Owner's Thread for the Sony X900H (No Price Talk) - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 770 Old 04-04-2020, 01:21 PM
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any confirmed US/EU release date for 65" version ?
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post #62 of 770 Old 04-05-2020, 10:06 AM
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If that's the case, that would be very disappointing, and would get curb stomped by Vizio for the same price. I was hoping to go with Sony again, but 1000nits peak brightness vs 3000nits for the same or comparably priced Vizio is too big of a difference to ignore. Screen brightness isn't the be-all end-all of display and picture quality, and I have hope that if they are rumored to include the honey comb design we can expect phenomenal screen uniformity and contrast. That alone would sway my decision in Sony's favor. But I guess we'll see, because Vizio isn't asleep at the wheel this year and their TV's may be even more compatible with Sony's next gen console (PS5), than Sony's own television models.
Won’t be surprised if Vizio, TCL, and HiSense pretty much take over the value and mid-tiers going forward. That leaves the higher-end tiers to Sony, Samsung, and LG. Vizio and TCL are trying to break into the higher-end tiers, but the hiccups in quality are going to hold them back.
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post #63 of 770 Old 04-05-2020, 01:16 PM
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Won’t be surprised if Vizio, TCL, and HiSense pretty much take over the value and mid-tiers going forward. That leaves the higher-end tiers to Sony, Samsung, and LG. Vizio and TCL are trying to break into the higher-end tiers, but the hiccups in quality are going to hold them back.
Can’t see that happening... that’s likely the area with the bulk of the sales. Well those entry TV brands are decent, their TVs still lack to the big three you mentioned.

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post #64 of 770 Old 04-05-2020, 05:18 PM
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Can’t see that happening... that’s likely the area with the bulk of the sales. Well those entry TV brands are decent, their TVs still lack to the big three you mentioned.
They’ve been a step behind so far. But the others have basically stalled this year so ‘20 might be the year they’re so close the most distinguishable difference may be price. It’s really how the other big makers made their way into US market dominance.

With many of the core parts now manufactured in China by the same suppliers to all of them, the gap’s just not going to be there.

Vizio and TCL erred in ‘19 with pricing on their QX and 8Q series because both were too high for first forays into the top-tier. They’ll never get a 2nd chance to recover from the quality missteps - for many. Some of us will give then another look if they correct the quality and come in at lower/better pricing.

The big makers recognize this - look at their lower prices on the ‘20 models.

Again, HiSense, TCL, and Vizio doing well helps the whole buying market right now. That’s what I want to see.
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post #65 of 770 Old 04-05-2020, 07:10 PM
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They’ve been a step behind so far. But the others have basically stalled this year so ‘20 might be the year they’re so close the most distinguishable difference may be price. It’s really how the other big makers made their way into US market dominance.

With many of the core parts now manufactured in China by the same suppliers to all of them, the gap’s just not going to be there.

Vizio and TCL erred in ‘19 with pricing on their QX and 8Q series because both were too high for first forays into the top-tier. They’ll never get a 2nd chance to recover from the quality missteps - for many. Some of us will give then another look if they correct the quality and come in at lower/better pricing.

The big makers recognize this - look at their lower prices on the ‘20 models.

Again, HiSense, TCL, and Vizio doing well helps the whole buying market right now. That’s what I want to see.
Those brands still have major reliability issues, most consumers like to buy brand names. It’ll be very tough for companies like TCL to win against Sony, Samsung or LG, people will trust bigger brand names from their long proven track record.

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post #66 of 770 Old 04-06-2020, 06:05 AM
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Do you know the XH90 release date in Europe?
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post #67 of 770 Old 04-07-2020, 04:50 PM
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Those brands still have major reliability issues, most consumers like to buy brand names. It’ll be very tough for companies like TCL to win against Sony, Samsung or LG, people will trust bigger brand names from their long proven track record.
Might be the case except they're all buying parts from the same sources and all using some other Chinese manufacturer to assemble under their brand name. Bottom line is the value- and mid-tiers aren't where the brand names want to be now. That's clear as models from 2018-now aren't very different while Vizio and TCL are trying to win over customers.

