Sony X900F 65" 4K HDR TV: First Look & Review - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #91 of 214 Old 04-27-2018, 10:13 AM
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is a full review still forthcoming?

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post #92 of 214 Old 05-12-2018, 08:56 AM
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So what happened to this much awaited review from imagic?
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post #93 of 214 Old 05-12-2018, 09:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by andy sullivan View Post
So what happened to this much awaited review from imagic?
I reviewed the TCL 6-series first. I'm gonna wrap this one up this week. Don't much feel like working over the weekend though so it's gonna have to wait. I can only do so much, c'est la vie; it's only been 30 days since I started this thread, that's not exactly an eternity.
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post #94 of 214 Old 05-12-2018, 10:00 AM
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Looking forward to knowing if the off axis views are really as degraded as earlier reviewers have reported.
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post #95 of 214 Old 05-12-2018, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Looking forward to knowing if the off axis views are really as degraded as earlier reviewers have reported.
Here's the scoop on that... use rtings.com to make a decision. I'm not doing deeply technical reviews anymore because that resource exists and it's more useful to compare measured results to a deep database of other TVs, which I do not have but that site does. Here's the link: https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/x900f

I don't mind referring people there to make a judgment on a measurement-based parameter, the site buys its own TVs and has consistent methodology and is not ad supported, that's all good for me and good for the community, too. I get TVs from manufacturers, which is nice because it's free and I get them early but I think readers appreciate measurements from a TV that came from astore and was essentially randomly picked. That's always been the bar at consumer Reports, too... no ads, TV comes from a store. It's the right way to do it but beyond my means. So, I will focus on the overall user experience and not the explicit performance of the one review unit I have.
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post #96 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 05:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Here's the link to my review: https://www.avsforum.com/review-sony-65-x900f-4k-hdr-tv/

Now, do not get upset that this is not a numbers-heavy review. Here's the reality of the situation: You should check out the rtings.com review if you are interested in measurements. Or subscribe to Consumer Reports. Either way, you want to get your measurements from an organization that is purchasing its own TVs, using consistent methodology, and compiling a large database. Only then do the numbers become explicitly useful. Performance characteristics that vary from sample to sample, such as peak brightness and screen uniformity, are subject to so-called cherry-picking. And the fact is that it's not just companies doing it, I've certainly read plenty of comments from forum members who have swapped out their TV, sometimes more than once, in a search for the best replacement panel.

So, I'm focusing on the lifestyle and usability elements, as well as the subjective holistic impression I get watching a TV. There are others dedicated to getting the numbers and I'd rather point you, the reader, to them as part of the process of reading reviews. Take my observations were what they are, use your own eyes, read reviews on Amazon as well as professional reviews, it's best to have a variety of sources of information when making a major purchase.

So, having said all that, way to go Sony. This is a nice TV, at a good price, available in the sizes you want be it 49" for a bedroom or 85" for a living room. That's awesome and makes it a Top Choice for 2018.

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post #97 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Here's the link to my review: https://www.avsforum.com/review-sony-65-x900f-4k-hdr-tv/

Now, do not get upset that this is not a numbers-heavy review. Here's the reality of the situation: You should check out the rtings.com review if you are interested in measurements. Or subscribe to Consumer Reports. Either way, you want to get your measurements from an organization that is purchasing its own TVs, using consistent methodology, and compiling a large database. Only then do the numbers become explicitly useful. Performance characteristics that vary from sample to sample, such as peak brightness and screen uniformity, are subject to so-called cherry-picking. And the fact is that it's not just companies doing it, I've certainly read plenty of comments from forum members who have swapped out their TV, sometimes more than once, in a search for the best replacement panel.

So, I'm focusing on the lifestyle and usability elements, as well as the subjective holistic impression I get watching a TV. There are others dedicated to getting the numbers and I'd rather point you, the reader, to them as part of the process of reading reviews. Take my observations were what they are, use your own eyes, read reviews on Amazon as well as professional reviews, it's best to have a variety of sources of information when making a major purchase.

