Masking Your Edgelit LCD TV for Better Blacks - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
But it does keep Gorillas from breaking the glass.
Maybe the gorillas have black fur and they absorb the ambient light improving the perceived black levels?
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post #32 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 10:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
so the plasma is not calibrated i mean the colors are totally different on both photos...
if both are calibrated then something is want wrong with the digicam or i don't call this a properly calibrated.

but what this very bad black there? i mean my very bad (and very very cheap) pfl4606h 1100:1 CR display doesn't look that terrible. or are CCFL backlight normally better at this ? based on that screen i would call that TV defect.
Every side-by-side photo of a calibrated LCD and plasma you see, the screens will look different. Typically the plasma will look more accurate. Cameras see TVs differently than the human eye.

Also the plasma has more contrast.
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post #33 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 10:59 AM
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So you put tape on your pretty & elegant piano black finish frame, would think that would be sure to scratch it?

The bars seem to vary so much in size too. I noted this on mine, though adjusting the contrast & turning the brightness way down helps.

I really found the glare from the 'pretty & elegant' piano black to be annoying in a not so dark room, yet they continue to make sets like that.
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post #34 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Every side-by-side photo of a calibrated LCD and plasma you see, the screens will look different. Typically the plasma will look more accurate. Cameras see TVs differently than the human eye.

Also the plasma has more contrast.
is the very bluish and bright black bars of your LCD screen also a "problem" with the camera? so the effect is a lot bigger in the picture else in real life?
i don't say this to protect LCD. but this is real a lot of back light bleeding.
i know shutter times have a huge effect on this but the general picture doesn't look like it was done with a really high shutter times.
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post #35 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:05 AM
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Mark,

I love this idea! Very clever and cost effective! One question: When the lower mask is in the folded-down orientation (i.e. not being used), doesn't it block the IR sensor for the TV's remote?
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post #36 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_H View Post
Mark,

I love this idea! Very clever and cost effective! One question: When the lower mask is in the folded-down orientation (i.e. not being used), doesn't it block the IR sensor for the TV's remote?

It also blocks the light sensor, the camera, the internal TV speakers (if used), the 3d sensor, and whatever else I forgot.

It also does not help with 4 X 3 content.

It also looks to be a pain in the you know what. Not all widescreen movies have the same aspect ratio, so you have to fiddle to get it right for each movie.

I would use the G word, but someone else already did!
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post #37 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
is the very bluish and bright black bars of your LCD screen also a "problem" with the camera? so the effect is a lot bigger in the picture else in real life?
i don't say this to protect LCD. but this is real a lot of back light bleeding.
i know shutter times have a huge effect on this but the general picture doesn't look like it was done with a really high shutter times.
I paused the image, the photos are shot with HDR, a combination of a 2 second exposure and a 10 second exposure. That might be why the photos don't look like typical shots of a screen. (which usually preserves highlights but crushes blacks). Most cameras can't handle the full contrast range of a TV in a single shot. I'm a pro photographer with 20 years experience, fwiw.

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post #38 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post
It also blocks the light sensor, the camera, the internal TV speakers (if used), the 3d sensor, and whatever else I forgot.

It also does not help with 4 X 3 content.

It also looks to be a pain in the you know what. Not all widescreen movies have the same aspect ratio, so you have to fiddle to get it right for each movie.

I would use the G word, but someone else already did!
That's all so helpful! Thanks!
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post #39 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Using the THX optimizer is not the same as calibrating your TV, but it helps. BTW what TV is it?

"Professional" calibration would be performed in what picture mode?


Sony 55NX720.

http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-bravia-kdl-55nx720/
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post #40 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post
"Professional" calibration would be performed in what picture mode?


Sony 55NX720.

http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-bravia-kdl-55nx720/
There are plenty of threads here on AVS that can help you answer those kinds of questions, if you are genuinely interested.
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post #41 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by krips View Post
And that's why I never liked the edge lit LED LCD TV even with local dimming option. The lights bleed like anything. LED LCD with full array local dimming is completely different. But at the same time not all FALD created equally.

For reference, here's the scene from movie Battlefield on my 2.5 years old Sony XBR55HX929 looks like.

The top and bottom bars look like inky black.


According C|NETs HX929 review ''In chapter 3 of ''Tron: Legacy,'' for example, the bars were brightened in parts by a moonbeam (18:27), two ceiling lamps (19:46), a bright plastic dust cover (20:38), and a flashlightilluminated bit of the door (21:29). '' So no continuously inky black black bars while watching a 2.40:1 movie in a dark room on the HX929/HX950..


http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-bravia-xbr-65hx929/2/
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post #42 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
There are plenty of threads here on AVS that can help you answer those kinds of questions, if you are genuinely interested.

I already know the answer. Sports mode is different than Cinema mode(s) is different than PC mode is different than General mode.

Tons of setting to play with, and a reset per screen mode to get settings back to normal after you forget what you played with.