People called Toyota and Honda cheap. Until they started dominating US car auto sales. Said the same thing about them with SUVs. Then came Hyundai/Kia. All came in as value-plays in categories that US automakers were "stepping away from." The only thing US car makers have held strong (though losing lots of luxury SUV ground) is trucks, especially due to fleet sales.

People buy what works for the now and foreseeable future. No one expects to hang on to a TV for a decade any more, and they'll gladly try out other brands if the price-features-value is right.

In no way do I think Vizio, HiSense, or TCL are as good as the others. But they're close enough for far less. Close enough that an extended warranty makes it a no-brainer to give them a try.
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post #68 of 770 Old 04-07-2020, 06:18 PM
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No one expects to hang on to a TV for a decade any more, and they'll gladly try out other brands if the price-features-value is right.
Speak for yourself only please. Most normal people do buy TVs for the long run, it's our forum members are abby-normal buying and then returning/replacing TVs as sort of a hobby. Every person I know outside of this forum keeps their TVs until they fail and have to be replaced. My 2008 and 2010 plasma TVs are were moved to my beach house and still look excellent. And the 2008 1080p Panny has well over 30,000 hours on it. My 2005 720p DLP was in service in my basement until 2018 when it was replaced by a larger 4K LCD. While it's certainly true that today's TVs are not that robust, I expect both my two-year old 4K LCDs to last at least 5 more years. I have no interest in buying new TVs every two to three years just because they're there.
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post #69 of 770 Old 04-07-2020, 07:27 PM
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Speak for yourself only please. Most normal people do buy TVs for the long run, it's our forum members are abby-normal buying and then returning/replacing TVs as sort of a hobby. Every person I know outside of this forum keeps their TVs until they fail and have to be replaced. My 2008 and 2010 plasma TVs are were moved to my beach house and still look excellent. And the 2008 1080p Panny has well over 30,000 hours on it. My 2005 720p DLP was in service in my basement until 2018 when it was replaced by a larger 4K LCD. While it's certainly true that today's TVs are not that robust, I expect both my two-year old 4K LCDs to last at least 5 more years. I have no interest in buying new TVs every two to three years just because they're there.

Agreed, I have a 10yo Sony 52NX800 that is still going strong, recently moved from the master bedroom to a back bedroom for the Grandkids to use for a PS4 gaming monitor. Hopefully preventing conflicts with Grandpa when he want to watch a movie in the evening.

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post #70 of 770 Old 04-08-2020, 09:40 AM
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Speak for yourself only please. Most normal people do buy TVs for the long run, it's our forum members are abby-normal buying and then returning/replacing TVs as sort of a hobby. Every person I know outside of this forum keeps their TVs until they fail and have to be replaced. My 2008 and 2010 plasma TVs are were moved to my beach house and still look excellent. And the 2008 1080p Panny has well over 30,000 hours on it. My 2005 720p DLP was in service in my basement until 2018 when it was replaced by a larger 4K LCD. While it's certainly true that today's TVs are not that robust, I expect both my two-year old 4K LCDs to last at least 5 more years. I have no interest in buying new TVs every two to three years just because they're there.
You're making my point and the only difference is definition of long-term. And yet here's what often does happen. People on forums like this make better choices for good TVs and know not to jump on the next thing until there are multiple or one game-changing reason to buy again. Most other people buy whatever looks good in whatever stores they normally frequent. If it lasts, it lasts. If it doesn't they just react and re-buy when necessary or the next gee-whiz marketed TV comes along.

Many of the people I know have gone through 2-3 TVs in the time I've had one. Most buyers don't see TVs as new/old the same way TV-heads do. They see it in terms of what's being sold/out there while TV-heads see it as what's the technical reason to upgrade/buy new. That's an important distinction because it's much easier to sell year-over-year incremental features vs must-haves and giant leaps.

