2019 Samsung Q90R Owners Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 231 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 4980Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #6901 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 02:06 AM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just got the Q90R mainly for PC work/gaming. I am very disappointed with the TV in PC Input Mode. As soon as you enable HDR in Windows display settings, the screen goes quite dim and looses all the color. It also disables most of the TV's picture settings (such as color) so you can't even adjust the screen. I changed the input to "Game Console" and it at lease allows me to turn the "game enhancer" setting on in game mode now. But since I just this to view a lot of Text for work, I want to be able to use the Chroma 4:4:4. But this TV wont let me have the best of both worlds. I am glad I am not the only person experiencing this... As I did not see anyone mention this in reviews before buy it.

Has anyone found a solution or anything to get better PC HDR gaming while using the "PC input" mode?
make sure you have enabled hdmi uhd colour mode for the ports on your tv this can be done in the settings off the samsung tv and is needed to allow the tv to operate at 4:4:4
darzyd88 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #6902 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 02:34 AM
Senior Member
 
Nighthog's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 349
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 45 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just got the Q90R mainly for PC work/gaming. I am very disappointed with the TV in PC Input Mode. As soon as you enable HDR in Windows display settings, the screen goes quite dim and looses all the color. It also disables most of the TV's picture settings (such as color) so you can't even adjust the screen. I changed the input to "Game Console" and it at lease allows me to turn the "game enhancer" setting on in game mode now. But since I just this to view a lot of Text for work, I want to be able to use the Chroma 4:4:4. But this TV wont let me have the best of both worlds. I am glad I am not the only person experiencing this... As I did not see anyone mention this in reviews before buy it.

Has anyone found a solution or anything to get better PC HDR gaming while using the "PC input" mode?

Windows HDR isn't meant to be used on Desktop. Use it only with supported games or videos. Some of these will AUTO change to HDR mode if supported but some may need to you manually change into HDR mode from within Windows before starting your game.



For Example Destiny 2 will AUTO change into HDR if you have enabled HDR within the game settings when you start the game. Works for me on the 2018 Samsung models Q8DN. While Final Fantasy XV needs you to manually enable it before you start the game. Depends on game support/implementation.



Video I've only tested 1 film with HDR using MPC-HC+madVR and it seemed to work but uncertain how accurate it was. Wasn't the greatest HDR content.
Firefox doesn't support HDR yet so not seen any YouTube work yet there but your supposed to be able to use Chrome for HDR, not tested myself.


As for HDR on desktop. Everything windows is SDR so it "tries" to adjust the SDR within the HDR limits but it's kinda badly implemented. SDR to HDR aren't really interchangeable and a linear extension of SDR content. There is a slider to adjust the range if you want to try but I recommend to stick with SDR for Desktop and only HDR for supported content.

You don't want the screen to be too bright all the time for static content after all and wasn't really what HDR was made for.
Nighthog is offline  
post #6903 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 09:17 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
Industry Insider
 
Cleveland Plasma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 25,271
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7036 Post(s)
Liked: 7071
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
Calibration is definitely worthwhile to me; enough so that I calibrate my 75" myself. Assuming you mean calibrate for accuracy, are you already using Movie picture mode and Warm2 color tone, for both SDR and HDR? And do you basically like how it looks? Movie/Warm2 with default settings is already fairly accurate for SDR, but calibration improves accuracy even further, with results that I'm quite happy with. Movie/Warm2 with default settings isn't all that accurate for HDR, so calibration definitely improves accuracy, but I'd say the results are only so-so, with color accuracy being worse than grayscale accuracy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggw2000 View Post
Has anyone had their 75 Q90R professionally calibrated? Is it worth the money to do this on this TV?
Thanks, Gerry
Calibration is always a choice. You have no idea where your new TV sits as far as accuracy. You set could be way out of wack for some reason and you could be no where near its full potential.....If you deside to do that route,

Chad B : [email protected]
D-Nice : [email protected]
Gregg Loewen : [email protected]
Kris Deering [email protected]

If all else fails master list :

<<< Click Here >>>

<<< Click Here >>>
Cleveland Plasma is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #6904 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 12:50 PM
Senior Member
 
JoelArt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 338
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 228 Post(s)
Liked: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I just got the Q90R mainly for PC work/gaming. I am very disappointed with the TV in PC Input Mode. As soon as you enable HDR in Windows display settings, the screen goes quite dim and looses all the color. It also disables most of the TV's picture settings (such as color) so you can't even adjust the screen. I changed the input to "Game Console" and it at lease allows me to turn the "game enhancer" setting on in game mode now. But since I just this to view a lot of Text for work, I want to be able to use the Chroma 4:4:4. But this TV wont let me have the best of both worlds. I am glad I am not the only person experiencing this... As I did not see anyone mention this in reviews before buy it.

