Official 2016 Sony XBR75 X940D Owners thread: no price talk - Page 429 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12841 of 13301 Old 12-14-2018, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by chelsMan88 View Post
Facial definition on Bluray is marginally better. On OTA it's about the same TBH. When watching the Football pundit's talking on a live 4K broadcast, the picture is fantastic.Also I've noticed how most of the advert's look very good too.Obviously these big companies want their product seen in the best possible light. All this leads me to think the problem lies in the source, namely the satellite box.Glad you're enjoying your new TV. I know you say it's a step up, but in terms of just PQ and sharpness, is the difference huge? Thanks.
A brighter HDR image, and Dolby Vision, add up to a significant improvement. "Huge" is relative, especially given that the 940D is already pretty good. However, if the sharpness issues lie in the source, then a new TV isn't going to magically make things better.
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post #12842 of 13301 Old 12-14-2018, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by chelsMan88 View Post
Facial definition on Bluray is marginally better. On OTA it's about the same TBH. When watching the Football pundit's talking on a live 4K broadcast, the picture is fantastic.Also I've noticed how most of the advert's look very good too.Obviously these big companies want their product seen in the best possible light. All this leads me to think the problem lies in the source, namely the satellite box.Glad you're enjoying your new TV. I know you say it's a step up, but in terms of just PQ and sharpness, is the difference huge? Thanks.
I'll say it again... Source QUALITY is king. There is no stacked rank of media formats that guarantees thing... In other words, BluRay is not better than DVD. Ever. If the original content was shot in 1930 and then it was digitally transferred and mastered to a BluRay with 3 other movies, it's still going to look like it was shot in 1930.

I have the DVD set of the first three Indiana Jones movies. The Last Crusade looks absolutely fantastic on my 940D and it's "only" mastered at the level that DVD can support. On the flip side, my BluRay mastered copy of The Blues Brothers looks decent, but I would imagine the DVD version is identical. The benefit to the BluRay version is a second copy of the movie with additional scenes.

You have to use source media that will produce known results in order to accurately assess PQ capabilities.
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post #12843 of 13301 Old 12-15-2018, 03:28 PM
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When using my Oppo 205 as a CD-only player, I have to leave the 940D on to avoid audio dropouts. Because I have my Marantz AV8802A set to analog input, the TV shows the No Device Connected screen. I would prefer to have the TV be dark (but still on). Is there any sort of dummy load I can plug into the HDMI port to cause this to happen? I tried a HDMI Dummy Plug Headless Ghost Display Emulator, but that had no effect on the display.
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post #12844 of 13301 Old 12-15-2018, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by hawkster27 View Post
When using my Oppo 205 as a CD-only player, I have to leave the 940D on to avoid audio dropouts. Because I have my Marantz AV8802A set to analog input, the TV shows the No Device Connected screen. I would prefer to have the TV be dark (but still on). Is there any sort of dummy load I can plug into the HDMI port to cause this to happen? I tried a HDMI Dummy Plug Headless Ghost Display Emulator, but that had no effect on the display.
A simple solution I use is to press the Pic Off button. I like a dark screen when I am listening to music, and this works for me. If you have a programmable remote, you could even automate the Pic Off command.
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post #12845 of 13301 Old 12-15-2018, 07:53 PM
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I'll say it again... Source QUALITY is king. There is no stacked rank of media formats that guarantees thing... In other words, BluRay is not better than DVD. Ever. If the original content was shot in 1930 and then it was digitally transferred and mastered to a BluRay with 3 other movies, it's still going to look like it was shot in 1930.

I have the DVD set of the first three Indiana Jones movies. The Last Crusade looks absolutely fantastic on my 940D and it's "only" mastered at the level that DVD can support. On the flip side, my BluRay mastered copy of The Blues Brothers looks decent, but I would imagine the DVD version is identical. The benefit to the BluRay version is a second copy of the movie with additional scenes.

