Official 2014 Vizio Mxxx-Bx Series owners thread - Page 114 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3391 of 3766 Old 03-13-2015, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigOc90 View Post
Like you Primetime, I to noticed a little of the stutter while watching sports on my M60 (1.34 firmware), not bad enough to make me want to take the TV back, but just enough to notice from time to time. I watch sports probably 75 to 80% of the time from Aug ( pro and college football ) through March madness ( love college basketball......Md terp fan ) and I have ( like sonoftumble ) the Direct TV Geni ( HR 44 ) connected to my Yamaha V677 and then to my M60.
I decided to turn on the video processing on my Yamaha ( mostly just to play around and see what it would do ) and also noticed it helped. The V677 is not top of the line ( about a middle of the line AV receiver ), but it does do a pretty good job of video processing and it did seem to help.
It seemed to help the look of the standard definition channels also, but that could be all in my head. But man, right now..........I am loving my M60 with your settings (that I got from a sonoftumble post) and my V677 along with the Geni !
What AV receiver are you using ?
I have on Onkyo 818 which has pretty good video processing but I had never used it before. I now use the scaling and noise reduction to cleanup my Dish feed. So far so good.
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post #3392 of 3766 Old 03-15-2015, 11:45 AM
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Hey all, I have had the M55" for a while now. I am thinking of getting the 60" and wondering how different the VA panel looks compared to the IPS panel I have. I understand the viewing angle is a lot narrower, and that the VA panel will have a greater contrast ratio. I usually watch dead-on or 30 degrees off center. I'm thinking the extra size and higher contrast ratio will outweigh the viewing angles. Anything else I'm missing? Thanks!
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post #3393 of 3766 Old 03-15-2015, 05:05 PM
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Does anyone have any experience with the 60 and 65 inch models? I was wondering if there would be a noticeable difference in picture quality since the 60 inch will have more leds per square inch. Thanks.
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post #3394 of 3766 Old 03-15-2015, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post
So for the last while (months?) I have noticed occasional picture stutter on my 70". It's been a slow process trying to troubleshoot it but I think I have nailed it down to the TV and not the Dish Hopper, receiver or source. And note this TV and my previous one both pre and post board swap had the same issue (which is why I didn't think it was the TV). I seem to only notice it watching sports but that is 90% of what I watch via satellite or OTA. Anyway, what I found is when I reduce the load on the TV video processor, meaning upscale everything to 1080p in my receiver, I do not have the issue. It is very repeatable as I can rewind multiple times and see the problem, then switch to external scaling and the issue is gone. This is not something that happens a lot, maybe a handful of times during a game that I notice but was annoying to me. I don't recall seeing any other posts related to this in this thread however some similar things have been pointed out on the P series until recent firmware updates. So just an FYI as to what worked for me and curious if others see the same.

Edit: Note this is the 1.34 firmware
This is issue I have on my 42" with 1.34.

It stutters the worst while watching live golf.

Vizio told me to shut off clear motion and set film mode to off.

Obviously still does it.
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post #3395 of 3766 Old 03-15-2015, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by hort22 View Post
This is issue I have on my 42" with 1.34.

It stutters the worst while watching live golf.

Vizio told me to shut off clear motion and set film mode to off.

Obviously still does it.
I had the same issue Hort 22,


I just returned and got the sony kdl-48w600b. it was a $12.00 difference.

June
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post #3396 of 3766 Old 03-15-2015, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by donaldsonjune View Post
I had the same issue Hort 22,


I just returned and got the sony kdl-48w600b. it was a $12.00 difference.

So no stutter on the Sony?

Really like everything else about the unit, but the stutter is pretty crappy at times.

Got mine from amazon so returning not quite as easy.
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post #3397 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by hort22 View Post
So no stutter on the Sony?

Really like everything else about the unit, but the stutter is pretty crappy at times.

Got mine from amazon so returning not quite as easy.
Hello Hort22, Choose your pain! Do you still have the box? Amazon return policy is usual very easy. Best Buys match Amazon prices now!!

June
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post #3398 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 10:34 AM
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M602i-3b owner here. For connecting an Xbox One, should the Xbox One be set to output at Full RGB or limited TV? I am using primetimeguy's settings, so Black Level is set to Off on the Vizio.

If the suggestion is to change Xbox One output to Full RGB, do I need to make any changes to primetimeguy's settings?

Thanks

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post #3399 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremygary View Post
M602i-3b owner here. For connecting an Xbox One, should the Xbox One be set to output at Full RGB or limited TV? I am using primetimeguy's settings, so Black Level is set to Off on the Vizio.

