to eliminate blooming and therefore show less shadow detail.
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post #15347 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Raz52 View Post
Thank you for the suggestions. The Sony 950G is definitely on my list as I've read about its upscaling ability. Good to know that samsung and LG have caught up though. If I'm going FALD VA, it seems Sony and Samsung are really the only options here. LG is really only an option if you go OLED from what I've read (too expensive in 77" and burn in scares me).

Would it be fair to say I should be deciding between the Sony 900G / 950G and Samsung Q70 / Q80?

I just can't see myself going upto 85". I think it would look a little overwhelming on my wall.
85 is better but the aesthetics in a living room is understandable. If you are looking at 75", I'd include the Vizio PQX in consideration. As Dave mentioned, 720P upscaling has historically been a weakness but owners are reporting that it is much improved with recent firmware updates. Check the Rtngs review and Whisper Status74 on Youtube has an extensive video series reviewing the performance. Yes its a series, and is very indepth.

You'll gain higher brightness, lower price and avoid the stupid Sony Xwide angle technology which kills contrast.
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post #15348 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 10:24 AM
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85 is better but the aesthetics in a living room is understandable. If you are looking at 75", I'd include the Vizio PQX in consideration. As Dave mentioned, 720P upscaling has historically been a weakness but owners are reporting that it is much improved with recent firmware updates. Check the Rtngs review and Whisper Status74 on Youtube has an extensive video series reviewing the performance. Yes its a series, and is very indepth.

You'll gain higher brightness, lower price and avoid the stupid Sony Xwide angle technology which kills contrast.
Thanks , I'll add the Vizio PQX to my list and definitely take a look at Rtings and the youtube series you mentioned. I have a feeling HDR and 4K content will look acceptable on all of the TV's on my list, but when watching upscaled verizon fios content, I'd like to avoid the graininess and pixelation I sometimes see on newer TV's. My plasma presents the image in a soft way rather than grainy which I prefer between the two.

I secretly had the Samsung Q80 on the top of my list because of the "larger than life" way it presents the images. Very vivid and saturated colors. I understand that samsung doesn't offer Dolby Vision. Is this a deal breaker?
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post #15349 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 10:50 AM
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Thanks , I'll add the Vizio PQX to my list and definitely take a look at Rtings and the youtube series you mentioned. I have a feeling HDR and 4K content will look acceptable on all of the TV's on my list, but when watching upscaled verizon fios content, I'd like to avoid the graininess and pixelation I sometimes see on newer TV's. My plasma presents the image in a soft way rather than grainy which I prefer between the two.

I secretly had the Samsung Q80 on the top of my list because of the "larger than life" way it presents the images. Very vivid and saturated colors. I understand that samsung doesn't offer Dolby Vision. Is this a deal breaker?
I watch lots of sports, especially football, on Verizon Fios and Fox's 720p signal is the most problematic. So if you go Vizio, in addition to the standard DSE/Banding/Jail Bars issues, be sure that they have actually improved their 720p upscaling. Rtings rating found the usual Vizio DSE, gradient banding, and 720p upscaling issues in their review of the PQX.

Regarding DV you'll get all kinds of opinions about it. For me, it's not a big deal, especially if you like the more over the top HDR on the Samsung Q80R.
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post #15350 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 10:59 AM
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I watch lots of sports, especially football, on Verizon Fios and Fox's 720p signal is the most problematic. So if you go Vizio, in addition to the standard DSE/Banding/Jail Bars issues, be sure that they have actually improved their 720p upscaling. Rtings rating found the usual Vizio DSE, gradient banding, and 720p upscaling issues in their review of the PQX.

Regarding DV you'll get all kinds of opinions about it. For me, it's not a big deal, especially if you like the more over the top HDR on the Samsung Q80R.
Check the Vizio PQX thread for owner feedback about the latest firmware and impact on 720P upscaling. Also be prepared to return a 75" TV if you are not happy, which applies to any TV you ultimately select. Costco online provides free return pickup for what its worth.

720P Fox broadcasts look as bad on my Sony 900F as they did on my 2018 Vizio PQuantum. Either Vizio's poor upscaling is overstated or Sony's upscaling is overrated IMO.

Dolby Vision is more important for movies. Most are being released with Dolby Vision these days. The improvements vs HDR10 are going to vary from movie to movie.
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post #15351 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 04:14 PM
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I watch lots of sports, especially football, on Verizon Fios and Fox's 720p signal is the most problematic. So if you go Vizio, in addition to the standard DSE/Banding/Jail Bars issues, be sure that they have actually improved their 720p upscaling. Rtings rating found the usual Vizio DSE, gradient banding, and 720p upscaling issues in their review of the PQX.

Regarding DV you'll get all kinds of opinions about it. For me, it's not a big deal, especially if you like the more over the top HDR on the Samsung Q80R.
Will def look into the 720p upscaling. I have a feeling I'll have to try them all out to find the one thats right for me. At the end I have a feeling its going to be between the Samsung Q80R or Sony 950H. SHould I also be considering the Sony Z9F? Where does that fall when comparing to the Q80 and 950H?
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Check the Vizio PQX thread for owner feedback about the latest firmware and impact on 720P upscaling. Also be prepared to return a 75" TV if you are not happy, which applies to any TV you ultimately select. Costco online provides free return pickup for what its worth.

720P Fox broadcasts look as bad on my Sony 900F as they did on my 2018 Vizio PQuantum. Either Vizio's poor upscaling is overstated or Sony's upscaling is overrated IMO.

