Official 2016 Vizio M-Series Owner's Thread - Page 269 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #8041 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Cam1977 View Post
I'm really not liking this casting...are their other devices that can stream DV by any chance?
From what I can find, DV is still in the realm of casting, but there are a few new UHD Blu-ray players coming out that will also support DV. All of the existing external streamers and BR players are HDR-10 except for the Oppo ( with a FW update ). DV requires serious processing power on both ends of the feed. With casting, the source feed has DV processing and obviously the TV completes it on the backside.

DV also requires licensing fees, which is why HDR-10 is so popular because it's open source freeware. HDR-10 plus is next. It will be dynamic like DV. Don't know if special hardware will be needed. The format wars continue! Who will be the next Betamax?

With all that said, and as @wmarkw posted, the new interface from Vizio later this summer ( FW update ) will take the casting technology and put it back on the TV. It will make it look like you're not casting, but instead using a smart TV.

Very cool.

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post #8042 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 10:51 AM
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@sonoftumble @Cam1977 @rjhseven @wooz123 When I got my ROKU P+ back in November of last year I was told I had to toggle the Sub Sampling on (now called Full UHD Color or whatever) and that still is the case for me today. Last night I messed with the toggle while watching ROKU content and when I turned it off I got the No Signal screen on my Vizio. I let it sit for a couple of minutes just thinking it might need some time to grab a signal. Nope. When I toggled it back to ON I got a picture/signal right away. Running all the latest and greatest FW. Same thing with the XB1S. Running everything through a Denon X1200 and in to HDMI-1. When @danbfree was on here he broke this down really good a few months back. I do know that it was determined you could run an HDR capable device to HDMI 2-4 w/o the need of Sub Sampling as it would down convert everything to 24hz or something. Above my head. But I'm thinking it has to do with the ROKU & XB1S able to output 60hz?? So what gives??
Roku was setup as 60Hz AND HDR so when you toggled off subsampling on the display you disabled the capability to do both at once, it couldn't process that signal from the Roku... if you had then powered off Roku and back on, it would have connected at [email protected] but no HDR... So if you actually want to run content in it's 24Hz native AND HDR you are actually better off using ports 2-4 and re-running the display setup on Roku. For some reason Roku doesn't allow forcing refresh, even in any secret menus so if you use port 1, you don't get the option for 24Hz, just 60Hz period, including HDR if subsampling/deep color is enabled, and regular [email protected] no HDR if it's disabled.

So guys, long time no talk, I'm simply very happy with my display and how absolutely everything has been addressed through firmware updates. I'm even very happy with the calibration and just don't have the need to be on here much, I'm more on the forums for my car now instead.

If anyone wants any insight like this, feel free to give me a mention and I'll jump in and try to help.
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post #8043 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 11:49 AM
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So guys, long time no talk, I'm simply very happy with my display and how absolutely everything has been addressed through firmware updates. I'm even very happy with the calibration and just don't have the need to be on here much, I'm more on the forums for my car now instead.

If anyone wants any insight like this, feel free to give me a mention and I'll jump in and try to help.
Hey @danbfree ,

We've missed you around here. Thanks for the better Roku answers than I could ever dig up. Glad to hear that your rig is running well.

Stop by whenever you feel like it. I'll throw a shrimp on the barbee.
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post #8044 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 12:02 PM
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Hey @wooz123 ,

Here's the definitive word on setting up the Roku and available connection options . . .

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Roku was setup as 60Hz AND HDR so when you toggled off subsampling on the display you disabled the capability to do both at once, it couldn't process that signal from the Roku... if you had then powered off Roku and back on, it would have connected at [email protected] but no HDR... So if you actually want to run content in it's 24Hz native AND HDR you are actually better off using ports 2-4 and re-running the display setup on Roku. For some reason Roku doesn't allow forcing refresh, even in any secret menus so if you use port 1, you don't get the option for 24Hz, just 60Hz period, including HDR if subsampling/deep color is enabled, and regular [email protected] no HDR if it's disabled.
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post #8045 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 12:31 PM
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Hey @wooz123 ,

Here's the definitive word on setting up the Roku and available connection options . . .
Question about this. I remember reading earlier that while ports 2-4 accepted and were able to display an HDR signal, the resulting Picture Quality was inferior to HDR reproduced on port 1.

