TCL 8 Series Roku TV (2019 Model - 65" & 75") *Owner's Thread*(No Price Talk) - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by hungarianhc View Post
Man... I really wanted this TV to be "close enough" to OLED for me... but the no local dimming on game mode is the deal breaker for me. gah! I hope they can fix that w/ a firmware update.
Do they make a 55 inch version of the 8 series?
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post #32 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by hungarianhc View Post
Man... I really wanted this TV to be "close enough" to OLED for me... but the no local dimming on game mode is the deal breaker for me. gah! I hope they can fix that w/ a firmware update.
Local Dimming can be manually enabled by the user. Doing so will raise the input lag, which is why is disabled in Game Mode, as Game Mode is supposed to offer gamers low input lag

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post #33 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 06:39 AM
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Originally Posted by hungarianhc View Post
Man... I really wanted this TV to be "close enough" to OLED for me... but the no local dimming on game mode is the deal breaker for me. gah! I hope they can fix that w/ a firmware update.
Who says you have to use Game mode to play games? If you want pretty games, use Standard or another mode. If you want fast, use Game mode.

There is no free lunch—the reason Game mode is the fastest mode is because all video processing is turned off, including local dimming.
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post #34 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by hungarianhc View Post
Man... I really wanted this TV to be "close enough" to OLED for me... but the no local dimming on game mode is the deal breaker for me. gah! I hope they can fix that w/ a firmware update.

I will take a pic for you. I am playing Luigis Mansion 3 and the video is sooooo goood you can see the texture of Luigis hat! It makes the game come alive! I am very happy with it

I am not using game mode

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post #35 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post
Do they make a 55 inch version of the 8 series?
Sorry only 65" and 75"

Comcast Xfinity with 200MB/s
75" TCL Series 8/LG OLED65E6P 65" OLED 4K 3D
OPPO UHD-203/TOSHIBA HD-XA2 HDDVD
SWISS TURNTABLE/TECHNICS 1520 REEL TO REEL
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post #36 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 12:48 PM
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Local Dimming can be manually enabled by the user. Doing so will raise the input lag, which is why is disabled in Game Mode, as Game Mode is supposed to offer gamers low input lag
Right. Obviously. I want my cake and eat it too... local dimming + low latency.
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post #37 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 01:35 PM
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Right. Obviously. I want my cake and eat it too... local dimming + low latency.
Interesting how Samsung keeps their numbers so low when it’s not an option to disable local dimming.
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post #38 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 05:11 PM
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Interesting how Samsung keeps their numbers so low when it’s not an option to disable local dimming.
There is still sacrifice. Samsung gaming dimming is worse than movie dimming.
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post #39 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 06:16 PM
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Tested new roku update today. I did not notice any big changes.

TCL calibration app became available today on samsung phones. Tested it as well. Useless. It did nothing to fix black crush. It only made a few adjustments in grayscale 60%+.

One more find, all this time I used builtin roku apps to do testing. Turns out it was a big mistake. There is something seriously wrong with roku os on this TV. All apps show worse picture than any other external device connected to this TV. Avoid using any roku apps at the moment!
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post #40 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 07:13 PM
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All apps show worse picture than any other external device connected to this TV.
This is true for almost all TVs
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post #41 of 141 Old 11-23-2019, 07:23 PM
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This is true for almost all TVs
This one is special. Attached two photos, tv factory defaults, first one is roku youtube app, second one is firetv stick youtube app. Same mode, same settings.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	roku youtube.JPG
Views:	68
Size:	263.8 KB
ID:	2644856   Click image for larger version

Name:	firestick youtube.JPG
Views:	71
Size:	318.2 KB
ID:	2644858  
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post #42 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 07:12 AM
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I already shared my thoughts on this TV in another thread, just want to repeat it here.

Huge box and TV is heavy. TV itself does not have a cheap feel except for remote.
Out of the box there is black crush in all modes. Calibrating grayscale is a must in my opinion. 11pt calibration using phone app fixes black crush for all modes at once.
Gamma setting 2.0 is closer to 2.2 and setting 2.2 is closer to 2.4. Leaving it 2.2 and calibrating 2.4 gave me the best picture.
I did not find any issues with SDR and HDR10. Those are not OLED black levels for sure, but still good. SDR can be set very bright which is good for bright rooms.
DV is the only mode where I could see issues. For example, there was patch of zones completely off in several dark scenes. Same movie same scene in HDR10 did not have such problem.
Hey which app did you use to do an 11pt calibration? Was it the roku app on an android phone?
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post #43 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 08:52 AM
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All in all this TV left me disappointed. I was not expecting much to start with in PQ department for color grading and accuracy, but was def-finitely expecting perfect control of low light scenes which it failed badly. I do agree that it is producing perfect blacks near to OLED level but to achieve that it is crushing shadow detail which I thought would not be the case with that many local dimming zones specially on 75" version. In addition to that it has many other shortcomings which I don't even care of.


