Sony Announces Z9D FALD-LCD UHDTVs - Page 33 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #961 of 1951 Old 08-07-2016, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by player002 View Post
For gamers with huds in game they will get burn in more likely than regular users. Watch CNN all day on an Oled and tell me it won't get burn in. Engineers all say that Oled has a much shorter lifespan than LCD. Point is Oled is not perfect they have made strides but still work needs to be done.. The fact that you can get burn in is not a solution but a bandaid as tech is more likely to do it. Plasma got much better but game for few day weeks on same game and you will get burn in.. Burn in should be last thing a user is concerned with. That said Oled does look amazing no doubting that.. This sony set I predict will give it a run for best looking set. This new tech in the Z9D is exciting and potentially game changing.
Dude why don't you go over to some of the OLED threads and talk to some of the owners, ask people how much they game and how long they have had HUDS displayed without a single instance of Burn in. These 2016 OLED's have been out for a few months now and a lot of people have had them in their homes and there has not been a report of this yet. It took quite a few years for Plasma to get that good and even some of the later ones were not as good. The reports are low enough (like I said none so far) that burn in is a non issue. And those "engineers" are probably talking about RGB OLED and not WOLED. LG said their tech will last 100,000 hours and there is no less of a reason to believe that than to believe any old LCD panel will actually last that long.
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post #962 of 1951 Old 08-07-2016, 09:40 PM
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I've been watching the Olympics games for hours since it started ,I let you guys know If the Olympic logo burn on my screen.

but so far I haven't seen any burn in.

I let you guys know when this one die do to HDR. I usually don't keep display longer than 5 years but will keep track with the next owner.
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post #963 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 04:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Vader1 View Post
There is like no burn in problem outside of (some) store demos. Not with WOLED anyway, it does seem to be more or a problem with RGB based OLED phones. Pay attention to the owners threads though, there has not been 1 single complaint about burn in with a single owner this generation. Even IR has barely been reported. Also LG's WOLED has a 100K hour lifespan now, same as they claim for LCD and Plasma. Some people still have their 2013 9800's and are happy with them. Improved motion you are right. Input lag is now like 30ms (or so) except for the B6 and that isn't a problem inherent to OLED.


Agreed - even the phosphorus LED could change over time resulting in more blue tint. 100k hours is great

But why is there reports of more lag? Is it a processing issue? I thought the actual pixel response time was fantastic?


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post #964 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
Thanks! Well, I think that's a big deal (the two pics of the blooming on the upper right hand corner) and other than tjcinnamon it hasn't phased anyone. If that shows up on production models that's a no ifs and buts deal killer. And please, even at that angle in a room with that amount of light that is a serious problem.
They probably paused the video and took a photo..
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post #965 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 05:23 AM
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When I look at those photos I just thought that was a reflection - no way that would be acceptable and not an issue. To me its a reflection of those lights you can clearly see.

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post #966 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Vader1 View Post
Dude why don't you go over to some of the OLED threads and talk to some of the owners, ask people how much they game and how long they have had HUDS displayed without a single instance of Burn in. These 2016 OLED's have been out for a few months now and a lot of people have had them in their homes and there has not been a report of this yet. It took quite a few years for Plasma to get that good and even some of the later ones were not as good. The reports are low enough (like I said none so far) that burn in is a non issue. And those "engineers" are probably talking about RGB OLED and not WOLED. LG said their tech will last 100,000 hours and there is no less of a reason to believe that than to believe any old LCD panel will actually last that long.
Wow yes I am sure they improved it but Oled just like Plasma is susceptible to burn in . The very nature of Oled makes it lose brightness over time. Oled even if improved has a lower life span than LCD. Point is no perfect tv all have caveats . 30 ms lag on oled 20 and below on Samsung and other brands . Oled has great contrast but Quantum dots spanks it for colour. Oled does not get nearly as bright as LCD and in recent shootout LCD won for HDR over Oled... Yes Oled looks fantastic but not the king yet is my point.. You think otherwise and that is fine but now you should just take that to Oled forums.
Here is a german review look at the image ya Oled is not blowing LCD out of the water on this comparison .

