2020 Sony XBR-X950H owners thread (No Price Talk) - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 127 Old 02-26-2020, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
I just got an alert from Amazon saying my new delivery date, first was Feb 19th then Feb 26, is now MARCH 27TH (maybe they can do it by then, but no promisses)!

I am seeing the seller is Beach Camera, one of those grey market bait and switch New York camera stores.

Paul
I hope you have decided to cancel your order!

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post #32 of 127 Old 02-26-2020, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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It was an impulse buy based on snagging one when it kept dropping $200. If the A9S OLED comes out before my X950H arrives, I will order that and cancel the X950H.

Funny thing is, if you buy one now from them on Amazon they promiss it's in stock and ships by March 4th, and their website lists 9 in stock and free 2 day shipping...so yeah, New York bait and switch.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #33 of 127 Old 02-29-2020, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by otlbum View Post
Calaman is software along with equipment used to "calibrate" a tv's color performance. It's quite detailed, more so than calibrators had 20 years ago.

Here's a link to one of many youtube videos that show what goes into a calibration. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwdDPxrmWPw

Is the software and meter included or buy separate?
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post #34 of 127 Old 02-29-2020, 11:05 AM
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Is the software and meter included or buy separate?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...ny-2019-a.html

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post #35 of 127 Old 02-29-2020, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
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You buy the meter (I like the i1Display Pro) then you can either buy Calman Home for Sony 2019 or use something free like HCFR.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #36 of 127 Old 03-04-2020, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
It was an impulse buy based on snagging one when it kept dropping $200. If the A9S OLED comes out before my X950H arrives, I will order that and cancel the X950H.

Funny thing is, if you buy one now from them on Amazon they promiss it's in stock and ships by March 4th, and their website lists 9 in stock and free 2 day shipping...so yeah, New York bait and switch.

Paul
According to Best Buy (locally), this set will be available by this weekend for pickup. Don't know if it will be on display.

The A9S is tempting. Doubt that it will get here before next month.
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post #37 of 127 Old 03-04-2020, 12:20 PM
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I'm guessing the AS9 is going to be about double the cost.

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post #38 of 127 Old 03-04-2020, 10:47 PM
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So today I got an XBR49X950H from Amazon to review for Vine. Tonight after getting it set up I noticed that there are four or so different splotches on the screen that are easily visible on a solid color background. I also see the worst one in moving images. They look to be under at least the top layer of the screen and I can't wipe or massage them away. I am guessing it is some sort of crap from dirt at the factory. It is fuzzy and not well defined. I came here to see if anyone else has had the same but I guess I am early to the party. It is hard to get a picture of but I attached what I got real quick with my phone.
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post #39 of 127 Old 03-05-2020, 12:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Schwartzy View Post
So today I got an XBR49X950H from Amazon to review for Vine. Tonight after getting it set up I noticed that there are four or so different splotches on the screen that are easily visible on a solid color background. I also see the worst one in moving images. They look to be under at least the top layer of the screen and I can't wipe or massage them away. I am guessing it is some sort of crap from dirt at the factory. It is fuzzy and not well defined. I came here to see if anyone else has had the same but I guess I am early to the party. It is hard to get a picture of but I attached what I got real quick with my phone.
Oh wow, what a dissapointment! I will set mine up and test it before I tear apart my stand and mount it in place of my X900F. I am keeping my hopes limited to maybe a 200 nit increase in peak HDR luminance, and a faster OS and menu operation.

When did you order yours? I ordered on February 14th and still have not received mine, they keep changing the dates on me. I have a feeling that preorders like mine were put into a later batch list, and that when the TV's were actually in and IN STOCK on Amazon, they sold off all of those instead of shipping them to prepaid customers, so that they would not lose those new purchases to other sellers or models.

Paul
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post #40 of 127 Old 03-05-2020, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
Oh wow, what a dissapointment! I will set mine up and test it before I tear apart my stand and mount it in place of my X900F. I am keeping my hopes limited to maybe a 200 nit increase in peak HDR luminance, and a faster OS and menu operation.

