Samsung QLED TVs at CES 2018 - Page 5 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #121 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Latinoheat View Post
Blown away? Why?, all manufacturers always show prototypes at CES and never make it in production. Excited? Yes but I wouldn't get too excited until they actually hit the Audio/Video stores and see how they actually perform against the big dogs.
This is the debut of a new self-emissive display technology and Samsung has said that "The Wall" will be on sale later this year so I'm personally blown away. I agree that bendable, transparent, and otherwise gimmick prototypes that will never make it to production that are usually on show at CES are forgettable and pointless, "The Wall" on the other hand isn't one of those.
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post #122 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

This is the debut of a new self-emissive display technology and Samsung has said that "The Wall" will be on sale later this year so I'm personally blown away. I agree that bendable, transparent, and otherwise gimmick prototypes that will never make it to production that are usually on show at CES are forgettable and pointless, "The Wall" on the other hand isn't one of those.
Cled, micro led , crystal led , 8k have all been displayed at CES in the past. I'm all thumbs up for new tech also and the Samsung wall, looks impressive but let's get real, who on earth will spend close to a $100k on a panel.
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post #123 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Latinoheat View Post
Cled, micro led , crystal led , 8k have all been displayed at CES in the past. I'm all thumbs up for new tech also and the Samsung wall, looks impressive but let's get real, who on earth will spend close to a $100k on a panel.
I won't but still personally thoroughly impressed. Hopefully reviewers will actually get picture quality measurements on it, usually the 100"+ screens never get reviewed or even looked at by the critics. Since it's the debut of self-emissive MicroLED displays in a consumer model I hope there will be an exception but we'll have to see.
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post #124 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 08:23 PM
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Lesson learned ,edge lit backlight was a huge mistake.
Samsung was so stubborn with their edge-lite backlight. We're gonna take your money and do FALD when we want!!!Screw the consumer!!
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post #125 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 08:48 PM
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Samsung was so stubborn with their edge-lite backlight. We're gonna take your money and do FALD when we want!!!Screw the consumer!!
both sets were prolly designed the same year. they just released 1 at a time soo the can pay less into R and D. why bring them both out when 90% of the general public willl never be able to tell the difference. now they just amde 2 years of tvs. thats my guess anyway
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post #126 of 388 Old 01-09-2018, 11:26 PM
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I was disappointed to see all Samsung's new TVs were behind closed doors. Probably to avoid a repeat of last year where they were criticized for failing to deliver on what they promised at CES. Now, no one can see it or take pictures of it.

The 8K AI upsampling demo seems impressive, but it's like a 60 second canned video with some split screen footage segments and I suspect the images are simulated. Otherwise, if the split screen footage is real the thing is straight up magic turning noisy SD into flawless looking UHD+. I use madVR so I know what really good scaling looks like but their split screen footage looks like they took 8k footage and made a low quality SD version of it and used the real 8k footage + the SD version for the side by side. At one point they take a pixelated SD weather screen (all computer generated graphics) and the after looks like a native resolution rendering of vector graphics.
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post #127 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 12:21 AM
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I was disappointed to see all Samsung's new TVs were behind closed doors. Probably to avoid a repeat of last year where they were criticized for failing to deliver on what they promised at CES. Now, no one can see it or take pictures of it.

The 8K AI upsampling demo seems impressive, but it's like a 60 second canned video with some split screen footage segments and I suspect the images are simulated. Otherwise, if the split screen footage is real the thing is straight up magic turning noisy SD into flawless looking UHD+. I use madVR so I know what really good scaling looks like but their split screen footage looks like they took 8k footage and made a low quality SD version of it and used the real 8k footage + the SD version for the side by side. At one point they take a pixelated SD weather screen (all computer generated graphics) and the after looks like a native resolution rendering of vector graphics.
id like to hook a sd cable box up to it and see if its really that impressive or was a special made demo for the event and upscaling looks nothing like it.. Kinda like when you go to a bestbuy and visit the samsung store. they have there own Special made demos for the tvs.. they use to have direct tv hooked up on them.. then the figured out people saw it and it looked terrible. and had it removed
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post #128 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 01:51 AM
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2018 tvs with FALD and a new Q engine but I can't find one video on them from CES. Lack of info is frustrating. After last year I not taking there word on anything.
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post #129 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 02:46 AM
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2018 tvs with FALD and a new Q engine but I can't find one video on them from CES. Lack of info is frustrating. After last year I not taking there word on anything.
Haha, so true. I have been looking for days to get some info in regard of the 2018 lineup. All i got, nothing
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post #130 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 04:35 AM
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So, i just saw the samsung interview with digital trends.