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post #967 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:03 AM
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came to see if there's any real world users of this tv yet. nope, i see we're still debating oled vs. lcd and bullets that have be discussed countless times over and over.

...going back to my e6 oled thread

seriously, competition is a good thing, but to each his own. i honestly went with oled due to extremely wide viewing angles and haven't been disappointed.

carry on...
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post #968 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by guitarguy316 View Post
came to see if there's any real world users of this tv yet. nope, i see we're still debating oled vs. lcd and bullets that have be discussed countless times over and over.

...going back to my e6 oled thread

seriously, competition is a good thing, but to each his own. i honestly went with oled due to extremely wide viewing angles and haven't been disappointed.

carry on...
I love you man! Kumbaya, peace to all in the world of OLED. Regards. Ned.
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post #969 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:23 AM
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Why don't you take your own advice instead of proselytizing over here?
Oh please... I'll do that when some of the LCD people are over in the OLED threads stop spewing way worse crap than I am here. I haven't attacked this TV, Sony, or anybody here or tried to convince anybody not to buy Sony LCD. In fact I've even said myself Sony is the only one keeping LCD interesting. I'm not the only one who brings up OLED so don't tell me to get out of here. It's misinformation to claim LG's WOLED tv's have had a widespread problem with Burn in or that it's something that's been effecting many people when it obviously hasn't and you don't need a complex study to show it hasn't been there are enough reports and owners around here and elsewhere on the internet.

The whole thing with Burn In is obviously it's not impossible to get with OLED like it may be with LCD, but it wasn't impossible with CRT either and hardly anybody ever worried about it because it was rare. Early Plasma is primarily what made it such a big concern and fear in everyone's mind and the fear has lingered ever since, and any display now that has even a 1% (not saying OLED is even that low just an example) chance of burn in somebody somewhere blows it out of proportion and that scares away people from looking into it when it shouldn't. Early Plasma had a real serious issue with BI/ IR, obviously, and even in the end when it became harder to get burn in Image Retention was fairly frequent with just about every Plasma except the Kuro's. OLED hasn't really been like that, and if it wasn't for early Plasma and the fear of BI they created that lingers to this day people probably wouldn't think much about it with OLED just how they didn't with CRT.

I guess this brings up a question to ask... at what point is "chance of Burn in" so small that it really isn't worth worry about or using as a negative bulletin point for a display? IMO When a whole line of OLED's has been out for a whole summer and there isn't one known report of burn in from any user on AVS it starts to get hard to use it as an argument against the technology. The people in the OLED section have hardly complained of even IR. I don't know if any Plasma TV's outside of the Kuro that could claim the same several months after release.
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post #970 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:31 AM
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I love you man! Kumbaya, peace to all in the world of OLED. Regards. Ned.
Lol, reminds me of some old coca cola ads. Resistance is futile! To go beyond this you must attain the 4th level of Enlightenment! And may the Spirit always remain within you.

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post #971 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:36 AM
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I followed the "Sony Rumor" thread all the way during it's lifespan and then jumped to this thread to follow as well. Simply put I had an LG EC9300 for a year and then an EF9500 for two months (had to sell to recoup money for a sudden move). Right now I am rocking a Panny VT60 and could not be any happier since I have no desire or need for 4k/HDR (want to watch it mature a little more). I will say that the LG OLED's are VERY VERY capable TV's. People want to stomp on LG for being an inferior manufacturer, almost implying they are a kid who was given the rights to a game changing tech and have no idea how to use it. Which is false. OLED has flaws. LCD has flaws. This Z9D TV WILL have flaws. Every TV has flaws. Not sure why people are getting so emotional over that certain fact.

That being said, I am following this TV/thread:
A ) Because I love watching all audio and video technology progress WITHOUT bias or fanboyism
B ) I may be getting a year end bonus and could very well step into this technology as it seems to be the pinnacle of LED/LCD at the moment if it meets my criteria vs. OLED's strengths/weakness'
C ) Stressing point A again, I am here to learn and keep an eye on all evolving tech

Getting that out of the way...it's astonishing to see such bitterness among certain users in this thread. You have certain people who keep throwing the words "OLED Killer" out there with the tone of a child taunting on the playground. And others policing what's allowed to be discussed by telling people to take their opinions to other threads. How many "xxx Killer" threads or posts have we seen over the years on here? Kuro, Panny, blah blah blah. Seriously.

