Official Sony Master Series Z9F 75/65” Owners Thread (2018/2019) - Page 180 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5371 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ayeroff View Post
Well, that's disappointing. But thanks for letting me know.


Does anyone happen to know if there's a way to program a Harmony remote to switch picture-modes when a different source activity is selected? For example, if I were watching a movie, and select the Playstation Activity on the Harmony, could there be a way for the Harmony to change the inputs on the Receiver AND change the TV to a different picture-mode?
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Originally Posted by sgupta View Post
There's no way to do it with the the TV itself unfortunately, but IF you happen to have a Harmony remote (One here [previous was 880 and I'd forgotten]), there is a way to program a Macro into it to do this. (I do it for Game mode). It's a bit of a pain to set up, but once it's done it works quite well.
A Harmony macro may or may not work. Depending on what model you have, there is a limit to the number of commands that a macro can contain. In order to change the picture mode, you must program the keystrokes to open the Action Menu, scroll down and select Picture Adjustments, scroll through the list of picture modes until you get to the one you want, and then select it. The success of the Macro depends on starting from the same spot in the picture mode list, or the Macro will take you to a wrong place.

I have tried to create complex macros like this, but run into the maximum command limitation every time. @sgupta , if you have a macro that works reliably 100% of the time, please share it with us.
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post #5372 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
A Harmony macro may or may not work. Depending on what model you have, there is a limit to the number of commands that a macro can contain. In order to change the picture mode, you must program the keystrokes to open the Action Menu, scroll down and select Picture Adjustments, scroll through the list of picture modes until you get to the one you want, and then select it. The success of the Macro depends on starting from the same spot in the picture mode list, or the Macro will take you to a wrong place.

I have tried to create complex macros like this, but run into the maximum command limitation every time. @sgupta , if you have a macro that works reliably 100% of the time, please share it with us.
The one caveat I've found (which never really happens with my use) is, as you've said, if you happen to be on a different selection in the "Action Menu", everything will be wrong. (For example, if you've used the Picture Off mode, the highlight will stay on that until the next input change, etc.) It resets to the top (Picture-in-Picture highlighted) with every input change as far as I can tell (and also when going to things like Picture Adjustments, it tends to go back to the top), and I change inputs a lot, so in practice, this is rarely if ever a problem for me. If you're in that menu on something else frequently, the best workaround would be always to go back in and move it to Picture-in-Picture and pressing back so the menu is always set there. So your frequency as far as running into this limitation may depend on how you use the TV.

It's also true you can't be changing picture modes manually for this to work well as you have to stay on the last picture mode harmony sets, but since I use Harmony to change picture mode based on every activity, that's not an issue for me either.

I tend to watch the macro do its thing just to make sure it all executes right (only takes a couple seconds; it's much faster than the one on my last LG where I had to have a 1s delay after every single command). I use this daily though, and I rarely have any errors. I haven't had any issues with command limitation happening either for what it's worth.

NOTE: As noted earlier, my macro is now in the post a few replies ago, just so nobody misses it.

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post #5373 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 08:14 PM
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Well, for me this is all moot—I never change picture modes (except for the automated switch to HDR picture mode, of course). I am not a gamer, so I have no need for any other picture mode than the one I have calibrated.

If you can get a Harmony macro to work reliably, congratulations. But the first time a macro goes haywire, I would stop using it.
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post #5374 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Well, for me this is all moot—I never change picture modes (except for the automated switch to HDR picture mode, of course). I am not a gamer, so I have no need for any other picture mode than the one I have calibrated.

If you can get a Harmony macro to work reliably, congratulations. But the first time a macro goes haywire, I would stop using it.
It works reliably, but like any series of commands, there are always a few limitations. If the remote is not pointed enough at the TV, settings have been manually changed without switching back, etc., it won't work properly. Aside from that, though, there's really no reason for it to go haywire. Anytime it hasn't worked as expected (which is very rare), it's been my fault for one reason or another, not the commands. =oP
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post #5375 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 08:58 PM
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That would work. I'll give it a try when I get home, however when I was looking around for it in Australia we only have Digital or Analogue, when I choose digital there is no choice for the rest, it just asks if I want to run a channel scan????
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Are you talking about hiding channels that you don’t want to appear in the list? If yes, then go into Settings/Channels/Channel Setup/Cable-Antenna/ and select Show/Hide Channels.

Otherwise, I am not familiar with the term “Favorites List”.

So I did all this and it worked to some extent, but basically it did not do exactly what I am looking for. Basically I am wanting to set it up so that when I use the up down arrows for channels that they jump in the channel order I desire.


For example if I am on channel 7 and press up it goes to 70HD then 72 and then all the other "7 family" of channels. but what I would like it to do is go from 7 to 9 then 10, 22 etc. Basically an order I decide upon, without having to go through the grouping of numerical channels. I hope this makes sense?


Thanks
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post #5376 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 09:08 PM
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If you “hide” the channels you don’t want to land on, they won’t be selected. Did you go though and hide the unwanted channels?
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post #5377 of 6160 Old 05-19-2019, 09:54 PM
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If you “hide” the channels you don’t want to land on, they won’t be selected. Did you go though and hide the unwanted channels?