Can anyone deny or confirm whether this is still the case?

Also, can I pass 6-channel audio over ARC with the Roku connected to port 2?
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post #8046 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 12:39 PM
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Hey @wooz123 ,

Here's the definitive word on setting up the Roku and available connection options . . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoftumble View Post
Hey @danbfree ,

We've missed you around here. Thanks for the better Roku answers than I could ever dig up. Glad to hear that your rig is running well.

Stop by whenever you feel like it. I'll throw a shrimp on the barbee.
Happy to help any time guys, again, just mention or quote and I'll jumt right in... I'll be back around more when I'm looking to upgrade later or get too bored, lol.
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post #8047 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 12:40 PM
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@tocirahl

Negative. These ports are only lower bandwidth, not quality.
HDMI 2 - 4 can only accept 24Hz or 30Hz signal in HDR at 4K resolution.
It's limited to chroma 4:2:0, but so is the video material, so no loss there.
Not all source devices would work in this mode, though. Devices which are locked at 60Hz will not be able to pass HDR to these HDMI ports.

LG 65B7 | T95N with CoreELEC | Vizio SB3851-D0 | Calibration + Settings (TBD)
Vizio M60-D1 | T95M with LibreELEC | Calibration + Settings
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post #8048 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 12:54 PM
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Question about this. I remember reading earlier that while ports 2-4 accepted and were able to display an HDR signal, the resulting Picture Quality was inferior to HDR reproduced on port 1.

Can anyone deny or confirm whether this is still the case?

Also, can I pass 6-channel audio over ARC with the Roku connected to port 2?
I can't speak to your ARC question since I don't use it.

I just wanted to clarify that you are not depriving yourself of HDR movie watching picture quality bliss with HDMI ports 2-4. The general rule of thumb is that UHD HDR Blu-ray content outputs at 4K 4:2:0 @24. Ports 2-4 are perfect for that signal. Plugging a blu-ray player into HDMI 1 will not do anything to improve PQ and HDR data is the same in any port.
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post #8049 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 02:32 PM
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So the question is, save Roku for ports 2 thru 4. Nothing for Port 1 and 5?
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post #8050 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 05:57 PM
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So the question is, save Roku for ports 2 thru 4. Nothing for Port 1 and 5?
Put the DTV in port 1. It won't try to force HDR and 60Hz. Or the Blu-ray player. As long as the device can fully function with Full UHD Color turned OFF, you can use anything but the Roku.

This will also cure the input switching issue. I turned on Full UHD Color yesterday and had the same problem as you this a.m. until I remembered and turned it off.
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post #8051 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 07:22 PM
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The new UI to be released later this summer should help ease this issue.
I hope so because I spoke with vizio today and was told their is no update coming in regards to putting apps on the tv itself...of course the rep might not know what he is talking about.
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post #8052 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 07:51 PM
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My biggest issue so far with casting is lipsync issues and random audio dropouts with my receiver.
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post #8053 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 08:47 PM
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I hope so because I spoke with vizio today and was told their is no update coming in regards to putting apps on the tv itself...of course the rep might not know what he is talking about.
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My biggest issue so far with casting is lipsync issues and random audio dropouts with my receiver.
The first tier support personnel either don't know or aren't allowed to say.

Matt McRae, Vizio's CTO has already let the cat out of the bag. Starting with FW 3.2.8.3 & 3.2.13.3, Vizio re-introduced the on-screen menus. Next up, the casting input will display apps instead of a screen saver. We are fairly close to seeing this update.