When did you order yours? I ordered on February 14th and still have not received mine, they keep changing the dates on me. I have a feeling that preorders like mine were put into a later batch list, and that when the TV's were actually in and IN STOCK on Amazon, they sold off all of those instead of shipping them to prepaid customers so that they would not lose those new purchases to other sellers or models.

Paul
Don't get all excited about me having one. I ordered it a couple of days ago but I got mine to review for the Amazon Vine program so it isn't the same as a regular customer. The one I got wasn't sent from the product allocated for customers. Sometimes they send us stuff a little early. I thought others probably had them by now since Amazon was showing me delivery dates on the regular page if I was to order one. So they must be shipping soon.
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post #41 of 127 Old 03-05-2020, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
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My TV arrived a few ago, swapped it in place of my X900F. Watching some lame DVR shows to warm it up and then will throw a really simple and quick basic 2.2 Calman AutoCal at it. It is visually typical Sony green/yellow tint out of the box in Cinema Expert 1. On the max brightness boot up setup screens, off-angle, no evidence of black splotches, looking at white screen and absolutely no dirty screen effect present or visible at low SDR light levels. The box has only X95H written all over it, which worried me, but the TV itself has an X950H printed on the sticker, so I guess that is fine?

Weird thing though...MASSIVE, like really really massive input lag connected to my PC. It's like I am moving the mouse on the screen by remote control over the internet. I can swipe from one side of the screen to the other, and I have to wait for the pointer to catch up. :-\

Extra basic quick 2 point correction for my X950H, according to HCFR, my X950H has a slightly higher black nit level 0.032 vs 0.028), and is only 100nit brighter at max SDR than my old X900f, peak HDR luminance was measured at 720nit, vs 570nit for my X900F, so all around, not really impressed with this upgrade so far. The quicker menu UI is made hard to use because they added weird pop up boxes to everything, assumign X850G was the same, but this ends up slowing you down in the picture settings, so the quicker UI is only good for apps and not settings.

R Gain MAX
G Gain -4
B Gain -2
R Bias -12
G Bias -15
B Bias -19

Not perfect, but got rid of the heavy yellow green tint to the Cinema Expert 1 stock. Out of the box, Cinema Expert 1 was around 2.4dE for greyscale. After Calman Autocal, the errors are only correctable to 1.0dE, compared to 0.3dE for my X900F.

Paul
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post #42 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Anderegg View Post
Weird thing though...MASSIVE, like really really massive input lag connected to my PC. It's like I am moving the mouse on the screen by remote control over the internet. I can swipe from one side of the screen to the other, and I have to wait for the pointer to catch up. :-\
well, it probably requires PC-mode/game mode to reduce the lag ?



unless its something else besides that
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post #43 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 12:50 AM - Thread Starter
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well, it probably requires PC-mode/game mode to reduce the lag ?



unless its something else besides that
Probably, I will test when I get back home. My X900F in Cinema or any mode, even with motion and other extras enabled, had instant response, no lag, so you would expect a new TV with the upgraded beter processor and al extras turned off for calibration to not have this baked in super-lag.

If you have ever tried typing on a PC that has run out of RAM, and watch the text slowly creep across the screen after you have finished typing...this is the mouse equivelant.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #44 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 04:24 AM
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Extra basic quick 2 point correction for my X950H, according to HCFR, my X950H has a slightly higher black nit level 0.032 vs 0.028),
Well does it mean that there's no any improvement in black level and local dimming zones? It is pitty but you should expect it from Sony
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post #45 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 04:45 AM - Thread Starter
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I expected at least the same HDR luminance difference between the X900F and the X950G, but I didn't even get that. I will test the blooming performance when I get home, but I don't see any reason to expect that to have been mitigated in any way on this TV that is practically a clone of my X900F.

