***Official 2014 Vizio P Series Owner's Thread - Page 164 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4891 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackB View Post
I did put the replacement P70 standing up in the truck this time. Unboxed it at home and it works just fine. I have loaded Z-Mad's settings and am basically satisfied; but not totally. Just needs some color tuning. I'm watching the Giants/Cardinals game now and the green grass doesn't seem just right. I'm also trying to figure out the issue between motion smoothing and the other settings that are affected by it.
I haven't actually tried Z-Mad's settings on my set but just looking at what the CMS settings are in the Color Tuner in his, 100% saturation green would probably be pretty accurate but leave less saturated greens significantly undersaturated. Have you given my settings a shot yet? I calibrated my P70 rather differently than the standard workflow (as Buzz also found was necessary for good results on his P60) and have been very happy with the picture I'm getting in real content.
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post #4892 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 08:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MLD WOODY View Post

Update. I was playing Madden on HDMI 4 and there was crazy "artifacts"? I am not sure of the correct term. Basically, the TV wasn't updating/refreshing quickly as objects moved on screen. This seems like another poor development....
My suggestion is write any settings you changed for calibration purposes down and do a hard reset of your TV back to Factory and see if the issue continues before you put those settings in.

Then try them with the settings put back in and see what happens



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post #4893 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 10:11 PM
 
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My question is, is it worth exchanging and hoping I'll get one without any problems or are these issues normal for this set and panel? I've been contemplating taking it back and getting a XBR55X850B or saving towards a XBR55X900B as I've had good experiences with Sony in the past though I'm worried the black levels might not be as satisfying on the 850B. I use the set mostly for PC, PS4 gaming and some blu-ray but don't really watch cable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by traumadisaster
I have the x850b now and it had light bleed around one corner pretty bad, in frustration I rubbed the hell out of it and it did nothing at the time...the next day it was basically gone. Also a couple of other places I rubbed was better so it improved a lot. I understand the 50 inch sony is ips and the others are va (not sure), so I was not impressed with the blacks in a dark room in a dark scene like I thought I would be. I didn't know at the time I had an ips. You're contemplating the 55 which I think is va (not sure), so maybe you will be ok with the blacks.


I'm returning the sony for a VizP even though any scene, other than dark, is phenomenal in my experience coupled with the best "motion" I have experienced. I mostly 4k game and for the price and quality I think I will be ok with the Viz even though the I'm happy with the sony.


Tomorrow I'm probably going to order the walmart 50 since I can't get a best buy 50 and be done with it.

Quote:
I understand the 50 inch sony is ips and the others are va (not sure)

49" Sony 2160p 4K XBR-49X850B = LGD IPS panel .

50" 1080p 2K Sony KDL W850/850B are AUO AMVA

KDL-50W800B 2K = VA panel AUO
KDL-55W800B 2K = VA panel AUO

Some of the X950B X900B X850B X850A are IPS or VA depending on EXACT model and or size ofc the 49X850B is IPS .
Personally I prefer VA panels because of contrast and black levels as rule .

Here is a list if 2014 2160p 4K Sony panels that I believe is accurate .

XBR-65X950B 4K = VA panel AUO
XBR-79X900B 4K = IPS panel LGD
XBR-65X900B 4K = VA panel AUO
XBR-55X950B 4K = VA panel AUO
XBR-70X850B 4K = VA panel AUO
XBR-55X950B 4K = IPS panel LGD
XBR-49X850B 4K = IPS panel LGD
XBR-55X850A 4K = VA panel AUO
XBR 85X950B 4K = VA panel CMO