Yes I did that and as I said it works to some extent, but it doesn't when for example I want to keep 7 but have it come up after 3 and before 9. As it is it goes 7, 70, 72 etc. It still keeps the same channel families together. Really what I want to do is group all the SD channels and then all the HD channels.
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post #5378 of 6160 Old 05-20-2019, 06:32 AM
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Yes I did that and as I said it works to some extent, but it doesn't when for example I want to keep 7 but have it come up after 3 and before 9. As it is it goes 7, 70, 72 etc. It still keeps the same channel families together. Really what I want to do is group all the SD channels and then all the HD channels.
Sorry, I just can’t picture what your issue is. For example, in my area I have channels 24, 24.1, 24.2, 36, 36.1, and 36.2. 24 and 36 are the standard definition channels (which I don’t care to view), 24.1 and 36.1 are the primary digital channels, and 24.2 and 36.2 are alternate programming digital channels (also don’t interest me). I hide 24, 36, 24.2 and 36.2. So when I tune in the channels, it displays only 24.1 and 36.1, the digital channels I want to receive.

In my example, if you wanted to display 24, then 36, then 24.1 and finally 36.1, this is not possible, the channels would always be displayed in numerically ascending order.
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post #5379 of 6160 Old 05-20-2019, 07:39 AM
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This whole situation with programming macros to change picture settings is a prime example of trying to use technology to make life more difficult.

When I got my ZF9 and decided to upgrade my whole system I had flashbacks to setting up my Harmony remote. I didn't want to go through that stress again so went for a One4All that operates 8 devices. It works great and it takes me 3 seconds to change the picture setting from Custom to Game, for example.

Sometimes simpler is better...
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post #5380 of 6160 Old 05-20-2019, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by leamingtonspacem View Post
This whole situation with programming macros to change picture settings is a prime example of trying to use technology to make life more difficult.

When I got my ZF9 and decided to upgrade my whole system I had flashbacks to setting up my Harmony remote. I didn't want to go through that stress again so went for a One4All that operates 8 devices. It works great and it takes me 3 seconds to change the picture setting from Custom to Game, for example.

Sometimes simpler is better...
Is your point that the One4All is easier to program?
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post #5381 of 6160 Old 05-20-2019, 09:26 AM
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Hi,

Could anyone kindly point me in the direction of some calibration settings for the 65" Z9F? I believe professional calibration is out of my budget, and this TV has more settings than my computer and car combined. Any tips?

I'm definitely in the "set it and leave it camp," so I'm looking for general settings.. or perhaps two "profiles" (if that's a thing) that I could easily switch back-and-forth between, depending on content.

In (decreasing) order of frequency, I... play FPS games on the PS4, stream TV shows, stream HD movies, watch OTA and stream'd football, watch Blu-rays, and watch OTA TV (PBS and news lol).

Thanks!
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Are you looking for general picture settings, or actual calibration-type numbers (ie. RGB offsets)?
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General picture settings have been discussed here in detail. White balance settings vary from set to set, and require a meter and software to establish a display’s unique settings. The OP would not benefit from using someone else’s white balance settings.
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Right - I was just asking to try to establish, but completely agreed re white balance (which I haven't touched for those reasons anyways). I guess most settings have been talked about quite a lot, but I'm happy to provide where I'm at with current general settings if he's curious (by DM or here, whichever).
Sincere apologies for my incorrect terminology before. I said "calibration settings" while I should have said "picture settings." Actual calibration is something I leave to the pros, and while I'm sure it would make a difference, I'm going to stay with the factory calibration for now since pro calibration is outside of my current scope of interest / budget. But yes, @sgupta , general picture settings and advice is exactly what I am seeking! I know that there are some tips and things to consider, especially regarding the picture, motion, and smoothness options. I'm not a fan of the soap opera effect, but I do want smooth motion, and so I'm lost right now as I don't even know what some of these settings are! ha. I would go back through the thread to find this information, but the thread is nearly 200 pages long, so that would take me quite some time. I was hoping someone could point me at the correct post or page, perhaps. Thanks!

Last night I finally got the set up and running on the new feet. At first, I was afraid that the size wasn't going to be enough, and to be honest, I still would love a 75" (I hope I don't have buyer's remorse there, lol). That said, the picture is pretty awesome, and the size increase (coming from my 51") is noticeable. For the first minute or so I had to get used to the larger screen. Still, I'm not *super* thrilled with the PQ, but I think that's just because I honestly had no idea what to expect out of a 4K TV. If I try to be fair, I suppose I should be happy with the fact that this 65" 4K screen has the same *effective* PQ that my 51" 720p screen had at the same distance. In other words, I now have a much larger screen, and it looks just as good.. whereas if I simply upgrade my screen size without upgrading the resolution, it would obviously have looked horrible. Again, though, I expected a bit more, so I'm slightly underwhelmed. I believe, though, that the issue here in my situation is that I'm not viewing any native 4K content. Still, everyone said that all decent TVs today could upscale 1080p content very well (which is what I'm viewing), and that this TV up-scales the best, so I guess I was expecting too much? =/ It's frustrating because I simply have nothing to compare it to. Seeing sets in the store is pointless... and I have no friends with decent 4K sets to compare to heh. Such is life, I suppose.

