Samsung Q90 QLED Hands-On & Review - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #151 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by agincourt View Post
You make a great point. I remember bad PQ back to the 1960s and in the 80s those horrible rear projection big screens serving 480i. So anything today looks decent on it's own without side by side comarison
Most homes didn't have color until the 70s. I was in high school.
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post #152 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Yes, halo/bloom is caused by native contrast of the KCD panel not being sufficient to bring the black level of 'off' pixels down below the perceptible threshold.

The only 3 ways to reduce halo/bloom on a FALD LED/LCD are to:

-improve native contrast ratio of the LCD panel (~7000:1 is about the max).

-reduce the size of local dimming zones (by using more).

-improve the lical dimming algorithm so that each and every zone is only 'lit up' to the minimum luminance required to emit whatever are the brightest pixels within that zone (especially those zones also containing black / off pixels...).

All of that being said, this is true only for on-axis. One of the ways VA LCDs have delivered poor off-axis viewing is poorer black levels and increased halo/bloom when viewed off-axis. These off-axis photons are probably 'leaking' or otherwise the result of dispersion that corresponds to your 1b above.

So off-axis halo/bloom may not be strictly dependant on native contrast ratio only... (and if Samsung has succeeded to reduce/eliminate off-axis halo/bloom by adding these additional layers, that is fantastic).
Also, find a better way to isolate zones from each other behind the panel. If you can prevent light bleed across zones, any remaining blooming will be limited to the size of the zone. As you mentioned, native contrast still matters. While I appreciate how well some LCDs work, I'm still amazed how good a well done FALD can look based on the simple limitation.
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post #153 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Nillaz View Post
That figure is probably close to 2 years out of date at this point but came from a conversation with someone who works for Samsung that I trust implicitly upon their return from the same building that you visited. The only reason I remember it at all this point is that it was a crazy fast yet very specific number of seconds somewhere just south of 1 minute.



They could of course been totally talking out of their ass but I personally have no reason to believe that is the case. Every other piece of info I have received in the past has in fact turned out to be the real deal.
And it doesn't mean they make one in 50 sec. They could have multiple lines working on multiple sets. They also sell more cheap edgelits than anything else. A 90r will be more time consuming but even the cheapest set takes many minutes to make and the parts used to assemble took time as well. Speaking of how often a set comes off the line in a factory of many items in many lines doesn't tell you anything about the assembly of a given item, let alone the full manufacturing time.
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post #154 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 07:38 AM
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Nice write up. Everything sounds promising. Can not wait for the full review. Hopefully performance is as good as the on in this review.
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post #155 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by js950 View Post
Most homes didn't have color until the 70s. I was in high school.
That was probably the biggest breakthrough for television technology. I was born in 1972 so I do not think I ever saw a black and white TV.....
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post #156 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
That was probably the biggest breakthrough for television technology. I was born in 1972 so I do not think I ever saw a black and white TV.....
Born in 1971. But spent the 1970s in Greece, only watching black and white TVs... Not a lot of choice: Tom and Jerry, Little House on the Prairie & Star Trek (With Greek subtitles) seemed to be on constant rerun. And then one day I saw our new Sony Trinitron playing Sesame Street and I just couldn't believe it! Lol.

Especially back then, Greeks mostly went to movies, as opposed to watch TV at home.

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post #157 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
That was probably the biggest breakthrough for television technology. I was born in 1972 so I do not think I ever saw a black and white TV.....


Oh you youngins don’t know what you’re missing not worrying about red push/green tint.
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post #158 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 09:02 AM
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Born in 1949. Didn't have a color TV until I left college in 1968 and got a job. A year or so later I bought my mother a 21" Motorola Quasar (works in a drawer) color TV to replace our 20 year old Admiral 19" black and white TV. My first HD TV was a 720p 2004 Samsung 50" DLP that I still have sitting in storage in the basement, followed by a 1080p 46" Panasonic PZ800U in 2009. That just moved to my beach house with 30,000+ hours on it - still looks great and has the widest viewing angles ever.
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post #159 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 09:12 AM
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Growing up in the mid 70's, I can tell you that most kids who had their own TV in their room had a black and white set, even if bough new in the mid 70's due to price. It was pretty much a given that a 27" color TV will run around $700 in 1975 dollars which is $3400 today. If I recall correctly, even my 21" B&W cost my folks a good $250 back then and I couldn't move the thing because it weighed like solid lead. When we had Pong, no one noticed, even cartoons were ok, but the Atari 2600 was only playable in color.