So, having said all that, way to go Sony. This is a nice TV, at a good price, available in the sizes you want be it 49" for a bedroom or 85" for a living room. That's awesome and makes it a Top Choice for 2018.
Thank you for taking the time to write this excellent review!
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post #98 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Here's the link to my review: https://www.avsforum.com/review-sony-65-x900f-4k-hdr-tv/

Now, do not get upset that this is not a numbers-heavy review. Here's the reality of the situation: You should check out the rtings.com review if you are interested in measurements. Or subscribe to Consumer Reports. Either way, you want to get your measurements from an organization that is purchasing its own TVs, using consistent methodology, and compiling a large database. Only then do the numbers become explicitly useful. Performance characteristics that vary from sample to sample, such as peak brightness and screen uniformity, are subject to so-called cherry-picking. And the fact is that it's not just companies doing it, I've certainly read plenty of comments from forum members who have swapped out their TV, sometimes more than once, in a search for the best replacement panel.

So, I'm focusing on the lifestyle and usability elements, as well as the subjective holistic impression I get watching a TV. There are others dedicated to getting the numbers and I'd rather point you, the reader, to them as part of the process of reading reviews. Take my observations were what they are, use your own eyes, read reviews on Amazon as well as professional reviews, it's best to have a variety of sources of information when making a major purchase.

So, having said all that, way to go Sony. This is a nice TV, at a good price, available in the sizes you want be it 49" for a bedroom or 85" for a living room. That's awesome and makes it a Top Choice for 2018.
This is a well written review. I really wish I would have liked the 85" as much as you like the TV but in the 3 stores I visited, it didn't have that wow effect I was hoping for like on the C8, A1E, or Q9FN. Picture looked very good, not gorgeous. We all know now it's probably more accurate than the Q9fn, so for those who crave accuracy for now for that it's a great choice.

For the price, there is no better TV on the market. Why nobody has attempted to challenge this TV on the 85" front is disappointing and from everything I read this TV from a motion perspective is fantastic.

Glad that it seems most owners love the TV. It keeps me wondering if I should have purchased one in my environment rather than rely on what was in store. Oh well. Maybe I will if I hate my Q9fn when it arrives.

Thanks for the review.

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post #99 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 08:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Keithian View Post
This is a well written review. I really wish I would have liked the 85" as much as you like the TV but in the 3 stores I visited, it didn't have that wow effect I was hoping for like on the C8, A1E, or Q9FN. Picture looked very good, not gorgeous. We all know now it's probably more accurate than the Q9fn, so for those who crave accuracy for now for that it's a great choice.

For the price, there is no better TV on the market. Why nobody has attempted to challenge this TV on the 85" front is disappointing and from everything I read this TV from a motion perspective is fantastic.

Glad that it seems most owners love the TV. It keeps me wondering if I should have purchased one in my environment rather than rely on what was in store. Oh well. Maybe I will if I hate my Q9fn when it arrives.

Thanks for the review.

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Q9FN performs at a higer level. I'm willing to outright state that and numbers support it, but you pay. But, aside from there being no 85", the Q9FN is not as good in terms of SDR color out of the box accuracy, you'll need to work with the Samsung to get that. But Sammsy's got many more zones, higher contrast, better anti-reflective coating, is physically nicer (a true slab) and people compare it favorably to the Z9D. Look, Sony dialed in this X900F really well... the ColorChecker here took me 5 minutes with a meter to get the TV to that point.


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post #100 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Thanks for the great review. As a owner of a 85-X900F I am very please with the performance, and with the price of the 85", there is nothing close for performance/cost at this time.


Coming from a Plasma I settled on Cinema Pro versus Custom for picture mode as it just seemed to bright in Custom. Did you chose Custom for the better contract ratio?


I also tend to avoid the extra enhancement settings and did not even try the X-tended Dynamic Range for SDR settings, other than a couple of minutes to see what it would do. I might give that a longer try to see if it looks better. I am assuming that you used that for a better contrast ratio? I do have it on for HRD mode.