There is not one chance in a billion that a so called "professional calibration" would be done right.

As far as the THX Optimizer is concerned, the tests tell you as much as most people need to adjust their TV controls!
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post #43 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 11:54 AM
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Here are some pics of my improvised 'masking'. I can't see it in the dark so i do not see the point of using black tape. The duck tape solution
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post #44 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:03 PM
 
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This is a good idea. I will try this on my TV. $10 will be worth it!
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post #45 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
According C|NETs HX929 review ''In chapter 3 of ''Tron: Legacy,'' for example, the bars were brightened in parts by a moonbeam (18:27), two ceiling lamps (19:46), a bright plastic dust cover (20:38), and a flashlightilluminated bit of the door (21:29). '' So no continuously inky black black bars while watching a 2.40:1 movie in a dark room on the HX929/HX950..


http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-bravia-xbr-65hx929/2/


The blacks are inky blacks. That is the same vintage as my 55NX720. Same Gorilla glass and same LCD panel.


http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004QX6E7K/..._9dlqnfwfyt_ee
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post #46 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I paused the image, the photos are shot with HDR, a combination of a 2 second exposure and a 10 second exposure. That might be why the photos don't look like typical shots of a screen. (which usually preserves highlights but crushes blacks). Most cameras can't handle the full contrast range of a TV in a single shot. I'm a pro photographer with 20 years experience, fwiw.
Thank for the detailed answer.
i only have a 6 bit TN gaming monitor with edge light LED and i never saw something that extreme in a completely dark room. but thank to your infos i know now that's not possible to make a "perfect" photo of a TV with a camera.
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post #47 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
According C|NETs HX929 review ''In chapter 3 of ''Tron: Legacy,'' for example, the bars were brightened in parts by a moonbeam (18:27), two ceiling lamps (19:46), a bright plastic dust cover (20:38), and a flashlightilluminated bit of the door (21:29). '' So no continuously inky black black bars while watching a 2.40:1 movie in a dark room on the HX929/HX950..


http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-bravia-xbr-65hx929/2/
Sorry mate, I don't buy stuff by simply looking at the reviews. My eyes are the best buddy to tell me what looks great and what's not.
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post #48 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post
Trying to imagine a $10 black foam board masking my screen in my luxury homes living room in a $12K HT furniture entertainment center on a $3K-$8K TV surrounded by high end furniture and art, rugs - prepare yourself for divorce court if your married if you expect the wife's gonna put up with taping foam board in the living room HT. May work but it's going to look asinine anywhere other than a bachelor pad HT perhaps.

Truly desparate that says if your bothered that much buy a Plasma or OLED for god's sake. This would be a bachelor piece that'll keep you a bachelor!

For God's sake LED is not that bad that it warrants black band aids. You must be genuinely bored. Would your wife permit this in the living room Mark? Putrid in a luxury home and zero WAF!

...or a guy who does this who is married isn't p-whipped and doesn't let his wife control him like she is a queen and he is some peasant. These types of men actually DO exist. Or, these guys actually married cool women (these also DO exist) who are all for things like this since it actually improves the performance and don't give a rip about trivial BS like what the TV looks like when not in use. Can only imagine how fun it must be for men who are married to women who they have to always worry about the "WAF" and who apparently make a fuss about everything.

Seriously, where has the masculinity of so many North American men gone? Embarrassing some of the stuff I read around the net from so many so-called men these days. What I find amusing is how so many guys who say stuff like "my wife is letting me get this..." or "my wife wouldn't let me do that..." actually don't see how whipped they are. I don't know if it's a product of society's brainwashing (the entire media and entertainment industry makes it sound like men need to be manginas and servants of women) or their upbringing. Do these guys also have to ask permission of what they are allowed to eat?

"Honey, can I eat some chips now?"

Sheeeeeeeeeeeesh. Makes me want to vomit.


As for this masking, every single display short of a OLED would benefit from masking. Nobody should act like this is just something for an edge lit LED set. I'd love to add masking to my projection screen and I'm using a JVC RS50 that has a pretty good black level.

Speaking of my theatre room, I have black velvet pieces tacked all along the front half of my room's walls, ceiling and floor and it is damn ugly if you turn the lights on. You should see what my wife thinks!! Oh wait, I'm single and would kill myself before I ever let another human being prevent me from doing something I want that actually has a beneficial purpose. Any woman who acts like that isn't worth the time no matter what body part she has that I don't.

Last edited by rlindo; 06-23-2014 at 12:53 PM.
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post #49 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by J_Palmer_Cass View Post
I already know the answer. Sports mode is different than Cinema mode(s) is different than PC mode is different than General mode.

Tons of setting to play with, and a reset per screen mode to get settings back to normal after you forget what you played with.

There is not one chance in a billion that a so called "professional calibration" would be done right.

As far as the THX Optimizer is concerned, the tests tell you as much as most people need to adjust their TV controls!
I think you should start a thread in the Display Calibration section and use that as the title, I'd be interested to see what kind of feedback you get.