To quote Vizio's 4/25/17 press release: "Available this summer as an over-the-air update to 2016 SmartCast Ultra HD displays and all 2017 SmartCast models, VIZIO is bringing the SmartCast mobile experience to the big screen by making apps accessible directly from the display.

https://www.vizio.com/news/cat/news/...m-performance/

Audio: I haven't had any audio sync issues when casting. I am using the TV's optical digital audio output ( TOSLink ) and running direct to my AVR.
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post #8054 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 08:58 PM
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The first tier support personnel either don't know or aren't allowed to say.

Matt McRae, Vizio's CTO has already let the cat out of the bag. Starting with FW 3.2.8.3 & 3.2.13.3, Vizio re-introduced the on-screen menus. Next up, the casting input will display apps instead of a screen saver. We are fairly close to seeing this update.

To quote Vizio's 4/25/17 press release: "Available this summer as an over-the-air update to 2016 SmartCast Ultra HD displays and all 2017 SmartCast models, VIZIO is bringing the SmartCast mobile experience to the big screen by making apps accessible directly from the display.

https://www.vizio.com/news/cat/news/...m-performance/

Audio: I haven't had any audio sync issues when casting. I am using the TV's optical digital audio output ( TOSLink ) and running direct to my AVR.
Yeah that's what I figured in regards to the update...As far as the audio issues I might just need to a newer cable as I think this cable is a little old, although I should have been more specific its with vudu that I'm having the most issues with. As far as HDR are you on calibrated or calibrated dark...what do you prefer?

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post #8055 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 09:57 PM
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Yeah that's what I figured in regards to the update...As far as the audio issues I might just need to a newer cable as I think this cable is a little old, although I should have been more specific its with vudu that I'm having the most issues with. As far as HDR are you on calibrated or calibrated dark...what do you prefer?
My calibration settings use the "Calibrated" picture mode. I don't change it with HDR content because both Dolby Vision and HDR-10 take over the TV's CMS ( color management system ). If you inputted my calibration settings for the color tuner and 11 point for SDR content, and then when you start playing either HDR format - and check the settings - you will notice that they are zeroed out. That's because each HDR format loads a separate CMS table. This allows a separate calibration for each format - which is a good thing.

Generally, I will change the backlight setting a little bit, usually around 50 for Dolby Vision - and you may notice that an HDR-10 signal bumps up the color setting to 58. I may lower that a bit. And that's about it.

Sometime soon, I will post meter based calibration settings specific to the M70-D3. I just need to find the time. At this point, I'm fairly pleased with the PQ of the HDR formats, so I haven't been in a big hurry.

Have you tried my calibration settings yet? I believe you also have an M70-D3?
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post #8056 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 10:09 PM
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Put the DTV in port 1. It won't try to force HDR and 60Hz. Or the Blu-ray player. As long as the device can fully function with Full UHD Color turned OFF, you can use anything but the Roku.

This will also cure the input switching issue. I turned on Full UHD Color yesterday and had the same problem as you this a.m. until I remembered and turned it off.
Doesn't DanBFree contradict you on using Roku in port 1?

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post #8057 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 10:21 PM
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My calibration settings use the "Calibrated" picture mode. I don't change it with HDR content because both Dolby Vision and HDR-10 take over the TV's CMS ( color management system ). If you inputted my calibration settings for the color tuner and 11 point for SDR content, and then when you start playing either HDR format - and check the settings - you will notice that they are zeroed out. That's because each HDR format loads a separate CMS table. This allows a separate calibration for each format - which is a good thing.

Generally, I will change the backlight setting a little bit, usually around 50 for Dolby Vision - and you may notice that an HDR-10 signal bumps up the color setting to 58. I may lower that a bit. And that's about it.

Sometime soon, I will post meter based calibration settings specific to the M70-D3. I just need to find the time. At this point, I'm fairly pleased with the PQ of the HDR formats, so I haven't been in a big hurry.

