Ultra-D Glasses-Free 3D TV Hands-On Experience - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 200 Old 05-02-2014, 11:00 PM
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When my daughter was six she turned to me after watching a show from the 60's and said "I don't like gray TV." I can see in ten years her six year old daughter returning from watching grampa's 90" OLED TV and saying "I don't like flat TV!"

Early adapters fund expensive new AV technology so that after a few years development costs have been recouped and prices come down to be affordable to all consumers. Ultra-D technology may be an unusual exception where the adoption is trickle up. Mathu Ragan has said that 42" and 46" panels produced by Hisense could be available this year and be very affordable. These parameters suggest that the entry end of the TV market may embrace this technology before the high end gets on board. Grampa with his high-end OLED may not want a degradation of his 4K image. The entry level consumer may not be as concerned with image quality as with what he/she considers an affordable enhancement to a now mundane commodity - hi def TV. As Ultra-D TV gains technological sophistication, hi-end consumers will be the last to get on board. The early adaptors will actually be the low end consumers.

If my theory comes to pass, marketing assumptions may have an interesting divergent case study to evaluate.
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post #62 of 200 Old 05-03-2014, 12:46 PM
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I think you have a good point about the screen size. Also wasn't 3d welcomed more in china and some other countries where space is limited for larger panels?
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post #63 of 200 Old 05-03-2014, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by javanpohl View Post

Well, duh wink.gif I've never understood how you passive 3d fans have ever tolerated that. Don't know if it's a difference in vision or perception but I watched a passive 3d demo for about two seconds and saw the inferior resolution as clear as day. And the buddy that was with me was really impressed. Go figure.

Ultra-D sounds pretty intriguing. However, I'll, uh... have to check it out for myself before I get too excited smile.gif

We don't watch it in 2d so we aren't aware of the loss.. Ok, not entirely true, still are aware if you are sitting close enough (especially as it gives some parts of images a slight aliased/jaggy edge look).. Not sure why anyone would be a 'fan' in terms of pure 3d image quality. I got my 3d passive tv primarily due to price (low, while I wait for UHD +3D tvs to hit mainstream), the fact that shutter glasses are expensive, and I can see the shutter effect which hurts my eyes after a few hours of viewing (kinda like 60hz on CRT computer monitors used to bug the crap out of me). I had 8 people over the other day watching 3d at the same time and I think I spent about $10 after tax on all those glasses. Didn't even stress about the kids who were being kids and manhandling them somewhat. Not happing with active glasses.

Every one of these reports from AVS just make me sad as they aren't reviewing a soon to be released product, just showing us how cool it would be if someone ever did (with no concrete hope anyone will in the near term).
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post #64 of 200 Old 05-03-2014, 04:18 PM
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One somewhat silly thing I'm concerned with about consumer adoption, if they want to brand it with their name it would be: "Ultra-D Ultra HD" or "Ultra HD with Ultra-D". I can see consumers looking at this, scratching their head thinking W-T-Ultra-F? wink.gif
Kidding aside I do really see this being bad for them as it is confusing and will be hard for folks to be clear that it is their name and to communicate it to others "no ultra-d is different than ultra hd but it can be on an ultra hd tv or a hdtv.." Really should consider changing the product's name.
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post #65 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 07:02 PM
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I'll be following this thread closely. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like to experience this technology firsthand. I was thinking of getting a 4K passive 3D set this year, but this potentially could be better. I love watching movies and gaming in 3D, and am excited to hear more about ultra d.
Couple questions. How is the crosstalk performance? This is one area where passive shines. Also, how much does viewing distance affect the 3D effect?

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post #66 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eapleitez View Post

I'll be following this thread closely. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like to experience this technology firsthand. I was thinking of getting a 4K passive 3D set this year, but this potentially could be better. I love watching movies and gaming in 3D, and am excited to hear more about ultra d.
Couple questions. How is the crosstalk performance? This is one area where passive shines. Also, how much does viewing distance affect the 3D effect?

