2018 Sony XBR 900F owners thread (No Price Talk) - Page 343 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #10261 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 08:47 AM
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So did I read somewhere that the 900 is a better tv than the 950? I just got my 49” 900f not too long ago and I just saw it dropped $200 at both BB and Amazon. They told me something weird like they won’t match Black Friday prices when I got the 900f but that doesn’t mean I can’t return it. I might just go with the 55” for the same price as my 49 even though I think the 49 is a better size for the room. But I could also go with the 950 for that same price. I can’t imagine tHe 950 has a worse picture? Sitting directly in front of the tv it’s about roughly 10’ of viewing distance. Bright room with skylights and a back sliding door. Either way I can’t leave the $200 or extra inches in the table.
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post #10262 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by El Taco View Post
So did I read somewhere that the 900 is a better tv than the 950? I just got my 49” 900f not too long ago and I just saw it dropped $200 at both BB and Amazon. They told me something weird like they won’t match Black Friday prices when I got the 900f but that doesn’t mean I can’t return it. I might just go with the 55” for the same price as my 49 even though I think the 49 is a better size for the room. But I could also go with the 950 for that same price. I can’t imagine tHe 950 has a worse picture? Sitting directly in front of the tv it’s about roughly 10’ of viewing distance. Bright room with skylights and a back sliding door. Either way I can’t leave the $200 or extra inches in the table.
The 900F is arguably better at 75/85" but below that the 950G is better, especially at the same price. Faster processor, more Dolby Vision profiles.

At 10', 75" would be optimal but if you can't accomodate it do the best you can.
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post #10263 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by PlanetAVS View Post
The 900F is arguably better at 75/85" but below that the 950G is better, especially at the same price. Faster processor, more Dolby Vision profiles.

At 10', 75" would be optimal but if you can't accomodate it do the best you can.
This room I thought 50 was good but I think 55 could be fine. Thanks for the reply that is what I was looking to find out.

The ol lady is not happy. This process went from old Vizio to LG Nano to Samsung q70 to the Sony. Now maybe to a bigger one, lol.
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post #10264 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 09:20 AM
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This room I thought 50 was good but I think 55 could be fine. Thanks for the reply that is what I was looking to find out.

The ol lady is not happy. This process went from old Vizio to LG Nano to Samsung q70 to the Sony. Now maybe to a bigger one, lol.
Curious, what did you not like about the Q70?

I have an 85" 900f....its delicious!!!
I came from a 58 panny plasma and was worried about the black level. This tv is quite impressive on black level and color pop at the same time. Almost went with the Costco Q70 deal, but decided to go with the 900f!
So far, so good!
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post #10265 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 10:23 AM
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Curious, what did you not like about the Q70?

I have an 85" 900f....its delicious!!!
I came from a 58 panny plasma and was worried about the black level. This tv is quite impressive on black level and color pop at the same time. Almost went with the Costco Q70 deal, but decided to go with the 900f!
So far, so good!
I’m OCD af! Honestly it was pretty good most of the time. But sometimes I looked at and thought that picture isn’t that good. Keep in mind I’m just turning on xfinity and watching tv. No HDR stuff or apps. We do watch Netflix and amazon prime but it’s through the cable. Some things on Samsung just didn’t look that good. Everything looks good on the Sony. Maybe it’s the better upscaling? The Sony is also brighter which was a big requirement in this room. Apparently to get that typical super bright Samsung screen you have to go above the Q70 line.
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post #10266 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 12:43 PM
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Welp... Spend Thanksgiving designing/building a new entertainment center. Yesterday I went to BestBuy, bought the 85" 900F, Panasonic 820, came home, ordered a Denon x3500h and LightPack 2.
Now the hardest part... waiting.
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post #10267 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 09:13 PM
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Yes, I have put "auto download" back on a few weeks back. Even with "Check update available" it shows no updates available...



There has been some talks in various channels that the SONY update is "broken" somehow, but I have seen reports that ppl have received those too.



Also I have understood that the updates roll-out regionally so perhaps Finland is just _very bottom_ on that list...



So, still awaiting...
You can manually download it and install from a USB drive.