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post #101 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the great review. As a owner of a 85-X900F I am very please with the performance, and with the price of the 85", there is nothing close for performance/cost at this time.


Coming from a Plasma I settled on Cinema Pro versus Custom for picture mode as it just seemed to bright in Custom. Did you chose Custom for the better contract ratio?


I also tend to avoid the extra enhancement settings and did not even try the X-tended Dynamic Range for SDR settings, other than a couple of minutes to see what it would do. I might give that a longer try to see if it looks better. I am assuming that you used that for a better contrast ratio? I do have it on for HRD mode.
Yeah in the reference vs. preference equation, I tend to go for popping those highlights to extend contrast in SDR content. But, Custom with the light sensor off, FALD (auto local dimming) set to Medium, and brightness set to somewhere between 11 and 17 (room light dependent) was where I found the "plasma-like" performance. I'm sure there's more than one way to get there, and some movies look spot-on perfect viewed this way.

I do love that on this TV Brightness actually does what people expect it to, and also the TV manages to remap that color very well, so if everything else is locked in then changing the backlight control poses zero issues.
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post #102 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Yeah in the reference vs. preference equation, I tend to go for popping those highlights to extend contrast in SDR content. But, Custom with the light sensor off, FALD (auto local dimming) set to Medium, and brightness set to somewhere between 11 and 17 (room light dependent) was where I found the "plasma-like" performance. I'm sure there's more than one way to get there, and some movies look spot-on perfect viewed this way.

I do love that on this TV Brightness actually does what people expect it to, and also the TV manages to remap that color very well, so if everything else is locked in then changing the backlight control poses zero issues.

Great, thanks for explaining your rational for the settings. I will try your settings for a while to get use to them and see if I like them. Maybe my impression of the X900F will improve from excellent to excellent+

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post #103 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 09:17 AM
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imagic,

Great, great review on the 900f but I went to my local BB a few week's ago and took one look at it I said no thank's. Maybe that's partly because I already own the excellent 900e I dont know. But I took one look at those "Feet" and that was one big turn off. Now I know it should have nothing to do with the stand it should come down to PQ but those "Feet" are just ugly. I also looked at the PQ and to be honest it didnt look that much better then my 900e and my wife said she couldnt tell the difference at all. The 900f is a nice tv that has the upgraded Extreme Processor and will be DV ready but it aint enough for me to dump my 900e. HOWEVER.....if I would have missed out on the 900e, which thank god I didnt because I love the tv, the 900f would have been bought by me no matter how laughable the stand looks to me because again it's a great tv and a worthy successor to the 900e. So for those who missed out on the 900e they will be pleased I believe with the 900f. That being said if I had my choice between either the 900e or the 900f it would be the 900e by a mile with me but maybe I'm being biased lol. But again great great review.
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post #104 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 11:20 AM
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Wait & See

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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post
Maybe that's partly because I already own the excellent 900e I dont know.
That's a much more reasoned response then the words from my Dad, who purchased a 900e six or so months ago and is now all bent out of shape given his opinion about DV has changed with all of the recent releases on Netflix and discs. I told him that the 900f still doesn't have DV, that his x800 player can't play DV discs, and the only player that one can mate to a Sony set is the x700 now that Oppo is out of business, and that is still months away.

That's life in the fast lane of technology. I guess some people, such as my Dad, are loyal Sony buyers, and that's that. Or, used to be. We'll find out.

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post #105 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
From now on, I plan to leave the number-crunching and measured performance comparisons to rtings and other sites. I'll take the key measurements I need and move on and leave the drill-down stuff to folks who are compiling databases to begin with. I am not.

A specification war between TVs is boring to me at this point, just as it became boring to me as a photographer. And the debates that branch off from that stuff (pattern-gazing, etc.) are comical because they are proof that even an infinite number of TV channels and streaming options won't cure boredom.