 

I almost forgot what crosstalk was, ever since my active 3D Panasonic plasma broke a couple years back I've only caught a few fleeting glimpses. I'll see if I can find a good test for it. I have not scrutinized the effective viewing distances and angles yet, but I aim to summarize the experience in a review of sorts, so I will get to that this week.


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post #67 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 08:51 PM
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Thank you Mark for this update! Your efforts are greatly appreciated.
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post #68 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 09:03 PM
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Are you able to move your head around freely without any negative artifacts to the 3D effect, quite unlike Nintendo's implementation on the 3DS?
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post #69 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 09:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Are you able to move your head around freely without any negative artifacts to the 3D effect, quite unlike Nintendo's implementation on the 3DS?

 

Yes you can freely move your head without losing the effect, unlike Nintendo's screen or other similar lenticular displays I've seen. There is a slight rippling artifact when you move, but it is not distracting unless you bob your head like a chicken.

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post #70 of 200 Old 05-04-2014, 11:46 PM
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That's reassuring. I was worried that while there would be many viewing angles, moving your head too much could reveal distracting artifacts. I'm starting to get excited about these displays. I was originally interested in the Vizio R and P-series, but while they read better on a technical level Ultra-D seems like the more "fun" option.

And the 2D to 3D conversion is surprisingly good in terms of depth and accuracy? If it truly lives up to those promises, then I can imagine going through my entire video library again in binge sessions to see how they all look. The Lord of the Rings trilogy, Star Trek: Deep Space Nine and Ridley Scott's Alien and Aliens are all on my short list. How good is the conversion with SD content, though?
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post #71 of 200 Old 05-05-2014, 05:26 PM
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Love this update, thank you! What would be awesome would be a short throw projector, like Philips offering, where it sits just 1 foot from the screen. Many home theaters have AT screens with a couple feet of space behind the screens. All we would need to do is replace the screen with the multiple layers like the flat panel displays were described as having and build a small shelf for the projector. Problem solved...to bad solutions aren't always that easy!

As to marketing, they could call it the Ultra H Double D and offer cross selling with stores lingerie departments!! biggrin.gifeek.gif
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post #72 of 200 Old 05-08-2014, 10:50 AM
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sorry if this was answered, but what lighting conditions have you tested this in and what were the results of watch ability in those different conditions in both 2D and 3D?

I'm a Panasonic Plasma THX certified TV owner and have never regretted it, with the trade off being bright rooms needing to be lighting controlled for daytime viewing.

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post #73 of 200 Old 05-08-2014, 02:05 PM
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"there is no "peek around" effect. None whatsoever. Just depth."

Does this mean that you lose the depth the further away from the center you go? If so, then what would that viewing angle be? I saw this question asked earlier, but I didn't notice an answer to it.

I am already planning my movie nights with a whole bunch of people over and I need to know how many people can fit in the viewing space. This way I know how much beer to buy. Thanks again for the update, very exciting!
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post #74 of 200 Old 05-08-2014, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by addiction41999 View Post

"there is no "peek around" effect. None whatsoever. Just depth."

Does this mean that you lose the depth the further away from the center you go? If so, then what would that viewing angle be? I saw this question asked earlier, but I didn't notice an answer to it.

I am already planning my movie nights with a whole bunch of people over and I need to know how many people can fit in the viewing space. This way I know how much beer to buy. Thanks again for the update, very exciting!

You shouldn't lose depth. But all glasses free technology does limit popout somewhat from what I have heard elsewhere

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post #75 of 200 Old 05-08-2014, 07:29 PM
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Have they said when this display will hit the market or will/are they interested in licensing out Ultra D technology to manufacturers? I usually buy a new display about every 7 years, my last one was just 2 years ago, but for 4k and glasses free, I'd upgrade in the next 2 to 3 years if it's available. It sounds like Ultra D is the best glasses free tech out there right now, I could see this really helping 3D out if it succeeds for those that hate the glasses. Personally, I think it would be nice when company comes over, to not have to get all the glasses ready. That and keeping them clean.

