Official Sony Master Series Z9F 75/65” Owners Thread (2018/2019) - Page 169 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5041 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 01:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by New_to_4K View Post
Does the black bars on this tv became grey?
No, the black bar on mine are darker than the frame. This is the kind of nonsense that is perpetuated on the internet about this TV
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post #5042 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 01:52 PM
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This display is remarkably free of DSE. Maybe your YouTube tests are flawed.
My first set seemed that way (didn't see anything but had a scratch on screen). This was exchange with floor model and I do feel like this isn't as clean. I will take some pictures when I get back home. Not sure if it shows up in pictures or not.
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post #5043 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 04:05 PM
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No, the black bar on mine are darker than the frame. This is the kind of nonsense that is perpetuated on the internet about this TV
Thanks. I saw it on a shootout video, the bars were greyish whereas the Q9FN were black. I currently have the A9F but interested in a 75” LCD and if the contrast is decent, this tv seems to meet my other requirements.
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post #5044 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 04:17 PM
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Reading some user experience here makes this set seems more interesting than the reviews that I read months ago. Completely different. Here I was looking at Q90 / 950G whereas the Z9F could have been the underdog.

Sony 65 A9F, LG 65 E9
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post #5045 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 04:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by New_to_4K View Post
Thanks. I saw it on a shootout video, the bars were greyish whereas the Q9FN were black. I currently have the A9F but interested in a 75” LCD and if the contrast is decent, this tv seems to meet my other requirements.
Cant speak to the shoot out. I have reviewed this set and now own one. I compared it 3 times once with a professional calibrator against the QFN at 3 different Best Buys.

The difference was compelling with the Z9F have significantly better detail, blacks, motion brightness and color. Off angle was significantly better. It wasnt even close in 3 comparisons. After a month with the set I'm blown away by the picture quality. One underrated feature is the upscaling. Sony is reputed to have the best upscalers in the market so 1080 material looks fantastic. Some times I have to look closely to make sure it's not 4K

This TV has been trashed for no reason. I'm looking at it right now (Fox) and am amazed
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post #5046 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 04:41 PM
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Source?


Big enough and it would put this TV back in contention for my 75" purchase.
My Sony price sheet. It’s a big drop can’t say much else I’m sure someone will say soon.

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post #5047 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by agincourt View Post
Cant speak to the shoot out. I have reviewed this set and now own one. I compared it 3 times once with a professional calibrator against the QFN at 3 different Best Buys.

The difference was compelling with the Z9F have significantly better detail, blacks, motion brightness and color. Off angle was significantly better. It wasnt even close in 3 comparisons. After a month with the set I'm blown away by the picture quality. One underrated feature is the upscaling. Sony is reputed to have the best upscalers in the market so 1080 material looks fantastic. Some times I have to look closely to make sure it's not 4K

This TV has been trashed for no reason. I'm looking at it right now (Fox) and am amazed
Got it. Noticed that on my A9F too. 1080p looks 4K. The reason I went with A9F was the shadow details that I was having trouble with my previous OLED. I have avoided Z9F due to all the hate it received. Owners seems to love it.
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Got it. Noticed that on my A9F too. 1080p looks 4K. The reason I went with A9F was the shadow details that I was having trouble with my previous OLED. I have avoided Z9F due to all the hate it received. Owners seems to love it.
Most Best Buys have the Z9F right next to the Sammy QFN9 playing the same material. It's easy to see the difference between the 2 set. I paid extra to buy the Sony and wouldnt have done that if the Sony werent better (considering I'm a Samsung guy and just helped my daughter buy a low end Samsung).

