Official Vizio 2016/2017 P Series Owners ONLY Thread UHD/HDR/DV No Price Talk Please - Page 1210 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #36271 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GardenVariety View Post

I can't believe you and others can't get this simple concept.
It was not a beta list when I "signed up" for it.


Garden,

You quoted me and missed what I said:

"Yes, it turned into a Beta-push list, and yes you must have missed that..."

So you missed out on the step where Matt said to get back to him if you did not
want to be on the Beta list. I get that. What else do want from all of this?

Please, just bite the bullet. Write to Matt to get your SN taken-off the 'List'.

I wish you peace and calmness. A fix will come soon.


.

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EvilutionMankind Was CreatedWe Didn't Come From ApesThere Was a Worldwide Flood!
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post #36272 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 09:36 PM
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FYI, I just checked VUDU---BvS---Dolby Atmos/DD+ is working for me as reported by the Marantz 5010 AVR.
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post #36273 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 10:15 PM
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I can also confirm local dimming issues with the latest firmware.

However, I basically game on this set 99% of the time in HDMI 5 which isn't tied to the same stuff as 1-4, and I don't see any issues on that port.

I don't even use HDR in games since I prefer Clear Action, but in the hopes that the future will allow both to be used at the same time, I do hope the local dimming/HDR issues are fixed. For now, I'm mostly fine with the set.

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post #36274 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 11:01 PM
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So I'm ok with this because it's turned out that the problems seem to be HDR/DV specific - watching SDR content, if it's 720p, 1080p, or 4k, it all looks acceptable, and the local dimming issues are so subtle they're hard to see. It's only in HDR/DV modes, where a rapid and supple backlight is a prerequisite, that things start to look sluggish and bizarre. Hoping for a fix on those ASAP.

But to all the people saying it's a beta, and this comes with the territory - that's true, and fair - and it's a weird fluke of our connected age that, like Microsoft with the Xbox One S, you can actually rally your customers by having an incomplete product, where being in on its improvements is fun.

As betas go, though, the HDR problems with the backlight in this firmware are *so* conspicuous that they're beyond what I would have expected, both because Matt said this beta was very stable and because the bugs squashed and noted have been so scattered and trivial, like, if you Cast Dolby Audio at 6:47 P.M. and have the backlight to 73, you'll get some slight ghosting. If those are bugs, this is like finding a raccoon in your basement.

I haven't been in on beta testing anything for years, so maybe I'm wrong - but some sort of rollback option, or alternative delivery for firmwares, could be helpful for those of us who have less stomach for trapping wild animals, and just like to swat flies.
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post #36275 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 11:24 PM
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@andy582 the option is always available to remove oneself from the beta program. While this firmware might have looked good in house, getting it out to users here will truly show some of its warts. If you do t have he stomach for regressions then I would suggest getting off the beta/early release list. We've already seen an u precedented amount of communication from Matt, but I think he wants to keep this as "hands off" as possible. Adding too many variables just isn't feasible or easily manageable.


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post #36276 of 63942 Old 12-18-2016, 11:37 PM
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I do find it odd that the HDR issues everyone is getting was somehow not seen on their end before release. That one is pretty glaring, and hard to not see.
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post #36277 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 12:13 AM
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This is why we can't have nice things, not surprised we don't see Matt show up in the thread often anymore, there's too much childish bickering and whining about things we wanted or asked for and didn't get, or didn't ask for but got anyway. Just in time for the Christmas season, you're all acting like a bunch of spoiled brats on Christmas morning, good job.
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post #36278 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 02:59 AM
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More out of curiosity than anything.

If someone has the latest beta and is unhappy with it, even if they were taken off the beta list, wouldn't they still be stuck with the latest beta? It isn't like they can revert to an earlier release.....or is it? Are they any worst sticking with getting the betas than being stuck at the current beta and waiting for a general release?

My P65-C1 is due to arrive today. For now, would sticking with the general releases and not do any betas be better if all I intend to do is a HD SDR calibration?
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post #36279 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karnis2 View Post
Make sure the content is HDR by confirming it in the Vizio app, then while the HDR video is playing, set your picture mode to calibrated & backlight to 100 & see if that helps.
Thanks, confirmed it's in HDR mode. When I set the backlight to 100% it does increase contrast a lot, but blacks lose a lot of detail. Maybe that's how it's supposed to be, but it would surprise me...

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post #36280 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 03:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post
More out of curiosity than anything.

If someone has the latest beta and is unhappy with it, even if they were taken off the beta list, wouldn't they still be stuck with the latest beta? It isn't like they can revert to an earlier release.....or is it? Are they any worst sticking with getting the betas than being stuck at the current beta and waiting for a general release?