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post #76 of 200 Old 05-08-2014, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Have they said when this display will hit the market or will/are they interested in licensing out Ultra D technology to manufacturers? I usually buy a new display about every 7 years, my last one was just 2 years ago, but for 4k and glasses free, I'd upgrade in the next 2 to 3 years if it's available. It sounds like Ultra D is the best glasses free tech out there right now, I could see this really helping 3D out if it succeeds for those that hate the glasses. Personally, I think it would be nice when company comes over, to not have to get all the glasses ready. That and keeping them clean.

 Ultra-D is a licensed technology, the consumer-oriented TVs will come from OEMs. When I have a firm date for product availability, I'll certainly report on it.

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post #77 of 200 Old 05-09-2014, 11:50 AM
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Sorry, I should have said "backlit flat-panel display-agnostic," as in it works with LCD or Plasma or OLED or Rear projection (even CRT, presumably). The key is that light has to pass through a lenticular filter on the screen, as opposed to reflecting off it.

Hi. I have a FujiFilm FinePix W3 REAL3D camera paired up with an LG Cinema 3D D2343 passive display, a PS3 and an iMac. The camera has a rear view screen that displays in 3D. Everywhere I take the camera people are surprised that I have a 3D camera, such is the quality of the camera's screen. I believe it too has a filter with lenticular lenses like you describe. Presumably the Ultra-D is a full sized version of this screen?

The screen on the W3 is bright and colourful but one does need to view it straight on. Well mostly so; there is some degree of freedom to either side of head on, but not a lot. I wonder if this has been improved with the Ultra-D allow several persons side-by-side on a settee for instance, to view full 3D?

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post #78 of 200 Old 05-12-2014, 07:53 PM
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The unit tested was only a 30 hertz panel. The units for production are 50&55 inch 60 hertz and 65 inch 120 hertz with newer panels, the prices are very affordable . Make sure Leo Reilly gives you the latest version for next round of testing
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post #79 of 200 Old 05-12-2014, 07:58 PM
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The unit tested was only a 30 hertz panel. The units for production are 50&55 inch 60 hertz and 65 inch 120 hertz with newer panels, the prices are very affordable . Make sure Leo Reilly gives you the latest version for next round of testing

Can you give us any type of clue as to when we will start seeing these TV's in our local stores for purchase? Specifically the US market.
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post #80 of 200 Old 05-12-2014, 08:18 PM
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The unit tested was only a 30 hertz panel. The units for production are 50&55 inch 60 hertz and 65 inch 120 hertz with newer panels, the prices are very affordable . Make sure Leo Reilly gives you the latest version for next round of testing

Well, if Mark's testing with the 30hz version of the display is any indication, he's probably in for a real treat during the next round. He seems quite impressed with what he's seen so far.

You have some very excited future customers here, Mathu. On the morning these displays hit the shelves, I'll be banging on the Best Buy door before they open. biggrin.gif
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post #81 of 200 Old 05-13-2014, 01:31 PM
 
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... 65 inch 120 hertz with newer panels...

This is what I am waiting for. I am saving up my lunch money.
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post #82 of 200 Old 05-13-2014, 01:34 PM
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Please Eat it is not that expensive
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post #83 of 200 Old 05-13-2014, 02:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathu rajan View Post

The unit tested was only a 30 hertz panel. The units for production are 50&55 inch 60 hertz and 65 inch 120 hertz with newer panels, the prices are very affordable . Make sure Leo Reilly gives you the latest version for next round of testing

Well, if Mark's testing with the 30hz version of the display is any indication, he's probably in for a real treat during the next round. He seems quite impressed with what he's seen so far.

You have some very excited future customers here, Mathu. On the morning these displays hit the shelves, I'll be banging on the Best Buy door before they open. biggrin.gif

 

Joseph, that you for loaning me the 3D video camera. In the next couple of days I'll have an update ready for this thread. I was really surprised to hear that the panel was only 30 Hz, yeah I'd really love to see what a larger, better screen looks like. 65 inches would be quite immersive from usual 8-foot viewing distance.


