2018 Samsung FALD Q8FN Owners thread - No price talk - Page 29 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #841 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Keithian View Post
So based on your expertise, do you think that the zone difference in the 55" versus the 65" supports Rtings conclusion that the zone counts would have minimal impact on picture quality regardless of source? I just wonder if the 55" for this and the Q9 are not representative of the quality of the 65" and the 75" despite the owner above who obviously has a dud or some other issue.
How many zones did they say was in the 55?

I'll say this as a person who went from having the Q8FN and found a dead pixel on it to trading that in for a LG C8 OLED, only to come back to the Samsung Q8FN.... For me, I think this TV gets hella bright (not as bright as the 9, but with it being a grand difference in price I'm not complaining), with great contrast between light and dark scenes, and a definitely has that HDR pop that I look for be it video game content or movie content. I don't notice blooming, And it plays great for me.

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Last edited by Damar1979; 04-27-2018 at 06:59 PM.
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post #842 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by meduzadg View Post
If you looked at the pics and video I posted yesterday it looks as the 65 has only few zones...😁
Did you try to do zone count yourself?
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post #843 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:08 PM - Thread Starter
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@Damar1979

Yes, I'm aware you counted 200 plus zones and Samsung relayed to you the count of 240 zones but something is not adding up unless you want to believe there are six times the zones going from the 55" to the 65" model (very bizarre if that's the case). Modernwize is not letting on the zone count with his Q8FN (building up suspense for his overview I guess) but he is leaving hints it's a lot closer to the 240 count. i.e., rtings is really confusing me as I see it very unlikely there would be such a dramatic difference in dimming zones between theses two sizes.
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post #844 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
@Damar1979

Yes, I'm aware you counted 200 plus zones and Samsung relayed to you the count of 240 zones but something is not adding up unless you want to believe there are six times the zones going from the 55" to the 65" model (very bizarre if that's the case). Modernwize is not letting on the zone count with his Q8FN (building up suspense for his overview I guess) but he is leaving hints it's a lot closer to the 240 count. i.e., rtings is really confusing me as I see it very unlikely there would be such a dramatic difference in dimming zones between theses two sizes.
What was the zone count in the 55?

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post #845 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:19 PM
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even without VRR mode (which we may never get on Nvidia cards anyway), same as their current [email protected] lag)
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about 20 hours ago · #827
I am attaching a You Tube link to show you the local dimming issue I have with the 65" TV I received yesterday. The scene is from Goliath on Amazon episode 8, 56 min mark. Also, it looks as the brightness is pulsating a bit and I used movie mode. I contacted Samsung and they asked that I send pics of the issue and if they feel it is a problem, they will send a tech to try to fix it. I really do not want to have a tech in my house working on a brand new TV. It looks as this TV has only 10 zones.......This one is going back. Let me know your opinion.

I would like to add that this scene looks great on my 2015 JU7100 Samsung TV and on my previous Vizio 65P. I cannot believe spending 3K on this sub par TV. I guess I will now wait for the TCL series 6, Vizio P series 2018 or the Vizio P Quantum. It is funny that Samsung Advertise 1,500 nits for this TV and it only measures by Rting at about 600 or so nits. Does not make sense. You can now get the Sony 930E for so much less and its edge lit panel will perform better that the Q8 "FALD". Unbelievable......

I had the same issue i exchanged and will have new q8 tomorrow , lets see how local dimming works on new set.
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post #846 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Damar1979 View Post
What was the zone count in the 55?

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rtings says 40!

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post #847 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:31 PM
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40 zones on the 55? I would advise they redo that or otherwise based on just zone count alone TCL will clean house once their sets are released next month.