OK, so... one thing that I've noticed so far that I wasn't happy with was motion. Especially in a long panning shot, for example, I'm having an issue where it will be relatively smooth, but then kind of "judder" for a second, then be smooth again, over and over. I hope this makes sense.. I've seen this phenomenon before in a review but I cannot remember what they called it or how to fix it. Any tips for mitigating/correcting this?

Also, here are the other topics that I wanted to ask you guys about after watching for a while and a giving it a very quick thorough look-over:

- In certain light - I believe it was with a black screen during a show that was paused.. so I imagine the back-light was on, but the image was black - I noticed a hazy swirl that covered nearly the entire screen. I wonder if this is part of the X Wide layer, or some layer, because the swirls all ended at a certain point (line) near each side of the screen (left and right), but the swirling did go all of the way to the top and bottom. I don't know how else to describe the swirl other than it was like if you put oil into water and then swirled the oil around in the water with your finger. The 2D image of what the oil/water mixture would look like from above is what my screen looks like in this certain situation of having a black screen paused and then looking closely at my screen from an angle.

- I also noticed that there is a distinct vertical line in the panel, in the very center. I also did notice some vertical banding all over, but only in test videos, and even then it was pretty minor. It's definitely nothing I'm worried about at all for real-world use. That said, this one vertical line in the center can be noticeable even during normal use if you're thinking about it. Not a huge deal, but I wondered what you guys think about this?

- Brightness adjustment. Out of the box, the set was on 35 brightness. I've turned this down to 25 and it is still very bright compared to my last set. Anyway, my question is about the brightness scale. When I adjust the brightness, the actual brightness doesn't seem to change that much. Is this something you guys have also noticed? The difference between the lowest setting and the highest just wasn't all that great. On my plasma, it is super dim at the lowest setting while very bright at its highest. However, it's like the Sony just cannot go very dim at all. Is this possibly due to the picture "mode" that I am in? Just seemed odd to me is all... and I want to make sure that nothing is wrong with my set!

- Okay, this is probably the biggest point I'd like some feedback on, because this is what I noticed the most and is most surprising and disappointing to me. Now, again, I am not viewing actual 4K content, but everything I'm viewing is up-scaled 1080p signal from a PS4 (non-Pro). Anyway, while most images look really great, there are two things I'm seeing that I'm not loving.
1) I'm getting a lot of noise and graininess, mostly in backgrounds. It's odd to me that I only see this in background areas. But there is definitely a lot of, what I believe is called noise, and general graininess in some areas.
2) Soft, fuzzy borders, especially with text. Large text, or "photos of text" such as a movie title in an odd font, etc. can sometimes look great and sharp. However, when there is small text, just normal "words" such as on PS4 screens or menus, etc., sometimes the text is just very soft and fuzzy looking and, well, not as sharp as I'd expect from an UHD, or even HD screen. It's weird because some text is sharp, some images are sharp.. but then sometimes everything looks very soft and almost washed out. Could it simply be the content? I notice this most while gaming during the menus, screens, etc. It kind of seems like it's most noticeable when there is a 3D situation, such as when an object is in the foreground. Often the object's "borders" seem so fuzzy and washed out that the image almost doesn't seem 3D but rather 2D... it really affects the depth of field. Again, perhaps this is just the game/PS4? I never noticed this before on my last TV, though. Thoughts?

Finally, I just want to end on a good note. Many people might not like this feature, but I'm enjoying the HDR effect that is apparently applied to all content in most of the picture modes. So far I've just been using game mode (I'm told that this mode has better input lag, can anyone confirm that?), and I noticed that certain light colored objects are super bright. I was doing some reading and read that it's due to the Sony processing. As I have no native HDR content to view, it's pretty sweet in my eyes, heh. I can't wait to actually watch a 4K Bluray one of these days! Disappointed to learn that the Sony PS4 Pro doesn't have a 4K Bluray player... so I'm not sure when I'll have the chance to actually view a 4K Bluray lol.

I know that this is a super long post and I really appreciate your time and help!!

Thanks,
John

Sony MASTER Series | harman/kardon AVR | Klipsch Reference Premiere | KEF UniQ | PlayStation | Mohu Leaf | Hue Play | MediaLight | logitech Harmony | CyberPower PFC UPS

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post #5382 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 02:08 AM
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I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.

I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.

I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.

The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.

So my questions are

1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?
2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.
3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?

Thanks for any input you can provide.
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post #5383 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by p3trol_h3ad View Post
Sincere apologies for my incorrect terminology before. I said "calibration settings" while I should have said "picture settings." Actual calibration is something I leave to the pros, and while I'm sure it would make a difference, I'm going to stay with the factory calibration for now since pro calibration is outside of my current scope of interest / budget. But yes, @sgupta , general picture settings and advice is exactly what I am seeking! I know that there are some tips and things to consider, especially regarding the picture, motion, and smoothness options. I'm not a fan of the soap opera effect, but I do want smooth motion, and so I'm lost right now as I don't even know what some of these settings are! ha. I would go back through the thread to find this information, but the thread is nearly 200 pages long, so that would take me quite some time. I was hoping someone could point me at the correct post or page, perhaps. Thanks!
Since you asked p3trol_h3ad, I'll sum up my current settings below on the 75". I thought about DMing but figured it might be useful for others, so I'll just keep it to one post and put it in-thread. Settings are a very subjective thing, so I'm just listing MY recommendations based on my own experience and understanding, with my personal goal as getting things very accurate color-wise but pleasing to the eyes with a few small divergences (like SDR brightness). Please nobody take this as criticism of YOUR settings if you're using something else.