I need to do some more testing woth the TV before calbrating it any further, as it seems the X950H only has a single 2 point setting for the entire TV. If you calibrate SDR and HDR with different 2 point adjustments, too bad, you only get one setting, so this is causing me some headaches. Calman cannot handle my TV without a 2 point precalibration being performed, it's just so bad and the colors are so off from the factory that the 10 point adjustments just max out without being able to hit their targets. The color dE for my X950H is WORSE after CMS calibration than my X900F which has no CMS adjustments.

Paul
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post #46 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 04:55 AM
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maybe the 49 model is worse ..
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post #47 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 08:14 AM
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R Gain MAX

G Gain -4

B Gain -2

R Bias -12

G Bias -15

B Bias -19







Paul
Those bias numbers are very excessive. You should not have to even touch bias. Sony typically has a dip around 20-30% grayscale with gamma.

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post #48 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 01:29 PM
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I expected at least the same HDR luminance difference between the X900F and the X950G, but I didn't even get that. I will test the blooming performance when I get home, but I don't see any reason to expect that to have been mitigated in any way on this TV that is practically a clone of my X900F.

I need to do some more testing woth the TV before calbrating it any further, as it seems the X950H only has a single 2 point setting for the entire TV. If you calibrate SDR and HDR with different 2 point adjustments, too bad, you only get one setting, so this is causing me some headaches. Calman cannot handle my TV without a 2 point precalibration being performed, it's just so bad and the colors are so off from the factory that the 10 point adjustments just max out without being able to hit their targets. The color dE for my X950H is WORSE after CMS calibration than my X900F which has no CMS adjustments.

Paul
I would say use the trick shoman showed in the masters series thread about getting 16 on the floor for black level and go into the tv and check HDMI video range. Mine is backward on the X950G, meaning if you put it on video levels range, it is actually PC levels. See if that doesn't help readings.
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post #49 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 02:16 PM
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I would say use the trick shoman showed in the masters series thread about getting 16 on the floor for black level and go into the tv and check HDMI video range. Mine is backward on the X950G, meaning if you put it on video levels range, it is actually PC levels. See if that doesn't help readings.
Yours is backwards? How do you figure that?

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post #50 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 02:51 PM
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Yours is backwards? How do you figure that?

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I've tested it out with all settings and the only ones that work are full and auto. I have all settings on full everywhere else, from the graphics card to madVR.
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post #51 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 05:52 PM - Thread Starter
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I've tested it out with all settings and the only ones that work are full and auto. I have all settings on full everywhere else, from the graphics card to madVR.
So on the X950G, full is limited, and limited is full? You sound like someone from the Samsung subforum.

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post #52 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 10:48 PM
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So on the X950G, full is limited, and limited is full? You sound like someone from the Samsung subforum.



Paul
I think he's mistaken and the TPG levels are off.

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post #53 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 11:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Having tons of issues with Calman as usual, took me 4 hours just to get through a 2.2 and bt1886 Autocal. If you use Calman with this TV, don't attempt a rolling calibration, it will take 45 minutes and will go all crazy for the last 15 minutes and your zig zig calibration will be like 3.0dE.

I did confirm that the 2 point settings are PER SOURCE, so I would highly recommend performing a very basic 2 point 2.2 calibration at max brightness, because max brightness changes (color shift) the RGB alignment. That basic max bright 2.2 SDR 2 point would then form the base for all other calibrations you do, so you would then throw a 20 point at a 2.2 or bt.1886, but that 2 point will be forced into each source on all picture modes.

Blooming is basically the same as my X900F, it's there, it's obvious, just as annoying as ever. Peak HDR brightness for me after full calibration is now only 90nit brighter than my X900F, but the tone mapping on the new TV is much much much better. In my Forza game with a HDR slider, my X900F was able to tone map up to 1300 per the game slider. The X950H can tone map between 4000-7000 depending on if I select contrast at 90 or 83.