You have to use source media that will produce known results in order to accurately assess PQ capabilities.
So, are you really trying to convince us that a DVD, with a resolution of 480p, will look just as good as a Blu-ray, with a resolution of 1080p? I can hardly believe an AVS Forum member is posting this!! I don't mean to offend, but what you are saying is incredulous. The quality of the SOURCE is a consideration, but a lousy source (with specks, noise, and other anomalies) can be CLEANED UP quite nicely when it's REMASTERED unto a 1080p Blu-ray (or even better, a 4K/UHD Blu-ray). For example, I have the "Alfred Hitchcock Limited Edition" (The Essentials Collection) on Blu-ray, 5 films that date back to the 40's and 50's. They looked "okay" on DVD but they look AMAZING on Blu-ray.

I could list MANY more examples (such as the Remastered James Bond films on Blu-ray) that prove, without dispute, that Blu-ray is most definitely a SUPERIOR format over DVD. I have "double-dipped" (and sometimes "triple-dipped" because of UHD) many times with movies that I love because of the superior quality of a Blu-ray over its DVD counterpart or a UHD Blu-ray over its 1080p counterpart.

Okay, I'll get off my soap box now. I don't normally do this, but your post was so "off the wall" that I simply had to respond.
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post #12846 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 06:54 AM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
A simple solution I use is to press the Pic Off button. I like a dark screen when I am listening to music, and this works for me. If you have a programmable remote, you could even automate the Pic Off command.
AJ, that's effen genius! I've got a Harmony Elite, so programming should be easy. Thanks for helping an old man cross the street.
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post #12847 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
So, are you really trying to convince us that a DVD, with a resolution of 480p, will look just as good as a Blu-ray, with a resolution of 1080p? I can hardly believe an AVS Forum member is posting this!! I don't mean to offend, but what you are saying is incredulous. The quality of the SOURCE is a consideration, but a lousy source (with specks, noise, and other anomalies) can be CLEANED UP quite nicely when it's REMASTERED unto a 1080p Blu-ray (or even better, a 4K/UHD Blu-ray). For example, I have the "Alfred Hitchcock Limited Edition" (The Essentials Collection) on Blu-ray, 5 films that date back to the 40's and 50's. They looked "okay" on DVD but they look AMAZING on Blu-ray.

I could list MANY more examples (such as the Remastered James Bond films on Blu-ray) that prove, without dispute, that Blu-ray is most definitely a SUPERIOR format over DVD. I have "double-dipped" (and sometimes "triple-dipped" because of UHD) many times with movies that I love because of the superior quality of a Blu-ray over its DVD counterpart or a UHD Blu-ray over its 1080p counterpart.

Okay, I'll get off my soap box now. I don't normally do this, but your post was so "off the wall" that I simply had to respond.
Maybe you should read my post again.

A) I -NEVER- said a DVD looks as good as a BluRay

B) I cited specific TITLES and described how the format does not make them better or worse.

-I- am surprised that a member here completely missed the details in that post.
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post #12848 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 11:39 AM
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Maybe you should read my post again.

A) I -NEVER- said a DVD looks as good as a BluRay

B) I cited specific TITLES and described how the format does not make them better or worse.

-I- am surprised that a member here completely missed the details in that post.
Okay, let's keep this simple. What you SAID (which I was basing my post on) was, "In other words, BluRay is not better than DVD. Ever." That is a pretty "blanket statement" and your words which followed gave the same impression...that the Blu-ray format isn't going to offer you anything better than the DVD format.

As far as the "specific titles" that you cited, I happen to have the Indiana Jones 4 Film Collection on Blu-ray and they definitely look better (more clarity...better details...better black levels, etc.) than the DVD versions. Let's face it, a DVD is NOT "High Definition," and one can't expect it to look the same as a full HD (1080p) Blu-ray. Can it look almost as good? Yes, in some cases. But in the majority of cases it will NOT LOOK NEARLY AS GOOD.

Before I get off my soap box again, I will never forget the first time I saw a true HD broadcast/film; I was blown away by the clarity and depth compared to a DVD presentation. There may not be that big of a difference between Blu-ray and UHD, but there can be (and most often is) a huge difference between DVD and Blu-ray.

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post #12849 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Okay, let's keep this simple. What you SAID (which I was basing my post on) was, "In other words, BluRay is not better than DVD. Ever." That is a pretty "blanket statement" and your words which followed gave the same impression...that the Blu-ray format isn't going to offer you anything better than the DVD format.
And that is 100% true. BluRay and DVD are media. They are NOT source material. You are taking the next step with my statement and inferring that I was stating something about the quality of the CONTENT they held. But, if you put the same exact quality source material on both, they are going to look 100% identical when you watch either of them.