Has anyone found a solution or anything to get better PC HDR gaming while using the "PC input" mode?
I tried with all modes and settings and a bunch of tests, in the ended I gave up and went with the Sony ZF9 due to the aforementioned problems, it handles Graphics/Game modes perfectly when it comes to full 4:4:4 Chroma and proper sRGB with no change in HDR brightness, it's worlds apart from how Samsung treats PC input. I even like the X-Wide angle as it makes the image more uniform with no raised gamma curve (raising the brightness of dark regions), towards the edges, it's not a problem on the Q90 of course as there wide angle implementation is quite good but their dimming algorithm still black crushes to much details for an accurate image representation. I have to admit, the blacks do suffer in HDR on my Sony a bit due to the X-wide filters implementation. It's only a problem in primarily dark scenes with smaller areas of very bright region next to big darker areas but it's not really a problem in SDR content which is most of my actual consumption. If you can't find the 75" (more dimming zones than the 65") then X950G might be the next great option for both PC text and design work and gaming.

One more nitpick I have with Samsung is their low backlight flicker rate of only at 120hz in all modes except Movie mode, this makes edges look duplicated in 30/60fps games and flicker A LOT when panning the camera or backgrounds in games without heavy motion blur. It also makes the image a bit less calm to look even at a PC desktop, try and switch between movie mode and game mode and try out camera panning or just passively looking at an image with bright regions or when quickly flicking you eyes over a black screen with white thin lines or text and see them duplicated as a result. Sony does better again with a 720hz flicker in ALL modes, it's not as good as the older generations of LCD TV's which didn't use PWM backlight (pulse with modulation) but still much better than what Samsung does, this is quite weird as they obviously can do it in Movie (960hz IIRC) mode and easily could have enable it in other modes as well.

Oh, and about the reviewers, most of them are just movie buffs and test the gaming aspects because they have to and most aren't that technically knowledgeable, and basically no one test proper PC desktop text and work aspects. To be fair, most people buys a TV to watch TV or movies in the living room and rarely need accuracy and instead want wow and pop to the image. A little bit like headphones, when you master music you want a flat EQ for accuracy but most people prefer a V shaped bass boosting sound. Samsung caters to the uninformed non demanding mainstream, like selling food with a lot of sugars in it, while Sony high-end is leaning more towards accuracy and correctness, like healthy home cooked food.

PS. I've worked with games and graphics my whole life and find learning in detail about input-lag and display technologies very interesting.

Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75") | PC > TV > miniDSP 2x4 HD > XTZ EDGE A2-300 > SVS Ultra Towers + XTZ 10.17 EDGE.

Last edited by JoelArt; 11-30-2019 at 01:00 PM.
JoelArt is offline  
post #6905 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 01:36 PM
Member
 
briancail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Having trouble with a 2 day old Q90R (65").

Inputs to One Connect Box: HDMI1 (DirecTV Genie) / HDMI2 (Apple TV 4K; configured for HDR and Chroma setting of 4:2:2; High Speed HDMI cable. Note: the AppleTV passed a test earlier indicating the HDMI cable was capable of Chroma 4:2:2 although originally it was set as Chroma 4:2:0. What Chroma settings are others using on Apple TV 4K with the Q90R?).

All worked well the first 1.5 days. Then, in the middle of watching a HDR Netflix show on Apple TV, the picture became "sparkles" appearance fora a couple of seconds and then went black.
Note: Netflix had the program description tagged as "Dolby Vision" (I assume AppleTV auto converts to HDR 10 as the Q90R doesn't support Dolby Vision)]

Now, the TV indicates "No Signal" on all HDMI inputs (including HDMI 3/4 when swapping to those).
However, I can stream using the built-in Samsung apps (network connection: WiFi) and all menus, etc are available.
I'm able to change HDMI inputs with the remote --- but there is no video signal on any of them and they eventually show as "No Signal" error
It shows when I connect and disconnect HDMI cables to/from the One Connect Box and walks thru the set-up of the input.
Optical output on OneConnect Box continues to work.

I have tried the following:
1. Power Cycling (pull the power cord and 10min waiting)
2. Swapping HDMI cables
3. Power cycling the Apple TV and DirecTV box
4. Unplug/replug the Invisible Connect Cable
5. Factory reset of TV
6. Updating the firmware to the 1335 version
7. HDMI cable check via Settings (it passed)
8. Video Test via Settings (it passed)
9. Troubleshooting call with Samsung where they remoted into the TV (no faults found in the diagnostics that they ran although they could confirm the "no signal" messages I was seeing for the HDMI inputs)

I don't have an antenna to check if antenna --> OneConnect Box --> TV will display a picture.