Simple math, more zones better contrast between brightness and black level with less blooming. If they are saying that their HDR peak brightness is the same as an OLED nit wise, I would advise them to play the BvS scene where they meet right before they fight, and see which set produces the most searing flame scene. 600+ nits? Seriously? You are right..... something ISN'T adding up. This set is just as bright as a 930e. Either way, the contrast in this set (to me) is fantastic! They can't say this is the best LED they ever tested, yet say that the nit count/zone count is low compared to other sets.... there would be blooming all over the place

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post #848 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:34 PM
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Almost bought the 55" to use as monitor. Phew!
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post #849 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 07:56 PM
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I think I’m going to return it and try a c7 thru amazon... the DSE is bad when gaming
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post #850 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Damar1979 View Post
Samsung reps confirmed 240 zones

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Well, in this rate, Samsung owes me about 230 zones.....could be that my tv has an issue with the local dimming hardware as if it was software related, it would effect all of us.
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post #851 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 08:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Damar1979 View Post
40 zones on the 55? I would advise they redo that or otherwise based on just zone count alone TCL will clean house once their sets are released next month.

Simple math, more zones better contrast between brightness and black level with less blooming. If they are saying that their HDR peak brightness is the same as an OLED nit wise, I would advise them to play the BvS scene where they meet right before they fight, and see which set produces the most searing flame scene. 600+ nits? Seriously? You are right..... something ISN'T adding up. This set is just as bright as a 930e. Either way, the contrast in this set (to me) is fantastic! They can't say this is the best LED they ever tested, yet say that the nit count/zone count is low compared to other sets.... there would be blooming all over the place

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how do you finally think this tv and the sony x930 used in a dark room with bias light on the back of tv switched on, compare in terms of contrast, blacks and light control? does x930e still hold up pretty well against the new 2018 q8 samsung fald? and how about in terms of peak brightness and hdr movies/games performance?
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post #852 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Damar1979 View Post
40 zones on the 55? I would advise they redo that or otherwise based on just zone count alone TCL will clean house once their sets are released next month.

Simple math, more zones better contrast between brightness and black level with less blooming. If they are saying that their HDR peak brightness is the same as an OLED nit wise, I would advise them to play the BvS scene where they meet right before they fight, and see which set produces the most searing flame scene. 600+ nits? Seriously? You are right..... something ISN'T adding up. This set is just as bright as a 930e. Either way, the contrast in this set (to me) is fantastic! They can't say this is the best LED they ever tested, yet say that the nit count/zone count is low compared to other sets.... there would be blooming all over the place

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Thats why I asked. Something doesn't add up and Rtings is making assumptions without anything to back it up. I know they have budget limitations which is why they got the 55", but its obvious there is something wrong here. I hope for the Q9 they got a 65", though I doubt it. I believe Mark/Imagic in his 900F comments think there is too much focus on zone count, but in this case, where it is so wildly different, I just think to accept an assumption that is based on possible inaccurate specifications between sizes shouldn't be acceptable.
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post #853 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Damar1979 View Post
40 zones on the 55? I would advise they redo that or otherwise based on just zone count alone TCL will clean house once their sets are released next month.

Simple math, more zones better contrast between brightness and black level with less blooming. If they are saying that their HDR peak brightness is the same as an OLED nit wise, I would advise them to play the BvS scene where they meet right before they fight, and see which set produces the most searing flame scene. 600+ nits? Seriously? You are right..... something ISN'T adding up. This set is just as bright as a 930e. Either way, the contrast in this set (to me) is fantastic! They can't say this is the best LED they ever tested, yet say that the nit count/zone count is low compared to other sets.... there would be blooming all over the place

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This is why that rtings measurement funky. The TV does NOT max out at 600 nits. It's apparently an average of multiple wild measurements. The TV will do up to 1300 nits. But can be "low" in other scenes. All they did was average these measurements together. The measurement is extremely misleading as quite a few people are confused what it actually means. They discussed a couple pages back about making the test more clear so readers could better understand it, possibly adding the nit measurements they are using to achieve that number.

