Official Sony Master Series Z9F 75/65” Owners Thread (2018/2019) - Page 183 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5461 of 5712 Old 06-07-2019, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoelArt View Post
Interesting response on the measurement of screen contrast (ZF9) in the comment field form the reviewer:

The review



Note, that I used Google translate on the page and comments from german.
When measuring using the ANSI grid, the higher you set the brightness the higher the ratio. Also going full 100% white to full black will give you the large 40,000:1 numbers.

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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
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post #5462 of 5712 Old 06-08-2019, 11:22 AM
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I absolutely love my 75 Z9F and have had zero problems with mine
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post #5463 of 5712 Old 06-08-2019, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Cody Chesnutt View Post
I absolutely love my 75 Z9F and have had zero problems with mine
Same here!

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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5464 of 5712 Old 06-08-2019, 01:52 PM
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Ha! Just losing my sh|t a little. It's ok for OLED junkies to have, crushed shadow detail, banding, tinting, abl and posturization issues but it's still the best..... Just ask them. God forbid you have a little blooming in specific low APL scenes, specific reflection situations and it's the end of the world.

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That exchange was epic. Anyone know the bit processing for the Z9F? I know the Z9D has 14 bit processing.

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post #5465 of 5712 Old 06-10-2019, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
That exchange was epic. Anyone know the bit processing for the Z9F? I know the Z9D has 14 bit processing.

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It is not just a little blooming though on the 65 at-least. The blooming is awful and pointed out by guests unasked. I also have a strange orange chin effect(IE a lot of people on regular COX HD have weird orange chins on this set but not my others) that I need to explore further.

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post #5466 of 5712 Old 06-11-2019, 02:01 PM
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Is the 65inch Z9F still more expensive than X90F in USA?
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post #5467 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 06:10 AM
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Is the 65inch Z9F still more expensive than X90F in USA?
By a considerable amount, yes, unless you can find one at a BB that was a display. Then they are cheaper.

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post #5468 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 03:02 PM
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Yes they're nearly twice the price. Not worth it IMO even though it is certainly a better set in all regards (except X Wide Angle where it's a personal preference).

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post #5469 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 03:35 PM
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What do you guys use for brightness/backlight settings?

Is the light sensor worth a dang? I usually stay away from light sensors because they never seem to work well. They seem to lag behind and only work in an incremental manner from my experience, but I'm hoping the one on this set is worthy. On that note, does anyone know where it is located? I'd like to use my hand to trick it so that I can witness its effectiveness.

I watch in what I would call a dim room. There is one window but we have black blinds and a thick curtain, both of which stay closed for the most part. During the day, the amount of light that filters through is perfect for our preference. At night I use a bias light. Honestly though, since the room is so small (10x11 ft.), and the TV so bright, the set creates so much light itself, I don't know how much the bias light even matters.

Anyway, I started on 10, then moved to 8. Then I decided to try using the light sensor with backlight set to MAX. It was too dang bright! Now I'm using the light sensor with backlight set to 40, but I'm just worried that the sensor wont accurately adjust output with changing ambient lighting (sunlight, bias light, pitch black, etc.)

This is all SDR content, by the way. I still haven't seen any HDR lol. We are moving this weekend so I've held off on rearranging the equipment. Next week I will have the PS4 connected directly to the TV so that I can finally see what HDR is all about!

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post #5470 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 03:57 PM
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Congrats to Z9F voted best LCD/LED display. Congrats to the owners
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post #5471 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p3trol_h3ad View Post
What do you guys use for brightness/backlight settings?

Is the light sensor worth a dang? I usually stay away from light sensors because they never seem to work well. They seem to lag behind and only work in an incremental manner from my experience, but I'm hoping the one on this set is worthy. On that note, does anyone know where it is located? I'd like to use my hand to trick it so that I can witness its effectiveness.

I watch in what I would call a dim room. There is one window but we have black blinds and a thick curtain, both of which stay closed for the most part. During the day, the amount of light that filters through is perfect for our preference. At night I use a bias light. Honestly though, since the room is so small (10x11 ft.), and the TV so bright, the set creates so much light itself, I don't know how much the bias light even matters.

Anyway, I started on 10, then moved to 8. Then I decided to try using the light sensor with backlight set to MAX. It was too dang bright! Now I'm using the light sensor with backlight set to 40, but I'm just worried that the sensor wont accurately adjust output with changing ambient lighting (sunlight, bias light, pitch black, etc.)