Samsung claims the issue is a bad Invisible Connect cable and is sending me a new one. However, I find that hard to believe when the failure occurred in the middle of AppleTV streaming and after having watched a few hours of TV just an hour or so before. The Invisible Connect cable wasn't touched during that time. How can the cable just suddenly fail?

I tried to get Samsung to parallel send me a new OneConnect box. But, they insist on trying a new Invisible Connect cable first.

Anyone experience similar/same issue? Suggestions?


Brian.

Last edited by briancail; 11-30-2019 at 02:06 PM.
briancail is offline  
post #6906 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 02:45 PM
Senior Member
 
JoelArt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 338
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 228 Post(s)
Liked: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by darzyd88 View Post
make sure you have enabled hdmi uhd colour mode for the ports on your tv this can be done in the settings off the samsung tv and is needed to allow the tv to operate at 4:4:4
If you want to make sure you do indeed get Full Chroma and no subsampling you can use this test image:


Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75") | PC > TV > miniDSP 2x4 HD > XTZ EDGE A2-300 > SVS Ultra Towers + XTZ 10.17 EDGE.

Last edited by JoelArt; 11-30-2019 at 02:51 PM.
JoelArt is offline  
post #6907 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 02:59 PM
Senior Member
 
JoelArt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 338
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 228 Post(s)
Liked: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by briancail View Post
Having trouble with a 2 day old Q90R (65").

Inputs to One Connect Box: HDMI1 (DirecTV Genie) / HDMI2 (Apple TV 4K; configured for HDR and Chroma setting of 4:2:2; High Speed HDMI cable. Note: the AppleTV passed a test earlier indicating the HDMI cable was capable of Chroma 4:2:2 although originally it was set as Chroma 4:2:0. What Chroma settings are others using on Apple TV 4K with the Q90R?).

All worked well the first 1.5 days. Then, in the middle of watching a HDR Netflix show on Apple TV, the picture became "sparkles" appearance fora a couple of seconds and then went black.
Note: Netflix had the program description tagged as "Dolby Vision" (I assume AppleTV auto converts to HDR 10 as the Q90R doesn't support Dolby Vision)]

Now, the TV indicates "No Signal" on all HDMI inputs (including HDMI 3/4 when swapping to those).
However, I can stream using the built-in Samsung apps (network connection: WiFi) and all menus, etc are available.
I'm able to change HDMI inputs with the remote --- but there is no video signal on any of them and they eventually show as "No Signal" error
It shows when I connect and disconnect HDMI cables to/from the One Connect Box and walks thru the set-up of the input.
Optical output on OneConnect Box continues to work.

I have tried the following:
1. Power Cycling (pull the power cord and 10min waiting)
2. Swapping HDMI cables
3. Power cycling the Apple TV and DirecTV box
4. Unplug/replug the Invisible Connect Cable
5. Factory reset of TV
6. Updating the firmware to the 1335 version
7. HDMI cable check via Settings (it passed)
8. Video Test via Settings (it passed)
9. Troubleshooting call with Samsung where they remoted into the TV (no faults found in the diagnostics that they ran although they could confirm the "no signal" messages I was seeing for the HDMI inputs)

I don't have an antenna to check if antenna --> OneConnect Box --> TV will display a picture.

Samsung claims the issue is a bad Invisible Connect cable and is sending me a new one. However, I find that hard to believe when the failure occurred in the middle of AppleTV streaming and after having watched a few hours of TV just an hour or so before. The Invisible Connect cable wasn't touched during that time. How can the cable just suddenly fail?

I tried to get Samsung to parallel send me a new OneConnect box. But, they insist on trying a new Invisible Connect cable first.

Anyone experience similar/same issue? Suggestions?


Brian.
"Sparks" is often a sign of failing signal strength for amount of data sent. Do you get a picture when the source device is outputting at lower resolutions. If so then you probably need to buy a better HDMI cable that is at least 18 Gbps certified.

Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75") | PC > TV > miniDSP 2x4 HD > XTZ EDGE A2-300 > SVS Ultra Towers + XTZ 10.17 EDGE.
JoelArt is offline  
post #6908 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 03:05 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
BRAC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Edmonton, AB
Posts: 2,054
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 706 Post(s)
Liked: 619
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
I think he shows and says enough to let people know that Samsung has intentionally weakened the dimming to improve lag.

Speaking of which, can tour meter measure black levels to check some real life scenes with Game Mode turned on and off?


Also wanted to mention that I ordered my 1st "real" meter even though it's just a cheapy i1 Display Pro OEM that can clibrate up to 2000 nits. Looking forward to playing with that next week and figuring it all out.