Key notes:

1. The wall is 4k, and will be shipped to consumers later this year.

2. 2018 Qleds are in hiding, exclusive press are shown the new modles

3. Samsung said we will hear more in spring?

I really do not understand their strategy with this.
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post #131 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 04:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Daniel Eilertsen View Post
So, i just saw the samsung interview with digital trends.

Key notes:

1. The wall is 4k, and will be shipped to consumers later this year.

2. 2018 Qleds are in hiding, exclusive press are shown the new modles

3. Samsung said we will hear more in spring?

I really do not understand their strategy with this.
same reason sony didnt show anything big and says nothing news coming. they didnt want the competition getting a view on what they have in store.
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post #132 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 04:49 AM
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same reason sony didnt show anything big and says nothing news coming. they didnt want the competition getting a view on what they have in store.
True. But still, samsung Qleds can only be not a so good tv off their flagship q9s? I recon sony understand samsung will release qleds with improved FALD as their main sellingpoint. Is there anything else?

What i find fasinating thou is the Q9S fald, and how thin it was. I have an KS9505 78 inch FALD. Its kinda thick and extremly heavy. Maybe they found a way to make it thinner?
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post #133 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 07:43 AM
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id like to hook a sd cable box up to it and see if its really that impressive or was a special made demo for the event and upscaling looks nothing like it.. Kinda like when you go to a bestbuy and visit the samsung store. they have there own Special made demos for the tvs.. they use to have direct tv hooked up on them.. then the figured out people saw it and it looked terrible. and had it removed
That's what I'm getting at... I don't think the "after" footage in the 60 second demo loop is actually the real output of the processor, more of a high level here's kind of how it works (with simulated footage).
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post #134 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 07:45 AM
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I fully agree. Surprisingly most people in the Q9/8 owners thread are quite happy with their sets.
It's called justifying one's (overpriced) purchase
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post #135 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 08:16 AM
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This is not microLED! It´s fine-pitch miniLED. Real microLED is only nanometer in sizes, thin like a hair. This is not. You clearly overhyped this Samsung tech. Sony and LG has similiar fine-pitch miniLED tech for signage und business applications. This here is a $100.000 to 200.000 screen.
Samsung failed with QLED marketing against OLED sales and QDCF is still one to two years away, real emissive QLED years away and now they try it with miniLED falsely called microLED.
Samsung, king of mis-marketing and confusing consumers with misdirection. I wish a US federal agency would step in and stop them from making everything confusing for consumers as other countries have done.

QLED
LED
MicroLed
...

However they do make solid products occasionally. Unless they can get this new FALD to near $2500 I don't see it selling too well. It's going to have to be substantially better than the 65" TCL (P series replacement) coming out in 2018; which is only rumored to be $1k ish. As well better than the 65" OLED(s) which will be $2500 or less.

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post #136 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 08:28 AM
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It's called justifying one's (overpriced) purchase
Perhaps this is the case.

Perhaps it's also the case that owners are actually satisfied with their display's performance. Weird.
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post #137 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 08:46 AM
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John Archers article on the 2018 Qled demo against 2017 oled, Sony Z9D, and 2017 Q9.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#3e7b23547087
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post #138 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 08:55 AM
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same reason sony didnt show anything big and says nothing news coming. they didnt want the competition getting a view on what they have in store.
That's not true. They showed the X1 Ultimate which will obviously be in the x930/40F and Z9F once it's finalized.