This is all SDR content, by the way. I still haven't seen any HDR lol. We are moving this weekend so I've held off on rearranging the equipment. Next week I will have the PS4 connected directly to the TV so that I can finally see what HDR is all about!
I use the light sensor most of the time and I think it works great together with the default brightness of 35 in my environment between day and night cycles. I do how ever use different brightness settings depending on the content I'm watching, some are too dark so I need to turn of the sensor and max out the brightness, but it's really down to the color grading of that movie. When gaming I often use sensor and max brightness or play without it.

I've also noticed it depends on whether I'm coming home from a bright day in to my shaded room or if I'm coming home late night as my eyes are then more or less accustomed to a certain brightness. Lastly it even depends on my bodys day and night cycle as I've noticed my light sensitivity changes a bit.
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Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75")
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post #5472 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 07:01 PM
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I use the sensor but on max brightness so in a dark room it measures 115 nits.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5473 of 5712 Old 06-12-2019, 09:54 PM
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Congrats to Z9F voted best LCD/LED display. Congrats to the owners
Who gave out the reward?

Last edited by Mike Lang; 06-13-2019 at 07:12 AM.
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post #5474 of 5712 Old 06-13-2019, 01:55 PM
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https://www.*********************/up...sults_copy.pdf Value Electronics

Z9F vs. Q90R, I suppose those are the top two LED 4K available. Interestingly they used 65" versions for testing. Guess it's good there was no judgement for contrast/blooming lol.

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post #5475 of 5712 Old 06-13-2019, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by p3trol_h3ad View Post
https://www.*********************/up...sults_copy.pdf Value Electronics



Z9F vs. Q90R, I suppose those are the top two LED 4K available. Interestingly they used 65" versions for testing. Guess it's good there was no judgement for contrast/blooming lol.
That was part of the dynamic contrast.

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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5476 of 5712 Old 06-13-2019, 08:31 PM
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I am so amazed at the difference between the 65" and 75".

I will also say this; I decided to perform a factory reset then recalibrated and now my basic PM settings have changed. I can now leave XDR on high for HDR along with LD set to high and ACE is off. I use to have Ace on low and XDR on Med for dark room viewing. I feel like there was an improvement done behind the scenes that did take until I rest the TV. Maybe because I was calibrated?

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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
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post #5477 of 5712 Old 06-14-2019, 01:56 AM
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Since this is a topic of discussion, I thought I'd post my findings for brightness output at various settings for SDR. This is a using 75" Z9F and C6 HDR2000 colorometer with CalMAN Home 2019 for Sony. Test pattern used is 100% brightness in a Constant APL 10 window (which should equate to about 10% of the screen size). This is using the 0.3067 x 0.318 whitepoint (close to Sony default) as well as D65 - there is some variation, but not a lot. Similarly, I played with Auto Local Dimming both On and Off as well as a 100% window to see how much these readings changed, and everything was within 1 brightness point. SINCE calibration recommends Local Dimming Off and a Contant APL 10 window, that's what I decided to use, so all these readings are using that. Greater than (>) denotes these are the settings that just go over the target brightness, whereas less than (<) denotes the setting just under target brightness.

>100 cd/m2 = 4
This is reference brightness for a very dark room. Interestingly, it's also the default Netflix Calibrated Mode uses. If you have a truly theater-esque setting, this might be appropriate, but I'd go brighter if you have much ambient light at all.

>120 cd/m2 = 6
A lot of calibrators seem to calibrate to this to give reference + a bit of extra headroom.

>150 cd/m2 = 8
Some users seem to target this as a good all-around setting for a dim room that sometimes has some daytime viewing. It's also the upper limit of Netflix's recommendations for semi-critical viewing.

>160 cd/m2 = 9
This is what I'm calibrating to at the moment. Quite a bit of extra headroom and the upper limit of Adobe RGB recommendations. Also sufficient for watching during daytime as long as the room isn't completely full of sun.

>200 cd/m2 = 13
I've seen certain publications recommend this one for a medium-to-bright room. I tried this for a while in a fairly dim room, and in certain situations it works, but is still eye-searing with the wrong ad or scene.

<250 cd/m2 = 16
This might be appropriate for a very, very bright room. It's the upper limit of Netflix's completely casual/non-critical viewing recommendation.

Last edited by sgupta; 06-15-2019 at 07:15 PM.
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post #5478 of 5712 Old 06-14-2019, 01:00 PM
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. SINCE calibration recommends Local Dimming Off and a Contant APL 10 window, that's what I decided to use, so all these readings are using that.
10% window not constant APL.

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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5479 of 5712 Old 06-14-2019, 01:57 PM
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10% window not constant APL.

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I'm going by this, which recommends Constant APL 10 for LCD's, though in all honesty, I don't see a difference between the two.

https://kb.portrait.com/help/calman-...ny-walkthrough

Thoughts?