Edit 10/20/2014

Last edited by tubetwister; 10-20-2014 at 01:53 PM.
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post #4894 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Dr.Shankenstein View Post
The X850B will likely employ the same LGD IPS panel found in the P55 and the X900B will have a VA panel resulting in better contrast and better black level performance. Both should offer pretty good input lag numbers,better processing and (maybe) better QC,but is that worth the premium paid for either display?
And as someone has suggested already the P60 may be the way to go/
I have thought about the p60 I'll probably stop into BB on sunday and see if they'll place an order to exchange it for one of the different models or give a refund. I'd hate to have to keep returning tv's with problems and have them turn away my business as I live in quite a rural area and the next nearest place to shop for a set is about an hour away. To be honest I'm not sure if the sony's offer a value worth the premium. The sony sets I've had over the years have all impressed me and I can't remember seeing any clouding or light leakage though the blacks were a bit light. I'm fairly new to vizio. I've heard good things about vizio picture quality but don't know about their longevity. It's not that the light leakage it terribly bothering either, as I can't see it unless I'm on a black scene, It's the combination of all the symptoms I mentioned previously that make me wonder if this set will last. Does anyone know if costco provides the warranty extension for online purchases? It just might make sense to go through them after the QC issues I'm seeing. I forgot my camera at work so no pics of the the light bleeding tonight.
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post #4895 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyingv33 View Post
Not sure what I was wrong about, maybe the confusion over the screens vs who the ODM was....

The majority of the supply on the P50 went to the P502ui-B1E. The P502ui-B1 supply will be available mainly after the holidays and will hit the majority of the big box stores then. Not saying you have to believe me, but I'm 100% certain on this as I was tasked with helping to sell the P502ui-B1 after the supply becomes available. Things could have changed in the relatively short time since I left, but I highly doubt it
We were told a former Vizio employee (apparently you) said that the P502ui-B1 wouldn't be available until January and that clearly isn't the case. It's available at the Vizio store front and apparently Cosco (someone ordered a P502ui-B1 on Saturday and is expecting delivery tomorrow) right now. Amazon has 3-4 weeks for expected deliveries which admittedly means they don't currently have them in stock but it sure implies they'll have them in before or at the very least during the holidays. Big box stores don't get much bigger than Amazon and Cosco but on the bright side you might not be wrong about Best Buy not having them until after the holidays.

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post #4896 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffyg1 View Post
I think these are good points/observations - it goes into the "what floats your boat" category. Given your comments on 4K in general, from a value proposition, would you say, for instance, that the P70 is worth $700 more than the M70? And, under the "do no harm" rule, is there anything that the P70 (or series) does that complicates or degrades the user satisfaction when compared to the M-series?

For me the P55 and now the P60 were worth the price delta over the M-Series to have twice the dimming zones, the faster processor and HEVC encoding. The 70" has 8 more dimming zones and you can sit a bit further away and still get the benefit of 4K (a maximum of 9' for 70" versus 6' for 60", according to this chart at rtings.com). Whether or not all that's worth the price delta for you is something that I can't decide for you bit it was for me.

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post #4897 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Googer View Post
I haven't actually tried Z-Mad's settings on my set but just looking at what the CMS settings are in the Color Tuner in his, 100% saturation green would probably be pretty accurate but leave less saturated greens significantly undersaturated. Have you given my settings a shot yet? I calibrated my P70 rather differently than the standard workflow (as Buzz also found was necessary for good results on his P60) and have been very happy with the picture I'm getting in real content.
Just FYI, I calibrated at 75% - had no under-saturation issues with green or any color for that matter. I think he is simply looking at the fact that each set needs individual calibration for true accuracy. Also, it is uncertain what he considers as "right looking grass" or what he is comparing it to. It could very well be that he just needs a slight tweak in hue for the "right looking grass"...
Now, potentially your settings might translate better on his particular set, which is simply a game of chance as with any shared settings
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post #4898 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by jtl46 View Post
How are you connecting to NF? Either let the tv do it or connect via HDMI 5. I think only HDMI 5 will do 4K.

I'm not aware of any shipping external streaming boxes capable of 4K video, so I'm pretty sure he's using the internal VIA app. Also your last statement is wrong--all of the HDMI ports can accept a 4K signal up to 30 Hz; only HDMI 5 can receive [email protected] Hz. I'd expect 2160p video from a streaming STB or disc to be supplied at 24 or 30Hz.

