Panasonic CX850U Anticipation Thead - Page 24 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #691 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 03:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dick W View Post
Unless it's information directly sourced from Panasonic.
Would you consider this "directly sourced"? I just had a web chat with an agent on Panasonic.com who confirmed it is FALD. Screen cap is attached.
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post #692 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by marcuslaw View Post
Would you consider this "directly sourced"? I just had a web chat with an agent on Panasonic.com who confirmed it is FALD. Screen cap is attached.
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post #693 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 03:27 PM
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Interesting. In a chat with them yesterday they knew nothing about the CX850 and told me to call the 800 #.

Quote:
Jessica: Hello! How may I help you today?
You: website showing a TV: TC65CX850U.
Says "Not available". Is that because it's new or because it will only be available at
Magnolia Design Centers like AX900?
Jessica: Thank you for visiting Panasonic today! I'd be happy to assist you with information regarding our televisions.
Jessica: In order for me to provide accurate information, I'd like to ask a few questions. Would that be alright?
You: ok
You: i'll answer yours if you answer mine...
Jessica: I understand.
Jessica: Not available televisions on our website are new.
You: well, the AX850 and AX900 are surely not new. The 65CX850 is new today.
Jessica: Is there a particular product that you are interested in?
You: yes. TC65CX850.
Will it be available via shop.panasonic.com? When?
Jessica: I apologize but I have no further information for future releases on our products.
Jessica: Were there any additional questions that I may assist you with today?
You: what do you mean future release? It's on the website today.
You: you just don't have any information beyond "not available"?
Jessica: I apologize. However, as much as I would want to assist you, I would not be able to do so since I do not have the
information here on my end. What I would suggest to help you is to call our Customer Support team at 18002117262
as they
would be able to assist you further.
I'm sold and will say nothing further on the subject.
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post #694 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 04:13 PM
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The CX800 is listed on my local AV store website, I will head over this weekend to see if it's there.

Media room- 65" Panasonic FZ950 OLED, Pioneer Elite VSX-90, Panasonic UBD-820 4K, Klipsch Gallery G28's, Klipsch Sub 12, Klipsch RS-52 II, Optik HD cable

Living room- Sony 4K 79XBRX900B, Onkyo RC-360,HTPC,Klipsch Reference R-62II,Rc52II,PS4
Gaming room -Panasonic ST60, PS3, Wii
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post #695 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcuslaw View Post
Would you consider this "directly sourced"? I just had a web chat with an agent on Panasonic.com who confirmed it is FALD. Screen cap is attached.
On the U.K. forum site, a Dane reported the same info from Panasonic Scandinavia re the 802.

Go Duke !
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post #696 of 1664 Old 05-29-2015, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcuslaw View Post
Would you consider this "directly sourced"? I just had a web chat with an agent on Panasonic.com who confirmed it is FALD. Screen cap is attached.
Hopefully they are right, a lot of tv company agents are clueless or just read of the info charts.

Media room- 65" Panasonic FZ950 OLED, Pioneer Elite VSX-90, Panasonic UBD-820 4K, Klipsch Gallery G28's, Klipsch Sub 12, Klipsch RS-52 II, Optik HD cable

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post #697 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 04:46 AM
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I think even before Jessica (funny it was perhaps the same Jessica in both chats) said it was fald that Panasonic pretty much said it was fald. In the Panasonic Canada and UK descriptions of local dimming pro it says

"...individual control over a large array of LED lights behind the screen"

You'd have to be playing pretty loose with the English language to refer to edge lit as a large array of led lights behind the screen. To me it is not so much the description of behind the screen that is key but the description of a large array of LED lights. For those who may be looking at descriptions of the tech from last year's sets, they do not describe it as a large array of led lights behind the screen for local dimming pro on the edge lit ax800.