82Q90*X4200*55OledC8*Oppo 203/Panasonic 820*Note10+
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nillaz View Post
The i1 Display Pro is less expensive than some of the other meters out there but it's still a couple hundred dollars and it's actually a good colorimeter. If you spend any significant amount of time calibrating it will be a workhorse for you for years. Have fun!
Ray, was it the X-Rite meter that you ordered? Thinking about grabbing a meter myself. I’m quite happy with my Q90 in Movie mode with minor tweaks, but I’m thinking it might be fun to mess around with a meter. Any added improvement would be icing on the cake.

Which software are you planning to use, DisplayCAL?
ray0414 likes this.

Samsung 82” Q90R * LG 55” C8 * Denon X4500H * 5.2.4 Atmos * Xbox One X * PS4 Pro
BRAC is offline  
post #6909 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 06:34 PM
Member
 
briancail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoelArt View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by briancail View Post
Having trouble with a 2 day old Q90R (65").

Inputs to One Connect Box: HDMI1 (DirecTV Genie) / HDMI2 (Apple TV 4K; configured for HDR and Chroma setting of 4:2:2; High Speed HDMI cable. Note: the AppleTV passed a test earlier indicating the HDMI cable was capable of Chroma 4:2:2 although originally it was set as Chroma 4:2:0. What Chroma settings are others using on Apple TV 4K with the Q90R?).

All worked well the first 1.5 days. Then, in the middle of watching a HDR Netflix show on Apple TV, the picture became "sparkles" appearance fora a couple of seconds and then went black.
Note: Netflix had the program description tagged as "Dolby Vision" (I assume AppleTV auto converts to HDR 10 as the Q90R doesn't support Dolby Vision)]

Now, the TV indicates "No Signal" on all HDMI inputs (including HDMI 3/4 when swapping to those).
However, I can stream using the built-in Samsung apps (network connection: WiFi) and all menus, etc are available.
I'm able to change HDMI inputs with the remote --- but there is no video signal on any of them and they eventually show as "No Signal" error
It shows when I connect and disconnect HDMI cables to/from the One Connect Box and walks thru the set-up of the input.
Optical output on OneConnect Box continues to work.

I have tried the following:
1. Power Cycling (pull the power cord and 10min waiting)
2. Swapping HDMI cables
3. Power cycling the Apple TV and DirecTV box
4. Unplug/replug the Invisible Connect Cable
5. Factory reset of TV
6. Updating the firmware to the 1335 version
7. HDMI cable check via Settings (it passed)
8. Video Test via Settings (it passed)
9. Troubleshooting call with Samsung where they remoted into the TV (no faults found in the diagnostics that they ran although they could confirm the "no signal" messages I was seeing for the HDMI inputs)

I don't have an antenna to check if antenna --> OneConnect Box --> TV will display a picture.

Samsung claims the issue is a bad Invisible Connect cable and is sending me a new one. However, I find that hard to believe when the failure occurred in the middle of AppleTV streaming and after having watched a few hours of TV just an hour or so before. The Invisible Connect cable wasn't touched during that time. How can the cable just suddenly fail?

I tried to get Samsung to parallel send me a new OneConnect box. But, they insist on trying a new Invisible Connect cable first.

Anyone experience similar/same issue? Suggestions?


Brian.
"Sparks" is often a sign of failing signal strength for amount of data sent. Do you get a picture when the source device is outputting at lower resolutions. If so then you probably need to buy a better HDMI cable that is at least 18 Gbps certified.

I’m using ultra high speed HDMI cables (48 Gbps). Swapping cables resulting in same issue — “no signal”, even with 1080p source.
briancail is offline  
post #6910 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 07:14 PM
Senior Member
 
JoelArt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 338
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 228 Post(s)
Liked: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by briancail View Post
I’m using ultra high speed HDMI cables (48 Gbps). Swapping cables resulting in same issue — “no signal”, even with 1080p source.
Oh, then it might really the the one connect box, cable or TV input connection hardware having problems.

Sony ZF9 75" (Owned: Sony KDL-W55905A, Samsung Q9FN 65" & Q900 75") | PC > TV > miniDSP 2x4 HD > XTZ EDGE A2-300 > SVS Ultra Towers + XTZ 10.17 EDGE.
JoelArt is offline  
post #6911 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 08:16 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Nillaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,153
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 576 Post(s)
Liked: 379
Quote:
Originally Posted by briancail View Post
I’m using ultra high speed HDMI cables (48 Gbps). Swapping cables resulting in same issue — “no signal”, even with 1080p source.

The OC cable has it's own electronics in it and of course it can fail. However, whatever genius you spoke to obviously hasn't thought this through, regardless of what their diagnostics are showing them.



All of the brains are in the OC box. If the wire failed how in the world are you able to watch the TV's apps, etc? That info has to travel over the same OC cable as the HDMI data. It should be self evident to them that something failed in the OC box. I haven't taken one of the boxes apart but clearly something failed on the motherboard, or possibly an HDMI daughter board if they separate the ports from the main board.