They also showed their 8K 10,000 NITs prototype.
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post #139 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
John Archers article on the 2018 Qled demo against 2017 oled, Sony Z9D, and 2017 Q9.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#3e7b23547087
Good article. Sure seems strange that they aren't going to even release specs/info until late March. Who knows when they will actually show up in stores.

I have always been very suspicious of these head-to-head comparisons though, when done by a manufacturer and, behind closed doors. Some of the differences are SO large that it makes you wonder if the settings on the competing displays were adjusted to less-than-optimal. Samsung would never do something like that would they?
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Blown away? Why?, all manufacturers always show prototypes at CES and never make it in production. Excited? Yes but I wouldn't get too excited until they actually hit the Audio/Video stores and see how they actually perform against the big dogs.
This is the debut of a new self-emissive display technology and Samsung has said that "The Wall" will be on sale later this year so I'm personally blown away. I agree that bendable, transparent, and otherwise gimmick prototypes that will never make it to production that are usually on show at CES are forgettable and pointless, "The Wall" on the other hand isn't one of those.
Bendable/rollable definitely is not a gimmick.

That's the future of tv, especially for large screen sizes. I don't even need to list the reasons why.
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post #141 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:32 AM
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The color reproduction on Samsung's QLEDs is beautiful. However, as much as I want to wait for an FALD Q9 that supposedly will beat my B7 and Z9D in overall picture quality I just don't trust the brand that much any longer. Even when they release a truly good product, the cost is astronomical compared to competing brands and tech. I've been waiting to grab a 75" screen for a media room. I think I'm just punting on the Q9S at this point. A 75" Z looks better every day.
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post #142 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:32 AM
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Bendable/rollable definitely is not a gimmick.

That's the future of tv, especially for large screen sizes. I don't even need to list the reasons why.
We've never seen them in a marketable form factor until this year with LG's rollable display. Vincent from HDTVTest thinks they could rival or even replace projector screens. This is a far cry from the rollable screens we've seen in the past. The realization of the idea is the future, not the initial conceiving of an idea is the point Heat and I are making here.
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post #143 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:40 AM
 
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Bendable/rollable definitely is not a gimmick.

That's the future of tv, especially for large screen sizes. I don't even need to list the reasons why.
We've never seen them in a marketable form factor until this year with LG's rollable display. Vincent from HDTVTest thinks they could rival or even replace projector screens. This is a far cry from the rollable screens we've seen in the past. The realization of the idea is the future, not the initial conceiving of an idea is the point Heat and I are making here.
Rollable displays are the greatest evolution of tv since the flat panel some ~20 years ago, perhaps more so. To put it in the same category as a gimmick even at the initial stages is just ridiculous.

Like I said, I don't even have to go into the reasons why it's so significant, but it's easy to imagine how televisions coming in boxes similar to window blinds or curtain rods would be an unbelievable revolution in the industry - way WAY more so than 4k, 8k, or hdr.
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post #144 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:40 AM
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The color reproduction on Samsung's QLEDs is beautiful. However, as much as I want to wait for an FALD Q9 that supposedly will beat my B7 and Z9D in overall picture quality I just don't trust the brand that much any longer. Even when they release a truly good product, the cost is astronomical compared to competing brands and tech. I've been waiting to grab a 75" screen for a media room. I think I'm just punting on the Q9S at this point. A 75" Z looks better every day.
Samsung hasn't talked prices yet. If they are smart and want to salvage the damage they did to their market share and brand recognition last year they'd be wise to drop the prices for 2018. We'll also have to wait for the reviews to see how the picture performance has actually improved verses what Samsung is claiming. In general though, QLED has the best colors on the market despite also having the pitfalls of LCD tech, ideally they're aiming to minimize those pitfalls for 2018 with new full array microLED local dimming that should offer the most precise backlighting control we've seen yet on LED LCDs.