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post #10268 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 10:16 PM
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A few posts back someone mentioned that you should make sure that your 900F was set to Enhanced Input. I was surprised to find that mine was set to Standard. So I changed mine to Enhanced and now everything looks like HDR and much of the material is over saturated or just has a strange colorful look to it. So I set it back to Standard but nothing changed. So I'm thinking there is a bug in the software or there might have benn another setting that I had changed when I went to Enhanced and I have to find that in order to get back to Standard. My input is Directv and Firestick 4K for Netflix and Prime Video.

Anyone have this experience?

Is your HDR Mode set to 'Auto' in the Video options?

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post #10269 of 10997 Old 11-30-2019, 11:30 PM
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Is your HDR Mode set to 'Auto' in the Video options?
When I set it to Auto the picture takes on a "florescent" look to it, especially the whites. So I just switched it back to Enhanced and the picture didn't change. Still has that look. My memory may be fooling me but it seems that when I first discovered I was at Standard and switched to Enhanced that I got the florescent look. But when I switched back to Standard it stayed the same.

Jack
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post #10270 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by KGrinols View Post
Welp... Spend Thanksgiving designing/building a new entertainment center. Yesterday I went to BestBuy, bought the 85" 900F, Panasonic 820.
I think I’m going to do this exact setup next month. Looking forward to your thoughts once you’re up and running!

😎It's just life, dude. We are all gonna die sometime--Might as well try and have a kickass time while we're still here.😜
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post #10271 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by JackB View Post
When I set it to Auto the picture takes on a "florescent" look to it, especially the whites. So I just switched it back to Enhanced and the picture didn't change. Still has that look. My memory may be fooling me but it seems that when I first discovered I was at Standard and switched to Enhanced that I got the florescent look. But when I switched back to Standard it stayed the same.
Yes, you want Enhanced enabled for HDR use and under Video Options you want HDR mode as Auto.

Settings under Brightness such as Auto local dimming High and X-tended Dynamic Range on non-HDR material will be very bright if you don't turn them down.
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post #10272 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 08:23 AM
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Yes, you want Enhanced enabled for HDR use and under Video Options you want HDR mode as Auto.

Settings under Brightness such as Auto local dimming High and X-tended Dynamic Range on non-HDR material will be very bright if you don't turn them down.
I will check thse brightness settings. They could be the culprit.

BTW, I also have some recommended settings under Custom. The problem above is under Cinema Pro. Are the two totally independent as far as all of the detailed settings underneath them? Or do I have to pay attention to some of the details that might not change but really should be different?

Jack
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post #10273 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 08:37 AM
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I will check thse brightness settings. They could be the culprit.

BTW, I also have some recommended settings under Custom. The problem above is under Cinema Pro. Are the two totally independent as far as all of the detailed settings underneath them? Or do I have to pay attention to some of the details that might not change but really should be different?
X-Tended Dynamic Range, when used with non HDR picture, will attempt to stretch the highlights and such up to 800nit and create a fake HDR picture...this would definitally make whites glow rather oddly in many cases. Also, if you throw a non-aproved Dolby Vsion device signal at the TV, it will show the wrong colors, like a color blind test, with neon green whites for instance. The device has to be included in the Dolby Vision profile of the TV's firmware (they update new devices on newer firmware) or it doesn't know how to handle it.

All of the picture modes are pretty much identical, the only things that really change are the available adjustments (some are fixed in certain modes) and the WHITE BALANCE, such as warm and neutral etc...the WB's are set to diff color temperatures at their 0 settings. The cinema profiles do include a certain amount of extra highlight roll-off to the picture, to make movies not blow out the highlights. Best to ignore all the per mode adjustemtns, reset them all to 0, then adjust them on an as needed/wanted basis. Just because they throw a setting at a picture mode doesn't mean that the picture mode is required, they make these TV's for a lot of people who never even enter the menu and think a blue screen on an iPhon is perfectly color calibrated. \

