2019 Sony XBR X950G Owners Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 44 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1291 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 11:19 AM
 
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Originally Posted by JD23 View Post
From what I've read, the Z9F is far less successful commercially than the Z9D, so the reduced zone count approach did not work in that case.
The D has been out for 2 years while the F has been out for a few months, so that might impact number of sales.

Secondly, many people on this forum have trashed the F without having ever owned one. I own one and it's the best LCD available (blows away the Samsung Q9fn and Sony 900F). Picture is fabulous with none of the blooming issues a few have reported. Best detail, motion and color. Bunch of wannabe calibrators have trashed a great set because that's what people do here

Last edited by agincourt; 03-20-2019 at 11:45 AM.
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post #1292 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 01:11 PM
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I was looking at doing that as I just got this TV, but the '4k hopper' doesn't offer any 4k channels. Only 4k streaming with netflix etc (which the built in apps on the TV work very well for that).

I have the same setup. Menu improvements, overall PQ, etc, all improved, especially HDMI. I'd get noise on my old boxes, which I attributed to HDMI handshakes with audible noise. All gone with the newere boxes. I did the upgrade last year mostly to get the newer hardware, menus, etc. And at least the boxes are 4k ready should someone get off their lazy A's, like HBO, SHO, etc. That's the issue with 4k in general. Nobody offers 4k channels, and Netflix doesn't even offer 4k discs. Content is the issue. At least on these newer 4k tv's, the upscaling is very good so makes watching cable programming much more enjoyable.
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post #1293 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by agincourt View Post
The D has been out for 2 years while the F has been out for a few months, so that might impact number of sales.

Secondly, many people on this forum have trashed the F without having ever owned one. I own one and it's the best LCD available (blows away the Samsung Q9fn and Sony 900F). Picture is fabulous with none of the blooming issues a few have reported. Best detail, motion and color. Bunch of wannabe calibrators have trashed a great set because that's what people do here
Noticed more in the last 6 months the forums have descended into a this vs. that mentality. A couple of years ago you could read 80% of the posts and actually glean some knowledge. Today it’s about 20%. Maybe the tech isn’t advancing fast enough to keep people positively minded.

About 15 months ago on another handle (password recovery never worked ) I got tired of the poor Sony DV Implenetation discussion and researched what exactly profile 5 for Sony TVs actually meant. I posted a lengthy response as gyates11 in the 930e channel. Seem to help people understand generally that discussion has died down.

Think a lot of the time most people just don’t comprehend something and therefore assume the worst.
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post #1294 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 01:51 PM
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Motion handling is critical to me. I'm actually returning a C8 due to motion issues.

It sounds like Sony is the way to go for me correct?

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post #1295 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 02:11 PM
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Review: Sony KD-75XG9505 (XG95-serie)


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post #1296 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 02:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by geoffo11 View Post
Noticed more in the last 6 months the forums have descended into a this vs. that mentality. A couple of years ago you could read 80% of the posts and actually glean some knowledge. Today it’s about 20%. Maybe the tech isn’t advancing fast enough to keep people positively minded.

About 15 months ago on another handle (password recovery never worked ) I got tired of the poor Sony DV Implenetation discussion and researched what exactly profile 5 for Sony TVs actually meant. I posted a lengthy response as gyates11 in the 930e channel. Seem to help people understand generally that discussion has died down.

Think a lot of the time most people just don’t comprehend something and therefore assume the worst.
I think there are a subset of people that get their kicks out of denigrating this set. Like the poster that constantly tells us that he can walk through Best Buy and see the blooming from across the store. Before I purchased, I viewed the set at 3 different Best Buys and one time in the company of a professional calibrator and educated Magnolia manager. They both said it was the best set for bright conditions and motion in the store and said they could see no blooming. In the 3 weeks I have owned mine I have seen zero blooming on everything from 480i to 4K. I'm sure that guy will be in soon to rip the Z9F.
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post #1297 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by geoffo11 View Post
Noticed more in the last 6 months the forums have descended into a this vs. that mentality. A couple of years ago you could read 80% of the posts and actually glean some knowledge. Today it’s about 20%. Maybe the tech isn’t advancing fast enough to keep people positively minded.

About 15 months ago on another handle (password recovery never worked ) I got tired of the poor Sony DV Implenetation discussion and researched what exactly profile 5 for Sony TVs actually meant. I posted a lengthy response as gyates11 in the 930e channel. Seem to help people understand generally that discussion has died down.