My P65-C1 is due to arrive today. For now, would sticking with the general releases and not do any betas be better if all I intend to do is a HD SDR calibration?
Yeah, I'd stay off the beta. The last one cleared up an issue with HDR through the Xbox One S, but the new beta has introduced an issue with HDR and the backlight that applies to devices and casting.
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post #36281 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post
@andy582 the option is always available to remove oneself from the beta program. While this firmware might have looked good in house, getting it out to users here will truly show some of its warts. If you do t have he stomach for regressions then I would suggest getting off the beta/early release list. We've already seen an u precedented amount of communication from Matt, but I think he wants to keep this as "hands off" as possible. Adding too many variables just isn't feasible or easily manageable.


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Fair enough- but I haven't done any beta testing in years, so I'm out of touch- is this backlight issue more dramatic than the usual glitches in a beta release, or no?
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post #36282 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 03:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemon11 View Post
This is why we can't have nice things, not surprised we don't see Matt show up in the thread often anymore, there's too much childish bickering and whining about things we wanted or asked for and didn't get, or didn't ask for but got anyway. Just in time for the Christmas season, you're all acting like a bunch of spoiled brats on Christmas morning, good job.
Look, I love this set, I've already recommended it to people - but let's not act like it's ingratitude when Vizio shipped a feature-incomplete product and has been scrambling to get it up to speed. Customers aren't children.
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post #36283 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 04:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Official Vizio 2016 P Series Owners Thread (UHD/HDR/DV) No Price Talk Please

Quote:
Originally Posted by CleCakYngMfd View Post
Garden,


You quoted me and missed what I said:

"Yes, it turned into a Beta-push list, and yes you must have missed that..."

So you missed out on the step where Matt said to get back to him if you did not
want to be on the Beta list. I get that. What else do want from all of this?

Please, just bite the bullet. Write to Matt to get your SN taken-off the 'List'.

I wish you peace and calmness. A fix will come soon.


.


One thing we don't do in this thread and on this site is evoke other members names into things. I see you meant it in jest but it's bad practice and rarely taken well.

SONY Z9F LCD Master Series Owners Thread
Vizio 2016 P series FAQ, general info and Help
Sony Z9F 75, Vizio P75C1 UHD/HDR/DV, Pioneer Elite SC-95, Samsung UHD Bluray K8500, AppleTV 4K, CC Ultra

Last edited by thomasfxlt; 12-19-2016 at 07:01 AM.
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post #36284 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 04:10 AM
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I'm not seeing the problems many others are reporting. I played Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children on my 65 inch via Samsung 4k player, and saw what to my eye is the best all around PQ I have seen to date. My day to day viewing with Directv as my provider has been solid also. I have not gotten around to watching my Roku Ultra, or done any casting since the update. If and when I see a problem with either of them I will report it here.

I can say however that the video drop outs still happen when I connect my Yamaha 106 sound bar via HDMI.
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post #36285 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 04:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven Crimson View Post
I do find it odd that the HDR issues everyone is getting was somehow not seen on their end before release. That one is pretty glaring, and hard to not see.
This is the value of releasing the beta firmware to us. Users will always find things that you just don't find in testing. It not just testers sitting down and watching BvS 100 times on different settings. There are usually targeted tests that are performed and probably for this beta just a regression suite that was run and full testing is happening now. But what is good about catching these types of things and being able to give this kind of feedback, 1) they can fix it prior to the official release in some cases, and 2) they can develop new test cases to incorporate how users use the set. I can't tell you how many times I gloss over a simple checkbox or widget in a GUI and not test all interactions thinking "oh no one will click this checkbox and not hit OK" only to find someone clicking the box and then exiting the GUI. There is a lot of complexity with the set and all the options, its so hard to test every combination.
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post #36286 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shortyg83 View Post
Do you have the newest Beta Firmware? 3.10?
This is an issue I have been having as well since getting the update. The TVs handshake seems to be obscenely more picky. Everything I have runs through my Yamaha receiver and into HDMI 1. Now when switching input on the AVR i have to sometimes change back and forth to get one to actually go through. This happened obscenely rarely on the old firmware but since I got the beta I have to do it almost everytime I change an input.
My hdmi sync had been solid since my last cabling swapping escapade. Now with the latest firmware my Roku Ultra intermittently flashes a purple screen saying HDCP 2.2 not detected. Then flashes right back. Something definitely changed or off with the hdmi sync in the new beta.
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post #36287 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 05:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CleCakYngMfd View Post
Garden,

You quoted me and missed what I said:

"Yes, it turned into a Beta-push list, and yes you must have missed that..."