Is this a rushed launch for TCL? Could they have delivered a better product if they waited another 6months or a year?
At this point I am not sure they could have done better if they were to be given that extra period of time.
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post #44 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 09:11 AM
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It's a little early to be making final pronouncements on such a new model TV as firmware updates can often resolve early production issues.
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post #45 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by KING DRANZER View Post
... but was def-finitely expecting perfect control of low light scenes which it failed badly. I do agree that it is producing perfect blacks near to OLED level but to achieve that it is crushing shadow detail which I thought would not be the case with that many local dimming zones specially on 75" version. In addition to that it has many other shortcomings which I don't even care of.
3840*2160/900 zones is 9216 pixels per dimming zone. Way too many pixels to "perfect" much less "fix" LCD light control shortcomings. The advantage of the 25k LEDs is more bright screen uniformity which several reviewers have mentioned that it is the best that TCL has done. Light control with 25k zones will be a lot better with only around 330 pixels per zone. Still not as good as OLED, but probably would work great at a normal viewing distance. Just have to wait another couple of generations for the back light processing calculation processor to get powerful enough to do it...

I suspect that they will release fixes for black crush. But, it will come at the expense of brightening up the rest of the zone and people will then complain more about halos and cloudiness.

Perhaps Samsung or Sony will release one next year that can handle a few thousand zones, which would make the side effects less visible. But, they will probably charge 2x as much.
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post #46 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 11:26 AM
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Perhaps Samsung or Sony will release one next year that can handle a few thousand zones, which would make the side effects less visible. But, they will probably charge 2x as much.

Well literally if SONY renames and releases Z9D at X950G price-point, I wouldn't be surprised and to be honest I'd be happy. In any case I don't think SONY be taking Mini-LED route and instead they would be stepping in Dual-Cell market. If they do take up Mini-LED route then I expect them to launch at least one variant at X950G budget range as they have already launched one at high-end market years ago. SAMSUNG I don't know what their plans are as the are up on Micro-LED path. CES2020 is definitely going to be interesting.

Last edited by KING DRANZER; 11-24-2019 at 11:32 AM.
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post #47 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 11:32 AM
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3840*2160/900 zones is 9216 pixels per dimming zone. Way too many pixels to "perfect" much less "fix" LCD light control shortcomings. The advantage of the 25k LEDs is more bright screen uniformity which several reviewers have mentioned that it is the best that TCL has done. Light control with 25k zones will be a lot better with only around 330 pixels per zone. Still not as good as OLED, but probably would work great at a normal viewing distance. Just have to wait another couple of generations for the back light processing calculation processor to get powerful enough to do it...

I suspect that they will release fixes for black crush. But, it will come at the expense of brightening up the rest of the zone and people will then complain more about halos and cloudiness.

I don't think it is unattainable. SONY attained near perfect blacks without losing shadow detail at all and at the same time have very high peak brightness to the limited portion of the screen with hardly 10-15% more dimming zones compared to TCL8 series. So I expected it to be close if not as good as Z9D but it not even a comparison for shadow detail.
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post #48 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 11:43 AM
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It's a little early to be making final pronouncements on such a new model TV as firmware updates can often resolve early production issues.
Re electronics industry, I don't see a problem whatsoever in rushing to judgment. Saves some folk from early waste spending. And, might even encourage (heaven willing) the manufacturer to improve. Don't bet on pie-in-the-sky firmware updates, sooner or later.

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post #49 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 11:51 AM
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This one is special. Attached two photos, tv factory defaults, first one is roku youtube app, second one is firetv stick youtube app. Same mode, same settings.
That's messed up. Have you tried a factory reset after your recent firmware update?