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As far as the "specific titles" that you cited, I happen to have the Indiana Jones 5 Film Collection on Blu-ray and they definitely look better (more clarity...better details...better black levels, etc.) than the DVD versions. Let's face it, a DVD is NOT "High Definition," and one can't expect it to look the same as a full HD (1080p) Blu-ray. Can it look almost as good? Yes, in some cases. But in the majority of cases it will NOT LOOK NEARLY AS GOOD.
Now you're making your own comparisons by telling me that a specific title looks better on one media than the other. That's perfectly reasonable, SO LONG AS the original material is high enough quality to take advantage of the increased storage capacity on BluRay or UHD BluRay. But, if you master a copy of your one-year-old's birthday party that you shot with your cell phone, it's going to be identical no matter what media you master it to.

I did not say that the DVD copy of The Last Crusade was better than the BluRay format - I stated that its quality was excellent. I also stated that the quality of The Blues Brothers on BluRay was likely identical to the quality on DVD because BluRay did not allow for higher quality source material - it wasn't recorded in high enough quality to benefit from the additional storage available on BluRay.

My comments were chosen to specifically demonstrate differences in the quality of the source material and you interpreted them to mean I was talking about the capabilities of the media. Avatar on DVD looks like crap next to any other, higher-quality format available. But, that wasn't what I was trying to explain. Quite the opposite, really.
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post #12850 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 12:03 PM
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^^^^^^

I hear what you're trying to say, but I DO WONDER how other members interpreted your post.

Regarding what you are saying, I have, at times, compared current broadcasts on satellite tv that were running the same show, at the same time; one was broadcast in SD and the other in HD. The difference is usually HUGE! Are you saying that the HD broadcast has a different "SOURCE material" than the SD broadcast and that's why it looks better? Remember, I'm referring to present-day material, not something from the 1930's.

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post #12851 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 12:21 PM
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^^^^^^

I hear what you're trying to say, but I DO WONDER how other members interpreted your post.

Regarding what you are saying, I have, at times, compared current broadcasts on satellite tv that were running the same show, at the same time; one was broadcast in SD and the other in HD. The difference is usually HUGE! Are you saying that the HD broadcast has a different "SOURCE material" than the SD broadcast and that's why it looks better? Remember, I'm referring to present-day material, not something from the 1930's.
It is my understanding that show being broadcast in different resolutions would fit the definition of having a different "source", regardless of the methodology that gets it to you. For example, an OTA broadcast will often have a HD and SD version of the same channel within the same "channel". These are two distinct streams, meant for different end systems. The HD one is not usable by an SD-only device, and that SD-only device would need to tune the SD version to be able to watch the programming.

It's sort of like taking a high quality visual film like Avatar and transcoding it down in order to be able to be mastered to DVD versus BluRay or UHD BluRay. The ACTUAL, ORIGINAL source is the same for all, but the VIEWED SOURCE for each is different as they are what the quality of the particular master is.

Does this mean that the show is being shot with two totally different cameras? No. One is being transcoded and streamed at one set of capabilities and the other is being transcoded and streamed with a second set of capabilities. But the camera being used and the original quality of what it captures is the single starting point for both.

When you're watching the HD version and then comparing it to the SD version, you're comparing an "original quality" version with a "reduced quality" version. I quoted both of those because the HD stream is almost certainly not a true original quality feed and is a reduced quality feed itself. So, it's probably better stated as comparing a slightly reduced quality version with a significantly reduced quality version. The quality reduction is handled before it's sent to save bandwidth while also still providing a version that can be used by lower resolution devices.
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post #12852 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 12:38 PM
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How about let’s discuss something new. What do you guys think about black bars and light bleed?
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post #12853 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 04:03 PM
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How about let’s discuss something new. What do you guys think about black bars and light bleed?
So, are you coaxing me to get back on my soapbox Jerry?

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post #12854 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 04:08 PM
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So, are you coaxing me to get back on my soapbox Jerry?
At least I could understand a discussion about black bars. The other one, not so much...
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post #12855 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 04:20 PM
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At least I could understand a discussion about black bars. The other one, not so much...
The "other discussion" (which, technically, I didn't start) is what often happens when nothing else is happening (just like the last few posts).

