Sony Z9F vs Vizio Quantums - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 21 Old 07-13-2019, 07:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Sony Z9F vs Vizio Quantums

Any thoughts on the Z9F compared to the new Vizio Quantums(P and X)? We have an open box available at BB here that I can pick up with a 5 year warranty. Room would be a fairly bright living room with both evening and day watching. I know the Z was Sony's flagship lcd but it sounds like some were disappointed with the tradeoff of black levels for wide viewing angles. There are also pretty good deals on new X950G and X900F at Dell right now so those are also a possibility. I'm looking at 65". Thanks.

Last edited by teachsac; 07-13-2019 at 08:39 AM. Reason: removed price talk
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post #2 of 21 Old 07-13-2019, 09:04 AM
 
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The Vizio P and X will be far better because they have many more dimmable zones and a higher contrast ratio.
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post #3 of 21 Old 07-13-2019, 09:12 AM
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I'd go with the Vizio and save the money. Your gonna get 90-95% of the performance of the Sony for way less.
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post #4 of 21 Old 07-13-2019, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Some pretty heavy moderation going on here.
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post #5 of 21 Old 07-13-2019, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by stuuke View Post
Some pretty heavy moderation going on here.
Oh well. If I were in your shoes, I’d pull the trigger on the Z9F and not think twice about it.
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post #6 of 21 Old 07-14-2019, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by stuuke View Post
Some pretty heavy moderation going on here.
If you are a stickler and dislike panel uniformity/banding and blooming...I would go Sony all day long


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post #7 of 21 Old 07-14-2019, 07:56 AM
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If price isn't a large consideration, I'd take Sony quality, motion, gradients and scaling every time. Word is that the 75 Z9f is better with blooming than the 65 and the one area along with contrast that the Vizio is better. Folks will tell you that Vizio is better due to contrast which is impressive in a static measurement but that's all it's got on the Sony and even with more dimming zones, the FALD is more visible in use. There's a lot more to quality video than static contrast.
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post #8 of 21 Old 07-14-2019, 08:34 AM
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Z9F all the way!

The only thing that would give me pause in recommending the 65” Z9F is excessive blooming. I owned the 75” version, which is said to be much better than the 65”(far more zones), and ended up returning it due to excessive blooming and poor reflection handling.

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post #9 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by stuuke View Post
Some pretty heavy moderation going on here.
While I do not understand why they don't want us discussing price here (THE most important detail when considering purchasing something), I do not own the forum so it doesn't matter TOO much what I think. That said, I do appreciate when people actually enforce rules that they set (unlike, for example, the police and speed limits). It would be more annoying, IMO, if the moderators were constantly absent and threads got out of control (which would definitely happen here because of OLED lol).

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post #10 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by imabel View Post
The Vizio P and X will be far better because they have many more dimmable zones and a higher contrast ratio.
All the dimming zones in the world do not matter if you have poor algorithms and software to utilize them.

I love my Z9F and I wouldn't trade it for any Vizio that's been made. And trust me, I tried *very* hard to go with Vizio. I mean, they're so much less expensive, why wouldn't I!? But the more we looked at the TV's side by side, the more we found issues with the Vizio's that we didn't like.

Consider light output, image processing, color accuracy, upscaling, motion, panel uniformity, panel lottery... can I stop now? Of course no TV is perfect (despite what the Z9D guys say ), so if you're obsessed with *native* contrast ratio and/or reflection handling, the Z9F isn't for you.

The PQX's sure were hyped this year, and low and behold, didn't live up to it. They're fine TV's, but they are still a budget brand and are lacking when it comes to some of the refinements that Sony offers. Even after all of the 2019 models have (finally) hit the shelves, a Z9F at a reasonable price (open box) is a fantastic choice.

Not hating on Vizio, or PQX... just saying that, IMO, the Z9F is absolutely superior. In my experience, the Vizio's always look better on paper than they do in the flesh, whereas Sony seems to be the opposite.

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post #11 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 12:00 PM
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Vizios remind me of Hyundais or Kias in that their specs look good on paper but the whole is normally less than the sum of the parts. If the Z9F is too expensive, you should consider the X950G.
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post #12 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 12:54 PM
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Or, instead of asking me (aka some random know-it-all on the internet), you can go to rtings and see for yourself.
Rtings rates the px65 better (some might say superior) for watching movies, hdr movies, video games and hdr gaming. And the px75 is less than half the price of the 75z9f...
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post #13 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by g0ndor View Post
Or, instead of asking me (aka some random know-it-all on the internet), you can go to rtings and see for yourself.
Rtings rates the px65 better (some might say superior) for watching movies, hdr movies, video games and hdr gaming. And the px75 is less than half the price of the 75z9f...
True, but Rtings also rated the Q9FN very highly for HDR movies and that set has some very serious FALD algorithm inconsistency and black crush issues. If I can see the FALD at work...it’s game over!

I personally don’t think Rtings spends enough time with these sets to uncover most of their flaws. Rtings is certainly a great source for numbers on the core performance metrics though.