Last edited by sgupta; 06-14-2019 at 04:29 PM.
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post #5480 of 5712 Old 06-14-2019, 03:23 PM
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I'm going by this, which recommends Consstant APL 10 for LCD's, though in all honesty, I don't see a difference between the two.



https://kb.portrait.com/help/calman-...ny-walkthrough



Thoughts?
Technically it doesn't matter with local dimming off. I didn't see that new guide so I'm gonna have to ask Tyler why specify constant APL 10%. Thanks for the link.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5481 of 5712 Old 06-14-2019, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupta View Post
I'm going by this, which recommends Consstant APL 10 for LCD's, though in all honesty, I don't see a difference between the two.

https://kb.portrait.com/help/calman-...ny-walkthrough



Thoughts?
Technically it doesn't matter with local dimming off. I didn't see that new guide so I'm gonna have to ask Tyler why specify constant APL 10%. Thanks for the link.

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I’m definitely curious as well. But yeah that makes sense re local dimming.
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post #5482 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 06:42 AM
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Yes they're nearly twice the price. Not worth it IMO even though it is certainly a better set in all regards (except X Wide Angle where it's a personal preference).
It is £200 less than XF90 in UK.
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post #5483 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 06:43 AM
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Does anyone have the 65inch and watch mostly in a dark room?
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post #5484 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 06:54 AM
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I can't comment too much as they both seem like great TV's and I'm not too familiar with the 950G. That said, regarding #3 , aside from occasional WiFi drops (solved by a TV reboot) a few people have had, there don't seem to be too many consistent issues with these TV's that I've seen as I've been following this thread for a while. It actually seemed to release really polished.

Z9F reviews weren't bad, but I do think real-world users tend to have a more positive impression than reviewers. Initial reviewers seemed to have a tough time evaluating contrast with the new X-Wide-Viewing layer as well (which I believe was the first of its kind)!

Love my Z9F, so I'd probably stick with this, and prices have fallen quite a bit from initial price as well. That said, you should enjoy either, and I wish you luck whichever way you go!
In Europe the Z9F has had terrible reviews for the contrast and hdr blooming issues. At £1,299 for 65inch it is still available.
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post #5485 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 09:39 AM
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Does anyone have the 65inch and watch mostly in a dark room?
I'm currently evaluating the 65 inch in my basement now before I decide if I send it back to bestbuy. I got it for $1300 so it's hard to complain. Pluses so far are it has a beautiful natural image, the x1 ultimate does a superb job with upscaling and it's a really nice gaming tv. Negatives so far - It's a tad bit more reflective than I would like, I can't seem to get my xbox one x to display a picture yet- it's hooked up through my Marantz receiver like my ps4 pro(which plays fine) it's probably a setting on the xbox. Last, I do notice some blooming in dark scenes and the black bars seem to fluctuate in Hdr. SDR black bars are fine. Problem is for me when you have 3 Oleds in house that stuff really sticks out. I love the screen size though for the basement. My alternative is to grab a 55A9f or C9 at best buy. I can't afford to go 65 inches on either right now. It is overall a very nice tv though.
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post #5486 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 09:54 AM
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Hey everyone, thought I'd ask here since everyone seems really knowledgeable,

I currently own a Sony 75 inch 940C. It's an older set at this point but its great. Mainly I use my TV for gaming and it's definitely been good. I play pretty much all types of games but mainly RPG's. Biggest reasons for wanting to upgrade mainly are the new processors in the TV that help with upscaling and color as well as wanting to decrease the weight of the tv (120 lbs with this beast) so I can reorganize my stand some,

I dont want to go any smaller than 75 inches and was looking at OLED but with the risk of burn in and it most definitely would happen due to HUD's, ive decided against it. So my question would be, how is the Z9F? I also saw the price of the Z9D and saw its significantly more expensive than it even though its an older TV. If I'm going to drop the case, I definitely want to get a decent upgrade. Ill be getting it calibrated ASAP either way professionally from Chad at Cleveland Plasma when he's available so I want to go for the best option if I make this purchase.

Thanks for any responses.
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post #5487 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 04:21 PM
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Hey everyone, thought I'd ask here since everyone seems really knowledgeable,



I currently own a Sony 75 inch 940C. It's an older set at this point but its great. Mainly I use my TV for gaming and it's definitely been good. I play pretty much all types of games but mainly RPG's. Biggest reasons for wanting to upgrade mainly are the new processors in the TV that help with upscaling and color as well as wanting to decrease the weight of the tv (120 lbs with this beast) so I can reorganize my stand some,



I dont want to go any smaller than 75 inches and was looking at OLED but with the risk of burn in and it most definitely would happen due to HUD's, ive decided against it. So my question would be, how is the Z9F? I also saw the price of the Z9D and saw its significantly more expensive than it even though its an older TV. If I'm going to drop the case, I definitely want to get a decent upgrade. Ill be getting it calibrated ASAP either way professionally from Chad at Cleveland Plasma when he's available so I want to go for the best option if I make this purchase.