Custom SDR, which is the setting I use the most. Assume all Default settings to start:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Brightness is 10 even though I'm in a fairly dark room with bias light. I tried Light Sensor On at Max Brightness but it was still a bit too dim for me. 10 is brighter than reference, but I find it works well in a dark or bright room without giving me headaches, and it has enough pop for me. 10 is also what RTINGS recommends for around ~200 nits (on the 65"). Reports here seem to have it somewhere between the 150-200 nits as well on the 75", but I can't test actual nits directly.

* Contrast (90) & Black Level (50) are at default, but I did boost Gamma to 0. I like a bit more shadow detail, and accordings to RTINGS, this should be the right setting for 2.2. (If you prefer the dimensionality of 2.4, the -2 default should be fine, but it's a little too dark for me personally.)

* Black Adjust and Adv. Contrast Enhancer are left to Off. Auto Local Dimming I kept at Medium. There isn't a big difference between Medium and High, but I felt Medium is safer for not eliminating small details. (Even then, very rarely I'll find individual stars in a starfield in a show like The Orville dim a bit more than I'd like - usually it's a reasonable compromise for the extra blacks, but Low in those situations will resolve that if it bothers you).

* X-Tended Dynamic Range should be set to Off. Initially, I thought I liked this, but it turned out really messing up colors in certain content, though it wasn't immediately noticeable. The best place to see this is on things like the PS4 menu. Reds especially become flat and yellows just look off to me. As explained way earlier to me in the thread, XDR artifically extends color range in SDR to be more like HDR, but it can cause things to look unnatural as there's not a way to do this particularly accurately. So for accuracy sate, the best setting is Off.

* Color (50) and Hue (0) should remain at default, with Expert 1 Color Temperature and Live Color Off.

* Sharpness (50) is left at default. I turn Reality Creation Off, but if you like some artificial sharpening, it could be left at default. Random noise reduction and Digital noise reduction I also turn Off, but since you feel the picture is noisy sometimes, you could experiment with these. I leave Smooth Gradation at Low as this can clean up some banding.

* Motionflow I personally keep Off as I prefer to see only the intended frames without any generated ones. This does lead to judder at times, but I find I prefer my brain doing the smoothing over artificial frames. Since you said you want smooth motion but without soap opera effect, I would recommend trying a Smoothness of 1 or 2 and seeing which you prefer. Clearness is up to you; it won't introduce artifacts, but you will need to bump Brightness a few notches to compensate for the black frames inserted; I'd try 1 to see if you like it. I personally don't like the image duplication I see with it, and it can give somepeople headaches, but a low level of Smoothness and Clearness can look quite good during pans if that's what you're looking for. Cinemotion I leave set to Auto, as my understanding is this setting looks for anything done with the signal and undoes it to preserve the original intended cadence as best as possible.

* HDR mode, HDMI Video Range, and Color Space should all be set to Auto.


Custom HDR is the exact same settings as for SDR above, except:
---------------------------------------------------------------
* Brightness is Max and should stay that way since tone-mapping takes care of not being overly bright.

* X-Tended Dynamic Range should be set to High for HDR. XDR works differently in HDR and properly expands the dynamic range (without altering colors the way it does in SDR) to use all the tone-mapping capabilities of the TV. [Unlike the others, this setting is independent for SDR and HDR and will save accordingly, so you don't have to worry about changing it in one carrying over to the other].


Dolby Vision Dark is the same as Custom HDR, except:
----------------------------------------------------
* Along with Max Brightness, Contrast is higher (Max) by default than other modes (including HDR) and should be left there.

* Smooth gradation should be set to Off, as based on some reports, it can lose detail in some Dolby Vision scenes.


Game Mode SDR is what I use for all consoles and should use the same settings as Custom SDR, with the following exceptions:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Color by default is 55. Technically, 50 would be fine here as well, but I left it at the default 55 to give a bit of the game mode pop without much distortion to colors.

* I can't remember if Live Color was on by default for Game Mode, but I turned this Off personally. If you like a little extra pop (at the cost of accuracy), you could play with this, though.

* Not a change from my Custom SDR recommendations, but I've noticed Low Smooth Gradation is pretty important here and makes a big improvement in some scenes (for example, without it, Breath of the Wild on Switch shows a lot of banding in the menus).

* Not a change from my Custom SDR recommendations, but I was having a very tough time with colors at first on all my games when I first got the TV. Turned out the cuplrit was the X-tended Dynamic Range. Having it on (which I believe is the default) quite radically altered my reds, yellows, and other colors in a way I found very unpleasant. Once I figured this out, there was an immediate sigh of relief when I turned it off and everything instantly looked much better to me.


Game Mode HDR is the same as Game Mode SDR with the following exceptions:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Again, Brightness is correctly Max by default for HDR.