If the suggestion is to change Xbox One output to Full RGB, do I need to make any changes to primetimeguy's settings?

Thanks

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My guess says it should be set to Limited TV but I don't have an XBOX.
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post #3400 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post
My guess says it should be set to Limited TV but I don't have an XBOX.
I have had it set to limited TV, but not sure whether the 602i can output Full RGB and I don't have metering equipment to test with. So I came to the forum for any advice.

Thanks for your settings, by the way. The have worked really well for me.

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post #3401 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 03:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jeremygary View Post
I have had it set to limited TV, but not sure whether the 602i can output Full RGB and I don't have metering equipment to test with. So I came to the forum for any advice.

Thanks for your settings, by the way. The have worked really well for me.

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk
The 602i appears to support full RGB. At least with the PS3 full setting on and a calibration disc, I can see shades above 235 depending on where I set my contrast. I have it at 75 now, which leaves a few steps of headroom just in case. Still don't understand if this is the ideal setting to leave the console on, though.
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post #3402 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremygary View Post
I have had it set to limited TV, but not sure whether the 602i can output Full RGB and I don't have metering equipment to test with. So I came to the forum for any advice.

Thanks for your settings, by the way. The have worked really well for me.

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk
Set it to limited as that is what the TV is expecting.
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post #3403 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 04:42 PM
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Does anyone here have some calibration settings they'd like to share for the Vizio M492i-B2 televsion? Thanks!
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post #3404 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 05:00 PM
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hey this is probably way off base but thought i would post anyway and see what you guys think about my stutter/judder problem.

so my cable box either outputs in 720p or 1080i...i have it set to 720p and the channels that i notice the most issues are are channels that are shot in 1080i like nbc, the golf channel, etc...

should that have anything to do with what is going on with the stutter?
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post #3405 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by hort22 View Post
hey this is probably way off base but thought i would post anyway and see what you guys think about my stutter/judder problem.

so my cable box either outputs in 720p or 1080i...i have it set to 720p and the channels that i notice the most issues are are channels that are shot in 1080i like nbc, the golf channel, etc...

should that have anything to do with what is going on with the stutter?
It very well could. I see occasional stutter as well as after finally tracking it down to the TV and not the source I now have my receiver upconvert everything to 1080p to take some processing load off the TV. I haven't see stutter since doing that but it has only been a short while. I had noticed it on 720p channels even when the satellite box was outputting 720p.
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post #3406 of 3766 Old 03-16-2015, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post
It very well could. I see occasional stutter as well as after finally tracking it down to the TV and not the source I now have my receiver upconvert everything to 1080p to take some processing load off the TV. I haven't see stutter since doing that but it has only been a short while. I had noticed it on 720p channels even when the satellite box was outputting 720p.
well i just switched my cable box to 1080i to see if i can see produce the same judder...amazon is allowing me to send it back for a full refund if i want even though i am past the 30 days by a bit, also they did allow me a few extra days to decide...so per usual i have no idea what i am doing...

what was so special and different about my 2007 model samsung 32" lcd? not one issue that beast!
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post #3407 of 3766 Old 03-17-2015, 05:29 AM
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Is there any way to disable the wifi on the M55? It's driving me nuts, as it's taking a full 40 mhz width from a pretty crowded 2.4ghz spectrum around me.

I went as far as to factory reset with the wired connection in, with no luck. Very annoying this can't be toggled off!!!
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post #3408 of 3766 Old 03-17-2015, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xkalibur View Post
The 602i appears to support full RGB. At least with the PS3 full setting on and a calibration disc, I can see shades above 235 depending on where I set my contrast. I have it at 75 now, which leaves a few steps of headroom just in case. Still don't understand if this is the ideal setting to leave the console on, though.
That is typical of LCD tech generally - whites do not hard clip. I would look to below black. I would think it would be a calibration issue rather than the panel not passing anything outside of 16 to 235 (my 60 passes below black and I always calibrate to pass above 235.

td
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post #3409 of 3766 Old 03-17-2015, 01:17 PM
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That is typical of LCD tech generally - whites do not hard clip. I would look to below black. I would think it would be a calibration issue rather than the panel not passing anything outside of 16 to 235 (my 60 passes below black and I always calibrate to pass above 235.

td
It seems as though opinion is split on whether to enable limited or Full RGB. Most articles and forums I have read had folks split 50/50.

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post #3410 of 3766 Old 03-17-2015, 02:01 PM
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Posted this in the defective firmware thread.

But my issue is splotches. So maybe there is someone here who can help.