Thanks for any responses.
Please be a bit more specific on what you want to know.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5488 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Soundizer17 View Post
In Europe the Z9F has had terrible reviews for the contrast and hdr blooming issues. At £1,299 for 65inch it is still available.
That's fair. I personally think those issues are overblown and stand by the statement that most owners actually like their sets quite well, but it's certainly true that X-Wide layer does increase blooming a bit in some situations. There also may be a difference between the 65" and 75" models based on some feedback. I find the contrast quite good on my 75" for most content. I still think at the time I purchased it, this was the best TV for me (and still probably is if I was making the decision today - at the current prices, I think it's a steal as well). It'll be interesting to see how the Z9G improves upon this, and I'll be watching new tech (mini/micro LED) going forward, but in the meantime, I'm greatly enjoying a really great TV with spectacularly bright HDR/Dolby Vision and no burn-in worries. Hopefully this'll last me until 12-bit mature 8K HDMI 2.1 panels with great brightness and near-perfect blacks as well as VRR and Dolby Vision/HDR10+ both, but that's a ways out, if it happens at all. =oP
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post #5489 of 5712 Old 06-15-2019, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Nocturne123 View Post
Hey everyone, thought I'd ask here since everyone seems really knowledgeable,

I currently own a Sony 75 inch 940C. It's an older set at this point but its great. Mainly I use my TV for gaming and it's definitely been good. I play pretty much all types of games but mainly RPG's. Biggest reasons for wanting to upgrade mainly are the new processors in the TV that help with upscaling and color as well as wanting to decrease the weight of the tv (120 lbs with this beast) so I can reorganize my stand some,

I dont want to go any smaller than 75 inches and was looking at OLED but with the risk of burn in and it most definitely would happen due to HUD's, ive decided against it. So my question would be, how is the Z9F? I also saw the price of the Z9D and saw its significantly more expensive than it even though its an older TV. If I'm going to drop the case, I definitely want to get a decent upgrade. Ill be getting it calibrated ASAP either way professionally from Chad at Cleveland Plasma when he's available so I want to go for the best option if I make this purchase.

Thanks for any responses.
Personally, I think it would be a good move. I'm a gamer too and moved up from an OLED because of burn-in it was getting. It's a great feeling not having to worry about it and I've been really enjoying the TV for gaming. The processor in these beasts are truly impressive.

Be aware there is some blooming in HDR content, but it's minor and isn't something that bothers me personally. It's worth it for the X-Wide-Viewing angles, incredibly bright and popping HDR, great colors, and good local dimming in general. Input lag for Game Mode is also decent, and you've got both HDR10 and Dolby Vision support. I think it's also at a really great price with that discount.

Your other choice might be something like the Samsung Q90 or Q900. Both the Samsungs and Sony have pros/cons. Samsung has a few things like Variable Refresh Rate support for games (albeit early) as well as HDR10+ (and on the latter early 8K support), but no eARC (at least on the Q90R) and no Dolby Vision on any of their panels. Also less blooming, but possibly more black crush or Dirty Screen Effect. Color reproduction out of the box is supposed to be a bit better on the Sony. Overall, I knew I wanted Dolby Vision as well as the better color reproduction and hopefully less chance of DSE, which is why I personally chose the Sony (instead of waiting for these panels to come out, which they weren't at the time, but I'd still make the same choice methinks).

Either way you go, good luck!
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post #5490 of 5712 Old 06-16-2019, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by sgupta View Post
That's fair. I personally think those issues are overblown and stand by the statement that most owners actually like their sets quite well, but it's certainly true that X-Wide layer does increase blooming a bit in some situations. There also may be a difference between the 65" and 75" models based on some feedback. I find the contrast quite good on my 75" for most content. I still think at the time I purchased it, this was the best TV for me (and still probably is if I was making the decision today - at the current prices, I think it's a steal as well). It'll be interesting to see how the Z9G improves upon this, and I'll be watching new tech (mini/micro LED) going forward, but in the meantime, I'm greatly enjoying a really great TV with spectacularly bright HDR/Dolby Vision and no burn-in worries. Hopefully this'll last me until 12-bit mature 8K HDMI 2.1 panels with great brightness and near-perfect blacks as well as VRR and Dolby Vision/HDR10+ both, but that's a ways out, if it happens at all. =oP
Perhaps the 75inch is much better due to more than double the dimming zones. Most positive people on this thread have the 75inch.

That is why i asked about the 65inch in a dark room?
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