* X-Tended Dynamic Range is High for HDR. Again, it works completely differently in HDR than SDR, so none of the SDR drawbacks mentioned above apply here.


Netflix Calibrated Mode as well as Apps should use the same settings as above, depending on sourse (SDR, HDR, Dolby Vision Dark, etc.).


To answer some of your other questions:

* The "swirl" you're speaking of sounds like what happens with reflections on this TV, and I think it is some light source reflecting. It does have to do with the X-Wide Angle Viewing layer. I'd see if you can try to pinpoint the source of that reflection; there's not much else you can do about it besides trying to eliminate the reflection light source.

* I have NOT examined my screen closely. To be honest, I prefer not to know about things like dead pixels, etc., if I can't see them during normal usage. That said, I haven't noticed any vertical line down the center of my screen, nor do I recall any reports of it from anyone else. It might be worth bringing up to either Sony or your retailer to see if it's normal.

* Brightness on a Sony is different than Brightness on most TV's and is actually Backlight. This can be set according to preference - it's not supposed to affect the rest of the image settings as the backlight should evenly change brightness of everything on the screen, preserving the amount of light difference between the darkest and brightest elements. Reference for SDR bright white is supposed to be 100 nits in a completely black room, but some people calibrate to 120 instead. I had a VERY tough time finding the right brightness when I first got the TV. RTINGS, which also bases it on your 65" size, found that a setting of 2 was about 100 nits in a dark room while a setting of 10 was 200 nits and suitable for a medium-lit room. A lot of users here have brightnesses ranging between 4 and 8. 25 would still be eye-searing as I tried to get used to higher brightnesses too. An alternate strategy would be to adjust Brightness to either 35 or Max and turn the Light Sensor on, which will adjust the TV to ambient lighting. This works well, but was still a touch too dark for my liking. I ended up at 10 on my 75", even for a dark room, which should be in the neighborhood of 150-200 nits and feels approximate to my old OLED in most situations (though the brights are still brighter). That's above reference, but after trying to get used to the dimmer settings, I just still prefer it a bit brighter. All that said, I find the difference between lowest brightness and highest brightness to be HUGE, so I really am a bit confused where you're coming from there [EDIT: I think I figured it out - see immediately below]. The brightness differenetial is definitely most noticeable on a bright white screen or colorful (ie. bright yellow) ad. On a dimmer scene, it doesn't seem as drastic.

* Another thing to consider (and why I think *I* had such a problem with this TV's brightness at first) is both Plasmas and OLED have something called ABL, Automatic Brightness Limiting. They can't handle a large, bright-white screen, for example, at full brightness, so they automatically dim down in those situations. What this means is, you can have an overall very bright picture, but it won't seem nearly as bright when it goes to a really bright full-screen image because that image must dim down in order to display properly. My two previous TV's were Plasma, then OLED, so I got very used to that. When I got this TV, everything just looked different, because the bright white full screens are REALLY FRIGGIN' BRIGHT since dimming them is no longer needed! What you may begin to notice is that certain things, like white shirts or larger white lights, are brighter in general than they used to be, even if the rest of the picture is the same or dimmer than you're used to. IMO, this is because we're relearning to see the image as it's actually mastered to be seen as opposed to the brighter darker scenes and dimmer brighter scenes we've gotten used to because of the auto-dimming technology used on our old TV's. It's actually a positive for the Sony, but it can feel like a negative until you get used to it. Start looking for these changes in content you're familiar with and hopefully you'll get what I mean.

* Regarding the noise you're seeing on the PS4, the first thing I'd do is make sure Enhanced HDMI is on for the TV. You can get there by (using the TV remote) going to Home -> Settings (Gear Icon in upper right) -> External Inputs -> HDMI Signal Format. Set whatever HDMI your PS4 is plugged into to Enhanced Format. After that, I'd go into the Display Settings for the PS4 and make sure everything is set to Auto. Once you're sure that's not the problem, you could play around with Random Noise Reduction and Digital Noise Reduction, though I'm not sure why they *should* be necessary. Cranking up Reality Creation or trying Auto for that could also potentially help (I can't recall for sure if it's available for Game Mode, but I *think* it is). One other possibility to consider - this is a much bigger screen than you're used to. It could just be that the blown up size is revealing more of the source limitations than you were able to see previously.

* Yes, you should only game in Game Mode for the best TV performance as those modes have dramatically better input lag. Most other modes will add quite a lot of lag. That's also why Motionflow Smoothness is disabled in game mode - it would add too much input lag.

* I'm not sure what you mean by HDR Effect, as that isn't really a part of most modes, unless you're talking about X-Tended Dynamic Range. Again, I personally would recommend this Off for all SDR content and games (but High for all HDR). That said, if it looks better to your eyes with it on, more power to you. You could also be seeing the +5 (over the 50 default in other modes) to Color, which is default for game mode and I also tend to like. Or you could be seeing Live Color on a setting other than Off. Any of those can add pop, but at the cost of accuracy.

Sorry for the delay in response - I needed some time to doulbe check these settings and type this all up. =) I hope some of it is helpful to you!
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post #5384 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by leamingtonspacem View Post
This whole situation with programming macros to change picture settings is a prime example of trying to use technology to make life more difficult.