Think a lot of the time most people just don’t comprehend something and therefore assume the worst.
I disagree and feel the vs. mentality is very important. This is especially true when discussing similar models from the same maker or even higher end older models around the same price point if said models are still available for purchase. Uninformed buyers are able to make a better choice when buying a new TV. Of course, not just for TV's but almost any relevant item worth the time for research.
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post #1298 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by R3plicant View Post
I was looking at doing that as I just got this TV, but the '4k hopper' doesn't offer any 4k channels. Only 4k streaming with netflix etc (which the built in apps on the TV work very well for that).
Au contraire, the Hopper3 and Dish have a SMALL amount of 4K programming on channel 540 and subchannels. This week and next several of the March Madness games are in 4K HDR on 540-3. During the college football season there is at least 1 game a week in 4k. The networks are still working the bugs out of the 4k production chain and are using these games as test beds.

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post #1299 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 04:11 PM
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Has the NEtflix dolby vision and Gaming HDR improved in this tv? I remember reading about very low brightness for Netflix DV and HRD in games for 900f.
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post #1300 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 06:13 PM
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Lightbulb Motion Rate of X950G

Since no one was able to answer my question as to why the 900E kills the 950G in the motion category, I will explain why.
X900E has MotionFlow 960
X930E has MotionFlow 960
X900F has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
X850G has MotionFlow 960
X950G has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
Z9D has MotionFlow 1440
Z9F has X-Motion Clarity
A8G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A9G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A1E has MotionFlow no rate reported

It appears that MotionFlow performs better than X-Motion Clarity. Also, why are all the higher end models not moving on to X-Motion Clarity? Sony has started degrading motion quality beginning with the F line of TVs. And since the X850G will have MotionFlow 960, it will probably outperform the 950G in the motion category as well. SMH, time to order one of the few 930Es that are still in stock.
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post #1301 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 06:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post

It appears that MotionFlow performs better than X-Motion Clarity.
Why would you say that? Everyone that has compared the D to the F says that the motion on the Z9F is better. In fact they say that the motion on the Z9F is the best of any TV ever manufactured
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post #1302 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post
Since no one was able to answer my question as to why the 900E kills the 950G in the motion category, I will explain why.

X900E has MotionFlow 960

X930E has MotionFlow 960

X900F has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported

X850G has MotionFlow 960

X950G has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported

Z9D has MotionFlow 1440

Z9F has X-Motion Clarity

A8G has MotionFlow no rate reported

A9G has MotionFlow no rate reported

A1E has MotionFlow no rate reported



It appears that MotionFlow performs better than X-Motion Clarity. Also, why are all the higher end models not moving on to X-Motion Clarity? Sony has started degrading motion quality beginning with the F line of TVs. And since the X850G will have MotionFlow 960, it will probably outperform the 950G in the motion category as well. SMH, time to order one of the few 930Es that are still in stock.


Your above analysis is completely wrong the motion is not less, all the x-motion adds is the ability to do BFI without a loss in brightness all of the other motion settings are the same. Plus those numbers you’re citing only come into play with custom smoothness high cinemotion auto or smooth Motionflow and cinemotion auto.

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post #1303 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post
Since no one was able to answer my question as to why the 900E kills the 950G in the motion category, I will explain why.
X900E has MotionFlow 960
X930E has MotionFlow 960
X900F has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
X850G has MotionFlow 960
X950G has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
Z9D has MotionFlow 1440
Z9F has X-Motion Clarity
A8G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A9G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A1E has MotionFlow no rate reported

It appears that MotionFlow performs better than X-Motion Clarity. Also, why are all the higher end models not moving on to X-Motion Clarity? Sony has started degrading motion quality beginning with the F line of TVs. And since the X850G will have MotionFlow 960, it will probably outperform the 950G in the motion category as well. SMH, time to order one of the few 930Es that are still in stock.
Do you even know what X-Motion Clarity stands for? It is only possible on FALD sets (and only introduced on the 900F; technical/(marketing?) issues exclude it being added on the 900/940E afterwards) ...