Dolby Vision is more important for movies. Most are being released with Dolby Vision these days. The improvements vs HDR10 are going to vary from movie to movie.
Free return delivery is a huge plus. I think I will be doing that. What are your opinions on the Z9F compared to the TV's we've been talking about?
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Free return delivery is a huge plus. I think I will be doing that. What are your opinions on the Z9F compared to the TV's we've been talking about?
Superb TV except that it has the Xwide angle technology to give wider viewing angles. But at the expense of contrast. Poor contrast is a showstopper in my books, and contrast is the single biggest factor in Rtngs overall performance measurements. The Z9F is dropping in price for a reason.
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post #15354 of 15364 Old 01-17-2020, 05:04 PM
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Will def look into the 720p upscaling. I have a feeling I'll have to try them all out to find the one thats right for me. At the end I have a feeling its going to be between the Samsung Q80R or Sony 950H. SHould I also be considering the Sony Z9F? Where does that fall when comparing to the Q80 and 950H?
The Z9F is better than the X950G, but since the X950H isn't actually out yet, who knows about that one. The Z9F was the 2018 Sony LCD flagship, has the X-wide angle layer for extended viewing angles, with lowered contrast ratio similar to the 75" X950G, but it has more FALD zones and is brighter than the X950G. I think its ideal for bright family rooms but not for dark room viewing. The 75" Samsung Q80R has deeper blacks than either the 75" X950G or 75" Z9F. Go look at them a see what you think.
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Should I repair or run away....

I have a 5.5 year old Samsung, 65" LCD - UN65H6350 series.

The LCD strips have started acting up, first, one of the plastic discs fell out. That was repaired for $300, which seemed high considering there were no parts ordered.

Now, six weeks later, a second one is acting up. The repair shop had me come in and take a look at ALL the led's while it was apart. About eight of them in various strips had started to emit different colors and intensities, in so much that when the plastic film was laid back down, you could see the effect it caused across the sheet, with regards to hot-spots, color, etc.

So, now the question - do I spend another $200 to replace ALL the LCD strips, as the repair place is suggesting? Will I have another 5 years of trouble free results, or do replacement LCD strips have a higher failure rate than do factory installed ones.

The reason for keeping and repairing this model is that it has PIP, which I use several times a year. I can't find any new TV's that include PIP as a feature anymore.

Thanks for any and all input....
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post #15356 of 15364 Old Yesterday, 12:09 PM
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Superb TV except that it has the Xwide angle technology to give wider viewing angles. But at the expense of contrast. Poor contrast is a showstopper in my books, and contrast is the single biggest factor in Rtngs overall performance measurements. The Z9F is dropping in price for a reason.
Okay, but what are we really talking about here? "Poor contrast" as in poor overall or poor as in slightly worse than models without the xwide tech?

Having had the 65" 900f and now the 75" 950g, I can barely notice the contrast difference when viewing. It's weird. I keep reading posters generally refer to this poorer contrast on the xwide models, but I certainly don't see it. Is this a tech spec thing or what?

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post #15357 of 15364 Old Yesterday, 12:10 PM
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Check the Vizio PQX thread for owner feedback about the latest firmware and impact on 720P upscaling. Also be prepared to return a 75" TV if you are not happy, which applies to any TV you ultimately select. Costco online provides free return pickup for what its worth.



720P Fox broadcasts look as bad on my Sony 900F as they did on my 2018 Vizio PQuantum. Either Vizio's poor upscaling is overstated or Sony's upscaling is overrated IMO.



Dolby Vision is more important for movies. Most are being released with Dolby Vision these days. The improvements vs HDR10 are going to vary from movie to movie.
720 will look bad on every 4k display. It's that simple.

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post #15358 of 15364 Old Yesterday, 12:36 PM
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Okay, but what are we really talking about here? "Poor contrast" as in poor overall or poor as in slightly worse than models without the xwide tech?

Having had the 65" 900f and now the 75" 950g, I can barely notice the contrast difference when viewing. It's weird. I keep reading posters generally refer to this poorer contrast on the xwide models, but I certainly don't see it. Is this a tech spec thing or what?
I think a useful term describing the difference is "slightly reduces contrast". Also, rtings often mentions that many measurements are done with instruments and may not be readily seen by eyesight, or words to that effect.

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720 will look bad on every 4k display. It's that simple.
Not true from my experiences.
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post #15359 of 15364 Old Yesterday, 01:15 PM
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I think a useful term describing the difference is "slightly reduces contrast". Also, rtings often mentions that many measurements are done with instruments and may not be readily seen by eyesight, or words to that effect.

Not true from my experiences.
I'd love to know what 4k displays do even a good job with 720. Perhaps I was too hasty in my prior comment. I must have run 720 content through 15-20 different 4k sets at BB and/or local tv stores and didn't find a single one that was satisfactory.

And, I think you nailed with the "slightly reduces contrast" characterization. The commens that others leave regarding the hit to contrast would give readers the impression that not only if there is perceptible difference, but that contrast is nearly fatally affected.
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post #15360 of 15364 Old Yesterday, 01:20 PM
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I'd love to know what 4k displays do even a good job with 720. Perhaps I was too hasty in my prior comment. I must have run 720 content through 15-20 different 4k sets at BB and/or local tv stores and didn't find a single one that was satisfactory.

And, I think you nailed with the "slightly reduces contrast" characterization. The commens that others leave regarding the hit to contrast would give readers the impression that not only if there is perceptible difference, but that contrast is nearly fatally affected.

720P from OTA sources looks excellent on my 75x900e, football on Fox is excellent.

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