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post #4899 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Compeau View Post
Play the test video "El Fuente: 60 MP10" and see what bitrate you're getting.
ok found it on netflix and i got bitrate 560kpps

resolution 640 x 480

par : 3:4

and for internet i have fios top speed 50 Mbp, modem wireless to the vizio

Last edited by ahwig60; 10-16-2014 at 03:28 AM. Reason: forgot information
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post #4900 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by SandstormGT View Post
I just searched google because I was curious about the WAN speed requirements for streaming 4k, this is what Netflix says but other users who actually use it might have a better answer.

https://help.netflix.com/en/node/13444

Netflix says 25 Mbps but I think that's conservative. In general you need about 20% headroom to stay ahead of a stream (to fill the buffer and keep it full as available bandwidth on your connection to the servers fluctuates); the maximum bit rate 2160p Netflix encode is 15.6 Mbps, with .192 Mbps that 15.792 x 1.2 = 18.9 Mbps, so 20 Mbps service should be fine. If you have other significant bandwidth consumption while watching Netflix you'll need more.
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post #4901 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganzhimself View Post
I'm not sure if my set is/was a fluke, but I don't have any of the light leakage or flashlighting others mentioned previously with the P55.

I didn't have any light bleed or flashlighting either. Hopefully my coming P60 will be equally free of problems.

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post #4902 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:58 PM
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As a P70 owner I have some thoughts to share

-from corner to corner the TV is bright and sharp, doesn't fade zero leakage.
-Input lag is not noticeable in fact you probably get more lag from your ps4 Xbox controller,
-had one occasion where I started getting heavy lag and artifacts from the TV, seems like Netflix caused it, solved it by shaping inputs and rebooting the TV.
-there's no blooming, there's tiny bit of glow if you look at credits from a 70 degree angle only, if you do see blooming it will be rare
-you only need 4k 60hz with pc games and it looks amazingly sharp and responsive
-doubt there will be anything better for a while at this price
buy the 70 if you can afford it
-you can plug your receiver on any input and it will work while watching any other input, you don't have to pass the TV signal through the receiver
-wish there was a 75 or 80 version
-I recommend motion smoothing to low on all calibrations it just makes faces in motion stay sharp.
-as for view angles let's just say that they are way better than my old 70 sharp and the rtings video doesn't do justice to how good it looks from the sides in person.


If you buy the VA panel you won't be disappointed,
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post #4903 of 18020 Old 10-15-2014, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xevious View Post
Going to try to say but its not meant for that? That is the weakest excuse ever...

No, it's not. I'm sure that only a tiny percentage of their target market has your requirements. If it added anything significant to the cost, reducing the number of people interested in using it for entertainment video who could afford to buy it, then it would have been irresponsible to try to hit those requirements.

I used to roll my eyes when people posted to these threads, "I'm going to use mine as a computer monitor, the true purpose of these models". It never was the true purpose and they cannot reasonably be criticized for it's not being particularly well suited to that usage.

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post #4904 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris J Gould View Post
Can someone explain why Netflix is calling for 25Mbps or higher. My DSL provider maxes out at 20Mbps and would have to switch to cable modem and that would be a pain.
As I wrote before, the 15.8 Mbps maximum stream bandwidth shouldn't require more than a 20 Mbps connection; Netflix is just being conservative to cover their butts. If you have a 20 Mbps connection and try to do much else with at while watching Netflix 2160p then there might be issues and they don't want to hear about it. You should, however, be able to get their lower bit rate 2160p encodes with considerably lower speed connections: there are 2160p encodes at 8-, 10- and 12 Mbps, which should require only require 10-, 12- and 15 Mbps available bandwidth on your connection(s) to Netflix's servers to stay out in front of. How much less sharp than the 15.6 Mbps encode those are is unknown; I always get the 15.6 Mbps encode on my 100 Mbps cable network service (with Cox, an early Netflix Open Connect partner).
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post #4905 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by eric3316 View Post
How many words would qualify for a long post? Then you might want to put that in the first page of the thread. Oh wait, no one reads the first page of the thread, otherwise you wouldn't see someone asking for settings on every single page.