When I got my ZF9 and decided to upgrade my whole system I had flashbacks to setting up my Harmony remote. I didn't want to go through that stress again so went for a One4All that operates 8 devices. It works great and it takes me 3 seconds to change the picture setting from Custom to Game, for example.

Sometimes simpler is better...
I mean, it depends. Certainly, there's not a thing wrong with your method, and I can understand why some people prefer it, especially depending on their setup. I have 7 different sources of input + my receiver connected to my TV, and for me, the Harmony makes life MUCH easier than a One4All remote ever could. Those remotes are great for what they do but also have limitations and less flexibility for some setups. I can assure you that for me, the technology makes everything much faster and less difficult than it would be without it. It does take initial setup time and ironing out quirks in the beginning to get there, but once it's all set and working, it's worth it for me. That's the great thing about having different options though.

That said, this particular macro only took me maybe 20-30 minutes max to set up with my Harmony for the Z9F and is something that works great and that I use daily. [It took longer to figure out the first time with my previous LG TV, but now that I'm familiar with how to script these things, it's not really a big issue.] Like I said previously, the Z9F is actually a big improvement over my previous TV as the macro is much quicker this time around.
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post #5385 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 02:53 AM
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I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.

I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.

I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.

The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.

So my questions are

1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?
2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.
3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?

Thanks for any input you can provide.
I can't comment too much as they both seem like great TV's and I'm not too familiar with the 950G. That said, regarding #3 , aside from occasional WiFi drops (solved by a TV reboot) a few people have had, there don't seem to be too many consistent issues with these TV's that I've seen as I've been following this thread for a while. It actually seemed to release really polished.

Z9F reviews weren't bad, but I do think real-world users tend to have a more positive impression than reviewers. Initial reviewers seemed to have a tough time evaluating contrast with the new X-Wide-Viewing layer as well (which I believe was the first of its kind)!

Love my Z9F, so I'd probably stick with this, and prices have fallen quite a bit from initial price as well. That said, you should enjoy either, and I wish you luck whichever way you go!
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I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.



I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.



I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.



The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.



So my questions are



1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?

2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.

3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?



Thanks for any input you can provide.
I don't see any reason not to get the Z9F over the 950g.
More dimming zones, higher brightness in HDR and SDR, virtually no DSE, a bit more color gamut/volume.

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post #5387 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 04:17 AM
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I don't see any reason not to get the Z9F over the 950g.
More dimming zones, higher brightness in HDR and SDR, virtually no DSE, a bit more color gamut/volume.

Sent from my LG-H932 using Tapatalk
This is a great point. For HDR, the higher brightness the better. I can't believe how much more I'm enjoying HDR on this TV over my OLED (where some stuff was near-unwatchable). Now, I'm sure both the 950G and Z9F have GOOD HDR, but based on my experiences, when it comes to HDR, it truly is the brighter the better. Some of the HDR I've seen (Detroit: Become Human [game] and Thor: Ragnarok [movie]) have blown my mind!
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Originally Posted by unicronic View Post
I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.

I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.

I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.

The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.

So my questions are

1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?
2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.
3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?

Thanks for any input you can provide.
Technology wise ZF9 is better in every way. ZF9 vs XG950 boils down to prise but I would pick ZF9 any day of the week due to the higher dimming zone count which will help with blooming and contrast as well as having a higher HDR peak brightness. Be aware that the 55” version of XG950 does not employ the X-Wide angle filter.

Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75") | PC > TV > miniDSP 2x4 HD > XTZ EDGE A2-300 > SVS Ultra Towers + XTZ 10.17 EDGE.
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post #5389 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by unicronic View Post
I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.

I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.

I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.

The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.

So my questions are

1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?
2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.
3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?

Thanks for any input you can provide.
What size(s) are you looking at? For many, the X Wide layer is a negative of the 65" Z9F, while the 65" X950G does not have that layer (IIRC). If you're considering 75" models, they each have the layer. Personally, the layer doesn't bother me, but it might make a noticeable difference to some.

IMO, the Z9F is just a nicer TV, period. It weighs a lot more, which usually says something. This is probably mostly due to the fact that it has more dimming zones than the X950G, which allows it to control blacks and blooming more. Finally, it's a Master Series set, so I believe that means more care was put into its calibration by Sony. The finish on the TV is a bit nicer, such as the feet and the back of the set, but that may or may not matter to you.

Hmm, other than that, they both have the X1 Ultimate, they both have four full-bandwidth HDMI ports, and I believe they're both IMAX Enhanced? But yes, the Z9F does get brighter, which is definitely a plus both HDR as well as life-span.

The Z9F is definitely a better set, but whether or not the "slight?" picture quality increase is worth an additional $1000 is up to you, sir. Good luck with your decision!

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post #5390 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 11:05 AM
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Spoiler!
You, sir, are very kind and helpful. I thank you greatly for taking your time to write all of this!

Most of what you've said makes great sense and definitely helps me on my way. I'll touch on a few specific things here...

1. HDMI Enhanced. I'm aware of what you're referring to here. However, I did not change my ports to enhanced. Since I only have a regular PS4 and not a PS4 Pro, which, further, is passing through my 1080p AVR, does it matter if the port is set to enhanced or not? I suppose if setting it to enhanced has no negatives, why wouldn't I? But I wonder why they even give you the option, personally...

