2019 Samsung Q90R Owners Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 18 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #511 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
We'll all have to wait until more owners get their hands on these...
Any info on when you expect to receive your review unit or what size?

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post #512 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:30 AM
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Any info on when you expect to receive your review unit or what size?
I won't order till I read some professional reviews and until it's clarified if Samsung will support any HDMI 2.1 features on these sets.

If there will be no HDMI 2.1 support I am feeling that I would be better off going with a 2018 LG C8 77" TV for around the same price as the Q90. I would still be missing HDMI 2.1 features but would have Dolby Vision which I can use immediately vs. promises around HDR10+. It also does Dolby Atmos via traditional ARC. I would connect my game console directly to the TV and everything else would go through an AVR that supports 4K/60fps.
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post #513 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
I won't order till I read some professional reviews and until it's clarified if Samsung will support any HDMI 2.1 features on these sets.

If there will be no HDMI 2.1 support I am feeling that I would be better off going with a 2018 LG C8 77" TV for around the same price as the Q90. I would still be missing HDMI 2.1 features but would have Dolby Vision which I can use immediately vs. promises around HDR10+. It also does Dolby Atmos via traditional ARC. I would connect my game console directly to the TV and everything else would go through an AVR that supports 4K/60fps.

My bad, I looked at your name super fast and thought it read imagic (I guess its what I wanted to see, lol), hence the mention of a review unit. Either way thanks for your input. I'd like to see earc added at minimum.

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post #514 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
I won't order till I read some professional reviews and until it's clarified if Samsung will support any HDMI 2.1 features on these sets.

It also does Dolby Atmos via traditional ARC. I would connect my game console directly to the TV and everything else would go through an AVR that supports 4K/60fps.
Xbox atmos will not work through ARC.
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post #515 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:53 AM
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Xbox atmos will not work through ARC.
On the LG or on the new Samsung?
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post #516 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 09:55 AM
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On the LG or on the new Samsung?
On any TV. You need eARC to get xbox atmos through TV.
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post #517 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 10:14 AM
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On any TV. You need eARC to get xbox atmos through TV.
I must have mis-read something I read about people getting Atmos out of the C8 through regular ARC.
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post #518 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 10:31 AM
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In terms of PQ and Performance, what are the Pros and Cons of a 65" vs a 75"?

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post #519 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Lorderl View Post
In terms of PQ and Performance, what are the Pros and Cons of a 65" vs a 75"?
Theroetically they should be the same. There were some anecdotal reports that the 75" had less DSE issues in last years model, but it's yet to be seen if that holds true this year. I'm not sure if there's even a large enough sample size to definitively say that for last year's model. The zone count is reportedly the same for both sizes, so Theroetically they should perform the same.
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post #520 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Darin View Post
The zone count is reportedly the same for both sizes, so Theroetically they should perform the same.

Theoretically, it should be slightly worse because the zones will be larger on the 75".
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post #521 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Darin View Post
Theroetically they should be the same. There were some anecdotal reports that the 75" had less DSE issues in last years model, but it's yet to be seen if that holds true this year. I'm not sure if there's even a large enough sample size to definitively say that for last year's model. The zone count is reportedly the same for both sizes, so Theroetically they should perform the same.
Any luck purchasing the 75 inch version?
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post #522 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post
The zone count is reportedly the same for both sizes, so Theroetically they should perform the same.