When I want to post pictures, big tables, articles from other sites, etc, I always wrap them in [spoiler] tags to protect the uninterested and keep the thread concise. Then people can quote my entire posts if they want and still those big sets of images, tables, etc won't display as more than a few lines. It's just nice to be able to take in a few posts a page without scrolling unless the post has a long stretch of original text.

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post #4906 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahwig60 View Post
ok found it on netflix and i got bitrate 560kpps

resolution 640 x 480

par : 3:4

and for internet i have fios top speed 50
Something's wrong there; FiOS has just jumped 9 places to top Netflix's September US ISP Speed Index. Do you have a wired or wireless connection to your television? If wireless, that'd probably explain it. You need about 20 Mbps available bandwidth on your connections to Netflix to stay ahead of their best quality 2160p video encode w/5.1 sound.

Wow! It's taken me all evening to catch up with this thread (starting in earnest at about 5 PM). For some odd reason I'd gotten only 3-4 hours sleep the previous 3 or 4 nights and slept until 2 PM today (I'm in disability retirement), after which I had to get up and take the cash refunded me by Walmart for my P55 to the bank so I could spend it on a P60 (apparently Walmart can't credit a refund to your Paypal account, a word to the wise; I'd have preferred that they cut me a check for it, which I could have deposited by phone app, which generally puts it immediately into my available account balance). You really have to start in the morning to stay ahead of this thread.

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Last edited by michaeltscott; 10-16-2014 at 12:35 AM.
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post #4907 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 01:26 AM
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Full chroma 4:4:4 in 1080p

Hi there,

I have my P55 hooked up to an Xbox 1 and HTPC on Geforce GTX680 on HDMI 5. When I run chroma tests from the PC at 1080p it appears I'm only getting 4:2:2. Am I doing something wrong? I thought the HDMI 2.0 port would easily do 4:4:4

Last edited by FIAChamp; 10-16-2014 at 04:47 AM.
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post #4908 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 04:29 AM
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Originally Posted by FIAChamp View Post
Hi there,

I have my P55 hooked up to an Xbox 1 and HTPC on Geforce GTX680 on HDMI 5. When I run chroma tests from the PC at 1080p it appears I'm only getting 4:2:2. Am I doing something wrong? I thought the HDMI 2 port would easily do 4:4:4
I would hope it does 4:4:4 at 1080. Hardforum and GeForce website has some threads on it, please keep us updated on what you find. Although that is troublesome I don't think it would be a deal breaker for me. Please try 120hz at 1080 and tell us what you think of it, thanks.
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post #4909 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 05:47 AM
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I have been following this thread daily since it started, but was not able to for the last week and a half. I searched but could not find the answer I need. Please excuse me if I missed it. Anyway here is my question:


Amazon is delivering my P55 today. My understanding is that the delivery guys plug in the TV to make sure it works. Since there seems to be quite a variance from one set to another as regards good versus defective panels, what should I be looking for while they are here? I am not a tech guy when it comes to TVs, unlike many on this thread are, so please keep the explanation simple. I will not be using a dark room for viewing, and do not plan to do gaming or use the TV as a computer monitor - just regular lighted room viewing - hooked to a TIVO.


I will use Buzz's recommended settings on page one, to start out with, for setup, but I am sure the delivery guys won't wait around for that. I just want to make sure that I am not starting out with a bad panel.


I will be grateful for any suggestions you may have.


Update: Just got a call from the shipping company. They forgot to put my TV on the truck so now it's coming tomorrow (@*&#$*^[email protected]&$#@). On the plus side. That leaves more time for you folks to post suggestions.