Anyways, I am sure someone will either tell me I am being biased (not sure how as I'm rocking a TV that isn't even included in this *fight*) or someone else will tell me to take my post to another thread. I'm just asking we, idk, maybe stick to the Science part of AVS and stop with the fanboyish comments from either side or childish blanket statements like "xxx Killer". The TV isn't even out for us, the end users, to see or evaluate and people are seriously so insecure they are deeming it a killer or this or that based on other peoples limited and controlled viewing? As if the TV they are comparing this Sony to killed their entire family and they are on a vendetta for revenge via an unrelenting smear campaign.

*sigh*

On topic, what is the consensus for a concrete release date for general Best Buy stores (i.e. not high target areas like metropolis cities but more general areas/cities)? Curious to go see this in person.
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post #972 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:39 AM
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Going forward, please limit posts to technical issues

Thanks
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post #973 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:41 AM
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Did the OLED replace the beloved Pioneer 150? Did you actually do any a/b comparisons? I'm considering replacing it as well but don't see the point unless I go up to 75 inch. And that's cost prohibitive in the OLED but should soon be reasonable in a top led like the admittedly expensive new Sony if it's as good as the nits on this thread seem to expect. How would you compare your Sony 940 to the Pioneer other than being much bigger? I'm assuming that you spend a lot of time on the OLED threads at this point. Are a majority thrilled with the panels or are there a fair share who find the faults being expressed by the nits here? Regards. Ned.
Actually I had a Samsung F8500 that replaced my Pro 150. It was much brighter, although black levels were just a smidge worse than the Pro 150...still very very close. All in all I preferred the picture on the F8500.

Later I replaced the F8500 with the Sony 940c and that presented better PQ than either prior display. Blacks were now as good as I had with the Pioneer, brightness better than either and, of course, 4K & HDR.

In the bedroom, my Sharp Elite LCD bit the dust and it was replaced by the B6 OLED. IMO, this display clearly trumps them all. Superb contrast, detail, color, all without a sacrifice in viewing angles or artifacts such as blooming. The overwhelming majority of OLED owners both here & on AV Forums in the UK, seem to be thrilled by the display. Yes, you'll see people complaining about uniformity issues (justifiably), but even so, a diminishingly small number of those would ever go back to LCD.

The bottom line is that no display is perfect, but the OLEDs, IMO, are the most perfect of all the imperfect displays I've ever owned.
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post #974 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
When I say hype, that. Is a result of a couple things.

1. LG advertising perfect blacks. Everyone wants to see perfection right? I think a lot of people hear this term, and it raises expectations for other areas to be perfect, which unfortunately are not. I do find it interesting though, that sony doesn't advertise perfect blacks with the Z9D, they say "near perfect blacks" on their website. Given the issue of lower source issues on oled, maybe they should advertise similar?
I see nothing wrong with advertising 'perfect blacks' for OLED. With an input of '0' luminance, you'll get a totally black screen, perfect blacks. Now you'd have a point if you wanted to contest 'perfect near black performance'. There, often because of poorly mastered content not intended for displays that can go as 'low' as OLED, you can, at times, see 'garbage' in a near black signal. Is that a fault of the display? For the most part I'd say no.
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2. Word of mouth. The hype around the oleds is real to an extent, but there are many asterisks that need to be attached. As with most tvs, its source dependent. People "hear", the oled hype, and go into best buy to see these new oleds, and they look fantastic.. but of the persons sole purpose is to watch cable, their gonna be disappointed. Garbage in = garbage out. You've got blocky and noisey blacks with oleds on lower sources (see this complaint often). I hope LG takes a big step up next year in its processing of lower sources.
Well, there's not a whole lot you can do about those that choose not to educate themselves or use common sense. If people expect pristine results from crappy signals, what's a manufacturer to do? Should they have a caveat in their advertising "Caution: Our displays look superb with great signals but crappy with lousy signals"? I can tell you that both 720p & 1080i signals from Directv (an often compressed source), look great on my OLED, they really do. I don't watch 480 content and would never choose a display based on how well it upscales a low resolution source like that. YMMV.
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Stronger and more intelligent processing is needed overall throughout the industry, and my biggest interest with the Z9D is how the new X1 extreme will work with lower and mid range sources.