That sucks that you have to jump through unnecessary hoops, but clearly common sense isn't always so common.
JoelArt likes this.

82Q90R / Denon X6400H / Polk Audio LSI 7.1.4 / Nvidia Shield Pro 2019 / Panasonic DP-UB820 4K BluRay / Xbox One X / PS4 Pro / Nintendo Switch / Custom Gaming PC / Custom VR PC / HTC Vive Pro HMD (Wireless)
Nillaz is online now  
post #6912 of 7475 Old 11-30-2019, 09:21 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
ray0414's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: michigan
Posts: 17,073
Mentioned: 266 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12864 Post(s)
Liked: 12234
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRAC View Post
Ray, was it the X-Rite meter that you ordered? Thinking about grabbing a meter myself. I’m quite happy with my Q90 in Movie mode with minor tweaks, but I’m thinking it might be fun to mess around with a meter. Any added improvement would be icing on the cake.



Which software are you planning to use, DisplayCAL?
I can send you a link to a slightly discounted meter that someone sent me. It appears to be the best bedget meter available for a TV that does over 1000 nits.

82Q90*X4200*55OledC8*Oppo 203/Panasonic 820*Note10+

82Q90R*75Q9FN(RIP)*55C8OLED*Galaxy Note10+*Ub820 fed into Oppo 203*XB1X*4k DenonX4200

MASTER LIST OF HDR CONTENT THREAD HERE, UPDATED OFTEN
ray0414 is offline  
post #6913 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 12:03 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 428
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 325
Bought a Samsung 82Q90. Watched some mostly bright content at daytime, looks very good. Just watched some content at night (dark room) with dark scenes, and I’m very disappointed to find obvious backlight uniformity issues: A big white blob on the top left and a smaller white blob on the bottom left (most visible during panning scenes with dark content). Also, irregular blooming everywhere around the letterbox borders.

I wonder how common this is. In a budget LCD TV, the blobs are subtle enough that they’d probably be considered within tolerance. But for the price range of this TV I expect more, since for about the same price I can get an OLED that will not be prone to such issues at all. Now I’m debating whether to try my luck with a replacement panel that may just end up with a different set of subtle blobs, or just go with exchanging for an OLED.

Neumann KH310A | Neumann KH120A | Ascend Sierra Towers & Horizon (RAAL) | Ascend Sierra 2EX | Revel F206 | Rythmik F18 x2 | Rythmik F12 | JL Audio E112 | SMSL M500 | Topping D10 | Sonos Amp | Marantz SR7012

Last edited by echopraxia; 12-01-2019 at 05:56 AM.
echopraxia is offline  
post #6914 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 08:05 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Darin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 6,110
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 105 Post(s)
Liked: 110
I'm having some major frustrations with settings on this set. I just bought a Panasonic UHD Blu-ray player. My older AVR (Denon AVR-4311ci) can't handle 4k/HDR, so I made sure to buy a player with dual HDMI outputs so I could run the video straight to the TV, and audio to the AVR. The problem is CEC. If I set the TV's input to the Blu-ray player, it automatically sets the AVR's input to to the TV for ARC. If I set the AVR back to the proper audio input for the blu-ray playter, the TV automatically switches to the input from the AVR. It seems IMPOSSIBLE to individually choose an audio source for the AVR and a video source for the TV unless I go in to the settings in the TV and disable Anynet AND go into the settings on the AVR and turn off HDMI control. But if I do that, neither the TV nor the receiver allow me to use ARC to get audio from the TV back to the AVR. The vast majority of our watching is sourced from the TV (broadcast or streaming via the TV), so I need audio returned to the AVR most of the time. I suppose an alternative is to use a separate digital audio connection back to the AVR, though I don't have a spare optical input. Perhaps I could juggle some things, but even if I did that, I'd be giving up higher audio formats from Netflix, etc., and even if I accept that compromise, I believe I've seen some posts of people having difficulty keeping the TV's speakers turned off with that set-up. Is my only other option going into the set-up menus for both the AVR and TV and disabling CEC every time I want to watch a blu-ray, then going back in and re-enabling it when I'm done?!?

An unrelated issue I've had since I got this set: It is constantly wanting to switch the HDMI black level to "normal" when I use my HTPC, which results in elevated black levels. I've tried setting to low, or setting it to auto (both of which fix the issue while I'm watching the HTPC), but every time I switch away from using the HTPC, the next time I use the HTPC input again it reverts back to normal.

Does anyone have any workarounds for any of this?

