**Official** Sony X930C / X940C Owners Thread - Page 170 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5071 of 14458 Old 11-08-2015, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Roper View Post
Does it look flat? Is it changing your backlight or contrast settings? It should look bright, punchy and saturated without you having to change anything on your part. But if it looks gray, flat or hazy, the tv is not acknowledging the meta data, and the experiment is over for the Sony.
Tom, I downloaded the file twice to a USB drive and tried playing it on my 940c. No success.

Unlike some HDR files whose metadata was not read properly, and therefore played 'flat', this was the first file that simply wouldn't play. Playback had the appearance of colored confetti, however the soundtrack played perfectly.

As I said, all other files I've tried either played HDR successfully or played it without HDR kicking in, resulting in a flat playback. This file had some odd structure that prevented any coherent playback.
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post #5072 of 14458 Old 11-08-2015, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
Tom, I downloaded the file twice to a USB drive and tried playing it on my 940c. No success.

Unlike some HDR files whose metadata was not read properly, and therefore played 'flat', this was the first file that simply wouldn't play. Playback had the appearance of colored confetti, however the soundtrack played perfectly.

As I said, all other files I've tried either played HDR successfully or played it without HDR kicking in, resulting in a flat playback. This file had some odd structure that prevented any coherent playback.

thats a bummer. ive played the file on my tv with no issues and it looks tremendous.

Tom might need to take the file on a USB into a tv store and see if they will let him try to play it on a sony tv and see if he can figure out whats going on.
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post #5073 of 14458 Old 11-08-2015, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by nobrien1 View Post
As I began watching a football game today it hit me that I could get a picture of what I am seeing by pausing the program. I have submitted these pictures to SONY to see what they have to say. Note the distortion around the players.
It's the broadcast, not the TV. I was watching the Raiders vs Steelers and the images looked great. Then I switched over to the 49ers vs Falcons and it looked exactly like your photos.
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post #5074 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 03:27 AM
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Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
thats a bummer. ive played the file on my tv with no issues and it looks tremendous.

Tom might need to take the file on a USB into a tv store and see if they will let him try to play it on a sony tv and see if he can figure out whats going on.
No biggie Ray. As I said, it's the first time I've seen that in all the files I played, so definitely something not quite right with the file structure...at least as the Sony sees it.

Here's the other odd thing about this file. When I played it on my 4K laptop, unlike all other HDR files I've played on it, it didn't play flat, it looked perfectly normal. Playing an HDR file on this computer has always resulted in a washed out playback, since it doesn't know what to do with that metadata. So even my computer acted oddly in playing it back HDR as a normal file.

The file also starts off with a screen filled with verbiage, such as the camera that shot it, etc.
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post #5075 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 04:51 AM
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Hypothetical law question : If i were to purchase a Sony 75XBR940C set early next year and by the end of 2016 Sony announces it is getting out of business selling TVs in the USA market, with the company still in existence with a headquarter, by USA law must Sony keep at hand replacement parts for consumer electronics products for 5 years afterwards ?
If i remember correctly (after these many years my memory is beginning to take a hit) i read an article in the 1980's stating the above fact and i wonder if my assumption is correct or not.

I wonder if owners of Mitsubishi or Toshiba or even Sharp LCD sets that are now in need of out-of-warranty repairs can easily find replacement parts for their sets and for how long, and please don't flame me for this post as i am not pointing suspicions/ aspersions toward Sony in any way or form, i simply became a "paranoid" consumer electronic buyer for some years now, especially concerning such expensive purchase.
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post #5076 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 04:59 AM
 
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Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
thats a bummer. ive played the file on my tv with no issues and it looks tremendous.