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post #14 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 06:00 PM
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Their grade has little to do with real world use. Very rotr test. Foe instance, current better Sonys get downgraded for motion because the BFI won't flicker at 60hz. That their zonal 120hz BFI works better than any other tV on the market for motion, flicker or artifacts is completely dismissed. I love ratings but you have to know how to read their reviews and observe their pics. The final # is not universal and even if it were, strengths and weaknesses vary by individual.
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post #15 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 06:24 PM
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Vizios remind me of Hyundais or Kias in that their specs look good on paper but the whole is normally less than the sum of the parts. If the Z9F is too expensive, you should consider the X950G.
Except that Kia and Hyundai vehicles are near the top in reliability, performance for the class and overall quality. Certainly as good as any other and better than most.

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post #16 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 07:40 PM
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True, but Rtings also rated the Q9FN very highly for HDR movies and that set has some very serious FALD algorithm inconsistency and black crush issues. If I can see the FALD at work...it’s game over!

I personally don’t think Rtings spends enough time with these sets to uncover most of their flaws. Rtings is certainly a great source for numbers on the core performance metrics though.
I don't read Samsung threads so I am not familiar with this issue - is it officially recognized by Samsung as a defect, is there like a recall or a class action lawsuit or something?
Or just a bunch of nerds whining on avs and reddit about every little imperfection that they think is the end of their world?
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post #17 of 21 Old 07-19-2019, 07:44 PM
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Their grade has little to do with real world use. Very rotr test. Foe instance, current better Sonys get downgraded for motion because the BFI won't flicker at 60hz. That their zonal 120hz BFI works better than any other tV on the market for motion, flicker or artifacts is completely dismissed. I love ratings but you have to know how to read their reviews and observe their pics. The final # is not universal and even if it were, strengths and weaknesses vary by individual.
So when they say better for movies, they don't actually mean "real world use" watching movies?
What do YOU think rtings means by "watching movies"?
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post #18 of 21 Old 07-20-2019, 05:37 AM
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So when they say better for movies, they don't actually mean "real world use" watching movies?
What do YOU think rtings means by "watching movies"?
If you're watching an action movie and are sensitive to stutter and blur, does better motion handling help or not? These are generalizations and I don't fault them for trying to make recommendations for lay folk but if you're here, you should know better or I assume are here to try and improve your perception. They purposely use an equation based on their tests to come up with repeatable numbers to be unbiased but like distortion specs on amplifiers, it doesn't always tell you much. For instance, in that movie scenario, you can be outstanding in 4 categories, quite poor in one and still have a relatively high score. Guess which aspect of the picture you will likely notice most?

Reviews are guidelines. Using them as absolutes is misguided and I would wager that reviewers would say the same.
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post #19 of 21 Old 07-20-2019, 08:25 AM
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Except that Kia and Hyundai vehicles are near the top in reliability, performance for the class and overall quality. Certainly as good as any other and better than most.

Nothing wrong with their reliability, but they struggle with the performance aspects that cannot be described in a spec sheet, such as suspension tuning, steering, and brake feel. It is a good car for people who don't care about those things, but these deficiencies have been noticeable every time I have rented a Hyundai or Kia (more so Hyundai). Comparing Sony and Vizio, features like number of dimming zones and peak brightness can be easily listed on a spec sheet produced by the marketing department, but more subjective factors like upscaling, gradient handling, and overall image processing cannot.
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post #20 of 21 Old 07-20-2019, 08:31 AM
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I don't read Samsung threads so I am not familiar with this issue - is it officially recognized by Samsung as a defect, is there like a recall or a class action lawsuit or something?

This flaw is a side effect of Samsung's overly aggressive FALD algorithm that is intended to improve black levels and contrast, it is not a bug or manufacturing defect. If Samsung is in the business of selling TVs, why would it publicly acknowledge its FALD implementation as defective? The algorithm was modified significantly and improved on the Q90R, so Samsung clearly realized that it was flawed.
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post #21 of 21 Old 07-26-2019, 08:56 AM
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Or, instead of asking me (aka some random know-it-all on the internet), you can go to rtings and see for yourself. Rtings rates the px65 better (some might say superior) for watching movies, hdr movies, video games and hdr gaming. And the px75 is less than half the price of the 75z9f...
another random know-it-all on the internet? Rtings is the only of it's type, so people flock there. Yes, they have some valuable info to *critically* read. But anyone that takes any single source of info as gospel is, well, doing it wrong. Rtings should only be one of many data points when researching, and it takes TIME to absorb and fully understand the complexities of the TV market and its offerings before making a somewhat-fully informed decision. So, you can do that, or you can just go buy something based on what you know and move on with your life. It'll probably be just fine, either way.

But LOL at Vizio beating the Z9F overall, especially in 75" sizes.

One thing I'm reminded over and over.. regardless of the Hyundais booming in the market and Vizios, etc... at the end of the day, you usually get what you pay for, as long as you put in some effort toward choosing the best option.

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