Thanks!
Darin is offline  
post #6915 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 08:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
thoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
Bought a Samsung 82Q90. Watched some mostly bright content at daytime, looks very good. Just watched some content at night (dark room) with dark scenes, and I’m very disappointed to find obvious backlight uniformity issues: A big white blob on the top left and a smaller white blob on the bottom left (most visible during panning scenes with dark content). Also, irregular blooming everywhere around the letterbox borders.
There have been some other complaints about black bar blooming specifically on the 82", some saying it's due to the 40x12 zone geometry on the 82" vs 30x16 on other sizes. But I don't recall other complaints about blobs. Are the problems seen with SDR or HDR content? Can you point at some specific content and timestamps? What settings are you using?
Terminader likes this.
thoth is online now  
post #6916 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 08:34 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nillaz View Post
The OC cable has it's own electronics in it and of course it can fail. However, whatever genius you spoke to obviously hasn't thought this through, regardless of what their diagnostics are showing them.



All of the brains are in the OC box. If the wire failed how in the world are you able to watch the TV's apps, etc? That info has to travel over the same OC cable as the HDMI data. It should be self evident to them that something failed in the OC box. I haven't taken one of the boxes apart but clearly something failed on the motherboard, or possibly an HDMI daughter board if they separate the ports from the main board.



That sucks that you have to jump through unnecessary hoops, but clearly common sense isn't always so common.

I was sure I had a bad OC box because after two days suddenly I couldn't see my dvr or blu ray player, but the apps worked. But when the repair guy came with a new box, he swapped the cable first and everything was ok. The cable has to have more fiber video feeds than one.
Kelly Kober is offline  
post #6917 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 09:25 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 428
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
There have been some other complaints about black bar blooming specifically on the 82", some saying it's due to the 40x12 zone geometry on the 82" vs 30x16 on other sizes. But I don't recall other complaints about blobs. Are the problems seen with SDR or HDR content? Can you point at some specific content and timestamps? What settings are you using?
I mainly notice it in very low-light HDR content with some bright or textured elements involved nearby (so that the local dimming can't shut off completely), especially when combined with a panning camera or other non-static content (which makes the fixed pattern nature of the blobs stand out more). Also, I haven't spent much time in the settings, and haven't done any kind of calibration, except to change the following settings from out-of-box default:

  • Local Dimming: High
  • Digital Clean View: Off
  • Auto Motion Plus: Off
  • Contrast Enhancer: Off
  • Eco Solution Settings: All Off
  • Intelligent Mode Settings: All Off

Two moments where I recall the issue being particularly noticeable:

  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 2, 17:15 - 17:20.
  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 3, 8:10 - 8:45.

I only really notice the issue in dark room viewing, but these scenes are so dark you won't see much at all in even a mildly illuminated room, unless your settings are configured to boost the scene into brighter values (which defeats the purpose of HDR anyway IMO).

The issue looks like subtle foggy/cloudy white blobs, fixed near the corners of the screen (mostly the top left and bottom left, but more subtle issues exist on the right as well). In a light room you might mistake them for screen reflections, or large foggy smudges. If you look closely enough in these scenes, you may notice a differently shaped blob in each quadrant of the screen, which also changes slightly in shape depending on viewing angle. The blobs are most obvious when viewing off-axis (e.g. left side of the couch), but also are visible even if perfectly on-axis.

It's fairly subtle and only shows up in dark HDR scenes like this. In SDR, the backlight is comparatively dim enough that I don't notice an issue. And in other HDR content I've seen so far, it doesn't get dark enough during panning where it becomes obvious. It's subtle enough that honestly I doubt it would be covered by warranty (it doesn't show up on any flat test images I could find), but it is very distracting in dark scenes like this when it becomes visible. Either way, I need to decide what to do within my return/exchange policy (thankfully I bought it locally). I don't know, maybe I'm expecting too much from an LED/LCD TV?

Neumann KH310A | Neumann KH120A | Ascend Sierra Towers & Horizon (RAAL) | Ascend Sierra 2EX | Revel F206 | Rythmik F18 x2 | Rythmik F12 | JL Audio E112 | SMSL M500 | Topping D10 | Sonos Amp | Marantz SR7012

Last edited by echopraxia; 12-01-2019 at 09:37 AM.
echopraxia is offline  
post #6918 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 09:37 AM
Advanced Member
 
thoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
I haven't spent much time in the settings, and haven't done any kind of calibration, except to change the following settings from out-of-box default:

  • Local Dimming: High
  • Digital Clean View: Off
  • Auto Motion Plus: Off
  • Contrast Enhancer: Off
  • Eco Solution Settings: All Off
  • Intelligent Mode Settings: All Off

Two moments where I recall the issue being particularly noticeable:

  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 2, 17:15 - 17:20.
  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 3, 8:10 - 8:45.
What Picture Mode and Color Tone are you using? I could compare for Netflix content, but I don't have Disney+.
thoth is online now  
post #6919 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 09:44 AM
Senior Member
 
bcab17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 388
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 90 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Anyone know of a pro calibrator in the NY (Long Island) area?
bcab17 is offline  
post #6920 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 09:55 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 428
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
I haven't spent much time in the settings, and haven't done any kind of calibration, except to change the following settings from out-of-box default:

  • Local Dimming: High
  • Digital Clean View: Off
  • Auto Motion Plus: Off
  • Contrast Enhancer: Off
  • Eco Solution Settings: All Off
  • Intelligent Mode Settings: All Off

Two moments where I recall the issue being particularly noticeable:

  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 2, 17:15 - 17:20.
  • The Mandalorian, Season 1, Episode 3, 8:10 - 8:45.
What Picture Mode and Color Tone are you using? I could compare for Netflix content, but I don't have Disney+.
Just “Standard” for both. Either way, this doesn’t seem to affect the backlight problem at all. Edit: I only tried the Color Tone though.

I’m not sure what Netflix content has extremely dark HDR scenes to test, but I’m open to suggestions to try.

Neumann KH310A | Neumann KH120A | Ascend Sierra Towers & Horizon (RAAL) | Ascend Sierra 2EX | Revel F206 | Rythmik F18 x2 | Rythmik F12 | JL Audio E112 | SMSL M500 | Topping D10 | Sonos Amp | Marantz SR7012

Last edited by echopraxia; 12-01-2019 at 10:15 AM.
echopraxia is offline  
post #6921 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 10:12 AM
Advanced Member
 
thoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
Just “Standard” for both. Either way, this doesn’t seem to affect the backlight problem at all.
Are you using the internal Disney+ app? If so, some have reported that local dimming High is broken for Standard picture mode for internal apps. In that case, as a test you could try changing local dimming to Standard, or changing picture mode to Movie (but not both). Another test you could try in any case is lowering HDR Contrast to 45 or so.
echopraxia likes this.
thoth is online now  
post #6922 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 10:13 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 428
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
Are you using the internal Disney+ app? If so, some have reported that local dimming High is broken for Standard picture mode for internal apps. In that case, as a test you could try changing local dimming to Standard, or changing picture mode to Movie (but not both). Another test you could try in any case is lowering HDR Contrast to 45 or so.
I will try that. Why do you say not both, though? I'll try Standard dimming in Standard mode, but what local dimming setting should I use if I use Movie picture mode?

Neumann KH310A | Neumann KH120A | Ascend Sierra Towers & Horizon (RAAL) | Ascend Sierra 2EX | Revel F206 | Rythmik F18 x2 | Rythmik F12 | JL Audio E112 | SMSL M500 | Topping D10 | Sonos Amp | Marantz SR7012
echopraxia is offline  
post #6923 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 10:21 AM
Advanced Member
 
thoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
I will try that. Why do you say not both, though? I'll try Standard dimming in Standard mode, but what local dimming setting should I use if I use Movie picture mode?
Keep local dimming at High for HDR Movie mode. On my 75", in HDR Standard picture mode, local dimming Standard measures about the same as local dimming High. But local dimming Standard has horrible peak brightness in HDR Movie mode. It might be tolerable for the Mandalorian, given that particular show's reported measly fake HDR, but not much else.
thoth is online now  
post #6924 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 10:36 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
BRAC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Edmonton, AB
Posts: 2,054
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 706 Post(s)
Liked: 619
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray0414 View Post
I can send you a link to a slightly discounted meter that someone sent me. It appears to be the best bedget meter available for a TV that does over 1000 nits.

82Q90*X4200*55OledC8*Oppo 203/Panasonic 820*Note10+
That would be much appreciated. Thank you!

Samsung 82” Q90R * LG 55” C8 * Denon X4500H * 5.2.4 Atmos * Xbox One X * PS4 Pro
BRAC is offline  
post #6925 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 11:11 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 428
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
Keep local dimming at High for HDR Movie mode. On my 75", in HDR Standard picture mode, local dimming Standard measures about the same as local dimming High. But local dimming Standard has horrible peak brightness in HDR Movie mode. It might be tolerable for the Mandalorian, given that particular show's reported measly fake HDR, but not much else.
Thank you! I tried both, and with Standard Picture Mode and Standard Local Dimming it seems slightly better, but with Movie Picture Mode and High Local Dimming it seems much better. It's still there, but not so distracting like before.