To me, the more interesting question is, how does everything come together (price, ergonomics, OS, PQ, aesthetics) and what usage scenarios does that apply to.

Anyhow thank you for your take on it. I recently sent back a X930E (that I did not wind up reviewing) and did think it was a good performer for an edgelit set. But I do not have it anymore for a side-by-side, oh well.
I just wanted to make a comment here, I like what you said. I am a photographer and DPReview got SOOOOO bad with all these minutiae and comparisons and users getting into virtual fist fights over everything it was basically unbearable.

Then I realized that not many of them actually took many photos or made any money if they were doing it professionally. I was going a PAC12 game and the guy next to me had these bodies that had been through the wringer. Hardly any paint on the battery grips. I asked him about the new XYZ, said I read on DPReview blah, blah, blah - he didn't know what DPReview was. I realized he was too busy using his tools to get too deep into the weeds on that sh*t.
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I reviewed the TCL 6-series first. I'm gonna wrap this one up this week. Don't much feel like working over the weekend though so it's gonna have to wait. I can only do so much, c'est la vie; it's only been 30 days since I started this thread, that's not exactly an eternity.
Mind checking if HDR10 works at 1080p 120hz while gaming on a PC?
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post #107 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 04:36 PM
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Thanks for the review! I've been on the fence about going with an X900F or an A1E for my living room. I know, I know. Totally apples and oranges, but it really seems like the 900 will get me most of where I'd like to get with PQ for the "family television" but will have better light output for the room (good for overcoming ambient light). I'll still probably get a 55" A1E (or A8F) for my master bedroom since it's nice and dark in there, but for my LR 65", the 900 REALLY hits a sweet spot with the performance:dollar ratio .

That X1 Extreme processor is really what sets these models apart from the competition. Such a great chip.
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post #108 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 04:48 PM
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Forgive me as I haven’t read through the entire thread, but has a zone count for the various sizes been determined yet?

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post #109 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 05:05 PM
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Forgive me as I haven’t read through the entire thread, but has a zone count for the various sizes been determined yet?
Good question and I haven't seen a zone count. I'm sure someone here knows though.

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post #110 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 07:59 PM
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Forgive me as I haven’t read through the entire thread, but has a zone count for the various sizes been determined yet?
Ive read at some point the 55" has 40 zones and the 85" has 72.

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post #111 of 214 Old 05-22-2018, 08:00 PM
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Ive read at some point the 55" has 40 zones and the 85" has 72.

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... and the 75" should have 60 zones

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post #112 of 214 Old 05-23-2018, 12:57 AM
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I will say this also. Zones count is a bit overrated. More zones doesn't automatically make a TV better. Sony's X1 extreme chip and processing is just as important.

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post #113 of 214 Old 05-23-2018, 07:22 AM
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I will say this also. Zones count is a bit overrated. More zones doesn't automatically make a TV better. Sony's X1 extreme chip and processing is just as important.

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I generally agree and I think zone counts are over rated, but I do wish the 85" for its size considering it only has 32 more zones than the 55" had more zones considering the huge per inch percent increase between those sizes. It would have helped a lot and I would gladly pay more.
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post #114 of 214 Old 05-23-2018, 07:30 AM
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I generally agree and I think zone counts are over rated, but I do wish the 85" for its size considering it only has 32 more zones than the 55" had more zones considering the huge per inch percent increase between those sizes. It would have helped a lot and I would gladly pay more.
I agree and can understand that. Makes perfect sense.

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post #115 of 214 Old 05-23-2018, 10:04 AM
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First, this review is fantastic. It provides plenty of technical detail, but also focuses on the overall UX, which is just as important as raw specs.