So you missed out on the step where Matt said to get back to him if you did not
want to be on the Beta list. I get that. What else do want from all of this?

Please, just bite the bullet. Write to Matt to get your SN taken-off the 'List'.

I wish you peace and calmness. A fix will come soon.

.
Fanboyz make me
I am glad you are not speaking for me.
I am glad I didn't put my name on a list to receive nonBeta firmware first. If I ended up getting beta firmware with no back up I would be upset.

From my point of view this is a Vizio mini PR disaster and it doesn't even matter how much of this stuff is true.

Now for all those nicely waiting for updates for beta firmware they didn't think they would get:
Christmas breaks and holidays start in 5 days. If you don't get something in the next couple of days you are probably out of luck unless you raise a stink. No company in their right mind is going to push firmware during xmas break unless a customer directs them to.
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post #36288 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaverJ View Post
The previous beta firmware mostly fixed the P50's backlight flicker, but the issue has returned (maybe worse?) with yesterday's firmware update for me.

Really hoping Matt McRae can look into this for the next stable firmware update.
I think its just inherent to the P50 TBH...oh well. My replacement is suppose to come today but I have work so I need to reschedule. Hopefully its not cracked again when it comes.
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post #36289 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 06:03 AM
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I can confirm I have also lost DD+ with my Denon X1200 when casting Netflix or Roku P+. Also when I start my Cast activity with my Harmony remote the Vizio switches to the COMP input vs the CAST. This happened post update and was working fine before. Anyone else notice this? I haven't had a chance to check my Harmony settings in the software but I couldn't imagine the Harmony doing this on its own.

@seinberg I see the same thing with The OA. Some detail looks amazing but for the most part the show doesn't benefit from the HDR and looks like an ok 4K presentation. Some of this has to be with the production of the show and based on the director's vision. Just because it has HDR doesnt mean it will be looking out the window or whatever. Daredevil is a prime example; the HDR has its moments but there is a lot of grain which was added back in during post.
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post #36290 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by wmarkw View Post
@seinberg I see the same thing with The OA. Some detail looks amazing but for the most part the show doesn't benefit from the HDR and looks like an ok 4K presentation. Some of this has to be with the production of the show and based on the director's vision. Just because it has HDR doesnt mean it will be looking out the window or whatever. Daredevil is a prime example; the HDR has its moments but there is a lot of grain which was added back in during post.
Ah, this is really good confirmation that it's not an issue with my set or calibration or something. I was watching some YouTube 4K demo videos (non HDR) and they looked absolutely incredible, so I couldn't understand how HDR with The OA and some other shows looked so mediocre. Is there a good streaming show that demonstrates HDR capabilities well?

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post #36291 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmarkw View Post

@seinberg I see the same thing with The OA.

Some detail looks amazing but for the most part the show doesn't
benefit from the HDR and looks like an ok 4K presentation.

Some of this has to be with the production
of the show and based on the director's vision.

Just because it has HDR doesn't mean it will
be looking out the window or whatever.

Daredevil is a prime example; the HDR has its moments but
there is a lot of grain which was added back in during post.



My diet has grains. I'll take grain vs a 'soft' cover-over. I see some sub-channel westerns that de-focus the grain and scratches. That's ugly. I'll take the film scratches, dirt, and grain in SHARP focus any day vs intentionally blurring the presentation.

Just to try it though, when I watched Daredevl, I adjusted the Reduce Signal Noise and/or Reduce Block Noise that greatly reduced or eliminated the 'grain'.


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post #36292 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 07:07 AM
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After some play time over the weekend within HDMI 5 - (GLL on) - i feel like the input lag increased just a tad bit.

Anyone else feel like the input was a little higher than usual?
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post #36293 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 07:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven Crimson View Post
I do find it odd that the HDR issues everyone is getting was somehow not seen on their end before release. That one is pretty glaring, and hard to not see.
"everyone" isn't having them. I haven't exactly been watching a ton of HDR content lately, but earlier in the thread someone posted some pretty bad looking pics with a ton of light bleed from The Do Over on Netflix DV. I queued up the same spot in the movie and saw none of those issues. Some of these issues are not 100% consistent and there are other variables at play so yes, they can slip through Vizio's testing but show up now that there's a wider audience beta testing.

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Last edited by chad473; 12-19-2016 at 08:31 AM.
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post #36294 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seinberg View Post
Ah, this is really good confirmation that it's not an issue with my set or calibration or something. I was watching some YouTube 4K demo videos (non HDR) and they looked absolutely incredible, so I couldn't understand how HDR with The OA and some other shows looked so mediocre. Is there a good streaming show that demonstrates HDR capabilities well?