Last edited by hubsm; 10-16-2014 at 06:47 AM. Reason: Update
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post #4910 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahwig60 View Post
ok found it on netflix and i got bitrate 560kpps

resolution 640 x 480

par : 3:4

and for internet i have fios top speed 50 Mbp, modem wireless to the vizio
What do you get when you do a speedtest on the Vizio?

If it's a much higher number, Verizon may be throttling Netflix (hooray for the death of Net Neutrality).
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post #4911 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mascior View Post
However, I did find an anomaly. Calibration dark seems to have a completely different dimming algorithm than any other preset. I noticed this when I went to save under a custom name and once saved, the blooming was almost magnified by 50%. I didn’t find this acceptable and decided to re-run another test. I deleted the new custom saved preset and brought calibrated dark back to factory. Next, I changed one setting (sharpness), so I can get the asterisk next to the calibrated dark preset. Then, I saved it again under a custom name and as soon as I hit save, the same anomaly happened again (a complete backlight shift).
Welcome to the thread, Ryan. These P's have some strange anomalies, no?



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Not to hijack this thread but for these were are you guys getting your full motion wall mounts from?
Parts Express or ??
MonoPrice





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Originally Posted by Ronzo3 View Post
The Marino fake spike was the final straw for me as a Jet fan when I lived in NY. I became a Dolphin fan from that point on, long before I moved to South Florida and got Dolphin season tickets for a few seasons.
Watching up here in Wisconsin on a 138" screen let's just say that it was a really big play.



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Originally Posted by FIAChamp View Post
Does anyone know what kind of pricing to expect for the Vizio Reference Series?
Yes. Some Vizio employees. But they aren't talking. Everything else is speculation.

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post #4912 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 07:12 AM
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I got the Tears Of Steel 4K via peer-to-peer and played it via thumb drive.

Wow!!!!!!

4K is the near future and then we're going to 8K. The detail in the picture was VERY impressive when viewed in both dark and bright environments. Great stuff.
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post #4913 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z-Mad View Post
Just FYI, I calibrated at 75% - had no under-saturation issues with green or any color for that matter. I think he is simply looking at the fact that each set needs individual calibration for true accuracy. Also, it is uncertain what he considers as "right looking grass" or what he is comparing it to. It could very well be that he just needs a slight tweak in hue for the "right looking grass"...
Now, potentially your settings might translate better on his particular set, which is simply a game of chance as with any shared settings
Very true that it may just be differences between how the different P70's calibrate, as well as a lack of information on how it didn't look right.

Another thing worth pointing out that may be that we're not referring to the same 75% when we say 'calibrate at 75%' - CalMAN's advanced workflow configuration that lets you set this is referring to the luminance used, not saturation. In that case 'calibrate at 75%' (which is the workflow's default even) means 100% saturation, 75% luminance. Doing that, I could get a pretty CMS chart exactly as you posted with minimal error but the true lesser saturations (as measured on a saturation sweep, and from the various colors measured with the color checker) were horrible.

I've gotten much better results by ignoring the 100% saturation points and calibrating directly with the inner, lesser-saturated points from the saturation sweep on my set - this is part of what I mean by not using the standard calibration workflow for these sets. If you look at my actual saturation sweep graphs, you'll see that my errors are extremely low for the inner points, drifting a bit higher on the top end (with green and yellow in particular still somewhat over-saturated), but actual total error even for them is still quite acceptable. Red of course is still an issue but bringing the red saturation sweep in-line with a hue adjustment messes up the nearby interpolated reds and oranges (i.e., skin tones ), and blue actually has a slight twist towards magenta on its top end but it's rather minor and doesn't seem to cause issues with any content.
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post #4914 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:30 AM
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Got my 60p after trading in my 55. Very big improvement to blacks and overall pq. Colors are getting close. Couple of tidbits I've found. Love that they built in a red, green, blue and combo thereof filter into the color tuner, very nice. Viewing only blue, red, green, magenta, cyan or yellow and making some adjustments on the SMPTE chart they provide has helped. One interesting tidbit is the differences between each picture mode. For punch in color and contrast starting with vivid and matching my day or night mode bring completely different results.
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post #4915 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by MLD WOODY View Post
Well... I have an issue now guys.