Secondly, this review really makes me want one, and the 85" model would be great for a home theater to compete with a larger, but not as bright front projection setup. It seems like the best TV out there that's not insanely expensive.
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post #116 of 214 Old 05-23-2018, 10:59 PM
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Just FYI, Sony released a DV update in Europe.
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post #117 of 214 Old 05-24-2018, 04:45 AM
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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post
imagic,

Great, great review on the 900f but I went to my local BB a few week's ago and took one look at it I said no thank's. Maybe that's partly because I already own the excellent 900e I dont know. But I took one look at those "Feet" and that was one big turn off. Now I know it should have nothing to do with the stand it should come down to PQ but those "Feet" are just ugly. I also looked at the PQ and to be honest it didnt look that much better then my 900e and my wife said she couldnt tell the difference at all. The 900f is a nice tv that has the upgraded Extreme Processor and will be DV ready but it aint enough for me to dump my 900e. HOWEVER.....if I would have missed out on the 900e, which thank god I didnt because I love the tv, the 900f would have been bought by me no matter how laughable the stand looks to me because again it's a great tv and a worthy successor to the 900e. So for those who missed out on the 900e they will be pleased I believe with the 900f. That being said if I had my choice between either the 900e or the 900f it would be the 900e by a mile with me but maybe I'm being biased lol. But again great great review.

For those basing your decision on viewing the 900f at Best Buy, please do not be discouraged! I did extensive research and came to the conclusion that this TV would be better in my situation than a 77" LG OLED C8. Now that I have the 85" 900F I am EXTREMELY pleased with my decision. I also looked at all the TV's at best buy and frankly the 900F appeared to have the worst picture of all of them, even worse than a couple of years old Vizio models! It has something to do with the way they calibrate the TV's for retail display. In fact, there is a "Retail" setting on the tv config menu and I suspect this has something to do with it. I even made Best Buy change the disc to a better quality 4K source and yet the image remained overly saturated, extremely grainy, and just lacked impressiveness overall.



HOWEVER, now that I have the 85" 900f installed at home I could not be happier! Everything I read about this set or imagined is leaps and bounds beyond what I could have hoped for. Seriously, when I am sitting at home watching this TV, it is extremely difficult to imagine a better image quality! I am sure if I had an LD OLED next to it, the difference would be noticeable, but by how much, I am not sure. The colors and vivid imagery are absolutely insane! I noticed no lag whatsoever when playing PS4 games nor did I notice any judder or degradation resulting from motion. Sure the on screen menus are not the most strategically efficient and the remote is a bit clunky but who cares?!?! I am enjoying a 85" display that is amongst the best picture quality available in the world today. Seriously folks, this is one amazing piece of technology.



Zones schmones, with the x1 processor and all the other features, the last thing most of us would be thinking about when enjoying this beautiful display is how many zones we are looking at. I didn't experience any problematic deterioration from off-center viewing as well.



So glad I didn't go with the OLED77C8PUA. That one is coming out at $10K, but even if it were priced the same as the 85" 900F, it would still be a difficult decision. The image quality is superb and to see it so accurately displayed on the 85" size screen is simply breathtaking.

Main: Sony X900F 85" LED, Denon AVRX7200WA, Klipsh RC64II, RF7II (x2), CDT5650 C II (x8), PSA 15V Sub, RSL Speedwoofer 10S Sub
Home Gym: AVR3312CI, RC62II , RF62 II (x2), Polk RC80i (x2), R112SW Sub, Panasonic 65" Plasma
Zone #2 (Lanai): Denon HEOS Amp, Polk RC80i (x2), LG 43" LED DJ Studio: Event PS8's
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post #118 of 214 Old 05-24-2018, 04:45 AM
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Great Real World review!
I have the 900E in my bedroom and because of good it is, I've decided to get the 900F for my living room.
I'm happy that this review confirms my decision.
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post #119 of 214 Old 05-24-2018, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Scarriere View Post
Great Real World review!
I have the 900E in my bedroom and because of good it is, I've decided to get the 900F for my living room.
I'm happy that this review confirms my decision.
And what size are we thinking? 85 inch!

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post #120 of 214 Old 05-24-2018, 05:22 AM
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And what size are we thinking? 85 inch!

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75" is first choice. 65" may be reality.
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