FYI, The TCL calibration app is only meant for Google Pixel phones at this time:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...d.ipq&hl=en_US

Q: Can this app be installed on Android phones other than Google Pixel phones for TV calibration?
A: It is possible to install and use the app on other Android phones, but the results of the TV calibration will likely be inaccurate. Only Google Pixel phones always support an accurate measurement that is needed for correct TV calibration. So you should only use Google Pixel phones with this app.
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post #50 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 12:11 PM
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Re electronics industry, I don't see a problem whatsoever in rushing to judgment. Saves some folk from early waste spending. And, might even encourage (heaven willing) the manufacturer to improve. Don't bet on pie-in-the-sky firmware updates, sooner or later.
Oh, I have no problem whatsover with others rushing to judgment. Sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong. It just takes a little more time to confirm which is which.
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post #51 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 12:40 PM
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This one is special. Attached two photos, tv factory defaults, first one is roku youtube app, second one is firetv stick youtube app. Same mode, same settings.
That tells me there is something wrong with the internal app. If the tv was not properly controlling the zones, it would look the same with the internal app and an attached device with the exact same picture settings. The fact that there is no crush with the fire stick attached to the tv, tells me a simple FW upgrade could fix the internal app.
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post #52 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KING DRANZER View Post
All in all this TV left me disappointed. I was not expecting much to start with in PQ department for color grading and accuracy, but was def-finitely expecting perfect control of low light scenes which it failed badly. I do agree that it is producing perfect blacks near to OLED level but to achieve that it is crushing shadow detail which I thought would not be the case with that many local dimming zones specially on 75" version. In addition to that it has many other shortcomings which I don't even care of.
Make sure you don't use any roku builtin apps. They are broken. Use any other external streaming device. Situation with PQ is much better on hdmi ports.

Last edited by Antarius; 11-24-2019 at 02:24 PM.
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post #53 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by PlanetAVS View Post
That's messed up. Have you tried a factory reset after your recent firmware update?

FYI, The TCL calibration app is only meant for Google Pixel phones at this time:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...d.ipq&hl=en_US

Q: Can this app be installed on Android phones other than Google Pixel phones for TV calibration?
A: It is possible to install and use the app on other Android phones, but the results of the TV calibration will likely be inaccurate. Only Google Pixel phones always support an accurate measurement that is needed for correct TV calibration. So you should only use Google Pixel phones with this app.
App showed up as compatible with samsung phones after November 21 update. So either description was not updated or labeled as compatible incorrectly. Either way app is useless.
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post #54 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlanetAVS View Post
That's messed up. Have you tried a factory reset after your recent firmware update?

FYI, The TCL calibration app is only meant for Google Pixel phones at this time:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...d.ipq&hl=en_US

Q: Can this app be installed on Android phones other than Google Pixel phones for TV calibration?
A: It is possible to install and use the app on other Android phones, but the results of the TV calibration will likely be inaccurate. Only Google Pixel phones always support an accurate measurement that is needed for correct TV calibration. So you should only use Google Pixel phones with this app.
App showed up as compatible with samsung phones after November 21 update. So either description was not updated or labeled as compatible incorrectly. Either way app is useless.
When I go to the app on Google Play it clearly says it is only meant to be used on Google Pixel phones.
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post #55 of 141 Old 11-24-2019, 11:05 PM
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Make sure you don't use any roku builtin apps. They are broken. Use any other external streaming device. Situation with PQ is much better on hdmi ports.

PQ is usually tested using external source for any TV as me as an individual or any other reviewer likes to test and compare TVs using single source of content which is handled externally irrelevant of TV inter-phase instead of using the one from online streaming services inbuilt into TV inter-phase which vary from model to model let alone brand to brand.
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post #56 of 141 Old 11-26-2019, 04:19 PM
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Rtngs review is completed, early access for paid subscribers
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post #57 of 141 Old 11-26-2019, 06:42 PM
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Rtngs review is completed, early access for paid subscribers
Nice! Looking forward to it.
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post #58 of 141 Old 11-26-2019, 07:43 PM
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Rtngs review is completed, early access for paid subscribers
I bet they don't have the latest firmware update and they say that the tv sucks and they give it a low rating like they did to the R625 saying it's less or maybe equal to the R617. They are wrong and they also have a bias against TCL.
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post #59 of 141 Old 11-26-2019, 07:45 PM
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Rtngs review is completed, early access for paid subscribers
Nice! Looking forward to it.
Rtings isn't the Bible...lol
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post #60 of 141 Old 11-26-2019, 09:02 PM
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Rtings isn't the Bible...lol
I don't recall mentioning that I pray at the altar of rtings, just said I was looking forward to it. Jesus Christ, you can't say anything anymore!
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