See the settings in my signature link if you want to try some custom picture mode adjustments.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #10274 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 11:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by El Taco View Post
So did I read somewhere that the 900 is a better tv than the 950? I just got my 49” 900f not too long ago and I just saw it dropped $200 at both BB and Amazon. They told me something weird like they won’t match Black Friday prices when I got the 900f but that doesn’t mean I can’t return it. I might just go with the 55” for the same price as my 49 even though I think the 49 is a better size for the room. But I could also go with the 950 for that same price. I can’t imagine tHe 950 has a worse picture? Sitting directly in front of the tv it’s about roughly 10’ of viewing distance. Bright room with skylights and a back sliding door. Either way I can’t leave the $200 or extra inches in the table.
That is so stupid, Corporate America for you. Yep do what you got to do, you paid for the return policy and price match policy as I am sure you paid retail.
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post #10275 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by El Taco View Post
So did I read somewhere that the 900 is a better tv than the 950? I just got my 49” 900f not too long ago and I just saw it dropped $200 at both BB and Amazon. They told me something weird like they won’t match Black Friday prices when I got the 900f but that doesn’t mean I can’t return it. I might just go with the 55” for the same price as my 49 even though I think the 49 is a better size for the room. But I could also go with the 950 for that same price. I can’t imagine tHe 950 has a worse picture? Sitting directly in front of the tv it’s about roughly 10’ of viewing distance. Bright room with skylights and a back sliding door. Either way I can’t leave the $200 or extra inches in the table.
https://www.rtings.com/tv/tools/comp...&threshold=0.1

950 has eARC and 1200+ nit HDR brightness...it seems to only give up a tiny bit of contrast...I would say the 950 is the winner.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552

Last edited by Anderegg; 12-01-2019 at 12:00 PM.
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post #10276 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
X-Tended Dynamic Range, when used with non HDR picture, will attempt to stretch the highlights and such up to 800nit and create a fake HDR picture...this would definitally make whites glow rather oddly in many cases. Also, if you throw a non-aproved Dolby Vsion device signal at the TV, it will show the wrong colors, like a color blind test, with neon green whites for instance. The device has to be included in the Dolby Vision profile of the TV's firmware (they update new devices on newer firmware) or it doesn't know how to handle it.

All of the picture modes are pretty much identical, the only things that really change are the available adjustments (some are fixed in certain modes) and the WHITE BALANCE, such as warm and neutral etc...the WB's are set to diff color temperatures at their 0 settings. The cinema profiles do include a certain amount of extra highlight roll-off to the picture, to make movies not blow out the highlights. Best to ignore all the per mode adjustemtns, reset them all to 0, then adjust them on an as needed/wanted basis. Just because they throw a setting at a picture mode doesn't mean that the picture mode is required, they make these TV's for a lot of people who never even enter the menu and think a blue screen on an iPhon is perfectly color calibrated. \

See the settings in my signature link if you want to try some custom picture mode adjustments.

Paul
have you tested this tv in dolby vision or hdr10 in any streaming boxes? appletv 4k or Nvidia shield? Seems like dolby vision for these is very dark and doesn't look right. Hdr10 I can get to look pretty good though not sure if you test with just the tv's interface or a player?
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post #10277 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
https://www.rtings.com/tv/tools/comp...&threshold=0.1

950 has eARC and 1200+ nit HDR brightness...it seems to only give up a tiny bit of contrast...I would say the 950 is the winner.

Paul
Keep in mind that the Rtngs review was of the 55" 950G which doesn't have the XWide Angle tech. For 75/85, the hit on contrast would be more significant
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post #10278 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 12:22 PM
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have you tested this tv in dolby vision or hdr10 in any streaming boxes? appletv 4k or Nvidia shield? Seems like dolby vision for these is very dark and doesn't look right. Hdr10 I can get to look pretty good though not sure if you test with just the tv's interface or a player?
Dolby Vision attempts to COMPRESS the highlights of an HDR image into the available brightness range of each TV it is profiled for. Most HDR movies are 2000-4000nit peak brightness, while the X900F can only handle 800nits. Normal HDR10, the TV would just clip anything above 800nits (my HDR calibration attempts to retain as much as possible), while DV will lower the peak brightness and gamma so as to keep it within the TV's limits. The DV attempt to keep the dynamic range ends up causing very dim images, because you cannot just reduce highlights without also reducing midrange gamma. In the same way that holding up welders goggles to the sun allows you to see the sunspots, it will also make the sun dimmer. For DV titles such as movies that appear to dim, increase the TV's GAMMA as necessary, but remember to set it back for the next title. To see an HDR title that uses a lower peak nit, check out The Tick or The Grand Tour on Amazon...those are not mastered in 4000 not, but rather in the 1000-2000 range so as to look right on most modern TV sets.