Then there is the fact guys like Mark and David had to have got their info from someone at Panasonic since they don't make up specs and features for TVs. Sure it is possible they were given wrong info yet it seems more likely they were given the correct info, especially since one or both apparently double checked after it was brought up recently.
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post #698 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 05:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Latinoheat View Post
Hopefully they are right, a lot of tv company agents are clueless or just read of the info charts.
Agreed. These agents are seemingly limited only to information and pre-written responses given them on "flip charts"/PC Q&A software by company marketing divisions. We often read about their misgivings in forums when they veer off that information with speculation or culled from outside sources. However, I would encourage doubting Thomases to go back and read posts 685 & 688 in this thread. Everyone who continues to doubt that the CX850 will feature FALD should ask themselves "why would Panasonic design and declare its 2015 "flagship" a lesser performing edge lit TV particularly on the heels of the AX900?" Why would the engineers who designed arguably one of the best performing IPS LCD panels (perhaps next to the Sharp Elite PRO-X5FD) that we'll probably ever see again in the AX900, abruptly abandon the one technology (FALD) in the next year's flagship that served as a major component for making it so good? Stated otherwise, why would the company take two steps back in a TV market increasingly crowded with OLED with edge lighting tech commonly plagued by poor uniformity and flashlighting in corners and at the edges?

You might be tempted to think that this is possible because such a move isn't necessarily unprecedented - it abandoned plasma. "They dropped one superior display tech before, they'll do it again with the CX850!" But look at why that happened and what came next. No one knows exactly why Panasonic pulled the plug on plasma but it surely had to do with the inability at the time to miniaturize plasma cells for a 4K display. Of course, there are other theories out there as well like these from member dsskid. Whatever the reason, Panasonic didn't just follow up its plasma line with any old LCD. It went back to the drawing board and came out with "a unique and highly capable display" that while it "[fell] short of emissive displays when it comes to contrast," impressed imagic to the point that he believes it possesses color accuracy unrivaled by any OLED. So the abandonment of plasma isn't somehow proof that the company is willing to replace greatness with a grape at the flip of a switch. Instead, the AX900 is evidence that the company at the very least cares about its reputation is an industry leader in PQ with consumer televisions.

The AX900 will probably always be viewed as a concept TV that due to high costs of engineering and manufacturing simply wasn't feasible for the consumer market but that doesn't mean Panasonic has to throw out everything it developed. Lesson learned. Techniques and manufacturing improved. Gone is the IPS panel with its low native contrast ratio; substituted with a vertically aligned panel for the CX850. Sure we get fewer zones and perhaps no BT.1886 but my guess is that the switch to a VA panel along with the local dimming technology developed for the AX900, the company found a way to render those added features and their associated costs largely unnecessary. Like all new TVs, time, reviews and hands on use will tell. That is where we need to be ready to focus our attention and, well, discussion in anticipation.

Last edited by marcuslaw; 05-30-2015 at 08:52 AM.
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post #699 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 07:49 AM
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Marcus - I am pretty sure I saw a mention of 3D LUT with the 850 by Panasonic. I don't recall where though. Maybe the Canadian or European sites? I'll see if I can find it again.

It's here (also confirms FALD): http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...300015519.html

Go Duke !

Last edited by Trackman; 05-30-2015 at 08:02 AM. Reason: update
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post #700 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 08:05 AM
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post #701 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post
Marcus - I am pretty sure I saw a mention of 3D LUT with the 850 by Panasonic. I don't recall where though. Maybe the Canadian or European sites? I'll see if I can find it again.

It's here (also confirms FALD): http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...300015519.html
I don't know if they're using '3D LUT' in the promo materials, but on the AX900 they defined it as a color system that tracked both RGB and CMYK, and they have said that the CX850 does that. I think they may have said 3D LUT in one of the videos.

The CX850 also keeps the wide color gamut. They're calling the color space 'Studio Master Color' on both the AX900 and CX850.

Hopefully there will be real sets on the ground within the next couple of weeks and we'll have some firm answers.
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post #702 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 08:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuteTibiImperes View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post
Marcus - I am pretty sure I saw a mention of 3D LUT with the 850 by Panasonic. I don't recall where though. Maybe the Canadian or European sites? I'll see if I can find it again.

It's here (also confirms FALD): http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...300015519.html
I don't know if they're using '3D LUT' in the promo materials, but on the AX900 they defined it as a color system that tracked both RGB and CMYK, and they have said that the CX850 does that. I think they may have said 3D LUT in one of the videos.

The CX850 also keeps the wide color gamut. They're calling the color space 'Studio Master Color' on both the AX900 and CX850.