Tom might need to take the file on a USB into a tv store and see if they will let him try to play it on a sony tv and see if he can figure out whats going on.
the file doesn't work on the LG OLED EF9500 either.
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post #5077 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 05:03 AM
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Originally Posted by MCaugusto View Post
Hypothetical law question : If i were to purchase a Sony 75XBR940C set early next year and by the end of 2016 Sony announces it is getting out of business selling TVs in the USA market, with the company still in existence with a headquarter, by USA law must Sony keep at hand replacement parts for consumer electronics products for 5 years afterwards ?
If i remember correctly (after these many years my memory is beginning to take a hit) i read an article in the 1980's stating the above fact and i wonder if my assumption is correct or not.

I wonder if owners of Mitsubishi or Toshiba or even Sharp LCD sets that are now in need of out-of-warranty repairs can easily find replacement parts for their sets and for how long, and please don't flame me for this post as i am not pointing suspicions/ aspersions toward Sony in any way or form, i simply became a "paranoid" consumer electronic buyer for some years now, especially concerning such expensive purchase.
You will be fine. Just get a SqTrade warranty and if it cant be fixed you get full value back. BTW, Sony actually is making money again.
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post #5078 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobrien1 View Post
As I began watching a football game today it hit me that I could get a picture of what I am seeing by pausing the program. I have submitted these pictures to SONY to see what they have to say. Note the distortion around the players.
It's the FOX broadcast. The resolution is lower than that of CBS/NBC. You will notice many more artifacts on the FOX/ESPN broadcasts than on the CBS/NBC broadcasts.
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post #5079 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 06:17 AM
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A lot more depends on it than 720p vs 1080i.

For example, my local fox is not loaded up with subchannels like CBS is, therefore Fox "looks" better OTA at times, especially in high motion. My local CBS is on 5.1, and they have a 5.2, 5.3, etc... for junk. PBS is the same way and CW is now doing it. Drastically diminished the PQ.

So all that being said, just because OTA CBS looks better than ABC in your area does not mean it will in another. Now ESPN isnt gonna hang with any of them, usually. ESPN also depends on the food which is why some games at stadium A look better than stadium B on the same day.

My Local ABC OTA is not diluted with subchannels and is easily the best of the group with a Satuday night college game.
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post #5080 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post
A lot more depends on it than 720p vs 1080i.

For example, my local fox is not loaded up with subchannels like CBS is, therefore Fox "looks" better OTA at times, especially in high motion. My local CBS is on 5.1, and they have a 5.2, 5.3, etc... for junk. PBS is the same way and CW is now doing it. Drastically diminished the PQ.

So all that being said, just because OTA CBS looks better than ABC in your area does not mean it will in another. Now ESPN isnt gonna hang with any of them, usually. ESPN also depends on the food which is why some games at stadium A look better than stadium B on the same day.

My Local ABC OTA is not diluted with subchannels and is easily the best of the group with a Satuday night college game.
While I agree, it's not just the resolution, I stand by the fact 1080i will look better than 720p in every aspect if all the other factors are the same (bitrate, compression, etc.). If you look at closeups on a FOX broadcast, they look spectacular. Once the camera pans out, you begin to introduce a lot of noise due to actual resolution loss. I am not a technical expert, but my eyes definitely see a difference. One more note, I also live in an area where our CBS station (WRAL) was the first to do a local HD broadcast. We have very high quality OTA here in the Raleigh-Durham area.
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post #5081 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 06:47 AM
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I agree, all things being equal CBS NFL will look better than Fox NFL, I remember that before OTA got too many subchannels and all tv providers cranked up compression on every channel (2002-2003).

Problem is now, between local market and provider variation, all things are not equal anymore. It's best to sort out issues using a reference blu-ray, not local channels, or even cable channels. hell, satellite is using variable rate encoders, so HBO might look good on Monday night and not as good on Tuesday night. It's crazy.

One of the best things I did is stop obsessing over PQ in those terms. Calibrate the display, get a good source, and it is what it is. You will drive yourself nuts if you want everything to look like digitally shot movies. I love Walking Dead, but they shoot that to look like a 70's flick and its bad at times.