Last night, I experienced that single line running across the TV as mentioned by some others on here earlier. As well as the top 1/5 of the screen updating late. This occurred right after I reset my Xbox One (all my video runs through my Xbox One). I tried a bunch of things, but turning the XBox One off then back on fixed it.

Now, is this an issue with the TV or the Xbox? I believe I had heard some others in here having a similar issue. Then only thig that's changed recently is the TV, leading me to believe that's the issue.

Any suggestions? Does this seem like something bad enough to warrant a return?
I have had that same static line running across the top 1/5 of my 65" when i turn on my ps4 plugged in through the hdmi 5. The fix that i've had for this is to switch picture setting profiles from my custom settings. I think it has to do with the GLL setting not syncing right. Turning off/on the PS4 didn't work, nor did changing the inputs back and forth between hdmi 1 and 5.
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post #4916 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:39 AM
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P60

About that thin vertical line on the right side of the screen that a couple of peeps have reported seeing while viewing NetFlix 4K....


Yep. It's there all right.

NetFlix 4K - 4 pixel wide top to bottom right edge, color, 50% saturated Green

NetFLix 2K - Lines on both right and left edges. Jitters when there is motion. Dark Gray

USB port 4K - same as NetFlix 4K

USB 2K - No lines

Cable TV 720P - No lines

Blu-Ray - Right side Gray line

The good news is that they're invisible at normal viewing distance and I consider the lines to be very strange but not a nuisance.

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post #4917 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:49 AM
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I got the Tears Of Steel 4K via peer-to-peer and played it via thumb drive.

Wow!!!!!!

4K is the near future and then we're going to 8K. The detail in the picture was VERY impressive when viewed in both dark and bright environments. Great stuff.
WOW

Can you please elaborate , what format, bit rate ? There is a free download " Mediainfo" that tells all about a video stream.
Have you tried other 4K. According to Vizio 4K MP4 is supposedly playable.

Thanks

Eugene

BTW the local CC has the units in stock and they are piled up horizontally !

Last edited by Eugene157; 10-16-2014 at 08:52 AM.
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post #4918 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:50 AM
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WOW

Can you please elaborate , what format and was it via USB/

Thanks

Eugene

BTW the local CC has the units in stock and they are piled up horizontally !
Storing horizontally is probably OK, at least as long as they're not stacked very high. Transporting horizontally is a big no-no as people are finding with cracked / broken screens, etc.
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post #4919 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Eugene157 View Post
WOW

Can you please elaborate , what format, bit rate ? There is a free download " Mediainfo" that tells all about a video stream.
Have you tried other 4K. According to Vizio 4K MP4 is supposedly playable.
3840x2160 h.265 ac3 mkv container

no but 1920x1080 mp4 plays

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Last edited by buzzard767; 10-16-2014 at 09:01 AM.
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post #4920 of 18020 Old 10-16-2014, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eugene157 View Post
WOW

Can you please elaborate , what format, bit rate ? There is a free download " Mediainfo" that tells all about a video stream.
Have you tried other 4K. According to Vizio 4K MP4 is supposedly playable.

Thanks

Eugene

BTW the local CC has the units in stock and they are piled up horizontally !
h.265 encoding in an MKV wrapper (though MP4 also works, as I tested a small 4K clip in an MP4). The bitrate is 27 mbps.

mkv wrapper, Matroska: 2.30 GiB, 12mn 14s, HEVC ([email protected]), AC-3, Overall bit rate: 26.9 mbps, 3840x2160 (16:9)
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