Theoretically, it should be slightly worse because the zones will be larger on the 75".
That's like saying the performance scales downward with increasing screen size just because the pixels are bigger. Theoretically, if you are properly selecting screen size based on viewing distance for optimal FOV, the pixels (and dimming zones) will appear the same size from the viewing position. 😉
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post #523 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:27 AM
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Any luck purchasing the 75 inch version?
No, I tried again about an hour ago. The "Perks at work" shopping portal through my company has a 10% bonus that ends tonight at midnight, so if they don't get it fixed today, this won't be happening until a similar or better deal comes along. I was originally prepared to wait until black Friday-ish, when the deals are better and all reviews out, so no biggie if it doesn't happen. 🙂
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post #524 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:40 AM
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No, I tried again about an hour ago. The "Perks at work" shopping portal through my company has a 10% bonus that ends tonight at midnight, so if they don't get it fixed today, this won't be happening until a similar or better deal comes along. I was originally prepared to wait until black Friday-ish, when the deals are better and all reviews out, so no biggie if it doesn't happen. 🙂
I've tried using EPP and without, won't work either way. I just don't want to lose that discount either.
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post #525 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:47 AM
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That's like saying the performance scales downward with increasing screen size just because the pixels are bigger. Theoretically, if you are properly selecting screen size based on viewing distance for optimal FOV, the pixels (and dimming zones) will appear the same size from the viewing position. 😉
So both sizes should handle banding and blooming equally? I recall reading somewhere that a smaller screen would have a sharper picture, this true?

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post #526 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 11:56 AM
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I recall reading somewhere that a smaller screen would have a sharper picture, this true?
Screen size alone doesn't affect sharpness, but the ratio of the screen size to your viewing distance affects your ability to discern flaws in the image. If you look at your TV now, then move back 10', the same TV will LOOK sharper. Its performance didn't improve, just your perception of it.
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post #527 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 12:49 PM
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My Q90R has arrived! I just got it. Still in box. Will be tonight before I can set it up. Very much looking forward to if!
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post #528 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorderl View Post
In terms of PQ and Performance, what are the Pros and Cons of a 65" vs a 75"?


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Originally Posted by Darin View Post
That's like saying the performance scales downward with increasing screen size just because the pixels are bigger. Theoretically, if you are properly selecting screen size based on viewing distance for optimal FOV, the pixels (and dimming zones) will appear the same size from the viewing position. 😉


I had both the 65 and 75" Q9FN last year side by side in my living room. With the same amount of zones, I can tell you 100% that the 65" performed better with widescreen bars and the 65 had less noticeable bloom
It wasn't a huge difference, but it was noticeable.

Regarding sharpness, I can also tell you with that my couch at a fixed position (which most people don't move their couches), the 65" was definitely sharper BUT the 75" showed alot more texture and detail. I was quite surprised how much texture was more visible on the 75".

Also, I could now never go back to 65".
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post #529 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 01:19 PM
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I can also tell you with that my couch at a fixed position (which most people don't move their couches), the 65" was definitely sharper BUT the 75" showed alot more texture and detail. I was quite surprised how much texture was more visible on the 75".
Sure, that's all to be expected. At a constant seating distance but variable screen size (and therefore variable size:distance ratio), your ability to resolve detail, including flaws, will change. But as far as blooming, etc, THEORETICALLY, the different sizes should perform the same. You could could compare two units of the same size and still see differences just thanks to panel lottery. I think we'd have to have a pretty big sample of multiple people seeing the same thing under the same conditions to be able to say definitively different panel sizes perform differently, and even if we did, that would only be valid for last year's model. We hardly have any feedback yet on the 2019 65". No one here has been able to compare different sizes of the Q90.
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post #530 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Darin View Post
Sure, that's all to be expected. At a constant seating distance but variable screen size (and therefore variable size:distance ratio), your ability to resolve detail, including flaws, will change. But as far as blooming, etc, THEORETICALLY, the different sizes should perform the same. You could could compare two units of the same size and still see differences just thanks to panel lottery. I think we'd have to have a pretty big sample of multiple people seeing the same thing under the same conditions to be able to say definitively different panel sizes perform differently, and even if we did, that would only be valid for last year's model. We hardly have any feedback yet on the 2019 65". No one here has been able to compare different sizes of the Q90.


You can theorize all you want while in real life, I had the situation in MY house. Did you? Ill take real world experience over "theories" 100% of the time. So by your "theory", the 98" version will perform the same as the 65?

You can also look at feedback of Sony's 900 series which also has the same number of zones on all sizes. The 85900F is reported to have much worse blooming/blacks than the smaller sizes, which all have the same zones.
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post #531 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 01:41 PM
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I must have mis-read something I read about people getting Atmos out of the C8 through regular ARC.