Having said that, I saw on the Z9F Thread (which you are now a part of as an owner) that you were going to test out the black bars to see how bad the blooming was. Have you seen some material yet to form any kind of an opinion? I can well imagine that it will be WORSE than the blooming we see occasionally on our 940D. I say this because of the high nit count on the Z9F, which is about DOUBLE the peak brightness of our beloved 940D.

Thankfully you aren't nearly as sensitive as I am to this plus you use bias lighting which should serve to obscure some of the blooming.

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post #12856 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 05:01 PM
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The "other discussion" (which, technically, I didn't start) is what often happens when nothing else is happening (just like the last few posts).

Having said that, I saw on the Z9F Thread (which you are now a part of as an owner) that you were going to test out the black bars to see how bad the blooming was. Have you seen some material yet to form any kind of an opinion? I can well imagine that it will be WORSE than the blooming we see occasionally on our 940D. I say this because of the high nit count on the Z9F, which is about DOUBLE the peak brightness of our beloved 940D.

Thankfully you aren't nearly as sensitive as I am to this plus you use bias lighting which should serve to obscure some of the blooming.
I have not run any specific tests to reveal whether there is an issue that I can't live with. The several HDR/Dolby Vision streaming programs I have been watching are not in letterbox format. I am still on the lookout, knowing you would like a report.
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post #12857 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 05:20 PM
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I have not run any specific tests to reveal whether there is an issue that I can't live with. The several HDR/Dolby Vision streaming programs I have been watching are not in letterbox format. I am still on the lookout, knowing you would like a report.
Jerry, one thing that has baffled me about "blooming" is that it is "inconsistent." By that I mean I have watched some UHD Blu-rays with bright objects next to the black bars and there was ZERO blooming. I believe I posted a picture well over a year ago from one of the Star Wars movies with a planet blowing up which was basically a huge fireball that spread all the way across the screen. I thought for sure the light would spill into the bars but it didn't. Then there are UHD Blu-rays like The Great Gatsby (starring Leonardo DeCaprio) that had scenes at his mansion with very bright chandeliers adjacent to the letter-boxed bars and they lit up like a Christmas tree! (That would be a good one for you to test your display with if you happen to own it or could stream it.)

Again, for the most part I've learned to live with it on our 940D, but I can't imagine what it would be like if our display reached 1500-2000 nits of brightness like the Z9F is reported to do. I am encouraged by all the praises the Z9F is getting from you and others regarding colors, wide-angle viewing, calibration options, brightness, etc. If only it had the Backlight Master Drive of the ZD9; if so I'd more than likely have one in my Man Cave right now and my 940D would be sitting in one of my daughter's family rooms.

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post #12858 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 05:45 PM
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I am not your typical owner here in AVS. I don’t purchase movies, because I rarely watch a movie more than one. So, since pure viewing enjoyment is my objective, I watch a fair amount of HD satellite broadcasts, and stream content from Netflix and Amazon Prime. I don’t go looking for programs to watch based purely on whether they are HDR or Dolby Vision.

I can say that I am very pleased so far with the Z9F with the programs I have watched this week (Marvelous Mrs Maisel in HDR, and My Brilliant Friend on HBO HD). The PQ has been exceptional. Did you see the results of my Autocalibration that I posted? Absolutely phenomenal.

HST, if you can recommend something on Netflix or Prime that is in HDR or DV, and that is in letterbox format, I’ll check it out and report what I see. I’ll even take some pictures, assuming that my iPhone will do justice reproducing what is on the display.
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post #12859 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 06:11 PM
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And I'm not your typical "streamer." I don't subscribe to Netflix or any other streaming service, but I am an Amazon Prime Member so I watch a fair amount of their "Original Movies." My most recent binge was watching Homecoming and The Jack Ryan Series. The PQ on Homecoming was a letdown, with poor blacks and many soft scenes. It wasn't "letter-boxed." The Jack Ryan Series had reference quality PQ, but it too was not letter-boxed. I believe they both had HDR but without a letter-boxed Aspect Ratio it's a moot point.