2. Last night I went ahead and reduced the backlight to 10, and now it's definitely more in line to what I'm used to. To be clear, though, I'm definitely not complaining about the brightness! You're absolutely spot on, though, when you talked about how bright full-screen white images can be. At first, whenever a screen such as that came on, my girlfriend would turn away, ha! I definitely really like the fact that the set will take a bright area, such as a white logo, and brighten it up more than it's surroundings. You're right, that's something that my plasma never did, and I'm quite enjoying it!

3. I read that the "forced HDR effect" was undefeatable on the TV, but I believe that was actually some erroneous reporting I stumbled across. I think you're right in that I'm noticing the XDR effect. I believe mine is set to medium, which I kind of like. That said, I am noticing that colors seem washed out a bit, and now I'm wondering if this XDR is the culprit. I'll definitely mess with this setting and see what's going on. Thanks for the tip!

4. The "Swirl." I really wish I could take a photo of what I'm describing. I will try to tonight. I cannot see the swirl at all from normal viewing distance, so it's not a complaint, but rather I just want to make sure that this is a normal part of the screen and that I don't have a lemon or damaged unit. I don't think it's really a reflection of a light source because I have no lights anywhere except for the bias light behind the set. The swirl covers nearly the entire scree (the middle 75% or so) and you can only see the swirl when there is a black image on the screen and the backlight is on. I think (hope) that this is from some layer in the screen, especially because I feel like if it was an irregularity, or damage, then the "edge" of the swirly section wouldn't be so defined at both the left and right extremes.

5. Brightness level. I'll try looking at this again, and this time I'll be sure to pause the content on a bright colored screen before I adjust the brightness for observation. I may have been looking at this when I was paused on a dim scene, which would explain why I didn't notice a huge variation in brightness.

All this said, other than just trying to iron out my settings and ensure that I have a good, undamaged unit, I'm thoroughly enjoying the new TV! Overall, it's bright, large, usually detailed, and the motion is (nearly always) excellent without me even messing with settings much! The general fuzziness and lack of defined edges is the only thing that kind of bothers me, but I do believe that it is just a product of my source material. To be fair, everything I've seen on the TV is through my 1080p PS4 and 1080p AVR. Hopefully, though, working with the various settings can help mitigate this some in the end.

I keep forgetting that I can even see actual 4K content by using the "Smart Apps," because I've never had a smart TV, don't like smart TV's, and prefer to not connect my TV to my network. But I guess I'll have to get over my general old man crotchityness and hook this puppy up to the 'net so that I can see how good it really can (does) look.

Thanks again!
J

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What size(s) are you looking at? For many, the X Wide layer is a negative of the 65" Z9F, while the 65" X950G does not have that layer (IIRC). If you're considering 75" models, they each have the layer. Personally, the layer doesn't bother me, but it might make a noticeable difference to some.

IMO, the Z9F is just a nicer TV, period. It weighs a lot more, which usually says something. This is probably mostly due to the fact that it has more dimming zones than the X950G, which allows it to control blacks and blooming more. Finally, it's a Master Series set, so I believe that means more care was put into its calibration by Sony. The finish on the TV is a bit nicer, such as the feet and the back of the set, but that may or may not matter to you.

Hmm, other than that, they both have the X1 Ultimate, they both have four full-bandwidth HDMI ports, and I believe they're both IMAX Enhanced? But yes, the Z9F does get brighter, which is definitely a plus both HDR as well as life-span.

The Z9F is definitely a better set, but whether or not the "slight?" picture quality increase is worth an additional $1000 is up to you, sir. Good luck with your decision!
65 inches for either.

ZF9 is around 20% cheaper than the X950G for me.
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post #5392 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 11:12 AM
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65 inches for either.

ZF9 is around 20% cheaper than the X950G for me.

If the ZF9 is cheaper, you should already be in here as an owner commenting on your television and not asking questions...

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post #5393 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 11:16 AM
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Amen. I'm totally jealous of the non-US consumers right now. Get the ZF9 before it's sold out and you're kicking yourself! Here in the US, the same thing just happened with the ZD9/Z9D. I believe Sony is re-arranging their model structure and this odd pricing situation is just part of that.

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post #5394 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 11:48 AM
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65 inches for either.

ZF9 is around 20% cheaper than the X950G for me.

If the ZF9 is cheaper, you should already be in here as an owner commenting on your television and not asking questions...
Well I just wrapped up an international relocation and am waiting to move to my own place. No space for a new TV until I move, until then plenty of time to do some research.
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post #5395 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 12:25 PM
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Well I just wrapped up an international relocation and am waiting to move to my own place. No space for a new TV until I move, until then plenty of time to do some research.

My point still stands as to the choice between those two, especially when the Z is a lesser cost. The only reason to choose the 950G over the Z9F (barring an aversion to the X-Wide tech) would be the value of savings for the 'lesser' 950G. That consideration is already alleviated for you.


Hope the relocation is a positive experience for you.

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65 inches for either.