TVs then aren't much different than autos. Lots of people see them as disposable (like car leases), and they want to have something new every few years just to have it. They also invest in soundbars and other items that aren't fully connected AV systems because it's easier to replace/upgrade the soundbar with the TV more so than a full AV setup.

I don't expect that most people on this forum are the average buyer. We're also not the market drivers because they're aren't enough of us. This is exactly why Sony, Samsung, and LG are splitting off the top features for their high-end pricey sets and leaving the tidbits for all other products. It's why often their sets from 2017/18 don't look or perform dramatically different from 2019/20 sets. In the meantime, they're selling hand over fists lower-end models with premium-brand names that the average buyer "thinks" is good. And they do buy those low-end sets. And they re-buy them again when something goes wrong or a new shiny one's available with a well-marketed but useless feature (ahem HDR10+) because they're cheap enough to not be painful to replace.

TVs used to last 20-25 years, but buyers don't want or care for that any more. In less than 5 years, TVs will have smart-assistance built-in and probably be taking space from other devices. As that happens, getting a few short years out of a TVs probably going to happen to the market-moving average buyers even more.

Not hard to see that coming at all.
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post #71 of 770 Old 04-08-2020, 10:05 AM
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I expect the 900H to last me at least 7-8 years, maybe 10+
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post #72 of 770 Old 04-08-2020, 10:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Sony(Japan made) as far as reliability wins.

With all the issues people have with Samsung.... Id take a Dolby Vision supported mid-high tier TCL/Hisense over them.
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post #73 of 770 Old 04-08-2020, 12:23 PM
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I expect the 900H to last me at least 7-8 years, maybe 10+

Ditto. If nothing else, I expect to move it to a secondary location if and when 8K takes off. I tend to rotate TVs the same way I rotate computers. When it's worth upgrading one, I cycle the ones I have downward and put the new one in the primary location. Same with phones, really. But I expect them all to last throughout the life of the cycle.
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post #74 of 770 Old 04-08-2020, 12:53 PM
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Sony(Japan made) as far as reliability wins.

With all the issues people have with Samsung.... Id take a Dolby Vision supported mid-high tier TCL/Hisense over them.
Don't know about HiSense, but I think TCL is vertically-integrated so making their panel improvements should be controllable and quick.
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post #75 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 10:50 AM
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Some thoughts on this set...

Big unknown is what the peak brightness will be. What is the biggest contributor to peak brightness in a set, and why wouldn’t the new sets be brighter than last year’s sets if a company like vizio is offering one with 3000 nits?

Also, I’m not sure the use of the regular X1 Processor is as a big deal as some say. My 900e uses that same processor and the upscaling is excellent with it. I suspect the difference bw their different processors is marginal and some of the difference is marketing hype. I could be wrong.


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post #76 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 12:03 PM
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I’m looking for an 85” set and have narrowed it down to this Sony and the new LG (86NANO90UNA)... what do you all think when comparing those sets?
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post #77 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 12:27 PM
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Some thoughts on this set...

Big unknown is what the peak brightness will be. What is the biggest contributor to peak brightness in a set, and why wouldn’t the new sets be brighter than last year’s sets if a company like vizio is offering one with 3000 nits?

Also, I’m not sure the use of the regular X1 Processor is as a big deal as some say. My 900e uses that same processor and the upscaling is excellent with it. I suspect the difference bw their different processors is marginal and some of the difference is marketing hype. I could be wrong.
Extreme Processor is no more, and IIRC the X1 was improved a couple of years ago, so I agree that it probably isn't a big deal.

Promises from "the lessers" are plentiful. We'll just have to wait and see how their latest pan out in stringent reviewing.