Have you tried my calibration settings yet? I believe you also have an M70-D3?
I haven't yet I wanted to break her in a little more...yeah I have the M70-D3. I kinda like calibrated dark for now...maybe ill plug in those settings tonight.
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post #8058 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 10:36 PM
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Doesn't DanBFree contradict you on using Roku in port 1?
No. The #1 complaint in the Roku thread is the fact that they can't watch 4K 4:2:0 @ 24 native content without the Roku bumping it up to 4:4:4 @ 60 when plugged into a port that supports that signal; i.e. HDMI 1. Almost all streaming/casting/blu-ray movies are originally 4K 4:2:0 @ 24. The Roku is artificially "enhancing" the signal to make it something it was never mastered to do - which introduces several issues including the dreaded soap opera effect. Streaming content is intentionally compressed to 4:2:0 so that it will look good within that limited bandwidth. The Roku's approach is kind of like putting a turbo charger on a lawn mower. Doesn't cut the grass any better.

Here's what he said: "So if you actually want to run content in it's 24Hz native AND HDR you are actually better off using ports 2-4 and re-running the display setup on Roku."
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post #8059 of 10266 Old 06-14-2017, 10:40 PM
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I haven't yet I wanted to break her in a little more...yeah I have the M70-D3. I kinda like calibrated dark for now...maybe ill plug in those settings tonight.
From everything I can tell, the only difference between "Calibrated" and "Calibrated Dark" is the backlight setting. As you will see in my settings, I have the backlight turned down to 40, so the "Calibrated" picture mode is no longer a "torch" mode.
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post #8060 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 06:14 AM
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From everything I can tell, the only difference between "Calibrated" and "Calibrated Dark" is the backlight setting. As you will see in my settings, I have the backlight turned down to 40, so the "Calibrated" picture mode is no longer a "torch" mode.
Been a while :-)

Rev4.5 settings are great. Are you using the settings on a separate custom mode for 4K/HDR, or are you just letting the display do its thing? I'm the latter.

Update on bright corners: I've supplied Vizio these pictures per their request. I've been having problems as the issue doesn't really translate well to photos, but holy hell is it noticeable sitting in front of it. This is the opening of the Lego Batman Movie. Funnily enough, first thing B-Man says is, "black".



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post #8061 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 06:41 AM
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Been a while :-)

Rev4.5 settings are great. Are you using the settings on a separate custom mode for 4K/HDR, or are you just letting the display do its thing? I'm the latter.

Update on bright corners: I've supplied Vizio these pictures per their request. I've been having problems as the issue doesn't really translate well to photos, but holy hell is it noticeable sitting in front of it. This is the opening of the Lego Batman Movie. Funnily enough, first thing B-Man says is, "black".



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Well, that didn't take long. Replied to Vizio less than an hour ago with those pictures - we've had a back and forth conversation since April 30th on this issue - and just got confirmation that they're replacing.

So, cheers to Vizio for making things right, but jeers for having to do this multiple times. This will technically be the fourth display (first replacement for panel failure was delivered damaged).

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post #8062 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 08:25 AM
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Been a while :-)

Rev4.5 settings are great. Are you using the settings on a separate custom mode for 4K/HDR, or are you just letting the display do its thing? I'm the latter.

Update on bright corners: I've supplied Vizio these pictures per their request. I've been having problems as the issue doesn't really translate well to photos, but holy hell is it noticeable sitting in front of it. This is the opening of the Lego Batman Movie. Funnily enough, first thing B-Man says is, "black".

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Well, that didn't take long. Replied to Vizio less than an hour ago with those pictures - we've had a back and forth conversation since April 30th on this issue - and just got confirmation that they're replacing. So, cheers to Vizio for making things right, but jeers for having to do this multiple times. This will technically be the fourth display (first replacement for panel failure was delivered damaged).

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Good to hear from you!

I could certainly see the corners in the first three pics. Were my eyes deceiving me - or is there a rectangular band of backlight bleed going down the middle of the display? Good news from Vizio, and I'll keep my fingers crossed on the next panel. I also have a tiny amount of bleed in my upper corners, but not enough to make me want to swap out what is otherwise a very clean panel - almost DSE free.