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Originally Posted by PlanetAVS View Post
Keep in mind that the Rtngs review was of the 55" 950G which doesn't have the XWide Angle tech. For 75/85, the hit on contrast would be more significant
Sorry, I view my TV head-on like a normal human, not from an angle like an animal :-P

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #10279 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 12:31 PM
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Dolby Vision attempts to COMPRESS the highlights of an HDR image into the available brightness range of each TV it is profiled for. Most HDR movies are 2000-4000nit peak brightness, while the X900F can only handle 800nits. Normal HDR10, the TV would just clip anything above 800nits (my HDR calibration attempts to retain as much as possible), while DV will lower the peak brightness and gamma so as to keep it within the TV's limits. The DV attempt to keep the dynamic range ends up causing very dim images, because you cannot just reduce highlights without also reducing midrange gamma. In the same way that holding up welders goggles to the sun allows you to see the sunspots, it will also make the sun dimmer. For DV titles such as movies that appear to dim, increase the TV's GAMMA as necessary, but remember to set it back for the next title. To see an HDR title that uses a lower peak nit, check out The Tick or The Grand Tour on Amazon...those are not mastered in 4000 not, but rather in the 1000-2000 range so as to look right on most modern TV sets.



Sorry, I view my TV head-on like a normal human, not from an angle like an animal :-P

Paul
why would Netflix/amazon/disney be releasing so many dolby vision content then? If the streams aren't even capable of that high of brightness/quality. Im mostly just trying to see if I can make any streaming or home media content in hdr/ dolby vision look as good as sdr does to me. Even with hdr10 its still too dim for my liking unless I turn live color up to max. Which I assume does all kinds of bad things as far as color which I tone down 8-10.
Dolby vision in any streaming box is unusable to me as its way too dark.
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post #10280 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 01:21 PM
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why would Netflix/amazon/disney be releasing so many dolby vision content then? If the streams aren't even capable of that high of brightness/quality. Im mostly just trying to see if I can make any streaming or home media content in hdr/ dolby vision look as good as sdr does to me. Even with hdr10 its still too dim for my liking unless I turn live color up to max. Which I assume does all kinds of bad things as far as color which I tone down 8-10.
Dolby vision in any streaming box is unusable to me as its way too dark.
If a TV had a peak nit of 10,000, then it would not need Dolby Vision. Again, it is a matter of compressing the encoded dynamic range into the range of the display. It would be nice if the streaming dongles would allow you to toggle DV off...my Sony X800MII UHD Bluray player has such a DV toggle, allowing me to watch Neflix in HDR10 instead of Dolby Vision. I would suggest you watch your Dolby Vision titles at night in the dark, and save your brighter SDR content for the day. Unfortunately, Dolby Vision atempts to retain the dynamic range of highlights, which means that the midtones and shadows get pushed really dark so that all that highlight range can be shown in something more than just an overly bright area.

Bad Dolby Vision mastering is another problem...if I am looking at a night scene with car headlights shining into the camera, that headlight should be beaming off my X900F's screen at the maximum available 800nit the TV is capable of...anything less = a bad master/grade.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #10281 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 01:22 PM
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BTW, the sun at noon is 1.6 TRILLION nits :-)

https://www.cnet.com/news/tvs-are-on...ght-is-enough/

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #10282 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 01:42 PM
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That is so stupid, Corporate America for you. Yep do what you got to do, you paid for the return policy and price match policy as I am sure you paid retail.
Completely agree. Should have seen all the returned tv’s behind CS, smh. I try to be a fair and yet a savvy consumer. So I’m not passing up a chance at a better and or bigger tv specially because of their own stupid BF policy. Thoroughly enjoying the 55” 950.

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https://www.rtings.com/tv/tools/comp...&threshold=0.1

950 has eARC and 1200+ nit HDR brightness...it seems to only give up a tiny bit of contrast...I would say the 950 is the winner.

Paul
That is exactly what I ended up doing. Only slight regret was I finally had the 900 picture looking now I liked it. So now the constant fidgeting with the settings will go on for days.

Btw - do you have recommended settings for the 950 or is it pretty much the same?
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post #10283 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 05:21 PM
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Bought the 75" 900f last week. Noticed two dead pixels in upper left hand corner and am trying to decide whether to return it. I can't really see it unless I look really hard and I. Normal content I don't see it unless I remember to look.

How normal/acceptable are dead pixels nowadays with 4K sets?
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post #10284 of 10997 Old 12-01-2019, 11:49 PM
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Bought the 75" 900f last week. Noticed two dead pixels in upper left hand corner and am trying to decide whether to return it. I can't really see it unless I look really hard and I. Normal content I don't see it unless I remember to look.