ZF9 is around 20% cheaper than the X950G for me.
You should go pick up the Z9F before they change there mind.......
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post #5397 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 04:16 PM
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I wanted to get some feedback from Z9F owners.

I'm in the market for a new TV and while I can afford OLED I experienced burn-in (mild only but still) and would like a TV with eARC due to complex sound considerations.

I've pretty much narrowed it down to this or the 950g.

The two TVs on paper seems very similar with the Z9F now becoming a fair bit cheaper with the 2019 range now out/incoming.

So my questions are

1. If you could choose between these two which would you go for?
2. The Z9F seems to get decent reviews but not too many are mind-blowing whereas the 900f and 950g seem to review very positively. I'm guessing the Z9F was initially reviewed at a much higher price than the 900f/950g launched at.
3. Are there any recurring common issues with Z9F that have been ironed in the 2019 range?

Thanks for any input you can provide.
Z9F all the way! It’s substantially better than the 900F and I would take it over the lower spec 950G without a second thought, especially at a lower price.

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4. The "Swirl." I really wish I could take a photo of what I'm describing. I will try to tonight. I cannot see the swirl at all from normal viewing distance, so it's not a complaint, but rather I just want to make sure that this is a normal part of the screen and that I don't have a lemon or damaged unit. I don't think it's really a reflection of a light source because I have no lights anywhere except for the bias light behind the set. The swirl covers nearly the entire scree (the middle 75% or so) and you can only see the swirl when there is a black image on the screen and the backlight is on. I think (hope) that this is from some layer in the screen, especially because I feel like if it was an irregularity, or damage, then the "edge" of the swirly section wouldn't be so defined at both the left and right extremes.







Thanks again!

J
Are you seeing this when you pause on an internal app? If so that's because the Local Dimming disables when paused.

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post #5399 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 06:50 PM
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You, sir, are very kind and helpful. I thank you greatly for taking your time to write all of this!
I'm very glad to help! It actually took quite a lot of time to adjust to this TV and "get settled" because like you, I was coming from some different technology and used to ABL. This is also the first TV of ANY type where I couldn't just use default out-of-the-box brightness with the Light Sensor Off.

1. Regarding HDMI Enhanced, a few things here. First, the regular PS4, from what I can find, CAN do HDR, even though it can't do 4K. So that means you'll definitely want to use Enhanced. The AVR may actually be the limiting factor here. You'll want to check with the manufacturer if your model can pass through HDR. If it can't, it might be in your best interest to hook the PS4 directly to the TV and use ARC (if possible) on the receiver (or optical could be another option, depending on your setup). At any rate, no, it shouldn't hurt anything to set it to Enhanced and see if it makes a difference. I suspect the reason Enhanced vs. Standard is an option is to troubleshoot compatibility with older devices, but I'm not certain of that.

2. Glad the Brightness (Backlight) tip helped you out. It kind of blew my mind when I realized the brightness on this type of TV reflected what the image was actually "supposed" to look like and how much my 2016 OLED was dimming down those things. I never actively *noticed* the dimming, so I honestly had no idea things were ever dimmer than intended. (And yeah, on higher brightnesses, this TV will melt your skull clean off. =oP)

3. Yeah, the "forced HDR effect" that's undefeatable doesn't seem to be true. I'd still recommend experimenting in various PS4 menus and content with XDR Off (to me, it feels a lot more natural and "right", but your mileage may vary). Personally, I noticed XDR the most with reds, which somehow seemed muted with it on, and yellows, which seemed tinted more towards blue-greenish than they should be, when it was on. It was strange, because it wasn't totally obvious (and I'd even argue some scenes didn't shift colors preceptibly), but the whole picture just seemed wrong somehow in other situations, especially menu screens, and I couldn't figure out why - I had thought it was Color Temperature at the time. Turning XDR Off got me the colors in line with what I'm used to, and like I said, for me felt completely right as soon as I tried it. I'll be curious your results of playing with it.

4. Regarding the Swirl, it would be helpful to know what content you're seeing this on. As others mentioned, it could have something to do with apps turning off local dimming temporarily - I have seen a few possibly similar things in those cases, but it's very rare.

5. Yes, try adjusting on bright white. Ads are great for this.

Finally, yeah, I think you'll want to take advantage of the Smart Apps. (There's also a fairly recent TV software update you might want to snag.) YouTube has both 4K and HDR available via the TV (for free) - you can search for demo videos if you want to see the true capabilities of the TV; there are some astounding ones. If you do anything like Netflix, although a subscription, there's tons of 4K/Dolby Vision content on there, as long as your Internet connection can support those apps. Same with Amazon Prime.

Glad some of this info helped you, and good luck with your new TV!
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post #5400 of 6160 Old 05-21-2019, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Are you seeing this when you pause on an internal app? If so that's because the Local Dimming disables when paused.

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I was not familiar with what you were talking about, so I ran a quick test. I played a Dolby Vision video using the Netflix internal app. I paused the playback, and after 10 seconds, the video output was dimmed and the video title was superimposed on the screen. Resuming the video returned the output to normal brightness. However, I don’t think the output dimming was caused by the local dimming being turned off. I opened the picture settings menu, and toggling the local dimming had no effect on the screen while in pause. So I am not sure I agree with you as to the cause of what the OP was seeing.
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