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post #854 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 11:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Keithian View Post
Thats why I asked. Something doesn't add up and Rtings is making assumptions without anything to back it up. I know they have budget limitations which is why they got the 55", but its obvious there is something wrong here. I hope for the Q9 they got a 65", though I doubt it. I believe Mark/Imagic in his 900F comments think there is too much focus on zone count, but in this case, where it is so wildly different, I just think to accept an assumption that is based on possible inaccurate specifications between sizes shouldn't be acceptable.
Yes they have the 65Q9FN. The 55" version is Europe only (they're in Canada eh)

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post #855 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 11:23 PM
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Yes they have the 65Q9FN. The 55" version is Europe only (they're in Canada eh)

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Thanks that's comforting, I thought they were in France lol
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post #856 of 3331 Old 04-27-2018, 11:40 PM
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Thanks that's comforting, I thought they were in France lol
Montreal. But I do believe they have a UK site as well. They posted a picture of the 65Q9FN box on their Twitter account so no worries there.
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post #857 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 03:06 AM
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Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
This is why that rtings measurement funky. The TV does NOT max out at 600 nits. It's apparently an average of multiple wild measurements. The TV will do up to 1300 nits. But can be "low" in other scenes. All they did was average these measurements together. The measurement is extremely misleading as quite a few people are confused what it actually means. They discussed a couple pages back about making the test more clear so readers could better understand it, possibly adding the nit measurements they are using to achieve that number.

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They don't average any measurements. They just take one scene and test the peak brightness. Hdtvtest polska does it to but on 4 scenes. In their Q9FN test 2 out of 4 scenes they have almost same nits as 7 series oled. While other 2 scenes are close to their max peak brightness of the leds.
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post #858 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 06:03 AM
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It is a shame they didn't get the 65" Q8 yet as a fellow Canadian, I can see why as Samsung prices here are ridiculous. The 65" Q8 almost costs as much as the 65" C8 oled ($100 difference right now) and the 65" Q9FN is right now $1200 more than the C8.

Regarding the zone count, I'm with Venus as it just seems like there is no way both the 40 zone and 240 zone figures can be correct. I am thinking one has to be wrong as that big a difference for a 10" difference in size seems too weird. If there is then Samsung is really screwing over customers buying the 55" model since that is a high MSRP for a 55" TV with only 40 zones.

I suppose there is also the chance the Q8 they got had some dimming issues that made the zone count seem smaller than it should be as it's clear from this thread some people have got sets with issues.

Hopefully we'll get more info on this and see what the deal is.
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post #859 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 06:12 AM
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Just because the TV has 240 dimming zones doesn't mean that they are controlled independently or the same way as the Q9FN.

Vizio TVs have the same number of dimming zones on a few of their differently priced TVs. But they control them less independently on the lower end and more independently on the higher end.
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post #860 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 06:16 AM
 
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Just because the TV has 240 dimming zones doesn't mean that they are controlled independently or the same way as the Q9FN.

Vizio TVs have the same number of dimming zones on a few of their differently priced TVs. But they control them less independently on the lower end and more independently on the higher end.
That's not true. They may have similar numbers of physical LEDs but the zone counts are definitely not the same on different Vizio.
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post #861 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Just because the TV has 240 dimming zones doesn't mean that they are controlled independently or the same way as the Q9FN.

Vizio TVs have the same number of dimming zones on a few of their differently priced TVs. But they control them less independently on the lower end and more independently on the higher end.
Actually that is exactly the definition of a dimming zone, that they can be controlled independently. A zone however my be composed of multiple LEDs.

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post #862 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 08:27 AM
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rtings says 40!
Well the 55" is about 39.7% smaller then the 65". 65" has 240 zones, if the 55" was up to snuff it would have about 96 zones and not 40, that sticks.......

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post #863 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 10:36 AM
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Well the 55" is about 30% smaller then the 65". 65" has 240 zones if the 55" was up to snuff it would have about 160 zones, interesting
Another post of why Rtings review that the 55" would basically be equivalent to the other sizes isn't necessarily true.
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^^^I re-did the math, check my edited post. No question the 55FN is no where near the zone count it should be at compared to the 65FN, as it is missing over 50% of the zones to be on par. The 65FN should be a far better TV compared to the 55FN.
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post #865 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 12:21 PM
 