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post #84 of 200 Old 05-14-2014, 07:29 AM
 
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post #85 of 200 Old 05-17-2014, 10:41 AM
 
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It's the middle of May already. It's a bit surprising that we haven't heard anything about release schedule from any of the brands if the Ultra D TVs are going to be released this year. I guess it's better than announcing release and not keeping to it like Vizio is wont to do but the suspense is killing me. mad.gif
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It's the middle of May already. It's a bit surprising that we haven't heard anything about release schedule from any of the brands if the Ultra D TVs are going to be released this year. I guess it's better than announcing release and not keeping to it like Vizio is wont to do but the suspense is killing me. mad.gif

I'm in need a of a new tv and was holding out to see if this product would hit the market soon. My gut tells me that it's still going to be a while. First it was going to be come out last year. Then it was early this year. Now who the heck knows. When Mark received a demo unit @ 30 hz that still isn't integrated with the new Qualcomm chip, I took it as an ominous sign in regard to an upcoming release date.

Even if it does start rolling out, the only trusted brand to possibly implement this tech is Toshiba. Who knows if they're even going to put it in any of their sets. I realize that many Chinese manufacturers are signed up, but I'm not a big fan of those brands and they are very limited in the States.
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post #87 of 200 Old 05-17-2014, 11:01 PM
 
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FYI, there is a new glasses-free technology (by MIT, no less) for projectors now, to be unveiled at Siggraph 2014:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/05/140516203332.htm
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post #88 of 200 Old 05-18-2014, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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It's the middle of May already. It's a bit surprising that we haven't heard anything about release schedule from any of the brands if the Ultra D TVs are going to be released this year. I guess it's better than announcing release and not keeping to it like Vizio is wont to do but the suspense is killing me. mad.gif

 

I just looked at my notes from CES 2014. I was told there would be real product in Q3 of 2014. I can definitely follow up on that and see if it's still what they think, or if a new ETA is needed. I'll do that tomorrow.


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post #89 of 200 Old 05-19-2014, 06:46 PM
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I just looked at my notes from CES 2014. I was told there would be real product in Q3 of 2014. I can definitely follow up on that and see if it's still what they think, or if a new ETA is needed. I'll do that tomorrow.

Thanks for checking for us Mark. We're all just dying to get our hands on a production version. However, since your pre-production version is fairly small and only 30hz, forgive me if I'm guessing that full production, 55 - 65 inch sets with 120 hz will not be available at retail in as early as the next 6 weeks. Even the end of Q3 seems pretty aggressive since thus far there are no production models announced by any partners and I see no advertising to speak of surrounding a potential launch of Ultra-D.

It wouldn't be the most impressive new tech debut if it launched in just the next few months with little to no excitement built up, especially for something so game-changing! eek.gif
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post #90 of 200 Old 05-19-2014, 08:07 PM
 
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I just looked at my notes from CES 2014. I was told there would be real product in Q3 of 2014. I can definitely follow up on that and see if it's still what they think, or if a new ETA is needed. I'll do that tomorrow.

Ah, Ultra D did announce more specific date. I thought it was sometime 2014. Good grief. I am afraid they are going to pull a Vizio, i.e., announce actual release date and not keep to it; in fact, completely neglect to mention anything after the initial announcement.

Like McGriddle said, if the product is coming out this year, we would have started seeing an ad or two especially since this would be a game changing TV tech. All we have is the CEO coming on this forum every now and then, dropping pithy, amusing line or two with no substantial content. And, to be frank, it's a bit disappointing when CEO keeps emphasizing that it will be cheap and evade offering solid information like actual release and pricing range. (To be fair, he may not contractually be allowed to disclose that kind of information.)

This is really perplexing. Since imagic did have his hands on a prototype, it can't be a vaporware (to borrow gamer's parlance) but otherwise Ultra D is sure behaving like a vaporware.
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