If the critics hate the Z9F then they need to tell us what's better
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post #5049 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 05:07 PM
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My Sony price sheet. It’s a big drop can’t say much else I’m sure someone will say soon.
Great news for me! Interested in 75”
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post #5050 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 06:27 PM
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Quick question - with Local Dimming on medium, I still run into very occasional situations where starfields (completely black background with quite small stars) dim down more than they should (still visible, but the stars aren't nearly as bright as they should be). The only solution I've found is to temporarily turn the Local Dimming to Low for that scene. I'm assuming that's the only thing a person can do for this issue? (I'd also assume this is something all FALD TV's occasionally do - this is my first, so I just want to make sure there's nothing I'm missing.) Thanks!
Yes this is the one area where Q9FN actually fares better in some instances, especially small lights against not complete black, a star field wouldn't work but very small light in a night city will look better than ZF9. Besides that, it's mostly the limited amount of dimming zones, X-wide and relatively low native contrast that I guess Sony decided to do it this way so to avoid blooming, but at least it doesn't crush dark details like the Q9FN on complete black background. I don't like it but it's what it is.
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post #5051 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 08:54 PM
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Yes this is the one area where Q9FN actually fares better in some instances, especially small lights against not complete black, a star field wouldn't work but very small light in a night city will look better than ZF9. Besides that, it's mostly the limited amount of dimming zones, X-wide and relatively low native contrast that I guess Sony decided to do it this way so to avoid blooming, but at least it doesn't crush dark details like the Q9FN on complete black background. I don't like it but it's what it is.
Thanks for the info. I've only noticed it a few times while owning this TV (mostly episodes of The Orville, which is a bit like a modern Star Trek: The Next Generation). While not ideal, given that it's only happened a few times, I don't mind watching affected scenes at a Local Dimming setting of Low and then turning it back up to Medium. I really haven't noticed it in the vast majority of content.

Re the black bars, it's going to depend a bit on settings and environment (whether you have a bias light, etc.). It's true they're lighter than OLED in some situations (others, honestly, I can't tell much of a difference), but I'm more than happy with their performance. In HDR you are going to see some lightening of them if really bright objects are right next to them. But it's completely acceptable and actually quite good in everything I've watched so far (to be fair, though, I've watched more SDR and full-screen HDR than HDR with black bars so far since owning it, although I have watched a bit of the latter with no complaints). For me (and I'm only speaking personally), mentality comes into play too. I've found just accepting the possibility of them getting lighter if bright spots are next to them, thinking about it similarly to ambient light extending the picture like some bias light systems do, has made it easier for me to not worry about them. It's similar to how if you go OLED, you have to accept risk of burn-in and that some blacks are likely crushed. There's no perfect display yet, and trying to find one leads to a lot more frustration than figuring out what minor limitations you can live with and accept and going with the best TV that doesn't have any major ones. For me, that was the Z9F, and I'm happy with my choice. (If that still doesn't ease your mind, looking up footage of old rear-projection televisions also helps =oP. ^.^).
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post #5052 of 6555 Old 04-10-2019, 09:02 PM
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Watching Avengers Infinity Wars from Netflix. Very impressed with scaling and motion handling. It looks really good for 1080 upscale. For the motion was trying to figure out if original is 24 FPS original or ~60 FPS. If this is 24 FPS with motion smoothing then I am very impressed, no soap opera effect.
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Watching Avengers Infinity Wars from Netflix. Very impressed with scaling and motion handling. It looks really good for 1080 upscale. For the motion was trying to figure out if original is 24 FPS original or ~60 FPS. If this is 24 FPS with motion smoothing then I am very impressed, no soap opera effect.
I just got a new toy (HDFury Vertex) to help me figure out various signals for things. Unfortunately, since the Netflix App is built in, I can't get data from that, BUT when switched to match range and framerate on AppleTV, when I play Avengers: Infinity War on Netflix, I get:

23.973 frames 4:4:4 Chroma BT709 8-bit SDR

It should be very similar with the internal app.