I have another issue. When I first power up the TV, the Directv screensaver is on or it cuts to a commercial & there is the momentary black I see see splotches.

Because the flat test pattern is light, it's not as noticeable. I have sun from the west pouring in and need to be able to point it ouy to the guy so Vizio will swap it out. I don't see how a board will fix that.

Suggestions?
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post #3411 of 3766 Old 03-18-2015, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by jeremygary View Post
It seems as though opinion is split on whether to enable limited or Full RGB. Most articles and forums I have read had folks split 50/50.

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk

I believe I was simply pointing out the set is capable of passing a full 8 bit range.

As to any controversy, anyone can set their range to whatever they wish, it's their set. However, Studio Video and Film source are encoded 16 to 235 so anything outside of that is not meant to be seen (unless "deep colour"), though as I stated I do not hard clip. Computer sources are the full 8 bit range. Though I've a "fat" PS3, I am not a gamer so I've not given it any thought other than I've always thought of games as computer based imagery so 'Full". Set it for what you wish, it's your display.

td
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post #3412 of 3766 Old 03-18-2015, 03:18 AM
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Since I use the Xbox One for both video content AND gaming, "limited" seems to be the most appropriate setting for me. Thanks for your input, everyone.

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post #3413 of 3766 Old 03-18-2015, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by tiki master View Post
I'm having the same problem with my 50" M series. It's not occurring exactly every 30 minutes though. The timing seems to be completely random. I have the 1.0.5 firmware also. I previously had a 2013 E series with two messed up hdmi inputs and I replaced that tv with this 2014 M series. Love the picture quality on both but I'm starting to seriously question Vizio's quality control/reliability. Any tips on how to possibly fix this freezing issue would be appreciated.
I called Vizio a couple of days after my initial post. They brought out a replacement and the new one hasn't had any issues whatsoever.
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post #3414 of 3766 Old 03-19-2015, 10:14 AM
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Is there any way to disable the wifi on the M55? It's driving me nuts, as it's taking a full 40 mhz width from a pretty crowded 2.4ghz spectrum around me.

I went as far as to factory reset with the wired connection in, with no luck. Very annoying this can't be toggled off!!!
There is no way to just "toggle off the wifi, but you cann make it forget your password and other connection info it needs to connect to the wifi.
Go to this post post (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-lc...l#post31373633 ) I made a while back telling another member the only way i know of to get it to stop connecting to the wifi.

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post #3415 of 3766 Old 03-19-2015, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by tvted View Post
I believe I was simply pointing out the set is capable of passing a full 8 bit range.

As to any controversy, anyone can set their range to whatever they wish, it's their set. However, Studio Video and Film source are encoded 16 to 235 so anything outside of that is not meant to be seen (unless "deep colour"), though as I stated I do not hard clip. Computer sources are the full 8 bit range. Though I've a "fat" PS3, I am not a gamer so I've not given it any thought other than I've always thought of games as computer based imagery so 'Full". Set it for what you wish, it's your display.

td
The research I have done indicates that the "native" mode for the Xbox 360 was Limited RGB and if you set the Xbox to Full, it scales/interpolates the Limited Range to Full.

However, the Xbox's scaling is flawed and it isn't accurately interpolating the new values for the expanded greyscale. If you stick with Limited, this isn't a problem since it isn't introduced into the mix. I don't know if this flaw was carried over to the Xbox One, but I would just about bet that it was...

Here is the text of the thread from the HighDef Forums addressing this:

On the AVS Forums they had this discussion and PARASITE performed the following test with interesting results:

Quote:
When I put the pattern on a usb stick and loaded into my xbox and set the reference level to standard and my tv to auto color space "which detects and switches to pc or video dependant on source", it correctly displayed the pattern crushing everything below 16 and over 235. I do want to point out 16 was infact black. Now the interesting results was this. When I set the reference levels to expanded my tv locked into to pc color mode and the ugly truth reared its head. I could clearly see every bar down to zero, BUT 0 WAS NOT BLACK! How could this be? The answer will shock you, but first I need to evaluate my hypothesis. I then took the usb stick with test pattern in hand and stuck it into my TV usb reader "thanks pioneer for a cool feature". First setting my tv to video color space, the pattern clearly crushed everything below 16 like I knew it would. Everything like before above 235 was crushed as well. Now for the shocker. When I set my tv to pc color my fears were then realized. The pattern showed every single strip down to 0 but, 0 was black as midnight unlike before on the 360 were black was dark grey. 255 was also absolute white and every strip below it was clearly slightly less white. THIS IS HOW THIS PATTERN IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK!