I think you can from the streaming apps if you have your Xbox set to bitstream Dolby Digital, which would pass Atmos using the Dolby Digital+ codec, but the lossless Atmos codec from games and UHD discs would not work.
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post #532 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 02:22 PM
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Do we have confirmation if last years official samsung "no-gap mount" will work on this tv?

I also found some on amazon that were half the price of the samsung mount for the same "no-gap" style.
The description says "No Gap ready". I'm assuming it will. I wish they would update it. In this thread, many complaints of "No Gap" being false.
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post #533 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 02:27 PM
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I must have mis-read something I read about people getting Atmos out of the C8 through regular ARC.
Sorry, was in a rush typing all that, let me clarify, you can get dolby atmos through compressed dolby digital plus. Uncompressed/TrueHD atmos needs eARC.
I have C8, xbox and atmos capable receiver. I have xbox plugged into receiver so I can get atmos from all sources unchanged.
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post #534 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 03:29 PM
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You can theorize all you want while in real life, I had the situation in MY house. Did you? Ill take real world experience over "theories" 100% of the time. So by your "theory", the 98" version will perform the same as the 65?

You can also look at feedback of Sony's 900 series which also has the same number of zones on all sizes. The 85900F is reported to have much worse blooming/blacks than the smaller sizes, which all have the same zones.
I dont think he is saying it didnt happen - he mentions that the explanation could possibly be due to a panel variance, not because the screen size was larger.
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post #535 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 04:05 PM
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You can theorize all you want while in real life, I had the situation in MY house. Did you? Ill take real world experience over "theories" 100% of the time.
Not to take this too off-topic, since this isn't directly related to the Q90, but here is a person who had three different 65" Q9Fs in his home, and found them all to have much worse banding than his 79" Q9F. And here is a person who had some dark shadows and streaks in his 65Q9F, but not in his 75Q9F. I've seen you talk about differences in color saturation, black levels, and blooming between your 65" and 75" Q9Fs, but I've never seen you mention the differences these other two people observed. And I've never seen them corroborate your findings. Are two of you wrong, or is it POSSIBLE that there are other variables, such as panel variances, that factor in? To answer your question: no, I have not compared these in my home. And I don't care who has, unless a decent number of people have all had the same results. A sample of one of each size is not nearly enough to definitively extrapolate traits across the entire production of those sizes. Much less extend those traits to the next model year.

Unless and until someone can demonstrate repeatable differences between the different Q90 screen sizes, people should by the size that best fits their use.
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Originally Posted by Darin View Post
Not to take this too off-topic, since this isn't directly related to the Q90, but here is a person who had three different 65" Q9Fs in his home, and found them all to have much worse banding than his 79" Q9F. And here is a person who had some dark shadows and streaks in his 65Q9F, but not in his 75Q9F. I've seen you talk about differences in color saturation, black levels, and blooming between your 65" and 75" Q9Fs, but I've never seen you mention the differences these other two people observed. And I've never seen them corroborate your findings. Are two of you wrong, or is it POSSIBLE that there are other variables, such as panel variances, that factor in? To answer your question: no, I have not compared these in my home. And I don't care who has, unless a decent number of people have all had the same results. A sample of one of each size is not nearly enough to definitively extrapolate traits across the entire production of those sizes. Much less extend those traits to the next model year.



Unless and until someone can demonstrate repeatable differences between the different Q90 screen sizes, people should by the size that best fits their use.
I tested 5 65 q9fn at home and several at various stores both 65 and 75 and every single 75 had less dse than any of the 65. Furthermore, the majority of 65 I tested were very undersaturated and/or had washed out gamma. Very few had good gamma and saturation from the ones I tested. However, none of the 75 that I tested had undersaturation or washy gamma. If this was me just hitting the Powerball of bad panel lotto, then why is the 75 z9d officially labeled the better panel than the 65 in real tests as far as response times go? You can argue that less dse on the 75 z9d is anecdotal, but you cannot use that arguement for response time. Hence, different sizes different panels.

