2019 Vizio P series G1 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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2019 Vizio P series G1 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk)

New owner of the P659-G1 here and I haven’t seen any other dedicated threads yet. For starters, I’m coming from a Samsung 5300 plasma that’s had picture issues for the last few years so needless to say, the Vizio is a huge upgrade for me.

Unboxing and setup was simple. I’m using a Denon AVR-4400 and the Xfinity 4K cable box in my chain. Everything (I think) is communicating properly. Netflix from the cable box displays with 4K HDR on the TV and Netflix from the in-TV app displays with Dolby Vision. So check those boxes. ARC through HDMI seems to be seamless as it’s all working. I only have a 4.0 setup though so I can’t test for Atmos or some fancier surround processing.

Picture impressions by me, a typical amateur TV viewer, are good. First off, I only got this thing setup late last night and I don’t own an HDR DVD player. The TV has built in test patterns but I haven’t had a chance to run through them yet. I put the TV in ‘calibrated’ mode and haven’t yet made any other adjustments. The picture is bright, it looks good, and I don’t have too many criticisms.

I put on Our Planet to try and assess the picture. For normal TV viewing (about 1.5 hours of watching), I did not notice any anomalies related to local dimming. Transitions and scene changes looked smooth. The only local dimming anomaly occurred on an all gray loading screen that had a white circle in the middle with a black area of the whole circle going around the circle. In that case, you could see each one of the local zones flickering on and off. But that never occurred in real-life viewing.

Off axis viewing did highlight some imperfections. Standing around 13 ft from the screen and stepping ~8 feet to the side you notice a fairly visible shift in contrast. It’s not terrible, my wife would never notice, but I do. I do think that as you go even more off axis from there it does t seem to get that much worse. To me there was this point where you notice that it’s deteriorated, but then it more or less holds there. Minor annoyance but I knew what I was getting with LCD.

The only other anomaly was some very very minor banding. There was a scene in Our Planet in the desert, where the screen is tan color from a dust storm. In that instance, I saw a couple very faint bands when I was off axis. This would never be noticed by the casual observer, but I saw it. For me, I’m not worried at all by it. It took a very specific screen picture and off-axis viewing to see it.

So, there are some early observations. What else can I do to help the forum? Not sure if anyone else owns this thing yet. Are there any tests that I’m able to run to help unlock some mystery about the panel? Happy to oblige when I can.

Thanks all.
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post #2 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 05:27 PM
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There are scenes you can run, or videos you can find that would act as torture teats for DSE, banding, fald issues and backlight uniformity. Or you can just put on a hockey game.

But I'd never demand or even recommend someone go looking for flaws unless they're interested or inclined to do so. Especially if you like what you see so far.
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post #3 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 05:37 PM
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Congrats to your new TV and sharing your initial impressions. There has been some sharing of updates in the Vizio 2019 Quantum Dots thread. There are 2-3 videos from a controversial Youtuber who has bought the set and done side by sides vs Q8FN. Looking forward to more reviews and impressions.

Tend to agree. If you like the picture dont go looking for trouble.

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post #4 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I’ve run into one issue and hopefully someone familiar with Vizio and compatibility issues can help. I went to the rtings setting for the 2018 PQ for ideas and ran across the suggestion to turn on ‘full UHD color’ in the input menu. Now, the TV had already said HDR10 when watching Our Planet through the Netflix App on the cable box with this set to off (I suspect the Xfinity box can’t pass Dolby Vision), so I wasn’t sure if the full UHD setting actually did anything. However, turning on full UHD color did fix another issue, which is when I select ‘enhanced 4K’ in the Denon 4400 (instead of standard), the Denon no longer gave me an error that the TV didn’t support enhanced. Unfortunately, after selecting ‘enhanced’ in the Denon, the picture died and I get no signal through the HDMI input. I can rectify the no signal by either turning off ‘full UHD color’ in the Vizio or switching the Denon back to ‘standard’ 4K.

So, there are a couple things to test. One, there is a chance that my HDMI cables (purchased ~4.5 years ago) don’t have high enough bandwidth to support this. However, would I be able to get 4K HDR10 in the first place, which I can get according to the info being displayed by the TV if I had cables that weren’t high enough bandwidth?

Second, is there just some kind of compatibility issue between enabling ‘enhanced’ on the Denon and ‘full UHD color’ on the Vizio? Rtings does make a comment that enabling full UHD color “may cause compatibility issues with older devices.”