I'll give credit where credit is due and LG has done good work with oleds. As a matter of fact, we should all thank LG for developing oled which seems to be pushing other manufacturers to raise their game. Does sony create the Z9D series if oled didn't currently exist?
I'd largely agree with the last part of this. Without OLED I don't believe there's much of an impetus to advance LCD technology. However I think the LG processing, as it exists in the 2016 OLEDs, is grossly underestimated. I've repeatedly said it compares very favorably to the highly esteemed processing of my Sony 940c. I truly think that old biases die hard. I never owned an LG in the past, and I'm assuming their processing in their older displays was not great. I don't see that in the 2016 OLEDs.
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post #975 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 08:58 AM
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This is just a thought, but had anyone considered the possibility that LG has purposely imposed an inferior hdr10 processing system so that Dolby Vision will undoubtedly look better? That maybe LG has no intentions of fixing the hdr10 issues because they don't want it to match dolby vision?
Wow, talk about conspiracy theories.

No, I don't think that's a logical explanation. DV, at least on paper (I still haven't seen any real A/Bs) is the superior format. Dynamically changing the contrast, on a scene by scene basis, is certainly better, logically, than one set of instructions that applies to all scenes. Now that may well change whenever the dynamic version of HDR10 is released. Will it work with any of the current HDR10 capable displays? Who knows, but it seems as if it won't.
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post #976 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 09:06 AM
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^^^^^^^
I agree with you Ken, that I also prefer OLED. My problem is that I want something much larger, at least 75", and until prices come WAY DOWN I am forced to look at lcd.

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post #977 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 09:08 AM
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LA Times ad announces Z9 first public viewing at video store in Woodland Hills on 8/11. Ad also claims 65" in stock, "coming soon 75" and 105". Also ad shows $500 price reduction on 75" 940D....same as new Amazon price. Hope user feedback and initial evaluation to follow shortly on this blog so that I can make a choice. I am leaning towards the 940D because you get 75" for about the same price as the 65" Z9.
The real test would be to have the Z9 up against the 940d, both properly calibrated, both displaying the same content. Seeing a demo like this at Sony would be of little value as most manufacturer demos are, to be generous 'less than perfect'.

I've yet to see any significant difference between the 940c and 940d, but I haven't seen them in a perfect A/B as described above.

@mmc - I hear ya. I would have loved to have the 77" OLED, but the price was insane. So here I sit with my 75" 940c and am very very happy with it. Yes, the OLED looks better, but when I'm watching the 940c, I can't say I have any regrets. It's a wonderful picture and I'm sure the same will be true of the Z.
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post #978 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 09:16 AM
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Have you A/B'd posterization content Ken? I can't remember. I see that mostly during gaming cut scenes. What is the cause of that?
Hell yeah!! Don't you remember the guy who posted his concern about posterization and gave several examples, giving time stamps on movies & Netflix where he saw it? I looked at all of them on both the 940c and the OLED. They were precisely the same, and I do mean 'precisely'. They both had the same degree of posterization and in the very same areas within the frame. Zero difference.

So this was truly source-related and not display-related.
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post #979 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 09:31 AM
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IMO Oled is future king but not yet... They need to eliminate burn in, Motion issues, input lag(gamers) and have higher nits. The tech will not overcome burn in and the lifespan of oled is very low. Oled losses brightness over time . This Sony should be superb and individually controlled led's should give it oled/Plasma appearance. The high nits and Hdr will give it a better Overall Image to Oled IMO. The fact that each led can be turned off should give it excellent oled like blk levels imo.

Qled should erase the issues of Oled and could become the new standard 2- 3 years from now... Honestly both the Oled and Sony will be good depends on what you need it for and how much price is issue... I can't wait to see this set TBH..
This is 2016 and there is no burn-in on OLED. There is not a single reported case of burn-in from any owner, G, E, C or B. So let's separate fact from fiction.