What did we learn through all of this? THE 360 SET TO EXPANDED IS NOT MAPPING THE LEVELS CORRECTLY.

That is why people say the pattern looks right on their pc or if they look at the pattern through any other usb device other then the 360. Yes you can use expanded on your tv if it has a pc color mode. However you are probally not getting the best image possible and are most likely losing contrast. When you set the 360 to expanded and use pc color on your television, you can only achieve black by lowering the brightness too far on your display which corrupts the original image. I have confirmed the problem being the 360 mapping errors in color space by using a different device to display the pattern on the same display. By do this I prove the calibration of the display is not the culprit.

I am confident now in saying the best image possible with hdmi for most people is by using reference levels standard. If your tv will display video and pc levels correctly then standard is what you should use. The problem is and always has been the 360. If you set refernce levels to expanded and your tv picture washes out, then your tv is looking for video levels. If your tv shows severe black crush on standard then PC levels is what you use. If your tv can do either standard or reference "sometimes by changing color space in the display" you should use standard because expanded is not mapping the levels correctly and you are losing black and washing out the very low ire. In layman's terms things that are supposed to be black will be gray.

Feel free to duplicate the test I have done.

Cybersoga replied to the test with this:

Quote:
The conclusion i've come to is that both DVD's and video games on the xbox 360 use the same levels natively - level 16 as black and 235 as white (video levels).

When you set the xbox 360 to RGB expanded and your TV is expecting PC Levels, all it does is it expands level 16 to level 0 and 235 to 255 and re-maps all the levels in between. Both DVDs and video games are affected the same way. <16 and >235 are hard clipped. This looks almost the same as when the xbox 360 is outputting video levels on a TV that's expecting video levels, however you are adding an extra conversion stage which can add banding and other artefacts. Below black and above white data is used by the video processor in the screen to reduce interpolation errors, so the lack of that could also degrade the picture.

The thing is, there's no way to get native PC levels out of the xbox 360 because no matter what you do, the xbox 360 treats 16 as black for both DVDs and Video Games.

So now I am in the agreement that there is no advantage to setting the xbox 360 to output expanded levels. Video levels are native for both DVDs and Video Games. If the TV and can be set to accept video levels that is the best option to have the xbox 360 outputting.
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post #3416 of 3766 Old 03-19-2015, 05:38 PM
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Hello I am in the market for a 60-70 inch Vizio tv but I'm having some apprehension regarding purchasing one.

The first anxiety I have is the possibility of it having already 1.6 firmware already inside, how likely is this, what can I do to avoid buying one with that firmware if I can?

Second anxiety I have is that I have been reading and hearing about a lip sync issue with the tv. My tv will only be connected to a directv reciever and nothing else, is this a big problem with vizio?

Any help any information would be truly appreciated, thank you for your time.
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post #3417 of 3766 Old 03-19-2015, 08:56 PM
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I just picked up 60 incher tonight at Costco for a great deal now that they are closing them out. The first thing I checked was the firmware, and it is currently on 1.34. If I understand things in the thread right, I should leave it at this firmware and not update to the latest version, correct?

The set is for my grandparents who do not have internet, so there is no need to ever connect it to the internet.
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post #3418 of 3766 Old 03-20-2015, 03:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkindig729 View Post
The research I have done indicates that the "native" mode for the Xbox 360 was Limited RGB and if you set the Xbox to Full, it scales/interpolates the Limited Range to Full.

However, the Xbox's scaling is flawed and it isn't accurately interpolating the new values for the expanded greyscale. If you stick with Limited, this isn't a problem since it isn't introduced into the mix. I don't know if this flaw was carried over to the Xbox One, but I would just about bet that it was...

Here is the text of the thread from the HighDef Forums addressing this:

On the AVS Forums they had this discussion and PARASITE performed the following test with interesting results:

Quote:
When I put the pattern on a usb stick and loaded into my xbox and set the reference level to standard and my tv to auto color space "which detects and switches to pc or video dependant on source", it correctly displayed the pattern crushing everything below 16 and over 235. I do want to point out 16 was infact black. Now the interesting results was this. When I set the reference levels to expanded my tv locked into to pc color mode and the ugly truth reared its head. I could clearly see every bar down to zero, BUT 0 WAS NOT BLACK! How could this be? The answer will shock you, but first I need to evaluate my hypothesis. I then took the usb stick with test pattern in hand and stuck it into my TV usb reader "thanks pioneer for a cool feature". First setting my tv to video color space, the pattern clearly crushed everything below 16 like I knew it would. Everything like before above 235 was crushed as well. Now for the shocker. When I set my tv to pc color my fears were then realized. The pattern showed every single strip down to 0 but, 0 was black as midnight unlike before on the 360 were black was dark grey. 255 was also absolute white and every strip below it was clearly slightly less white. THIS IS HOW THIS PATTERN IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK!