The very very severe input lag is on every mode except the game graphics and I think photo modes. In addition, any mode that is not game graphics or photo will show blurry rainbow text on a PC screen, regarless if you are using RGB full or limited or whatever...it basically forces the image to appear to be 4:2:0 and introduces the severe input lag. I don't know why it does this, my X900F with old slow processor showed clear text in all modes in RGB, and since my TV is hooked up to an HTPC, this is an annoyance I will have to suffer with or the duration of my ownership of this TV...ugh.

On the plus side, the TV reports itself to my graphics card with a 1080p 119Hz and 120Hz options in control panel, no having to force or make custom resolutions.

On the down side, both my Netflix app and Amazon Prime app are unusable, as they have glitching which causes the audio to cut out and stutter...YouTube works with full HDR triggering, and playing back an 8K 60p demo resulted in buttery smooth audio and video, with a nerd stat of like 100Mbps+, so I know the issue with Netflix and Amazon is not a bandwidth or buffering issue. And by unusable, i mean I have a Sony UHD with the apps that has no problems, and I am not going to sit through an hour long show with the audio cutting out every 10-15 seconds.

Lastly, Dolby Vision Dark vs Dolby Vision Bright...if you increase gamma +2 in Dolby Vision Dark, and toggle between Dolby Vision Bright, you will see that the +2 gamma is the absolute only difference between the two picture modes. There is a third Dolby Vision mode called Vivid. It appears to be Dolby Vision Bright with a bunch of settings maxed out to entertain people who look at HDR demo TV's in stores. If you turn off all the other features, it will look exactly like DV Bright. With three Dolby Vision profiles on-call, you can basically adjust each one for a different level of content brightness.

Paul
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post #54 of 127 Old 03-06-2020, 11:32 PM - Thread Starter
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I think he's mistaken and the TPG levels are off.

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Yeah, if his GPU is outputting FULL, and he switches from Auto to Full on the TV, he will not see a change...he needs to set his HDMI output to FULL and set his GPU "video" option to 16-235 and set his TV to LIMITED (*MadVR - TV expects 16-235). Like shooting a laser beam through a barn door

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post #55 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 08:06 AM
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Yeah, if his GPU is outputting FULL, and he switches from Auto to Full on the TV, he will not see a change...he needs to set his HDMI output to FULL and set his GPU "video" option to 16-235 and set his TV to LIMITED (*MadVR - TV expects 16-235). Like shooting a laser beam through a barn door



Paul
Something isn't right with yours either of you still have huge bias changes. Really there should be zero bias changes. I experience better results using the rolling option.

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post #56 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 01:12 PM
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In addition, any mode that is not game graphics or photo will show blurry rainbow text on a PC screen, regarless if you are using RGB full or limited or whatever...it basically forces the image to appear to be 4:2:0
as far as I know PC mode/input is required for proper 4:4:4 chroma display ..


tried it ?
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post #57 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 01:32 PM
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Any verdict so far on PQ? Improved over the "G"?
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post #58 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Something isn't right with yours either of you still have huge bias changes. Really there should be zero bias changes. I experience better results using the rolling option.

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The thing is extremely bad colors and greys out of the box...in fact, my X900F with no CMS does 1.0dE color, but I cannot get anywhere near that with Calman AuoCal on this TV's CMS controls. I hate Calman, but they would not reply to my requests for a refund. I will probably HCFR the thing after giving it a few weeks to break in. My new precalman 2 points are Max, -2, -2, +1, 0, -9...funny enough, my color dE with just 2 point is beter than after Calman bt186 CMS, and my greyscale with just that 2 point is only 0.1dE difference after Calman AutoCal.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #59 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 03:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john.odonnell01 View Post
Any verdict so far on PQ? Improved over the "G"?
I don't have a 950G, but the PQ over my X900F is basically nonobservable. Compared to my X900F, the TV has higher not tonemapping, but in reallity, wiht the same exact black levels, the end result can sometimes be a more SDR looking picture, similar to turning down the contrast to resolve more HDR highlights.

Paul

Sony X900F SDR and HDR Calibrations https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57551552
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post #60 of 127 Old 03-07-2020, 05:25 PM
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Could some please post the part# for the backlit remote?

Thanks
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