As for OLED losing brightness over time, all emissive displays do...and so do LCDs...oops. Backlights dim too. You'll be wanting a new display long before there's any noticeable dimming on any of these.

Individual LED control? Hmm. How many zones does the Z have? Until it has as many zones as it does pixels, it won't truly be individually controlled like OLED and emissive displays in general.

The rest is all subjective.
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post #980 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 09:35 AM
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For gamers with huds in game they will get burn in more likely than regular users. Watch CNN all day on an Oled and tell me it won't get burn in. Engineers all say that Oled has a much shorter lifespan than LCD. Point is Oled is not perfect they have made strides but still work needs to be done.. The fact that you can get burn in is not a solution but a bandaid as tech is more likely to do it. Plasma got much better but game for few day weeks on same game and you will get burn in.. Burn in should be last thing a user is concerned with. That said Oled does look amazing no doubting that.. This sony set I predict will give it a run for best looking set. This new tech in the Z9D is exciting and potentially game changing.
You won't get burn-in. There, I told you.

Are you aware of the compensation cycles the new OLEDs go through every 4 hours of viewing? Apparently not. You really need to cut back on some of this misinformation. You are really living in the past.
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post #981 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 10:09 AM
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Actually I had a Samsung F8500 that replaced my Pro 150. It was much brighter, although black levels were just a smidge worse than the Pro 150...still very very close. All in all I preferred the picture on the F8500.

Later I replaced the F8500 with the Sony 940c and that presented better PQ than either prior display. Blacks were now as good as I had with the Pioneer, brightness better than either and, of course, 4K & HDR.

In the bedroom, my Sharp Elite LCD bit the dust and it was replaced by the B6 OLED. IMO, this display clearly trumps them all. Superb contrast, detail, color, all without a sacrifice in viewing angles or artifacts such as blooming. The overwhelming majority of OLED owners both here & on AV Forums in the UK, seem to be thrilled by the display. Yes, you'll see people complaining about uniformity issues (justifiably), but even so, a diminishingly small number of those would ever go back to LCD.

The bottom line is that no display is perfect, but the OLEDs, IMO, are the most perfect of all the imperfect displays I've ever owned.
Thank you for the reasonable, rational response. I'll ask you a judgement question that I know you really can't answer for me, but I'll ask anyway, as you are one of the true students of this stuff on the site. I sit about 13 feet from my 60 inch Pioneer. In my situation, would you buy the 65 inch OLED or the 75 inch Sony 940 or even the expected new panel of the much discussion on this thread? Regards. Ned.
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post #982 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by midknight4 View Post
When I look at those photos I just thought that was a reflection - no way that would be acceptable and not an issue. To me its a reflection of those lights you can clearly see.
It looks like with the photo in the field the lights were off.
Here is a sony TV with lots of reflections, looks similar but not quite the same. You might be right though..
https://video.search.yahoo.com/searc...2&action=click
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post #983 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 11:51 AM
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OLEDs can display perfect black, but they can't display just above perfect black. If you look carefully at times, LCDs will show shadow detail that OLEDs don't. OLEDs crush everything to perfect black below a certain voltage.

It's not a big deal since you would never know unless you a had a LCD side by side paused at the same content and looked closely. And the picture still looks great, even with the crushed blacks. Plus the LCD will show more detail, but it might be brighter than it's supposed to be.
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post #984 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 11:54 AM
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Can you post an independently controlled study that shows the long term effects of HDR watching on an oled panel? Thanks in advance.

Also, can you tell me exactly what type of content needs to be watched and with what settings in order to hit 100,000 hour mark that LG claims? For example, Is this with zero hdr and backlight at 25%? Thanks in advance.
@ray0414 , of these questions you're asking, can you do the same for your LCD? I don't believe HDR has been long term tested on any consumer technology. Plus it's not like LCDs are absolutely prone to burn-in either. There are have been reports. Not a lot, but there has been cases.
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post #985 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:01 PM
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@ray0414 , of these questions you're asking, can you do the same for your LCD? I don't believe HDR has been long term tested on any consumer technology. Plus it's not like LCDs are absolutely prone to burn-in either. There are have been reports. Not a lot, but there has been cases.