And yes, the motion handling on this TV is great. =)
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I went from an 65" LG B6 OLED to the 75" Sony Z9F. I def like the Sony Z9F better but I just can't shake the feeling that I got ripped off. Most scenes look amazing. Far better than most anything else I've seen in the wild. But, then you see some unacceptable blooming. I used to have a Vizio Reference Series and have seen a Z9D in the wild so I've witnessed what is possible. I think LED TVs with FALD, large zone count, and Quantum Dots can be better than OLED. I want the best possible LED TV with Dolby Vision, FALD, & Quantum Dots. I feel like I'm going to have to shell out for the 85" Sony Z9G or I'll never be satisfied.
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I went from an 65" LG B6 OLED to the 75" Sony Z9F. I def like the Sony Z9F better but I just can't shake the feeling that I got ripped off. Most scenes look amazing. Far better than most anything else I've seen in the wild. But, then you see some unacceptable blooming. I used to have a Vizio Reference Series and have seen a Z9D in the wild so I've witnessed what is possible. I think LED TVs with FALD, large zone count, and Quantum Dots can be better than OLED. I want the best possible LED TV with Dolby Vision, FALD, & Quantum Dots. I feel like I'm going to have to shell out for the 85" Sony Z9G or I'll never be satisfied.
Keep in mind the G will have the same X-Wide Viewing Angle technology that can result in blooming with the F. It should have some more zones and a few others bells and whistles (including 8K support), but until there are more reviews and hands-on owners, nobody knows if it will still have any issues in that regard. The new Samsungs that are coming out were rumored to have an X-Wide layer that was better than Sony's in that regard, but those people seem to be anecdotally having some elevated blacks as well as their own issues like dimming anomalies. That said, the 85G looks like a killer set, and if you have the space (~75" is max for my space, so that made that decision easy), I don't think it's a mistake; it should be a great TV. But I do think if you're expecting ANY TV to be perfect, especially as the prices go up, you'll be disappointed in the end. From my research and the criteria you list (especially considering you want Dolby Vision), I think the the Z9F is still the best available option for its size, with the G fitting that category for bigger sizes, robust reviews pending.
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post #5056 of 6555 Old 04-11-2019, 05:22 AM
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Keep in mind the G will have the same X-Wide Viewing Angle technology that can result in blooming with the F. It should have some more zones and a few others bells and whistles (including 8K support), but until there are more reviews and hands-on owners, nobody knows if it will still have any issues in that regard. The new Samsungs that are coming out were rumored to have an X-Wide layer that was better than Sony's in that regard, but those people seem to be anecdotally having some elevated blacks as well as their own issues like dimming anomalies. That said, the 85G looks like a killer set, and if you have the space (~75" is max for my space, so that made that decision easy), I don't think it's a mistake; it should be a great TV. But I do think if you're expecting ANY TV to be perfect, especially as the prices go up, you'll be disappointed in the end. From my research and the criteria you list (especially considering you want Dolby Vision), I think the the Z9F is still the best available option for its size, with the G fitting that category for bigger sizes, robust reviews pending.
It also has the return of Backlight Master Drive. IMHO, the Z9F has 3 issues: X-Wide Angle, low zone count, and lack of Backlight Master Drive. We know they're bringing back BMD. I'm praying the zone count will be higher due to their "20x" contrast marketing, which I think is actually pretty accurate having seen the Z9D (16x) and the Z9F (12x). I'm completely guessing but I don't think BMD alone can go from 12x to 20x. There has to be a significantly higher zone count.
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Originally Posted by Justin Patel View Post
I went from an 65" LG B6 OLED to the 75" Sony Z9F. I def like the Sony Z9F better but I just can't shake the feeling that I got ripped off. Most scenes look amazing. Far better than most anything else I've seen in the wild. But, then you see some unacceptable blooming. I used to have a Vizio Reference Series and have seen a Z9D in the wild so I've witnessed what is possible. I think LED TVs with FALD, large zone count, and Quantum Dots can be better than OLED. I want the best possible LED TV with Dolby Vision, FALD, & Quantum Dots. I feel like I'm going to have to shell out for the 85" Sony Z9G or I'll never be satisfied.

I'm considering the Z9F once its price drops along with several OLEDs. It seems that the degree of blooming on the Z9F is quite controversial; professional reviewers claim it is significant, some owners admit blooming is visible but that it is a reasonable trade-off given all the strengths of the set (I feel the same about my x930e), whereas others claim that there is virtually no visible blooming and cinema bars remain black. I am trying to find a store to view the Z9F in a decent environment, but it has not been easy.
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I'm considering the Z9F once its price drops along with several OLEDs. It seems that the degree of blooming on the Z9F is quite controversial; professional reviewers claim it is significant, some owners admit blooming is visible but that it is a reasonable trade-off given all the strengths of the set (I feel the same about my x930e), whereas others claim that there is virtually no visible blooming and cinema bars remain black. I am trying to find a store to view the Z9F in a decent environment, but it has not been easy.
Maybe Best Buy will come to Dallas someday
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post #5059 of 6555 Old 04-11-2019, 06:58 AM
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Maybe Best Buy will come to Dallas someday

Wow, what a novel idea! The 75" is not on display anywhere and the 65" is on display at a single store in DFW, which is not close to where I live.
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post #5060 of 6555 Old 04-11-2019, 07:28 AM
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Snagged a floor demo 65z9f at BB for a ridiculous $1301.99. I couldn't believe it, just the day before it was $1854. Not sure when I will have it delivered, due to busy schedule, but I had to jump on it at that price. Check your BB as they are all shedding their floor model Z9Fs
That is a crazy low price, you do not have to think twice about that........Even if you where worried about open box, that is what extended warranties are for
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Wow, what a novel idea! The 75" is not on display anywhere and the 65" is on display at a single store in DFW, which is not close to where I live.
You never mentioned size
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post #5062 of 6555 Old 04-11-2019, 07:56 AM
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Wow, what a novel idea! The 75" is not on display anywhere and the 65" is on display at a single store in DFW, which is not close to where I live.