Where does that leave me? What exactly am I seeing picture-wise with the Denon on ‘standard’ and full UHD color set to ‘off’? The TV is telling me 2160p HDR10....so am I actually missing anything? Or can I just chalk this up as a compatibility anomaly that isn’t actually impacting the picture quality?
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post #5 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Attached are two images using the TVs internal test pattern. My guess is that this is about as bad a torture test that you can do to test for banding. It’s there, but it’s not that bad. In regular viewing you need some very specific screen conditions to see it. Also, I’d point out that there’s virtually no vignetting and certainly nothing that appears in regular viewing.
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post #6 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by rhoffman000 View Post
I’ve run into one issue and hopefully someone familiar with Vizio and compatibility issues can help. I went to the rtings setting for the 2018 PQ for ideas and ran across the suggestion to turn on ‘full UHD color’ in the input menu. Now, the TV had already said HDR10 when watching Our Planet through the Netflix App on the cable box with this set to off (I suspect the Xfinity box can’t pass Dolby Vision), so I wasn’t sure if the full UHD setting actually did anything. However, turning on full UHD color did fix another issue, which is when I select ‘enhanced 4K’ in the Denon 4400 (instead of standard), the Denon no longer gave me an error that the TV didn’t support enhanced. Unfortunately, after selecting ‘enhanced’ in the Denon, the picture died and I get no signal through the HDMI input. I can rectify the no signal by either turning off ‘full UHD color’ in the Vizio or switching the Denon back to ‘standard’ 4K.

So, there are a couple things to test. One, there is a chance that my HDMI cables (purchased ~4.5 years ago) don’t have high enough bandwidth to support this. However, would I be able to get 4K HDR10 in the first place, which I can get according to the info being displayed by the TV if I had cables that weren’t high enough bandwidth?

Second, is there just some kind of compatibility issue between enabling ‘enhanced’ on the Denon and ‘full UHD color’ on the Vizio? Rtings does make a comment that enabling full UHD color “may cause compatibility issues with older devices.”

Where does that leave me? What exactly am I seeing picture-wise with the Denon on ‘standard’ and full UHD color set to ‘off’? The TV is telling me 2160p HDR10....so am I actually missing anything? Or can I just chalk this up as a compatibility anomaly that isn’t actually impacting the picture quality?
Turning on full UHD color only impacts external inputs. That is why you were already getting Netflix HDR from the internal app. The enhanced setting on the AVR is similar to the full UHD color setting on the TV, both need to be enabled in order to pass and receive HDR.

Your older cables might be the issue that is holding you back from getting HDR from external sources, you need 18gb/s cables to properly pass HDR. Monoprice sells popular HDMI cables that will do the job for about $6 each. Amazon Basics and Mediabridge also have cheap cables that will do the job. Make sure they are 18gb/s capable.
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post #7 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Here’s an actual picture from Our Planet. Again, I’d imagine this is about as bad as it gets...and understanding that this isn’t a top end TV I’m not sure if I should expect it to be significantly better. The camera probably makes it a bit worse and it still isn’t that bad.
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post #8 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:36 PM
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Turning on full UHD color only impacts external inputs. That is why you were already getting Netflix HDR from the internal app. The enhanced setting on the AVR is similar to the full UHD color setting on the TV, both need to be enabled in order to pass and receive HDR.

Your older cables might be the issue that is holding you back from getting HDR from external sources, you need 18gb/s cables to properly pass HDR. Monoprice sells popular HDMI cables that will do the job for about $6 each. Amazon Basics and Mediabridge also have cheap cables that will do the job. Make sure they are 18gb/s capable.
sorry I misread your original post. How do you have the cable box connected? Via the AVR or direct to the TV?
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post #9 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Sorry if I wasn’t clear. When playing Netflix through the cable box app, the TV is telling me it’s displaying 2160p HDR10. Even though the Denon is set to standard and the TV input has full UHD disabled. I found something online that suggested you don’t need full UHD enabled in order to get HDR from all sources, “just most.” If the TV says HDR10 when pressing the info button is there a chance that it’s not full HDR10? Or would the TV not say it if it wasn’t true?

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Your older cables might be the issue that is holding you back from getting HDR from external sources, you need 18gb/s cables to properly pass HDR. Monoprice sells popular HDMI cables that will do the job for about $6 each. Amazon Basics and Mediabridge also have cheap cables that will do the job. Make sure they are 18gb/s capable.
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post #10 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 07:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Cable box to AVR, then AVR to TV.