I cannot offer those specifics, because samsung has made no number on life expectancy, but if they did, i would certainly question the details of what/how they came to those numbers

HOWEVER,

what I can offer you, is something that samsung HAS said recently.

Samsung offers 10 year warranty on its 2016 SUHD Quantum Dot Tvs for screen burn in


"Screen burn is much less of an issue in modern TVs, but it's still nice to have to have an official safety net in place. 'Quantum dot' will be a new phrase to a lot of people, and for that technology to grow in popularity, Samsung needs to inspire trust. The best shops offer at least five years' warranty on TVs. For Samsung to offer a 10-year warranty is not only a great gesture – it speaks volumes about its confidence in its products. This is a very wise move."


http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/s...screen-burn-in




Now for some reason, the article states that it applies to tvs purchased starting August 1st, not sure why it doesnt include tvs purchased before August 1st.

Say what you want about samsung/LCD, but the 10 year promise is a pretty confident and BOLD move. I would be flabergasted if LG offered anything remotely similar on the OLED tvs. Most people will upgrade within 5 years though anyways I bet.

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post #986 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:20 PM
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Now the topic is Oled burn in ? HDR please burn my screen so I can buy another one.
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post #987 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post
OLEDs can display perfect black, but they can't display just above perfect black. If you look carefully at times, LCDs will show shadow detail that OLEDs don't. OLEDs crush everything to perfect black below a certain voltage.

It's not a big deal since you would never know unless you a had a LCD side by side paused at the same content and looked closely. And the picture still looks great, even with the crushed blacks. Plus the LCD will show more detail, but it might be brighter than it's supposed to be.
but you should know, that oled gets a free pass with shadow detail. duh


heres a quote by a best buy employee that has been examining the tvs in his showroom trying to decide which tv to get, he hooks both tvs up to UHD players and compares HDR performance and plays with settings on the tvs:

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Yes I have, we have a 65 KS9800 and OLED65E6P side by side in our magnolia department. Not in the magnolia studios. So it's pretty much on open floor with natural sunlight through the roof and a few lights. The KS9800 blew it away in those lighting conditions. The OLED even on HDR Bright mode and OLED Lighting to max, the film looked very dark on it and in my opinion there wasn't very much details in the blacks even though they were of course blacker than the KS. However I want to test them both out in a darker room. We're getting a OLEDG6 put up soon. So I've yet to see if that panel with its processors make a difference but I highly prefer the KS9800 as of right now, it showed more detail in darker scenes.
so again, its a pick your poison type detail, but anybody critical of details on either tv shouldnt be scrutinized themselves. if OLED people are allowed to complain about black levels of LCDs, then LCD people can complain about shadow detail/black crush on OLEDS.

It is my opinion, that the sony Z9D will give you the best of both worlds with dark blacks and incredible shadow detail.

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post #988 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:29 PM
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Now the topic is Oled burn in ? HDR please burn my screen so I can buy another one.

Well, yes. I think its a relevant topic because there may be some potential buys concerned with long term HDR viewing on a tv set. if the Z9D offers similar black level performance, but sony does what samsung does and offers a long term promise about burn in, wouldnt that sway some buyers who are considering a Z9D and an OLED? it could very well be a deciding factor for someone, so it cant be dismissed. (not just burn in, but panel life). ALL factors need to be considered when spending this kind of money on tvs.

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post #989 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:34 PM
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Well I have the E6 and I gotta tell ya if the Z9 is "close enough" to the E6 in black level and has no blooming Im buying it!!!
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post #990 of 1951 Old 08-08-2016, 12:37 PM
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Well, yes. I think its a relevant topic because there may be some potential buys concerned with long term HDR viewing on a tv set. if the Z9D offers similar black level performance, but sony does what samsung does and offers a long term promise about burn in, wouldnt that sway some buyers who are considering a Z9D and an OLED? it could very well be a deciding factor for someone, so it cant be dismissed. (not just burn in, but panel life). ALL factors need to be considered when spending this kind of money on tvs.

I have had plasma since 2007 and now this Oled ,still waiting since 2007 for one to burn and die quick.
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