The Polish review says the motion on the (75) XG is one of the sharpest they have ever seen, with Clearness and Smoothness on 2 or 3 (X-Motion is Clearness 1)
What settings are on both of yours? (and what sizes)

Motionflow rating for the 900F is 1200, haven't encountered for the 2019 models so far. For OLED's it was XR120 so far afaik (converted from euro spec XR100) ... Z9F is 1440 as well (or at least that's what I noted down, will have to check where I got it from; XR1200 in euro terms).
Edit: I started this reply before any others were made but I see two have been posted in the mean time (past midnight here so rest of 'fact checking' will be for 'tomorrow')

Last edited by mithras1; 03-20-2019 at 07:03 PM.
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post #1304 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 07:06 PM
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Your above analysis is completely wrong the motion is not less, all the x-motion adds is the ability to do BFI without a loss in brightness all of the other motion settings are the same. Plus those numbers you’re citing only come into play with custom smoothness high cinemotion auto or smooth Motionflow and cinemotion auto.
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Why would you say that? Everyone that has compared the D to the F says that the motion on the Z9F is better. In fact they say that the motion on the Z9F is the best of any TV ever manufactured
This is my point exactly. Some people prefer MotionFlow/Cinemotion while others like watching movies in 24Hz. Most of these panels have a native refresh rate of 120Hz. MotionFlow/Cinemotion allows you to run a fake 960Hz while using MotionFlow 960. X-Motion Clarity is not reporting any rate at all. For all we know, it could be the equivalent of MotionFlow 480. All I can tell you is that I have both sets side by side, I can watch the same video, and while doing this I can clearly see that the 900E handles motion better. I paid cash for my 950G and would be happy to tell you that the 950 is better than the 900e in every way. But if I told you this, I would be lying. The difference in these two sets is that the 900E has Motionflow "Smooth" & CineMotion "HIGH" presets. The 950 has MotionFlow Auto, Custom, OFF and Cinemotion Auto or Off. Believe me, I wish that the 950 handled motion better than the 900e and feel that Sony could improve motion handling via firmware updates as they have in the past.
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post #1305 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by mithras1 View Post
Do you even know what X-Motion Clarity stands for? It is only possible on FALD sets (and only introduced on the 900F; technical/(marketing?) issues exclude it being added on the 900/940E afterwards) ...

The Polish review says the motion on the (75) XG is one of the sharpest they have ever seen, with Clearness and Smoothness on 2 or 3 (X-Motion is Clearness 1)
What settings are on both of yours? (and what sizes)

Motionflow rating for the 900F is 1200, haven't encountered for the 2019 models so far. For OLED's it was XR120 so far afaik (converted from euro spec XR100) ... Z9F is 1440 as well (or at least that's what I noted down, will have to check where I got it from; XR1200 in euro terms).
Edit: I started this reply before any others were made but I see two have been posted in the mean time (past midnight here so rest of 'fact checking' will be for 'tomorrow')
Forgive me as I am not bashing the TV at all. I am a true Sony fan and refuse to buy any other brand unless I have to. The motion on the 950G is good but not the same excellence that my eyes got used to. If I were to score the 900E at 10/10, the 950G would be 8/10. Just believe me when I say that my eyes were a tad bit let down once I started watching my first movie. However, the 950G is miles better at being a gaming TV. That is the one thing that is saving this set from being refunded.
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post #1306 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by agincourt View Post
The D has been out for 2 years while the F has been out for a few months, so that might impact number of sales.

Secondly, many people on this forum have trashed the F without having ever owned one. I own one and it's the best LCD available (blows away the Samsung Q9fn and Sony 900F). Picture is fabulous with none of the blooming issues a few have reported. Best detail, motion and color. Bunch of wannabe calibrators have trashed a great set because that's what people do here

I am not commenting on the merits of the Z9F, only that it is selling at a lower rate than the Z9D.
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post #1307 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post
Since no one was able to answer my question as to why the 900E kills the 950G in the motion category, I will explain why.
X900E has MotionFlow 960
X930E has MotionFlow 960
X900F has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
X850G has MotionFlow 960
X950G has X-Motion Clarity no rate reported
Z9D has MotionFlow 1440
Z9F has X-Motion Clarity
A8G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A9G has MotionFlow no rate reported
A1E has MotionFlow no rate reported

It appears that MotionFlow performs better than X-Motion Clarity. Also, why are all the higher end models not moving on to X-Motion Clarity? Sony has started degrading motion quality beginning with the F line of TVs. And since the X850G will have MotionFlow 960, it will probably outperform the 950G in the motion category as well. SMH, time to order one of the few 930Es that are still in stock.
DUDE, You have to calm down.
Now that you are calm, listen to me.
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post #1308 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 09:50 PM
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I think the 950G handles Motion very good I don't see any problems with it. However I don't own a E Sony set either.