Today, the most exciting thing about Samsung's 2019 releases are the price points for the quality. With $3400 today and a good sale, there will be some amazing things to be found. And as this wide viewing and anti-glare technology makes it into Sony, then Vizio and even TCL/Hisense- I suspect by later this very year, OLED could be in real trouble staying competitive, especially past 65".

Anyone attacking the reviewer here for giving us an admitted quick preview is missing the point. No one is trying to deceive and anyone making a pre-order based upon an initial impression deserves what they get. Even the reviewer said go to your local brick and mortar (with your wife!) and view all options on a source close to what you will be using (if possible). Choice is not about perfect reference output but personal preference, especially with color 'pop'.

There is one reason I will not touch Samsung personally and that is the Dolby Vision thing. Heck, charge me double what Dolby charges you in royalty and then charge me triple what it costs you (minimal) to put in passive 3D and *CHA-CHING*!
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post #160 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Born in 1971. But spent the 1970s in Greece, only watching black and white TVs... Not a lot of choice: Tom and Jerry, Little House on the Prairie & Star Trek (With Greek subtitles) seemed to be on constant rerun. And then one day I saw our new Sony Trinitron playing Sesame Street and I just couldn't believe it! Lol.

Especially back then, Greeks mostly went to movies, as opposed to watch TV at home.
1956. All we had was B&W during the early years. One day a neighbor down the street invited a few of us kids over to see his new color tv. Not many tv shows were broadcast in color in the beginning. I was like WOW!!! INSANE!!! COLOR!!! His name was Mr. White. He was an astronaut...died a short time later during a test of a space capsule when it caught fire, along with two others.

A year or two later my father finally bought one. And not to much later he (we) was transferred to Germany (military brat i be). Think I remember going back to B&W again...lol.

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post #161 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 10:20 AM
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1959 and ya, our first color tv was a thrill. Also, I think 25” was the most common size back then. Hockey was brutal to watch but I was a big Bruins fan in the late 60s early 70s so we just accepted that you often couldn’t see the puck. HD has really benefited that sport.
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post #162 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 10:26 AM
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1959 and ya, our first color tv was a thrill. Also, I think 25” was the most common size back then. Hockey was brutal to watch but I was a big Bruins fan in the late 60s early 70s so we just accepted that you often couldn’t see the puck. HD has really benefited that sport.
And somehow 25" seemed huge. Think I remember ours being 19". Dreamed of one day owning a monster 25".

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post #163 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 10:29 AM
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Back on topic. We want more info! We want more info!

Ya got us all dressed up and ready Mr. Imagic...when ya going to spill more beans?
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post #164 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Kenbar View Post
Back on topic. We want more info! We want more info!

Ya got us all dressed up and ready Mr. Imagic...when ya going to spill more beans?
Yah, geez - you guys sure knw how to take a thread wat OT, don't you .

Dog days of March, I guess...
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post #165 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenbar View Post
Back on topic. We want more info! We want more info!

Ya got us all dressed up and ready Mr. Imagic...when ya going to spill more beans?
Yah, geez - you guys sure knw how to take a thread wat OT, don't you [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif[/IMG].

Dog days of March, I guess...
ha ha, touché! We need to get out more. Tell us more about this thing called Q90 imagic.
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post #166 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Kenbar View Post
Back on topic. We want more info! We want more info!

Ya got us all dressed up and ready Mr. Imagic...when ya going to spill more beans?
This thread only started last Friday (March 8) when he said he did not have the review unit. So it's only Sunday March 10, does he even have the review unit in his possession?
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post #167 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
This thread only started last Friday (March 8) when he said he did not have the review unit. So it's only Sunday March 10, does he even have the review unit in his possession?
March 8th...he started a thread but did not have the review unit? And here we be two days later. Our bodies decaying as we grow old waiting. Wondering. Hoping to hear something before the kids ship us off to the nursing homes. Is this how you run your parties Imagic? Well, guess I should help out. Here's a pic for all to enjoy while we wait. Might look good on a Q90R...who knows...