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Turning on full UHD color only impacts external inputs. That is why you were already getting Netflix HDR from the internal app. The enhanced setting on the AVR is similar to the full UHD color setting on the TV, both need to be enabled in order to pass and receive HDR.

Your older cables might be the issue that is holding you back from getting HDR from external sources, you need 18gb/s cables to properly pass HDR. Monoprice sells popular HDMI cables that will do the job for about $6 each. Amazon Basics and Mediabridge also have cheap cables that will do the job. Make sure they are 18gb/s capable.
sorry I misread your original post. How do you have the cable box connected? Via the AVR or direct to the TV?
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post #11 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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And to clarify, my cables are “Perfect Path 1000 series, high speed HDMI with Ethernet.” Pretty sure they came from monoprice.

Attached is a pic of what the TV is telling me it’s displaying which leads me to believe I’m getting full 4K HDR10 even though the TV full UHD is set to off and the Denon is set to output ‘standard.’
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post #12 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 09:01 PM
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And to clarify, my cables are “Perfect Path 1000 series, high speed HDMI with Ethernet.” Pretty sure they came from monoprice.

Attached is a pic of what the TV is telling me it’s displaying which leads me to believe I’m getting full 4K HDR10 even though the TV full UHD is set to off and the Denon is set to output ‘standard.’
The results are opposite of what is expected. Do you have any other 4K HDR devices to test out? Are you up to date on the firmware for both the AVR and the Vizio? Try enabling full UHD color and enhanced 4K, then reseating the HDMI cables. Then try a hard reset and then a factory reset if things are still off.

The only way to test the cable is to take a known HDR source and test if HDR passes correctly. You can do this via the AVR or directly to the Vizio.
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post #13 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 09:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Unfortunately I don’t own anything else that can output a 4K signal. I’ll try buying a new high speed cable to see if that makes a difference. I can also run the cable box directly to the TV just to see if I notice anything.

Take a look at these two pictures. One, which you can tell by the label, is displaying Dolby Vision through the TV’s Netflix App. In looking around the outline of the polar bear, there are no visible gradations of white, it’s completely smooth.

The other picture is the same scene originating from Netflix on the cable box. Again, the TV says 4K HDR10, but there are definitely visible gradations (bell shaped curves above the polar bear) in this format that are not visible in the Dolby Vision format.

Would this be an expected difference between Dolby Vision and HDR10?
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post #14 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 09:37 PM
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Unfortunately I don’t own anything else that can output a 4K signal. I’ll try buying a new high speed cable to see if that makes a difference. I can also run the cable box directly to the TV just to see if I notice anything.

Take a look at these two pictures. One, which you can tell by the label, is displaying Dolby Vision through the TV’s Netflix App. In looking around the outline of the polar bear, there are no visible gradations of white, it’s completely smooth.

The other picture is the same scene originating from Netflix on the cable box. Again, the TV says 4K HDR10, but there are definitely visible gradations (bell shaped curves above the polar bear) in this format that are not visible in the Dolby Vision format.

Would this be an expected difference between Dolby Vision and HDR10?
If you buy Monoprice, make sure it has a Certified Premium High Speed label. In case you hadn't noticed, the full UHD color setting is separately enabled for each of the HDMI inputs. I don't believe it works on HDMI 5 though, as I believe that is designed to be a low lag 120Hz gaming input that doesn't support HDR.

I'm not a big believer in making judgments based on pics posted on the internet but based on your description, that shouldn't be a differentiator between HDR10 and Dolby Vision. My guess is that it might be a limitation of the cable box's Netflix app.
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post #15 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 09:40 PM
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I’ll try buying a new high speed cable to see if that makes a difference.
Generally the advice is to get "Premium Certified" cables from Monoprice, with the QR Code. (Or Amazon Basics with same.) That's the evidence that the specific cable has been tested as actually passing 18Gbps as opposed to being theoretically capable of it, if everything got assembled correctly. HDMI is really pushing the limits of what you can do over copper and everything has to be essentially perfect for it to work at max bandwidth.
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post #16 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 10:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestion. Cables have been ordered and we’ll see if that fixes it. I should have them by Friday night.

Now I get to nervously wait to see if the 20ft certified cable snakes through the too small conduit my contractor installed 5 years ago. Ha!