What did we learn through all of this? THE 360 SET TO EXPANDED IS NOT MAPPING THE LEVELS CORRECTLY.

That is why people say the pattern looks right on their pc or if they look at the pattern through any other usb device other then the 360. Yes you can use expanded on your tv if it has a pc color mode. However you are probally not getting the best image possible and are most likely losing contrast. When you set the 360 to expanded and use pc color on your television, you can only achieve black by lowering the brightness too far on your display which corrupts the original image. I have confirmed the problem being the 360 mapping errors in color space by using a different device to display the pattern on the same display. By do this I prove the calibration of the display is not the culprit.

I am confident now in saying the best image possible with hdmi for most people is by using reference levels standard. If your tv will display video and pc levels correctly then standard is what you should use. The problem is and always has been the 360. If you set refernce levels to expanded and your tv picture washes out, then your tv is looking for video levels. If your tv shows severe black crush on standard then PC levels is what you use. If your tv can do either standard or reference "sometimes by changing color space in the display" you should use standard because expanded is not mapping the levels correctly and you are losing black and washing out the very low ire. In layman's terms things that are supposed to be black will be gray.

Feel free to duplicate the test I have done.

Cybersoga replied to the test with this:

Quote:
The conclusion i've come to is that both DVD's and video games on the xbox 360 use the same levels natively - level 16 as black and 235 as white (video levels).

When you set the xbox 360 to RGB expanded and your TV is expecting PC Levels, all it does is it expands level 16 to level 0 and 235 to 255 and re-maps all the levels in between. Both DVDs and video games are affected the same way. <16 and >235 are hard clipped. This looks almost the same as when the xbox 360 is outputting video levels on a TV that's expecting video levels, however you are adding an extra conversion stage which can add banding and other artefacts. Below black and above white data is used by the video processor in the screen to reduce interpolation errors, so the lack of that could also degrade the picture.

The thing is, there's no way to get native PC levels out of the xbox 360 because no matter what you do, the xbox 360 treats 16 as black for both DVDs and Video Games.

So now I am in the agreement that there is no advantage to setting the xbox 360 to output expanded levels. Video levels are native for both DVDs and Video Games. If the TV and can be set to accept video levels that is the best option to have the xbox 360 outputting.
Thanks for the wealth of information. I would assume (possibly?) that this issue has been fixed on the newer console (Xbox One.) I'll repeat the test this weekend on Xbox One and see what results I get.

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jeremygary is offline  
post #3419 of 3766 Old 03-20-2015, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by tcramer View Post
I just picked up 60 incher tonight at Costco for a great deal now that they are closing them out. The first thing I checked was the firmware, and it is currently on 1.34. If I understand things in the thread right, I should leave it at this firmware and not update to the latest version, correct?

The set is for my grandparents who do not have internet, so there is no need to ever connect it to the internet.
General consensus is that 1.34 is the firmware version you want. There are a few good calibration settings in this thread you might try too. I'm sure your grandparents will enjoy it.
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post #3420 of 3766 Old 03-20-2015, 04:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Romain12 View Post
Hello I am in the market for a 60-70 inch Vizio tv but I'm having some apprehension regarding purchasing one.

The first anxiety I have is the possibility of it having already 1.6 firmware already inside, how likely is this, what can I do to avoid buying one with that firmware if I can?

Second anxiety I have is that I have been reading and hearing about a lip sync issue with the tv. My tv will only be connected to a directv reciever and nothing else, is this a big problem with vizio?

Any help any information would be truly appreciated, thank you for your time.
There are a few posts in this thread that detail how to find out when the TV was manufactured. I would try to find one that was made as late as possible. If you're ordering online it would be a craps shoot. Vizio has a decent record with replacing the faulty firmware with a new motherboard. Not the best solution, but it's at least an option.

The lip sync issue was one of the biggest complaints people had about this TV until the 1.60 firmware debacle. There is a setting to adjust it in the menu, but it doesn't work well (or at all, in some cases). I use the audio delay feature in my AV receiver, but I don't know if your cable box will have a way to make adjustments.

It's too bad because this is about the best picture you can get for the money. Personally, now that I've had my board swapped for one with the 1.34 firmware, I'm very happy with it, but I won't spend this much time nursing a TV back to health again.
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