TC.
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post #1309 of 3411 Old 03-20-2019, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by PlanetAVS View Post
For the price of a 75 950G or Z9F, I'd look at the 85" 900F instead. If you have the room for a 85, of course.
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Originally Posted by bc151rules View Post
I do have room for the 85", so now I'm weighing that option as well.
The old quality VS quantity, what are you going to do?
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post #1310 of 3411 Old 03-21-2019, 01:40 AM
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Forgive me as I am not bashing the TV at all. I am a true Sony fan and refuse to buy any other brand unless I have to. The motion on the 950G is good but not the same excellence that my eyes got used to. If I were to score the 900E at 10/10, the 950G would be 8/10. Just believe me when I say that my eyes were a tad bit let down once I started watching my first movie. However, the 950G is miles better at being a gaming TV. That is the one thing that is saving this set from being refunded.
From your findings I’d probably rule out a faulty set just to be on the safe side especially if you plan on keeping it. Maybe go to store and view one on display and see if you notice the motion issues. ( and I do realize this can be difficult sometimes.) if you have the fundss buy another 950g and see how it pars.

Of course, start with the basics like a factory reset and double check every possible setting the TV has to offer. Perhaps you already done all of the above and this is just the nature of the beast. I sure hope not because it sounds the the 950g will be a nice solid option for a lot of folks.
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post #1311 of 3411 Old 03-21-2019, 03:56 AM
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This is my point exactly. Some people prefer MotionFlow/Cinemotion while others like watching movies in 24Hz. Most of these panels have a native refresh rate of 120Hz. MotionFlow/Cinemotion allows you to run a fake 960Hz while using MotionFlow 960. X-Motion Clarity is not reporting any rate at all. For all we know, it could be the equivalent of MotionFlow 480. All I can tell you is that I have both sets side by side, I can watch the same video, and while doing this I can clearly see that the 900E handles motion better. I paid cash for my 950G and would be happy to tell you that the 950 is better than the 900e in every way. But if I told you this, I would be lying. The difference in these two sets is that the 900E has Motionflow "Smooth" & CineMotion "HIGH" presets. The 950 has MotionFlow Auto, Custom, OFF and Cinemotion Auto or Off. Believe me, I wish that the 950 handled motion better than the 900e and feel that Sony could improve motion handling via firmware updates as they have in the past.
This had indeed been an unwelcome change in settings available (started with the Z9F/A9F) and may be limited to models with the X1 Ultimate.
Smooth preset is the same as having Custom slider 'Smoothness' on 2 or 3 but Cinemotion Auto instead of High may be influencing. Perhaps you should try Custom: Smoothness on 3 and Clearness on 1 and Cinemotion Auto
(and there is no way the Motionflow rating will be lower on the 950 than the 850 even if it is not advertised, they are just marketing the krep out of X-Motion Clarity currently, perhaps because it has been getting glowing reviews)
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The old quality VS quantity, what are you going to do?

Based on all the reviews, I'm leaning towards the quantity (85X900F) over the quality, especially when I can get a decent deal on a new 900F tv.



Reading through reviews, size seems to win over a smaller TV with slightly better quality, for a true cinematic experience.(All subjective, I know) Plus, the 900F will be an upgrade over my 65"900B, which doesn't support HDR. Either way I go, I SHOULD end up with higher quality PQ then what I have, so I'm leaning towards size and looking to get a deal on the 900F!
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Based on all the reviews, I'm leaning towards the quantity (85X900F) over the quality, especially when I can get a decent deal on a new 900F tv.



Reading through reviews, size seems to win over a smaller TV with slightly better quality, for a true cinematic experience.(All subjective, I know) Plus, the 900F will be an upgrade over my 65"900B, which doesn't support HDR. Either way I go, I SHOULD end up with higher quality PQ then what I have, so I'm leaning towards size and looking to get a deal on the 900F!
In this case, it's debatable that you are compromising in quality.
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Still looking for more feedback from people who own both the 900F and the 950G as to how good the 950G’s “Dolby Vision Bright” setting works and if it is more watchable than the Dolby Vision on the 900F.