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post #168 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Kenbar View Post
March 8th...he started a thread but did not have the review unit? And here we be two days later. Our bodies decaying as we grow old waiting. Wondering. Hoping to hear something before the kids ship us off to the nursing homes. Is this how you run your parties Imagic? Well, guess I should help out. Here's a pic for all to enjoy while we wait. Might look good on a Q90R...who knows...

This is the best post I've ever seen. You should let your wife ghost write for you more often.
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post #169 of 192 Old 03-10-2019, 05:19 PM
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^Looks like view from our honeymoon cottage at the Divi Divi beach hotel in Aruba in 1978.
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post #170 of 192 Old 03-11-2019, 03:41 AM
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It bothers me whenever one of his vids show up here because you know he's making money by creating controversy and I mean 'creating' in its full meaning. If the mods could prevent that, it would be awesome but i suspect that isn't easy to do.
Very true and normally I don't watch them but so far this has been about the only video showing off the viewing angle with normal content and the lights off.



Folks in owner's threads asking for pics instead of videos ... (and getting about 20 degree off angle pics)
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post #171 of 192 Old 03-11-2019, 05:54 AM
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Very true and normally I don't watch them but so far this has been about the only video showing off the viewing angle with normal content and the lights off.



Folks in owner's threads asking for pics instead of videos ... (and getting about 20 degree off angle pics)
Watching a vid from a liar has no value. AT 30* people on screen start becoming stick figures. Why become overly critical beyond that? It's also an easy one to test at a shop without concerning yourself with the source.
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post #172 of 192 Old 03-11-2019, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by VA_DaveB View Post
^Looks like view from our honeymoon cottage at the Divi Divi beach hotel in Aruba in 1978.

lol I also honeymooned at the Divi Divi and that's exactly what I thought when I saw the picture last night.

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post #173 of 192 Old 03-12-2019, 02:27 AM
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Watching a vid from a liar has no value. AT 30* people on screen start becoming stick figures. Why become overly critical beyond that? It's also an easy one to test at a shop without concerning yourself with the source.
said by someone who hasn't even seen the video . 'Critical'? If Ultra Wide Viewing Angle is announced then it is only normal that one wants to find out just how Wide it is.
And no they aren't in the shops here yet and no idea when they will be and secondly it will almost never be a completely dark environment where the antiglare filter isn't helping out 50% ...
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post #174 of 192 Old 03-12-2019, 02:29 AM
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Watching a vid from a liar has no value. AT 30* people on screen start becoming stick figures. Why become overly critical beyond that? It's also an easy one to test at a shop without concerning yourself with the source.
said by someone who hasn't even seen the video . 'Critical'? If Ultra Wide Viewing Angle is announced then it is only normal that one wants to find out just how Wide it is (and seeing as it is apparently his mission to make the Q8FN stand out the Q90R result should be even more impressive for the QA critics ).
And no they aren't in the shops here yet and no idea when they will be (the 55" version in particular or even the 55Q950R) and secondly it will almost never be a completely dark environment where the antiglare filter isn't helping out 50% ...
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post #175 of 192 Old 03-12-2019, 04:42 AM
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I've got some awesome waterfront property for you.
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post #176 of 192 Old 03-12-2019, 01:26 PM
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Full review of (hopefully) a 75" Q90R is forthcoming (I don't have a review unit yet).
Any update on when you'll receive a unit and what size?

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post #177 of 192 Old 03-13-2019, 11:38 AM
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No...

I am taking about a graphic I saw during a PowerPoint presentation with Samsung engineers.

This?



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post #178 of 192 Old 03-14-2019, 12:02 PM
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Looking forward to hearing your thoughts with one that is a shipping model and not a hand picked set!!
Do you know what the length of the one connect cable Samsung provides for this unit and the Q70?

Thanks!
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post #179 of 192 Old 03-14-2019, 12:36 PM
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Do you know what the length of the one connect cable Samsung provides for this unit and the Q70?

Thanks!
according to the previews I saw it comes with a 15' and a 50' is available for several hundred additional dollars.
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post #180 of 192 Old 03-14-2019, 01:11 PM
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according to the previews I saw it comes with a 15' and a 50' is available for several hundred additional dollars.

Thanks! I went on Samsung website and there were some reviews from last year's model that said 49" I'm wondering what kind of cable can take all video and audio out of the TV at full 4K 60hz and cover most of DC3 colorspace and Rec2020 or whatever else is coming down the pike and be as thin and invisible as Samsung says.
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