Hopefully there will be real sets on the ground within the next couple of weeks and we'll have some firm answers.
I happily stand corrected.
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post #703 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 10:09 AM
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Crossing my fingers this one is good for gaming. All the other upper tier Panasonic sets have been great, the only nightmare set was the AX900.
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post #704 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 12:34 PM
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I just passed by Fillion here in Montreal and they do have the CX800 on display, the 65" version.

It's beautiful and I can't wait for the CX850.

The salesperson told me that they are a premiere reseller of Panasonic and will get the CX850 first... i'm on the waiting list
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post #705 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by MR MR View Post
I just passed by Fillion here in Montreal and they do have the CX800 on display, the 65" version.

It's beautiful and I can't wait for the CX850.

The salesperson told me that they are a premiere reseller of Panasonic and will get the CX850 first... i'm on the waiting list
Any more detailed observations of the 800 you'd care to share?

Go Duke !
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post #706 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 01:09 PM
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Any more detailed observations of the 800 you'd care to share?
Honestly the salesman was after me and I was kinda in a rush... so we talked much more about the CX850... but everything looks beautiful, the frame is a beautiful brushed aluminum.

For what it was worth, it was playing LOTR upscaled bluray, image is fantastic... but it didn't deliver a true 4k feed like the AX setup next to it which looked amazing (playing soccer and skyline images).
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post #707 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 01:34 PM
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Looks like Panasonic might take the crown for best high end value tv. LGs oleds still need to come down in price a little bit.
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post #708 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 02:01 PM
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Panasonic CX850U Anticipation Thead

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcuslaw View Post
Everyone who continues to doubt that the CX850 will feature FALD should ask themselves "why would Panasonic design and declare its 2015 "flagship" a lesser performing edge lit TV particularly on the heels of the AX900?"

Because it's not really the flagship? There's a picture of a CX900 specs overview over at AVF. It has the "ultra" version of the local dimming system:

https://www.avforums.com/threads/pan...#post-22124911

"New model - replaces AX902"

The forum member who posted that, he's a Panasonic dealer. He's proven to be a reliable source of information in the past.
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Last edited by fluxo; 05-30-2015 at 02:12 PM.
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post #709 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 02:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Because it's not really the flagship? There's a picture of a CX900 specs overview over at AVF. It has the "ultra" version of the local dimming system:

https://www.avforums.com/threads/pan...#post-22124911

"New model - replaces AX902"

The forum member who posted that, he's a Panasonic dealer. He's proven to be a reliable source of information in the past.
That's the first I've heard of that model. The CX850 is the flagship here in the U.S. according to Panasonic itself. Here's the press release from back on January 5th: Panasonic Unveils Its CX850 Flagship 4K UHD TV Series. No mention of a "CX900".
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post #710 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 03:43 PM
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Panasonic CX850U Anticipation Thead

Maybe you're not getting it in the US? Or perhaps they don't want to publicly announce it too soon? All sorts of possibilities.

As always, guessing is a bit of a hopeless game. As for the dimming system: let's just wait and see what it is. We shall know soon enough. Maybe the first here to get these sets can work out whether it's edge-lit or FALD.
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post #711 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fluxo View Post
Maybe you're not getting it in the US? Or perhaps they don't want to publicly announce it too soon? All sorts of possibilities.

As always, guessing is a bit of a hopeless game. As for the dimming system: let's just wait and see what it is. We shall know soon enough. Maybe the first here to get these sets can work out whether it's edge-lit or FALD.
It sounds like the CX900 won't be out until near year's end, even if it does come here. Was there any indication of whether it will be IPS or VA panel?

Go Duke !
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post #712 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlindo View Post
I think even before Jessica (funny it was perhaps the same Jessica in both chats) said it was fald that Panasonic pretty much said it was fald. In the Panasonic Canada and UK descriptions of local dimming pro it says

"...individual control over a large array of LED lights behind the screen"

You'd have to be playing pretty loose with the English language to refer to edge lit as a large array of led lights behind the screen. To me it is not so much the description of behind the screen that is key but the description of a large array of LED lights. For those who may be looking at descriptions of the tech from last year's sets, they do not describe it as a large array of led lights behind the screen for local dimming pro on the edge lit ax800.