Last year I binge-watched The Man in the High Castle (the PQ was mixed and the Aspect Ratio was 1.85:1) and Mad Dogs (the PQ was Reference and if memory serves me it too was Full Screen).

I've watched quite a few letter-boxed movies on Starz but I don't believe any of those are UHD/HDR.

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post #12860 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 06:18 PM
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I think Lost in Space on Netflix is HDR/DV with letterboxes. I’ll give it a try.
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post #12861 of 13301 Old 12-16-2018, 07:09 PM
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The problem I have with OTA, other than the limited channel selection, is the difficulty to time-shift with a DVR, and being able to skip over the commercials.
TiVo Bolt OTA for the win!
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post #12862 of 13301 Old 12-17-2018, 03:29 PM
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I think Lost in Space on Netflix is HDR/DV with letterboxes. I’ll give it a try.
@djoberg : I watched some of Lost in Space (Dolby Vision HDR). It does have some light bleed into the bars. It doesn’t bother me at all. If you want, I can share the name of the anti-bleed meds I am taking.
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post #12863 of 13301 Old 12-17-2018, 04:27 PM
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@djoberg : I watched some of Lost in Space (Dolby Vision HDR). It does have some light bleed into the bars. It doesn’t bother me at all. If you want, I can share the name of the anti-bleed meds I am taking.
If you were living in Denver, I bet you'd be using their legalized "medicinal marijuana," but since you live in Austin I don't have a clue what you're using!

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post #12864 of 13301 Old 12-17-2018, 04:31 PM
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If you were living in Denver, I bet you'd be using their legalized "medicinal marijuana," but since you live in Austin I don't have a clue what you're using!
Rose colored glasses!
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post #12865 of 13301 Old 12-17-2018, 07:41 PM
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If you were living in Denver, I bet you'd be using their legalized "medicinal marijuana," but since you live in Austin I don't have a clue what you're using!
Austin is weird. They don't have to use anything.
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post #12866 of 13301 Old 12-21-2018, 01:05 PM
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940D + Xbox One + HDR

Is there a proper order in which the tv and xbox need to be powered on in order for the tv to detect an HDR signal every time? This is the most annoying thing in that everytime I play an HDR title (game or movie) I need to verify the tv switched into HDR mode. Most of the time it does not and I need to reboot the tv. After the reboot it will go into HDR mode. Thanks.
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post #12867 of 13301 Old 12-21-2018, 01:08 PM
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Official 2016 Sony XBR75 X940D Owners thread: no price talk

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Is there a proper order in which the tv and xbox need to be powered on in order for the tv to detect an HDR signal every time? This is the most annoying thing in that everytime I play an HDR title (game or movie) I need to verify the tv switched into HDR mode. Most of the time it does not and I need to reboot the tv. After the reboot it will go into HDR mode. Thanks.


On an experimental basis, I changed my TV to the last thing on the startup macro to try to improve HDR detection. It seems to have improved, but now the macro doesn't reliably power it on. In essence, I may have traded one problem for another.
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post #12868 of 13301 Old 12-27-2018, 05:54 AM
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Sorry for what's probably a duplicate question but the forum doesn't allow me to search for HDR. How can I see if HDR is enabled when streaming a movie from Google Play? How can I see if I actually get 4K? I just streamed Die Hard (it's Christmas) and it's supposed to be 4K and HDR but it didn't look spectacular. Thanks.
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post #12869 of 13301 Old 12-27-2018, 06:51 AM
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Sorry for what's probably a duplicate question but the forum doesn't allow me to search for HDR. How can I see if HDR is enabled when streaming a movie from Google Play? How can I see if I actually get 4K? I just streamed Die Hard (it's Christmas) and it's supposed to be 4K and HDR but it didn't look spectacular. Thanks.
When the TV recognizes a HDR input signal, it will automatically switch to the HDR Picture Mode. On the remote, press Action Menu, then Picture Settings, and note whether the TV is in HDR picture mode.
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post #12870 of 13301 Old 12-27-2018, 07:18 AM
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When the TV recognizes a HDR input signal, it will automatically switch to the HDR Picture Mode. On the remote, press Action Menu, then Picture Settings, and note whether the TV is in HDR picture mode.
I just tried this while streaming the movie and picture mode stays in custom.
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