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I’ll try buying a new high speed cable to see if that makes a difference.
Generally the advice is to get "Premium Certified" cables from Monoprice, with the QR Code. (Or Amazon Basics with same.) That's the evidence that the specific cable has been tested as actually passing 18Gbps as opposed to being theoretically capable of it, if everything got assembled correctly. HDMI is really pushing the limits of what you can do over copper and everything has to be essentially perfect for it to work at max bandwidth.
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post #17 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 11:05 PM
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The other picture is the same scene originating from Netflix on the cable box. Again, the TV says 4K HDR10, but there are definitely visible gradations (bell shaped curves above the polar bear) in this format that are not visible in the Dolby Vision format.
That's to be expected since you don't have the Full UHD color/Enhanced 4K options enabled. Any external device will show banding because without that option the HDMI port(s) is rate limited. This was a common setting on earlier 4k HDR TVs, for example my 2016 Samsung KS8000 has a similar setting I had to enable.

Some details from Samsung on this, which the Vizio seems to behave similarly:

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"UHD Color is essentially a switch that allows the user to setup the TV to match the source material being sent through the HDMI ports. For 2015 Samsung TVs, this feature must be turned ON if the HDMI input is receiving a 10 Bit signal. For 2016 TVs, the TVs will automatically detect the signal and enable this function automatically (because the UBD K8500 is the currently the only UHD Source on the market). When other UHD sources become available, this feature needs to be turned on to process 10 bit and higher signals on Samsung TVs.

An HDMI connection HDMI UHD Color set to OFF supports up to UHD 50/60p 4:2:0 input signals, while an HDMI connection with HDMI UHD Color set to ON supports UHD 50/60p 4:4:4 and 4:2:2 input signals
You can also see the recommendation to enable Full UHD Color from CNET's settings for the 2018 P series here:
https://www.cnet.com/forums/discussi...15324505008366

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Unlike Samsung or LG sets, you'll have to set the TV's highest-bandwidth HDMI mode -- called Full UHD Color by Vizio -- manually. It's not required for every 4K HDR source, but will be for many.
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post #18 of 52 Old 06-12-2019, 11:15 PM
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That's to be expected since you don't have the Full UHD color/Enhanced 4K options enabled. Any external device will show banding because without that option the HDMI port(s) is rate limited. This was a common setting on earlier 4k HDR TVs, for example my 2016 Samsung KS8000 has a similar setting I had to enable.

Some details from Samsung on this, which the Vizio seems to behave similarly:



You can also see the recommendation to enable Full UHD Color from CNET's settings for the 2018 P series here:
https://www.cnet.com/forums/discussi...15324505008366
Good explanation. That suggests that its more likely that the cables are the problem, and once they are upgraded and Full UHD and Enhanced 4K are enabled he'll get a proper HDR experience.
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post #19 of 52 Old 06-14-2019, 07:12 AM
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Thanks for starting this thread! I'm very interested in this TV (upgrading from an antique Panny plasma). What are the lighting conditions in your TV room? My living room can go from very dark to very bright with the reflection from a large sliding glass door off to the side that washes out the plasma set in dark scenes.
Thanks!
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Good explanation. That suggests that its more likely that the cables are the problem, and once they are upgraded and Full UHD and Enhanced 4K are enabled he'll get a proper HDR experience.
He could test the cables directly by taking the AVR out of the chain and connecting the TV right to the 4k cable box. If "Full UHD color" on that input now works, then the AVR (or other HDMI cable needed to connect the 3 devices) is the culprit. If it doesn't, it's probably the cables he has.
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post #21 of 52 Old 06-14-2019, 06:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, I’m back with good news, bad news, and one complaint.

First the good. I purchased the certified high speed cables from Monoprice and now it’s almost working as it should (more on this below). I’m able to select both enhanced mode on the AVR as well as full UHD enabled on the TV and I’ve got a stable picture. Plus, the color gradient banding that I was seeing before is largely gone. In addition, I also purchased a 20ft active HDMI cable that wasn’t one of the certified cables (it’s 30AWG so it’ll fit through my conduit better) and it also works.

Now the bad. HDMI 1, which is the input with ARC, isn’t stable. I tried both the certified cable and the active cable. I tried running through the AVR and running it directly from the cable box and taking the AVR out of the chain entirely. Regardless, I could not get the TV to display a picture that wasn’t constantly cutting out when watching either regular HD content or Netflix based 4K. When both full UHD and enhanced 4K on the AVR were enabled, the picture would not hold.