Then there is the fact guys like Mark and David had to have got their info from someone at Panasonic since they don't make up specs and features for TVs. Sure it is possible they were given wrong info yet it seems more likely they were given the correct info, especially since one or both apparently double checked after it was brought up recently.


Maybe not too loose.........any lighting is of course behind the screen......there may be several lights behind the screen...along the edge.........I hope it is FALD though as I am interested.........I would want to see it with 4K Blu with max features to determine if the picture is better than Blu ray on my calibrated 65ST60........and I am certainly not necessarily expecting it to be any better.
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post #713 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 07:59 PM
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Maybe not too loose.........any lighting is of course behind the screen......there may be several lights behind the screen...along the edge.........I hope it is FALD though as I am interested.........I would want to see it with 4K Blu with max features to determine if the picture is better than Blu ray on my calibrated 65ST60........and I am certainly not necessarily expecting it to be any better.
Wasn't the ST the entry-level plasma set? ST<GT<VT<ZT ? I'd hope that it could at least beat that in overall picture quality, though the ZT may be more of a challenge.

There's more to picture quality than black levels. One issue I've had with the VA Shootouts is that they calibrate all of the sets to the same brightness level, which handicaps one of LCDs big benefits - they can achieve far brighter brights and more vibrant pictures than plasmas.
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post #714 of 1664 Old 05-30-2015, 09:49 PM
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Wasn't the ST the entry-level plasma set? ST<GT<VT<ZT ? I'd hope that it could at least beat that in overall picture quality, though the ZT may be more of a challenge.

There's more to picture quality than black levels. One issue I've had with the VA Shootouts is that they calibrate all of the sets to the same brightness level, which handicaps one of LCDs big benefits - they can achieve far brighter brights and more vibrant pictures than plasmas.

The calibrated 65ST60 blows the doors off of almost any LCD that ever existed !! The calibrated picture is better to me than the 65ZT60 (I owned both!)...........the ST can display a much brighter picture than the VT or ZT...........AND THE BLACK is as black as it gets outside of OLED !!


NO GLORIOUS LCD FLASHLIGHTING !!!!!!!!
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post #715 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 04:21 AM - Thread Starter
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If this CX900 is legit, WTF Panasonic? I'm beginning to wonder whether the local dimming in the CX850, though full array, is in fact some watered down version from the AX900 only to serve as a precursor for the CX900. I'm looking into it.
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post #716 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 06:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcuslaw View Post
If this CX900 is legit, WTF Panasonic? I'm beginning to wonder whether the local dimming in the CX850, though full array, is in fact some watered down version from the AX900 only to serve as a precursor for the CX900. I'm looking into it.
Sounds like the same launch plan as the ax900 but hopefully this one actually becomes available in good supply. The ax900 was available for months in Panasonic canada website @ a whopping $8K before the recent drop to $5499.

As I've said before my local contact says his info from then Panasonic Canada rep is that the 850 isn't FALD. What the info currently available does suggest though, is as you've stated,
A watered down local dimming ultra, OR is it an enhanced version of last years local dimming pro, with more zones?

We're getting mighty close to release wit the 65cx800 on the streets In Montreal. We should get our answer sometime in June . Sadly, for those interested in the pending cx900, it's going to be a long wait to the fall.
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post #717 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 06:55 AM
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If you watch this clip
http://youtu.be/B-J3io_ycuU you'll see that there is an x940, now whether that is a prototype or the actual flagship who knows, it appears to be at least a 75" screen. But I have read as others have that the x850 is going to be the u.s. Flagship
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post #718 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
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If you watch this clip
http://youtu.be/B-J3io_ycuU you'll see that there is an x940, now whether that is a prototype or the actual flagship who knows, it appears to be at least a 75" screen. But I have read as others have that the x850 is going to be the u.s. Flagship
Over here within Euroland there's an TX-85X942B listed

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post #719 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 07:15 AM
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Over here within Euroland there's an TX-85X942B listed
I wonder if that is more or less the equivalent of the TC-85AX850U? The specs are very similar, including the DisplayPort connection.

TX-85X942B: http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer...42b.specs.html

TC-85AX850U: http://shop.panasonic.com/tvs/4k-tvs/TC-85AX850U.html
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post #720 of 1664 Old 05-31-2015, 07:47 AM
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Unfortunately Panasonic's world-wide model number naming convention is highly confusing
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