A friend asked me why his 40" LCD looks better than his 70" at times on Uverse. I told him because the compression rates used are probably best for a 50" panel tops, its like blowing up low rez digital pics from a camera. We buy the big screens for movie time!
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post #5082 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post
One of the best things I did is stop obsessing over PQ in those terms. Calibrate the display, get a good source, and it is what it is. You will drive yourself nuts if you want everything to look like digitally shot movies. I love Walking Dead, but they shoot that to look like a 70's flick and its bad at times.

A friend asked me why his 40" LCD looks better than his 70" at times on Uverse. I told him because the compression rates used are probably best for a 50" panel tops, its like blowing up low rez digital pics from a camera. We buy the big screens for movie time!
I completely agree. It's interesting though, I have my set calibrated for Apps (Netflix/Amazon) like it would be set up in a theater (both dark and daytime). For sports, I like a lot more punch to the picture and prefer it to be a little over saturated and over sharp. I think it's just the nature of the content.

I hope you're enjoying your new set.
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post #5083 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 07:52 AM
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I am. As a plasma guy I was worried, but I am not any more.
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post #5084 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 08:30 AM
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No biggie Ray. As I said, it's the first time I've seen that in all the files I played, so definitely something not quite right with the file structure...at least as the Sony sees it.

The file also starts off with a screen filled with verbiage, such as the camera that shot it, etc.
I'm re-encoding a compliant version, since I suspect the issue for the LG and Sony is not supporting 4:2:2 playback from the USB.

HDR is actually just 4:2:0 chroma sub-sampling.

I'll post a link to the new file after it is uploaded.

Thanks for trying.

Tom
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post #5085 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 08:33 AM
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the file doesn't work on the LG OLED EF9500 either.
Encoding a compliant 4:2:0 version. I think this will fix the problem, if not I will try lowering the bit rate.
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post #5086 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 08:49 AM
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the file doesn't work on the LG OLED EF9500 either.
The spec sheet for the EF9500 shows support only for DivX HD from the USB, so it looks like that's the issue for that set. Do you have information to the contrary?

In other words, the EF9500 may support 4k HDR through streaming or HDMI.
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Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post
I am. As a plasma guy I was worried, but I am not any more.



I too have been viewing a plasma for 8 years and have adjusted well to this set. I agree you can drive yourself crazy with the PQ. I have been guilty playing around with the various settings on the various picture modes. I believe that this set does seem to upscale the 1080I/P better at least from what I am seeing the short time I have had it.
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post #5088 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 09:12 AM
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Another advantage of LCD is they can be more clean on noisy sources. Plasmas have dither going on in noisy areas and the screen appears to crawl in areas. I think the LCD tech avoids this.

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post #5089 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 09:21 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Tom Roper View Post
The spec sheet for the EF9500 shows support only for DivX HD from the USB, so it looks like that's the issue for that set. Do you have information to the contrary?

In other words, the EF9500 may support 4k HDR through streaming or HDMI.


That's false, I've viewed plenty of 4K HEVC content, as well as HDR content (2 movie demos, the fire demo, and that one 10-15 second demo) through the USB stick. Appreciate your help trying to get this working across the board! Like Ken Ross, this is the only file I've ever had any trouble playing via USB.
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post #5090 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 09:22 AM
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For the Sony X930C/X940C; I'm not seeing express support stated for 4k via USB. Does anyone have more information about this?

Ken, I assume you have tried HEVC 8 bit 4:2:0 30/p via USB?
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post #5091 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 09:30 AM
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That's false, I've viewed plenty of 4K HEVC content, as well as HDR content (2 movie demos, the fire demo, and that one 10-15 second demo) through the USB stick. Appreciate your help trying to get this working across the board! Like Ken Ross, this is the only file I've ever had any trouble playing via USB.
Okay then. All of the previous HDR content out there has been HEVC 10 bit 4:2:0 24/p.

Let's try taking it one step at a time, my video was HEVC 10 bit 4:2:2 30/p. I'm encoding a version now in 4:2:0 to see if that's the problem. If it's not fixed in this next version, can I request your help in trying a series of shorter clips say 5 seconds each, short downloads, to narrow down where the incompatibility is?