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post #50 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by krips View Post
Sorry mate, I don't buy stuff by simply looking at the reviews. My eyes are the best buddy to tell me what looks great and what's not.
It remains true that if you don't see it, it's not a problem for you. Just don't go looking for it; when it comes to displays, once you start seeing a 'flaw' that you didn't notice before, you can't un-see it.
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post #51 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
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...or a guy who does this who is married isn't p-whipped and doesn't let his wife control him like she is a queen and he is some peasant. These types of men actually DO exist.
And my wife is hot!!! Plus we've been together for 20 years. I must be doing something right.
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post #52 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bismarck440 View Post
So you put tape on your pretty & elegant piano black finish frame, would think that would be sure to scratch it?

The bars seem to vary so much in size too. I noted this on mine, though adjusting the contrast & turning the brightness way down helps.

I really found the glare from the 'pretty & elegant' piano black to be annoying in a not so dark room, yet they continue to make sets like that.
Where do you see variation in the letterbox dimensions? If that was really true, it would made constant image height front projection impossible, yet somehow high-end home theaters pull it off. Perhaps it's because 2.40:1 ratio movies do not actually vary in terms of the size of the letterbox bars.

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post #53 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:02 PM
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Red face

Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
It remains true that if you don't see it, it's not a problem for you. Just don't go looking for it; when it comes to displays, once you start seeing a 'flaw' that you didn't notice before, you can't un-see it.
Quite true. There's always a flaw in everything in and around us. Some are quite obvious and visible at plain sight and then there are some which is not easily visible but you have to really look hard to find one, and once you find that, your life turns upside down. Therefore, watch the movie Frozen and 'Let it go, let it go..
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post #54 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by rlindo View Post
You should see what my wife thinks!! Oh wait, I'm single and would kill myself before I ever let another human being prevent me from doing something I want that actually has a beneficial purpose. Any woman who acts like that isn't worth the time no matter what body part she has that I don't.
Successful relationships I have seen are all about give and take. I would go crazy if I were married to someone who thinks exactly like me. Sometimes the price of a happy marriage is compromise. Well worth it IMO. Sounds like you are doing okay being single
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post #55 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Where do you see variation in the letterbox dimensions? If that was really true, it would made constant image height front projection impossible, yet somehow high-end home theaters pull it off. Perhaps it's because 2.40:1 ratio movies do not actually vary in terms of the size of the letterbox bars.
How would a Blu-ray player handle the difference between 2.35:1 and 2.40:1? Surely there is some small difference in the letterboxing, no? And with all the mention of Tron: Legacy, I am reminded that the OAR of the original Tron is 2:20:1. Doesn't constant image height require the projector to "know" what the OAR is in order to set the height/width correctly?
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post #56 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:15 PM
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Velcro, dude.

Double layer the foam board so that the top one extends over the edge of the bottom one by the width of your bezel. Put a small amount of Velcro on the bottom portion of the top board where it is longer and on the bezel, thus eliminating your eyesore of a tape job.

Not only will this look cleaner, but it would allow you to conveniently put it up and remove it with ease.

THE ALL MIGHTY MACACASIAH HAS SPOKEN!

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post #57 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy_H View Post
How would a Blu-ray player handle the difference between 2.35:1 and 2.40:1? Surely there is some small difference in the letterboxing, no? And with all the mention of Tron: Legacy, I am reminded that the OAR of the original Tron is 2:20:1. Doesn't constant image height require the projector to "know" what the OAR is in order to set the height/width correctly?
The reality is that the films themselves (as presented in theaters) are 2.39:1 ratio. On Blu-ray boxes, it's listed as 2.40:1. Sure there are exceptions, but the vast majority of films are consistent. It might be easier to just call it 21:9.

2.35:1 was the ratio prior to 1970, it's not relevant to me since I rarely watch old movies.

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post #58 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
The reality is that the films themselves (as presented in theaters) are 2.39:1 ratio. On Blu-ray boxes, it's listed as 2.40:1. Sure there are exceptions, but the vast majority of films are consistent. It might be easier to just call it 21:9.

2.35:1 was the ratio prior to 1970, it's not relevant to me since I rarely watch old movies.
This makes me really curious - what would a modern theater or constant image height setup do with something like Ben-Hur with an aspect ratio of 2.75:1? It would either have to be letterboxed or have the sides cropped, right? Obviously that would be unnecessary for the vast majority of films nowadays.
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post #59 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
But it does keep Gorillas from breaking the glass.
Only if you hit it normal to the surface. Hit gorilla glass on its' edge and it cracks/splinters very badly. That's why WTC1 replaced all the gorilla glass. If a panel broke, large shards would rain down to the street/sidewalk below.

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post #60 of 313 Old 06-23-2014, 01:40 PM
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Thanks I will try this in my bedroom LCD TV, I'm another lucky husband ,I love my wife so much lol. I will show her this post and westa6969 post to see what she think.
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