I personally cannot watch Dolby Vision on my 900F as I simply find it way too dark. I would love to know if the the 950G’s bright setting fixes this completely or if it’s just a minor improvement.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post
This is my point exactly. Some people prefer MotionFlow/Cinemotion while others like watching movies in 24Hz. Most of these panels have a native refresh rate of 120Hz. MotionFlow/Cinemotion allows you to run a fake 960Hz while using MotionFlow 960. X-Motion Clarity is not reporting any rate at all. For all we know, it could be the equivalent of MotionFlow 480. All I can tell you is that I have both sets side by side, I can watch the same video, and while doing this I can clearly see that the 900E handles motion better. I paid cash for my 950G and would be happy to tell you that the 950 is better than the 900e in every way. But if I told you this, I would be lying. The difference in these two sets is that the 900E has Motionflow "Smooth" & CineMotion "HIGH" presets. The 950 has MotionFlow Auto, Custom, OFF and Cinemotion Auto or Off. Believe me, I wish that the 950 handled motion better than the 900e and feel that Sony could improve motion handling via firmware updates as they have in the past.
This had indeed been an unwelcome change in settings available (started with the Z9F/A9F) and may be limited to models with the X1 Ultimate.
Smooth preset is the same as having Custom slider 'Smoothness' on 2 or 3 but Cinemotion Auto instead of High may be influencing. Perhaps you should try Custom: Smoothness on 3 and Clearness on 1 and Cinemotion Auto
(and there is no way the Motionflow rating will be lower on the 950 than the 850 even if it is not advertised, they are just marketing the krep out of X-Motion Clarity currently, perhaps because it has been getting glowing reviews)
Thank you for your reply. I knew that I wasn’t crazy!!! Also didn’t know that I wasn’t alone by being disappointed by this. Thank you for shedding light. The picture is amazing and gaming wise, it’s a great tv. I don’t care about lower contrast, I can get around that. I just hope Sony improves motion via firmware.
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post #1316 of 3411 Old 03-21-2019, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Sillyrabbit21 View Post
Still looking for more feedback from people who own both the 900F and the 950G as to how good the 950G’s “Dolby Vision Bright” setting works and if it is more watchable than the Dolby Vision on the 900F.

I personally cannot watch Dolby Vision on my 900F as I simply find it way too dark. I would love to know if the the 950G’s bright setting fixes this completely or if it’s just a minor improvement.
Dolby vision bright is too bright on the 950g. I use Dolby vision dark since I’m in a pitch black room. The 950 is overall a lot brighter in general. I was using brightness 17 on the 900e but can get away 9 or 10 on sdr content. I also feel like gamma reduction is a must to help out the lower contrast. However, do not use black level reduction to make up for contrast.
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post #1317 of 3411 Old 03-21-2019, 04:22 PM
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Thank you for your reply. I knew that I wasn’t crazy!!! Also didn’t know that I wasn’t alone by being disappointed by this. Thank you for shedding light. The picture is amazing and gaming wise, it’s a great tv. I don’t care about lower contrast, I can get around that. I just hope Sony improves motion via firmware.
X90F and X950G are being highly praised for the handling of movement. Especially by X-Motion. This was my fear, the concealment of information from Motionflow (my preference was always smooth).

If we want an update so that we have the soft option again in motionflow and the high option in Cinemotion, we will have to ask.

They will not do anything if we do not ask. After all the praise praises and if we just wait, nothing will be done. I did my part, I already requested (even though I do not have any of these models, just to help you, because I will buy one of these TVs soon)

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post #1318 of 3411 Old 03-21-2019, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by allencc3 View Post
Thank you for your reply. I knew that I wasn’t crazy!!! Also didn’t know that I wasn’t alone by being disappointed by this. Thank you for shedding light. The picture is amazing and gaming wise, it’s a great tv. I don’t care about lower contrast, I can get around that. I just hope Sony improves motion via firmware.
X90F and X950G are being highly praised for the handling of movement. Especially by X-Motion. This was my fear, the concealment of information from Motionflow (my preference was always smooth).

If we want an update so that we have the soft option again in motionflow and the high option in Cinemotion, we will have to ask.

They will not do anything if we do not ask. After all the praise praises and if we just wait, nothing will be done. I did my part, I already requested (even though I do not have any of these models, just to help you, because I will buy one of these TVs soon) [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif[/IMG]

[IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
Please let me know how I can help as well. We need a petition. #CineMotionHIGH
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post #1319 of 3411 Old 03-22-2019, 09:29 AM
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Slight hiccup w/ my set today. I came in and turned on the receiver & TV w/ the remote and was listening to it for a couple minutes before I ever looked up and then noticed that the TV was powered on (led was lit) but screen was black. I powered the TV back off w/ the remote but after a few seconds, the TV would not power back on via the remote. Pulling the power for a minute took care of it but will get annoying if it happens often.

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post #1320 of 3411 Old 03-22-2019, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Lang View Post
Slight hiccup w/ my set today. I came in and turned on the receiver & TV w/ the remote and was listening to it for a couple minutes before I ever looked up and then noticed that the TV was powered on (led was lit) but screen was black. I powered the TV back off w/ the remote but after a few seconds, the TV would not power back on via the remote. Pulling the power for a minute took care of it but will get annoying if it happens often.
Maybe it is an energy saver feature.
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