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post #537 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 04:59 PM
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I tested 5 65 q9fn at home and several at various stores both 65 and 75 and every single 75 had less dse than any of the 65. Furthermore, the majority of 65 I tested were very undersaturated and/or had washed out gamma. Very few had good gamma and saturation from the ones I tested. However, none of the 75 that I tested had undersaturation or washy gamma. If this was me just hitting the Powerball of bad panel lotto, then why is the 75 z9d officially labeled the better panel than the 65 in real tests as far as response times go? You can argue that less dse on the 75 z9d is anecdotal, but you cannot use that arguement for response time. Hence, different sizes different panels.

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I never thought of that before, but it's quite possible that different panel sizes are made on different production equipment and maybe even in different factories altogether. This could lead to different performance and defect rates for one size vs another. Maybe that's the cause of what you were seeing.

Thanks for the info.
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post #538 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 05:20 PM
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That's not exactly true. The 2018 model Q900 has been out for months, of course, but the 2019 model Q900 is in short supply. I ordered a Q900RB in January, but was just put off until May for delivery from Best Buy.
Well you are in HI, I have 2 firneds there, great weather but everything takes a while to get and is expensive....

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So I bought another 65Q90 today after UPS destroyed my Amazon-bought unit.
That had to be an ac cident from Amazon shipping that UPS, the odds of a TV making it would be like 10% maybe..Got to ship double boxed or commercial freight......
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post #539 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 06:27 PM
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why is the 75 z9d officially labeled the better panel than the 65 in real tests as far as response times go? You can argue that less dse on the 75 z9d is anecdotal, but you cannot use that arguement for response time. Hence, different sizes different panels.
I'm not saying different panels can't have different traits, I'm saying there's nothing known about the Q90 to suggest different sizes are better than others. The Sony is a completely different TV. The 75" z9d even had more zones than the smaller ones, while The Q90 (and Q9f) don't. Samsung doesn't use a single panel manufacturer. You might get a 65Q9F with an Optronics panel, you might get one with a Samsung panel. I don't even know of anyone who has a 75Q90 yet. As I said, there were anecdotal reports of the 75Q9F having fewer DSE complaints. If you want to add better color to the list of anecdotal reports for the 75Q9F, then fine. But you can't just extrapolate those (non-scientific) reports to a new model. There's a reason I capitalized THEORETICALLY in my previous posts... there is no known reason for 65Q90 and 75Q90 reason to perform differently. Beyond size, the known specs for them are the same (same # zones, etc). Unless and until proven otherwise.
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post #540 of 5735 Old 03-13-2019, 06:29 PM
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(btw both are AA01 panels)

I've actually stated many times that the 65 I had was not good with its uniformity. The banding was atrocious. Had it been mine, it would have gone back. It was visible on alot of content but I'm not sure if my friend has noticed it because I made sure not to mention it. So the 75 had better unformity (as also reported on the forums), better colors, better contrast, deeper blacks/more crush(tho I can fix the crush using settings on my Panasonic Ub820). The 65 was sharper with better dimming control. Both tvs bloomed in the exact same spots usually, with the bloom area being a little more wide-spread on the 75. The panel lottery applies to alot of things such as saturation and color gamut etc, but the actual dimming control should be the same and consistent unless something is broken. I did live with the 65 full time for a few days while I tried to return my 75 due to a yellow line that developed a few weeks later, and the blacks were a noticeable difference again but I'd still choose the 75. I'm making a warranty claim on my 75 soon and will request a Q90R by paying the difference.

In the picture here of the earth, I had to raise the exposure to capture the raised blacks otherwise the camera was crushing it to black. But what u can see here, is that the very top black is much more raised than the 75, it was very noticeable even from the couch. The 65, it appeared black to me, though it looks raised in the picture. But you can definitely see a difference.

You can also see a touch of bloom on the other space picture.

75Q9FN* Panny UB820 fed into Oppo203*Denon X4200 * S10+*
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75Q9FN*55C8OLED*Galaxy S10+ *Ub820 fed into Oppo 203* XB1X* 4k Denon X4200

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