I'm aware that The Mandalorian is "fake HDR" in that it's only 2x SDR, but even so this shouldn't excuse any fixed-frame illumination non-uniformity issues. So, I just tried playing these scenes on my old-ish LG B6 OLED to check if there's anything in the content that could be causing this. On the OLED, I noticed that on these scenes there is a mild sort of "reverse vignette" effect around the edge of the frame! This could completely explain the cloudy backlight blobs I was seeing, if this particular 'reverse vignette' effect happens to be interacting poorly with the local dimming algorithm. It could also explain why I haven't seen the issue anywhere else so far.

As long as it's subtle and content-specific, I'd be totally okay with particular reverse vignette effects interacting with some subtle imperfections in rare cases -- that comes with the territory of FALD (even the best, like this), and would probably be unrealistic for me to expect OLED dark-room dark-scene precision here. All other content so far looks great (though I need to find more dark scenes to test), and so far now with the Movie Mode it also looks good here so far (though it's bright enough outside now that I need to wait for night again to truly confirm dark room performance).

So long as I don't detect the same pattern of blobs showing up in all content, this won't be bothersome to me and probably is just a regular (and rare) artifact from reverse vignette interacting with the FALD algorithm. Also, the letterbox bloom in of itself doesn't really bother me, and Movie Mode seems to have improved that as well.

However if I find the same exact pattern of cloudy blobs on other content, that will definitely be very annoying in the long run. Hopefully that doesn't happen though.

Neumann KH310A | Neumann KH120A | Ascend Sierra Towers & Horizon (RAAL) | Ascend Sierra 2EX | Revel F206 | Rythmik F18 x2 | Rythmik F12 | JL Audio E112 | SMSL M500 | Topping D10 | Sonos Amp | Marantz SR7012

Last edited by echopraxia; 12-01-2019 at 11:15 AM.
echopraxia is offline  
post #6926 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 11:33 AM
Advanced Member
 
thoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by echopraxia View Post
All other content so far looks great (though I need to find more dark scenes to test), and so far now with the Movie Mode it also looks good here so far (though it's bright enough outside now that I need to wait for night again to truly confirm dark room performance).
FWIW, Movie picture mode with Warm2 color tone should be the most accurate combination, for both SDR and HDR. And for HDR Movie/Warm2, accuracy should be further improved by lowering Contrast somewhat; you wouldn't know exactly how much without measuring, but I believe another 82" owner uses 42 (from calibration), and I use 45 (from calibration) on my 75".
Terminader likes this.
thoth is online now  
post #6927 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 12:02 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
elmalloc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 4,996
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 207 Post(s)
Liked: 115
got my 65" 90R over thanksgiving, looks good! Could have afforded 82" but they didn't have anything in stock and I'm not sure I'm going to use a TV in this room in the end. The TV is pretty good, been gaming on it with Outer Worlds (PC) and it's very smooth with game mode's settings on. Room is 17ftx19ft vaulted, 65" is the minimum.
Terminader likes this.

IN PROGRESS - Outdoor Theater:
Epson G7500U, Carl's Place CIH 21ft wide x 9ft screen

Game room:
Epson 5040UBE, Denon S920W, Philips BDP7501, NVidia Shield TV, PS4 Pro, SI 110"
elmalloc is offline  
post #6928 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 12:05 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
elmalloc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 4,996
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 207 Post(s)
Liked: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoth View Post
Interesting, I don't think I've ever had a Samsung where Movie/Warm2 wasn't the most accurate.



I got mine in May, and I probably average 10 hours per day of use. In September I had measurable drift from a calibration done about a month before. Since then it's been pretty stable.
are you retired?!

IN PROGRESS - Outdoor Theater:
Epson G7500U, Carl's Place CIH 21ft wide x 9ft screen

Game room:
Epson 5040UBE, Denon S920W, Philips BDP7501, NVidia Shield TV, PS4 Pro, SI 110"
elmalloc is offline  
post #6929 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 01:21 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Most other TV's on this site would have already had a detailed discussion on the newest firmware that was just released.

Is anybody seeing any improvements in picture quality, especially when upscaling broadcast tv?
crowlaw is offline  
post #6930 of 7475 Old 12-01-2019, 03:18 PM
Member
 
briancail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nillaz View Post
The OC cable has it's own electronics in it and of course it can fail. However, whatever genius you spoke to obviously hasn't thought this through, regardless of what their diagnostics are showing them.



All of the brains are in the OC box. If the wire failed how in the world are you able to watch the TV's apps, etc? That info has to travel over the same OC cable as the HDMI data. It should be self evident to them that something failed in the OC box. I haven't taken one of the boxes apart but clearly something failed on the motherboard, or possibly an HDMI daughter board if they separate the ports from the main board.



That sucks that you have to jump through unnecessary hoops, but clearly common sense isn't always so common.

Finally convinced Samsung to send replacement OC Box + OC Cable. Annoying wait for it to arrive. But, at least they were reasonable in the end.
briancail is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off