Thanks,
Tom
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post #5092 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 09:34 AM
 
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Okay then. All of the previous HDR content out there has been HEVC 10 bit 4:2:0 24/p.

Let's try taking it one step at a time, my video was HEVC 10 bit 4:2:2 30/p. I'm encoding a version now in 4:2:0 to see if that's the problem. If it's not fixed in this next version, can I request your help in trying a series of shorter clips say 5 seconds each, short downloads, to narrow down where the incompatibility is?

Thanks,
Tom
Sure, feel free to contact me through PM if you don't want to clog this thread out. I'd be glad to help.
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post #5093 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 12:15 PM
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So, tomorrow they will come for the third time the x940c exchange for a new one, hoping that this time a good one.
Three time's the charm, they say!
Fingers cross,that all pixels now working fine...
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post #5094 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 12:42 PM
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I was watching the newly released 4K version of Lawrence Of Arabia on Netflix on my 940c. Some scenes were stunning in terms of detail, color and contrast.

It's hard to believe the film is over 50 years old! Just a great job in terms of streaming 4K.

On the flip side, I was comparing the Amazon 4K version of Fury to the same 4K movie on my Sony FMP10. Although the streaming 4K version on Amazon was good, the 4K Unlimited version was far better.

For that test I was just using the 2 minute 4K preview on FMP10, that I had previously downloaded.
I saw that and was interested until I saw the price. I think it was $25. Did you pay $25? or is there a way to see it for free or discounted?
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post #5095 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 12:44 PM
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As I began watching a football game today it hit me that I could get a picture of what I am seeing by pausing the program. I have submitted these pictures to SONY to see what they have to say. Note the distortion around the players.
Turn off all image processing. It helps a lot with poor source material.
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post #5096 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 12:55 PM
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So, tomorrow they will come for the third time the x940c exchange for a new one, hoping that this time a good one.
Three time's the charm, they say!
Fingers cross,that all pixels now working fine...������
Good luck!
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post #5097 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Roper View Post
For the Sony X930C/X940C; I'm not seeing express support stated for 4k via USB. Does anyone have more information about this?

Ken, I assume you have tried HEVC 8 bit 4:2:0 30/p via USB?
Tom, I play all of my 4K edited projects via a USB drive and they all play perfectly. So no issues there.

Your new file plays beautifully with no issue and HDR settings do indeed kick in automatically. Encoding 4:2:0 was the key. Unlike the Sony's HDMI ports which can be 'extended' to accept 4K 10bit content, there is no such ability on the USB ports.

Thanks for the extra effort.
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post #5098 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 01:57 PM
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I saw that and was interested until I saw the price. I think it was $25. Did you pay $25? or is there a way to see it for free or discounted?
It was up on Netflix as part of my normal package. So no extra cost.
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post #5099 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 02:33 PM
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3 questions about Apps

1) How do I add an App? (for example - HBO)

2) How do I delete an App?

3) There's so much crap running in the background (App wise) - what do I actually need and what can I delete?
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post #5100 of 14458 Old 11-09-2015, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
Tom, I play all of my 4K edited projects via a USB drive and they all play perfectly. So no issues there.

Your new file plays beautifully with no issue and HDR settings do indeed kick in automatically. Encoding 4:2:0 was the key. Unlike the Sony's HDMI ports which can be 'extended' to accept 4K 10bit content, there is no such ability on the USB ports.

Thanks for the extra effort.
Thanks for your help in getting this issue solved! The new file is still 10 bit encoded, only change was to take the color sub-sampling to 4:2:0 as you noted, so good news the Sony is happy with 10 bit 4k content via USB.

Hopefully alexanderg823 gets to try this out on his LG EF9500 and that that is solved on that display as well.

All: Here is the download link to the new file that Ken tested via private mail.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7w...ew?usp=sharing
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Last edited by Tom Roper; 11-09-2015 at 03:08 PM.
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