Still have the backlight always slightly on issue, which I don't notice unless I turn off an input source - which makes me suspect that the FALD algorithm changes behavior when it doesn't have any content to work with.

HDR: I just use my custom picture mode and let the TV do it's thing. Both DV and HDR-10 load their own CMS tables. What's cool about that is I don't need to change picture modes, only adjust the CMS when it loads the respective table. It will automatically load the appropriate table based on the signal ( HDR(s) or SDR ) without changing PM's.

I'm going to try and do HDR-10 soon. It gets trickier with DV because the pattern generator needs to send a DV signal to get the table to load. I think my generator can handle it, but I need to talk to the folks at Murideo to confirm.
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post #8063 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 10:34 AM
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Good to hear from you!

I could certainly see the corners in the first three pics. Were my eyes deceiving me - or is there a rectangular band of backlight bleed going down the middle of the display? Good news from Vizio, and I'll keep my fingers crossed on the next panel. I also have a tiny amount of bleed in my upper corners, but not enough to make me want to swap out what is otherwise a very clean panel - almost DSE free.

Still have the backlight always slightly on issue, which I don't notice unless I turn off an input source - which makes me suspect that the FALD algorithm changes behavior when it doesn't have any content to work with.

HDR: I just use my custom picture mode and let the TV do it's thing. Both DV and HDR-10 load their own CMS tables. What's cool about that is I don't need to change picture modes, only adjust the CMS when it loads the respective table. It will automatically load the appropriate table based on the signal ( HDR(s) or SDR ) without changing PM's.

I'm going to try and do HDR-10 soon. It gets trickier with DV because the pattern generator needs to send a DV signal to get the table to load. I think my generator can handle it, but I need to talk to the folks at Murideo to confirm.
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post #8064 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 12:59 PM
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The new UI to be released later this summer should help ease this issue.
Would it be only selected apps, or would we be able to add our own stuff as well (such as Put.io or Reuters)? I assume Netflix, HBO and Hulu are present, but what about Amazon Prime?

I do dislike Chromecast -- it's basically Airplay and OK in a pinch, but while I do have my phone or tablet next to me most of the time, I really don't like fumbling with it to pause or replay, or even to open an app. Vizio made a poor UI decision, which effectively requires a tablet/phone plus a remote to operate these TVs, which is too cumbersome for many users.

I just picked up the M70 D3 for my bedroom, looking forward to the apps UI coming out soon.

Does Vizio have a beta tester program?

Last edited by Ryan1; 06-15-2017 at 01:15 PM.
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post #8065 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Tocom1 View Post
Please any calibration for the m60 d1 on the latest firmware
I would like to know the same thing.
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post #8066 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 02:55 PM
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Hey everyone! Been awhile since I've been on here. But I am loping my M70. I'm wondering if someone can clarify a few things for me. I've searched for these answers on here and nothing has come up.

1. Can anyone give me an updated list of what each HDMI port will support? Do the all carry HDR support now?

2. I'm using a Denon receiver connected to the M70 via ARC. My other devices are a DirecTV DVR, Xbox One, and a Roku Premier Plus. What connection setup would you recommend?


This place is a wealth of knowledge. Any and all help is always appreciated.
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post #8067 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 04:39 PM
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No. The #1 complaint in the Roku thread is the fact that they can't watch 4K 4:2:0 @ 24 native content without the Roku bumping it up to 4:4:4 @ 60 when plugged into a port that supports that signal; i.e. HDMI 1. Almost all streaming/casting/blu-ray movies are originally 4K 4:2:0 @ 24. The Roku is artificially "enhancing" the signal to make it something it was never mastered to do - which introduces several issues including the dreaded soap opera effect. Streaming content is intentionally compressed to 4:2:0 so that it will look good within that limited bandwidth. The Roku's approach is kind of like putting a turbo charger on a lawn mower. Doesn't cut the grass any better.