That being said if you're in the market and have a great price for a Z9D then I doubt you'll be disappointed. It may be worth waiting a couple more months though for more official details on the 2018 FALD flagships from Samsung. Up to you.
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post #145 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:48 AM
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Rollable displays are the greatest evolution of tv since the flat panel some ~20 years ago, perhaps more so. To put it in the same category as a gimmick even at the initial stages is just ridiculous.

Like I said, I don't even have to go into the reasons why it's so significant, but it's easy to imagine how televisions coming in boxes similar to window blinds or curtain rods would be an unbelievable revolution in the industry - way WAY more so than 4k, 8k, or hdr.
I'm personally more interested in the picture quality aspects of the technology more so than lifestyle form factors (at least not yet since I don't own a home at age 23). I would agree it would be one of the greatest evolutions in shipment costs and transit spacial efficiency for TVs since flat panel's introduction 20 some years ago assuming this rollable form factor takes over the consumer market.

The real excitement back when flat panels were introduced I'd imagine was more centered around higher pixel densities and better color fidelity than how the TV came in a lighter, thinner box. But I see what you're saying.
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post #146 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 11:52 AM
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The color reproduction on Samsung's QLEDs is beautiful.
Yep. Top of the mark for 2017 models.
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post #147 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 12:09 PM
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Rollable displays are the greatest evolution of tv since the flat panel some ~20 years ago, perhaps more so. To put it in the same category as a gimmick even at the initial stages is just ridiculous.

Like I said, I don't even have to go into the reasons why it's so significant, but it's easy to imagine how televisions coming in boxes similar to window blinds or curtain rods would be an unbelievable revolution in the industry - way WAY more so than 4k, 8k, or hdr.


As of right now it's definitely a gimmick because it requires a box with a mechanical mechanism and isn't finished. Keep in mind the prototype was actually not the same company as the TV company, it was the electronic division. They also said they still haven't figured out how to power it properly or get HDMI to it or something (sorry for forgetting the specific, but I know there's currently an issue.) when it becomes an actual usable product and has no more hurdles, then it won't have gimmick status.
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post #148 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 12:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by alexanderg823 View Post
Rollable displays are the greatest evolution of tv since the flat panel some ~20 years ago, perhaps more so. To put it in the same category as a gimmick even at the initial stages is just ridiculous.

Like I said, I don't even have to go into the reasons why it's so significant, but it's easy to imagine how televisions coming in boxes similar to window blinds or curtain rods would be an unbelievable revolution in the industry - way WAY more so than 4k, 8k, or hdr.


As of right now it's definitely a gimmick because it requires a box with a mechanical mechanism and isn't finished. Keep in mind the prototype was actually not the same company as the TV company, it was the electronic division. They also said they still haven't figured out how to power it properly or get HDMI to it or something (sorry for forgetting the specific, but I know there's currently an issue.) when it becomes an actual usable product and has no more hurdles, then it won't have gimmick status.
Gimmicks are ideas or concepts that have more flash than substance.

Rollable displays have the flash but even more substance. It benefits everyone from the producer to the consumer, in monumentally massive ways. I can't stress enough how huge of an impact rollable displays will have.

The idea of picking up a 75 inch + roll up display from BB and bringing it home in my sports car coupe and installing and hanging and then driving back to inevitably return it - all by myself, is an incredibly revolutionary idea.

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post #149 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 12:45 PM
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John Archers article on the 2018 Qled demo against 2017 oled, Sony Z9D, and 2017 Q9.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#3e7b23547087

I wonder if this article refers to the Q9 or the Q9S? I can't tell. Also, will there be an 85" Q9?
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post #150 of 388 Old 01-10-2018, 12:58 PM
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I wonder if this article refers to the Q9 or the Q9S? I can't tell. Also, will there be an 85" Q9?

The 85" Q9S was not part of his comparison demo he seen. Last years Q9 was in the demo lineup and of course it failed miserably against the other 3 tvs with dark room performance.
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