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Try Meridian from Nexflix
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post #36295 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shortyg83 View Post
I am not sure that will actually matter much. If you have your tv set to ARC only, it still controls the AVR even though it shouldn't. So once you power on TV the AVR will then turn on as well. Also everytime you change an input on your AVR it rehandshakes with the tv so it would make using an order kind of pointless.
I am using my Directv remote to turn Vizio set on. But doing it that way seems to negate the Vizio turning on the AVR, regardless of CEC settings on all devices. Maybe someone else has had some luck doing this, without going the expensive Logitech route?
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post #36296 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Optum88 View Post
Try Meridian from Nexflix
I guess I should give that a whirl. I watched a few minutes after initially setting it up but don't remember what it looked like - just remember that the acting was embarrassingly bad But it would be a good test of HDR quality.

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post #36297 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 08:30 AM
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Red face

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai G0SU View Post
After some play time over the weekend within HDMI 5 - (GLL on) - i feel like the input lag increased just a tad bit.

Anyone else feel like the input was a little higher than usual?
I honestly haven’t been able to reproduce the HDR issues that everyone else is describing. However, I haven’t been focusing on that so it could be there but I just haven’t seen it. Instead I preformed my regression testing on the motion handling and quite frankly I was pleasantly stunned.

There have been issues with motion handling all along. At first there were issues where the settings would stick or would change when you switched from one input to another and back again. Those issues were resolved quickly though.

Then the only way to truly get amazing motion handling with the best input lag was to use HDMI 5 with GLL and clear action turned on. This gave you excellent motion handling but it also introduced the annoying flicker especially with mostly white web pages.

When I tried the most recent Beta firmware yesterday I was pleasantly surprised that the issues I had seen before with 1080p @ 120 FPS were all resolved. Now you can turn clear action on and not get any flickering. In addition what appears to have changed in this release is that with 1080p @ 120 FPS specifically it appears that the input lag with GLL turned “OFF” appears to be very usable.

There is still a difference in input lag between turning GLL on and off with 1080p @ 120 FPS on HDMI 5. However, now that difference appears to be small enough so that you can achieve absolute perfect motion handling with very reasonable input lag.

I didn’t have the ability to measure input lag numerically. However, I really would like to see RTINGS.com test the input lag in 1080p @ 120 FPS mode with GLL on and off.

RTINGS.com has always completely ignored 1080p @ 120 FPS. Samsung displays get an absolute pass for not having it. In addition Sony TVs get credit for having it even though RTINGS.com has said it is broken in the past.

Honestly, RTINGS.com is doing their readers a disservice by ignoring 1080p @ 120 FPS. It is the single best way to play video games. It doesn’t take a monster computer to run 1080p @ 120 FPS like it does with 4K @ 60 FPS.

I really hope that someone from RTINGS.com reads this and responds to it by doing additional testing for input lag at 120 FPS. Also I wonder if the input lag for other resolutions and frame rates has changed since they did their last test? I really think it is about time RTINGS.com gave this display a fair shot and gave it a real honest update to the review. I know they indicated in the past that they were going to do more testing to truly determine what it can and cannot do. However, I honestly do not believe that they gave it a fair shake when they retested it.
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post #36298 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpgxsvcd View Post

I preformed my regression testing on the motion
handling
and quite frankly I was pleasantly stunned.

There have been issues with motion handling all along.
At first there were issues where the settings would stick or would
change when you switched from one input to another and back again.
Those issues were resolved quickly though.


All the bad motion stuff from 2.2.7.4 and especially Beta 3.0.6.4 is fixed in 3.0.10.7?
If so, that's great.

I'm still waiting for some feedback that the audio dropouts in 3.0.6.4 is fixed
in 3.0.10.7. Then I can turn-off my Display for a bit and allow Beta 3.0.10.7 in.


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post #36299 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Optum88 View Post
Try Meridian from Nexflix

I tried casting Meridian to test out Netflix HDR (on current beta firmware) and the screen went pink on my P75 about halfway through. Anyone know why this is or how to fix? (thanks!)
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post #36300 of 63942 Old 12-19-2016, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by AdaptDaBuLL View Post

@Matt McRae



UPDATE:

I just received the Beta 3.0.10.7 firmware on my P65-C1. I will re-test the panel with the various devices and scenarios listed above and see if anything has changed. Feel free to drop me a line if you'd like me to check out something for you.

Hi AdaptDaBuLL,

Any news about the audio drops with Beta 3.0.10.7?

Is it corrected or still there?

Thanx-a-bunch.



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2016/2017 vizio p-series - nice pic(k)! / netflix , best value , D7000 , dolby vision , latest firmware - 6.0.18.1 - previous 5.0.16.1 , Vizio , Vudu

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