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^^^I re-did the math, check my edited post. No question the 55FN is no where near the zone count it should be at compared to the 65FN, as it is missing over 50% of the zones to be on par. The 65FN should be a far better TV compared to the 55FN.
Yep. That's why the rtings review of the q8 is not representative of the 65 inch at all since they seem to be vastly different performing televsions
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post #866 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 12:26 PM
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We keep waiting on reviews but can no one at home do a zone count ? If its true that this tv has anywhere under 200 zones im returning. I have a strong feeling this isnt a true fald tv , probably a direct lit tv that dims through software. Something is fishy about this tv why the $200 price drop 2 weeks in ? If this tv settles in a price range around $2200-2400 then it makes sense that theres around only 100 zones considering samsung has been selling its 2017 q7 for 2000 for months now. Previous flagships like js9500 and ks9800 all had 150 zones and black bars were INKY not grey like q8 , also it doesnt look like zones shut off completely / can someone please do a zone count on 65" ? Rtings is totally imcompetent. What a false reviee they post , numbers are a joke. They show peak brightness of movie mode which is lower than dynamic , they use 55" model which has less zones , maybe even a different panel manufacturer who knows. Rtings cannot be taken seriously at this point
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post #867 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 12:42 PM
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We keep waiting on reviews but can no one at home do a zone count ? If its true that this tv has anywhere under 200 zones im returning. I have a strong feeling this isnt a true fald tv , probably a direct lit tv that dims through software. Something is fishy about this tv why the $200 price drop 2 weeks in ? If this tv settles in a price range around $2200-2400 then it makes sense that theres around only 100 zones considering samsung has been selling its 2017 q7 for 2000 for months now. Previous flagships like js9500 and ks9800 all had 150 zones and black bars were INKY not grey like q8 , also it doesnt look like zones shut off completely / can someone please do a zone count on 65" ? Rtings is totally imcompetent. What a false reviee they post , numbers are a joke. They show peak brightness of movie mode which is lower than dynamic , they use 55" model which has less zones , maybe even a different panel manufacturer who knows. Rtings cannot be taken seriously at this point
My black bars on my q8fn are inky black. Just like they were on my c7 OLED.
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post #868 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 01:31 PM
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Well i had to return my previous q8 , i got a new one at home waiting on papa to open up , sadly im working 16 hours so its been a long day knowing my tv is at home. I hope the new set is improved , anyone know when hdr10+ is coming ? I have been hearing about it for 2 years now
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post #869 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by esosa17237 View Post
We keep waiting on reviews but can no one at home do a zone count ? If its true that this tv has anywhere under 200 zones im returning. I have a strong feeling this isnt a true fald tv , probably a direct lit tv that dims through software. Something is fishy about this tv why the $200 price drop 2 weeks in ? If this tv settles in a price range around $2200-2400 then it makes sense that theres around only 100 zones considering samsung has been selling its 2017 q7 for 2000 for months now. Previous flagships like js9500 and ks9800 all had 150 zones and black bars were INKY not grey like q8 , also it doesnt look like zones shut off completely / can someone please do a zone count on 65" ? Rtings is totally imcompetent. What a false reviee they post , numbers are a joke. They show peak brightness of movie mode which is lower than dynamic , they use 55" model which has less zones , maybe even a different panel manufacturer who knows. Rtings cannot be taken seriously at this point
Like they knew beforehand that the 55" would be a different beast ...
And yes anyone at home can do the zone count, since you already have it why not do it yourself as well. I've asked a million teams for people to put up a video of the zone counter running (for various sets) but no one has managed so far ...

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post #870 of 3331 Old 04-28-2018, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep. That's why the rtings review of the q8 is not representative of the 65 inch at all since they seem to be vastly different performing televsions
I'm thinking it's much more likely the 55Q8FN has way more zones than rtings.com is indicating (or the 65Q8FN doesn't have 240 zones) than being vastly different performing televisions. Yes it's usual for the larger sizes to have more zones but not by a factor of 6.

An early owner of a 65Q8FN counted 75 zones and opined that the dimming performance was similar to his Vizio P series. Maybe he was right about the zone count. Unless we get an owner of a 55Q8 who is willing to run the LD zone counter video we may never know if rtings is correct. For current owners you can run the video below and count the zones and report back with your count and panel size. In addition to the instructions at the beginning of the video please do so in a completely unlit room. Good luck to those who try!


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