Here's what he said: "So if you actually want to run content in it's 24Hz native AND HDR you are actually better off using ports 2-4 and re-running the display setup on Roku."
Netflix and Vudu actually stream 4k 4:2:2 @24.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #8068 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackoutUT View Post
Hey everyone! Been awhile since I've been on here. But I am loping my M70. I'm wondering if someone can clarify a few things for me. I've searched for these answers on here and nothing has come up.

1. Can anyone give me an updated list of what each HDMI port will support? Do the all carry HDR support now?

2. I'm using a Denon receiver connected to the M70 via ARC. My other devices are a DirecTV DVR, Xbox One, and a Roku Premier Plus. What connection setup would you recommend?


This place is a wealth of knowledge. Any and all help is always appreciated.
I have all my devices running IN to my Denon X1200 (Cabl/Sat, Media Player, Game, DVD/Bluray) and then OUT to HDMI 1 IN on the Vizio. Denon handles all the switching. I have a harmony remote handling all the action. Make sure you have all monoprice certified cables in every chain. my $.02
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post #8069 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackoutUT View Post
Hey everyone! Been awhile since I've been on here. But I am loping my M70. I'm wondering if someone can clarify a few things for me. I've searched for these answers on here and nothing has come up.

1. Can anyone give me an updated list of what each HDMI port will support? Do the all carry HDR support now?

2. I'm using a Denon receiver connected to the M70 via ARC. My other devices are a DirecTV DVR, Xbox One, and a Roku Premier Plus. What connection setup would you recommend?


This place is a wealth of knowledge. Any and all help is always appreciated.
1)
a) HDMI 1 is a full speed HDMI 2.0a port, meaning it can support up to [email protected] 4:4:4 (or RGB) signal.
b) HDMI 2 - 4 are uprated HDMI 1.4 spec in terms of bandwidth capability. You can achieve [email protected], and 4K HDR @ 24Hz.
c) HDMI 5 is still the same low input lag port meant for gaming, it doesn't support HDR.
d) Input lag on HDMI 1 - 4 is about 43-44ms in game mode. It's about 17ms for HDMI 5.

2) If your receiver supports 4K HDR, I'd just run everything through it.
If it doesn't, then you're in a bit of a problem, as HDMI 1 is the ARC port.
If you have the non-S Xbox One, then run it and the DVR box through the receiver, and connect your Roku to HDMI 2/3/4.

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post #8070 of 10266 Old 06-15-2017, 07:08 PM
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Question Just delivered M70-D3 refurb

Hi Guys,
I'm struggling with this new M70-D3 refurbished unit I picked up off of ebay the other day. I've literally torn apart my media room trying to get the TV to sync with my Roku and Xbox One s. Here is my setup:
M70-D3 HDMI port 1-> 3ft Monoprice high speed HDMI cable-> wall connector -> active 40ft HDMI high speed cable -> wall connector -> 3ft Monoprice High speed HDMI Cable -> Onkyo NR555 receiver with a roku running on input (stream box). The Roku has had the special toggle to take it to 4.2.0 luminance.

I can't get the signal to sync with the above setup. This is what else I've tried:

HDMI Port 1 (Color Subsampling is what allows the HDMI port to do 60 fps)
* 20ft active HDMI cable can do HDR direct connect to Roku 60 fps
* tv -> 20ft cable -> coupler -> 3ft cable -> Roku works 60fps

* tv-> 3ft cable->coupler -> 20ft cable -> Roku Black screen 60fps WTH it's the same connection!!!
* tv->3ft cable-> coupler->40ft cable -> Roku Black Screen 60 fps
* tv->6ft regular cable-> receiver -> roku Black screen 60 fps


HDMI Port 2
* tv -> 6 ft regular cable -> receiver -> roku HDR works 30 fps
*
HDMI Port 5 can not do HDR. - Verified with short cable and Roku @ 4.2.0


Does anyone else have the M series hooked up via along HDMI cable via an AV receiver doing 4k HDR ?

Follow up question. Why in the WORLD do TV manufactures put the ARC HDMI port on the same/ ONLY HDMI port that can do 4k HDR @60fps ?????

Thanks for any advice or guidance!
Matt
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