How normal/acceptable are dead pixels nowadays with 4K sets?
if you can see them on a 4k tv id imagine tis more than 2 pixels dead. Im also curious as to what a warranty would cover if pixels where to go out. over 4 pixels in multiple spots is what I'm assuming would constitute a defect but I really don't know.
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post #10285 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 05:44 AM
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why would Netflix/amazon/disney be releasing so many dolby vision content then? If the streams aren't even capable of that high of brightness/quality. Im mostly just trying to see if I can make any streaming or home media content in hdr/ dolby vision look as good as sdr does to me. Even with hdr10 its still too dim for my liking unless I turn live color up to max. Which I assume does all kinds of bad things as far as color which I tone down 8-10.
Dolby vision in any streaming box is unusable to me as its way too dark.
I picked up the 49" 900F on a black Friday sale, and I'm impressed. The first thing I noticed with Dolby Vision is Netflix titles are very bright, just like SD content (examples: The Spy, Our Planet), but Disney+ DV titles are quite dim (examples: The Mandalorian, Rogue One).

Submitted without comment or complaint. Just an observation.
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post #10286 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by hodgjy View Post
I picked up the 49" 900F on a black Friday sale, and I'm impressed. The first thing I noticed with Dolby Vision is Netflix titles are very bright, just like SD content (examples: The Spy, Our Planet), but Disney+ DV titles are quite dim (examples: The Mandalorian, Rogue One).

Submitted without comment or complaint. Just an observation.
What streaming box? Dolby vision is super dim on my set. 75”. Both appletv 4k and nvidia shield.
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post #10287 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 06:15 AM
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What streaming box? Dolby vision is super dim on my set. 75”. Both appletv 4k and nvidia shield.
Apple TV 4K. I tried the tv's built in Netflix app and compared it to the Apple TV, and all Netflix titles were sufficiently bright on both. I don't have a light meter to compare, but to my eyes in a dimly light room, they looked pretty similar. For reference, I put the tv's brightness to 25 for SDR and max it out for HDR.

Not sure it means anything, but my tv has a manufacture date of 10/2019.
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post #10288 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by hodgjy View Post
Apple TV 4K. I tried the tv's built in Netflix app and compared it to the Apple TV, and all Netflix titles were sufficiently bright on both. I don't have a light meter to compare, but to my eyes in a dimly light room, they looked pretty similar. For reference, I put the tv's brightness to 25 for SDR and max it out for HDR.

Not sure it means anything, but my tv has a manufacture date of 10/2019.
Interesting. You are getting the hdr logo in the top right banner in picture settings right? Hopefully minds fixable with an update then. It’s never been great and I try disabling it because it’s unwatchable to me.
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post #10289 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 06:39 AM
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Interesting. You are getting the hdr logo in the top right banner in picture settings right? Hopefully minds fixable with an update then. It’s never been great and I try disabling it because it’s unwatchable to me.
It definitely flashes the DV logo in the top right corner. I read somewhere that there was an update specifically for Netflix DV. I believe this to be true because Disney+ DV is very dim. It has major black crush.

Do you get Netflix? If so, try watching Our Planet in both SD and DV and compare. The DV version is quite bright, but I can definitely see DV working by not blowing out highlights, but the shadows aren't crushed to death. Also try the Spy. That has some spectacular sky highlights in episode 2.
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post #10290 of 10997 Old 12-02-2019, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by hodgjy View Post
It definitely flashes the DV logo in the top right corner. I read somewhere that there was an update specifically for Netflix DV. I believe this to be true because Disney+ DV is very dim. It has major black crush.

Do you get Netflix? If so, try watching Our Planet in both SD and DV and compare. The DV version is quite bright, but I can definitely see DV working by not blowing out highlights, but the shadows aren't crushed to death. Also try the Spy. That has some spectacular sky highlights in episode 2.
They definitely updated DV on Netflix. I remember watching the movie Bright and remember it being so dark to the point of unwatchable. It’s now brightened up a bit and looks phenomenal. Same with Ozark..it was so dark before and now it is also a bit brighter. Both look much better now. Same for all DV content on Netflix. I’m using Sony’s internal apps btw. No need for Apple TV or Nvidia etc.
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