Now, I’ve tested out all the other HDMI inputs (2,3,4) except 5 (which is HD only) and the picture is stable with either cable and either signal path (with or without the AVR).

So, what the heck is going on? Why can’t I get a stable picture through HDMI 1 but I can get it through every other input? Is there something related to ARC that’s messing it up?

My complaint is that HDMI 1-3 face down. About three inches below the input the TV case juts back out. When using a thicker gage cable, or even 30AWG, you’re forced to slightly bend the cable to get it to fit and stay in the input. It’s a stupid design.

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post #22 of 52 Old 06-14-2019, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
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I’m not sure of the nits difference between your Panny and my Samsung 5300, but my wife and I used to turn off all the lights in the living room whenever we wanted to watch a show at night. Now, with the Vizio, there’s no need to do this. We don’t get direct sunlight on the TV, but our living room isn't huge and it has 8, 9.5 watt, 665 lumen LED light bulbs with only an 8ft ceiling. While a dark room is great, I now feel there’s no need to even turn the light dimmer down if I don’t want to. Plus, the anti-reflective qualities of the screen are a significant upgrade over my Samsung.

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Thanks for starting this thread! I'm very interested in this TV (upgrading from an antique Panny plasma). What are the lighting conditions in your TV room? My living room can go from very dark to very bright with the reflection from a large sliding glass door off to the side that washes out the plasma set in dark scenes.
Thanks!
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post #23 of 52 Old 06-16-2019, 07:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I’m still having uneven results with what seems to be some HDMI handshake issues. My wife has said the TV has turned on by itself a couple times. Earlier today when I turned it on, I then had to reboot the cable box to get a picture.

Good news is that using the HDMI 4 input, I’ve run into no picture flickering and once it’s all on, it’s stable on all content. I’ve ordered all new certified monoprice cables just to rule out any other issues. That way I can drop my long length cable from 20 ft to 15ft and just try a different cable connecting the cable box to the AVR. It’s also possible that Xfinitys box doesn’t play well with the Denon AVR.

So more things to test over the next couple days. If I can’t get the HDMI 1 (ARC) input to work with the AVR in the chain, I might have to try and contact Vizio.
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post #24 of 52 Old 06-17-2019, 08:03 AM
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I’m not sure of the nits difference between your Panny and my Samsung 5300, but my wife and I used to turn off all the lights in the living room whenever we wanted to watch a show at night. Now, with the Vizio, there’s no need to do this. We don’t get direct sunlight on the TV, but our living room isn't huge and it has 8, 9.5 watt, 665 lumen LED light bulbs with only an 8ft ceiling. While a dark room is great, I now feel there’s no need to even turn the light dimmer down if I don’t want to. Plus, the anti-reflective qualities of the screen are a significant upgrade over my Samsung.
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post #25 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 06:34 AM
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HDR blooming issue

Is it that bad?
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post #26 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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I’ll keep an eye out for it when I get a chance. I don’t game so I’m somewhat limited on being able to feed an HDR source (I don’t have an HDR DVD player either) and check for something like that. It seems like a bit of a torture test and I’ve never noticed it live.

If you know of content that I can source through Netflix or Prime to test for that type of blooming I’d be happy to do it.

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HDR blooming issue

Is it that bad?
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post #27 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 06:52 AM
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The PQX seems to suffer from similar issue. I find this quite surprising as the rting review of PQ did not give any indication of such problem.
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post #28 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 06:59 AM
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Is this the shill YouTuber that people were posting videos of in another thread on this forum? Or is his videos legit?


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post #29 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by qoopy View Post
HDR blooming issue

Is it that bad?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swk6H786Njs
I'm not saying blooming isn't real, but look again at that video. He has those TVs calibrated completely differently; the Vizio has the shadow detail cranked, everything looks washed out. The Q8 is producing a much darker, contrasty image. If the Vizio were using the proper settings for brightness and black level, I'd bet the blooming becomes dramatically less, if not invisible.

Do not trust this guy's videos. He sets the TVs up to show the 'defects' he wants you to see. Any FALD LCD set can be made to bloom horribly; The real question should be: does it do it when set up and calibrated in your space?
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post #30 of 52 Old 06-18-2019, 08:56 AM
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Is this the shill YouTuber that people were posting videos of in another thread on this forum? Or is his videos legit?


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Yep it's the same guy.
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