The 65" isn't on display within an hour of me and it would be a three hour drive to see a 75", so I understand your pain.


The BB site does have open box 65" listed down to $1301 on the site but none within 250 miles of me, and nothing for the 75" at all. I guess we will see what the overall drop is that was mentioned a few posts back.

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The 75" is not on display anywhere and the 65" is on display at a single store in DFW, which is not close to where I live.
The Nebraska Furniture Mart website indicates they have a 65" and 75" Z9F on display at their Dallas store. The KC store's TV area is partially light controlled, so it's at least better than a Best Buy floor. I'll probably stop back in to compare their Z9F against the 2019 models, like the X950G.

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New Review

Saw this today. Generally positive, nothing new.




https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/...-hd-tv-review/
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post #5065 of 6555 Old 04-11-2019, 09:47 PM
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It also has the return of Backlight Master Drive. IMHO, the Z9F has 3 issues: X-Wide Angle, low zone count, and lack of Backlight Master Drive. We know they're bringing back BMD. I'm praying the zone count will be higher due to their "20x" contrast marketing, which I think is actually pretty accurate having seen the Z9D (16x) and the Z9F (12x). I'm completely guessing but I don't think BMD alone can go from 12x to 20x. There has to be a significantly higher zone count.
True - I'll be curious about how BMD affects it with the new layer. It'll be interesting to watch. I think if you have the space, it'll be an awesome set if you do upgrade. Given the 75" Z9F has more zones than the 65", it's not unreasonable to think the larger sizes will have even more.
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Originally Posted by alluringreality View Post
The Nebraska Furniture Mart website indicates they have a 65" and 75" Z9F on display at their Dallas store. The KC store's TV area is partially light controlled, so it's at least better than a Best Buy floor. I'll probably stop back in to compare their Z9F against the 2019 models, like the X950G.

Thanks, I noticed this as well. The viewing environment at NFM is certainly better than at Best Buy and it opportunity to compare the 65" and 75" will be worthwhile.
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post #5067 of 6555 Old 04-12-2019, 07:36 AM
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Thanks, I noticed this as well. The viewing environment at NFM is certainly better than at Best Buy and it opportunity to compare the 65" and 75" will be worthwhile.
Definitely let us know your thoughts.


Still waiting to see this new pricing scheme.

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post #5068 of 6555 Old 04-12-2019, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin Patel View Post
It also has the return of Backlight Master Drive. IMHO, the Z9F has 3 issues: X-Wide Angle, low zone count, and lack of Backlight Master Drive. We know they're bringing back BMD. I'm praying the zone count will be higher due to their "20x" contrast marketing, which I think is actually pretty accurate having seen the Z9D (16x) and the Z9F (12x). I'm completely guessing but I don't think BMD alone can go from 12x to 20x. There has to be a significantly higher zone count.
It's my opinion that the X-Wide layer is what causes the blooming that can be seen in some scenes. I also think that zone count is more important than BMD.

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post #5069 of 6555 Old 04-12-2019, 09:29 AM
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It's my opinion that the X-Wide layer is what causes the blooming that can be seen in some scenes. I also think that zone count is more important than BMD.
You are probably correct about the X-Wide imapct. The BMD will by default have significantly more zones...it has to based upon it's design with the narrowly focused beam it has to have more zones in order to fully illuminate the screen. I would be very surprised if the 85" Z9G has less than 1000 zones.
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Living room: Sony XBR75X950G, Denon x4500, and Sony UBP-X800M2
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post #5070 of 6555 Old 04-12-2019, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by bluemoon737 View Post
You are probably correct about the X-Wide imapct. The BMD will by default have significantly more zones...it has to based upon it's design with the narrowly focused beam it has to have more zones in order to fully illuminate the screen. I would be very surprised if the 85" Z9G has less than 1000 zones.
It might have more LEDs than normal due to the focused beams, but I don't think that dictates the zone count. More LEDs do mean the posibility of more zones for sure and if they use the same mindset as the Z9D then yea I could see there being 1000ish zones.
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2018 Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio M50-E1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Marantz SR6013, AppleTV-4K, XBox One & (X), NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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