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Among all the Vizio 2020 TVs, the P-Series Quantum X promises the best 4K LCD performance the company has to offer. Vizio says the set’s maximum 3000 nits of peak brightness and 800 nits of full screen brightness will bring dynamic images to life. Its full-array LED blacklight holds 792 local dimming zones, meaning we can hopefully expect deep blacks and commendable contrast. Coming in 65-, 75- and all-new 85-inch sizing, the Quantum X is Vizio’s big-screen set to watch. The standard 65- and 75-inch P-Series Quantum, though not as bright as the Quantum X, will receive the important premium features like the ProGaming Engine. And neither the P-Series Quantum nor Quantum X should break the bank if last year’s pricing is any indication.
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/vizio-2020-tv-lineup

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post #78 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 01:02 PM
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Extreme Processor is no more, and IIRC the X1 was improved a couple of years ago, so I agree that it probably isn't a big deal.

Promises from "the lessers" are plentiful. We'll just have to wait and see how their latest pan out in stringent reviewing.

I'm thinking the Sony marketing team ran out of qualifiers (Ultra/Extreme/etc.) and have reverted to just calling them X1 processors. Except of course in there top of the line TVs.


AKA the new X1 = the old X1 Ultra.


Intel has done the same thing with their i3/5/7 line of processors, use the same name but say what generation they are.

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post #79 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 01:13 PM
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I'm thinking the Sony marketing team ran out of qualifiers (Ultra/Extreme/etc.) and have reverted to just calling them X1 processors. Except of course in there top of the line TVs.


AKA the new X1 = the old X1 Ultra.


Intel has done the same thing with their i3/5/7 line of processors, use the same name but say what generation they are.
Sounds plausible. Do you mean the Old Extreme or Old Ultra for now's X1?

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post #80 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 01:22 PM
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Sounds plausible. Do you mean the Old Extreme or Old Ultra for now's X1?

Pretty much, I'm thinking that the X1 in the 900H is not the same as the X1 in my 900E but rather a new chip that is equal to or better than the X1 Extreme that was in the 900F.


Gotta love marketing speak.


Marketing speak:
900E=X1
900F=X1 Exteme
900H=X1


Yeah, they didn't go to a less powerful chip.
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post #81 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 02:48 PM
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I’m looking for an 85” set and have narrowed it down to this Sony and the new LG (86NANO90UNA)... what do you all think when comparing those sets?
They completely different TVs. The LG is an IPS panel with wide viewing angles, but grayish black levels, while the Sony is a VA panel with deep blacks but a narrow viewing angle. Plus LG's FALD doesn't work anywhere near as well as Sony's FALD does. You should only consider the LG if you're viewing in a bright room and you need extended viewing angles. The LG will not perform well in a darkened room.
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post #82 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 04:27 PM
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I’️m looking for an 85” set and have narrowed it down to this Sony and the new LG (86NANO90UNA)... what do you all think when comparing those sets?
They completely different TVs. The LG is an IPS panel with wide viewing angles, but grayish black levels, while the Sony is a VA panel with deep blacks but a narrow viewing angle. Plus LG's FALD doesn't work anywhere near as well as Sony's FALD does. You should only consider the LG if you're viewing in a bright room and you need extended viewing angles. The LG will not perform well in a darkened room.
Black level isn’t my main concern (separate theater). I do plan on using it for mainly tv viewing and gaming. How narrow is the angle on the Sony? Will I be okay with a 12’ wide sectional about 12’ back?
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post #83 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 04:44 PM
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Black level isn’t my main concern (separate theater). I do plan on using it for mainly tv viewing and gaming. How narrow is the angle on the Sony? Will I be okay with a 12’ wide sectional about 12’ back?
Assuming the sectional is centered on the TV, the angle to each side would be a maximum of 26.5°, which would be iffy for a Sony VA panel without the X-Wide Angle layer. This going by reviews of the older X900F since there are no real reviews of the X900H yet. For VA panels with wide viewing angles, look at the Sony 2019 X950G and 2020 X950H, and the Samsung 2019 Q80R and Q90R. If you're a DV fan, Samsungs don't support it and never will. Both Samsungs have top rated anti-reflective coatings if that matters. The Sony's are OK with reflections, but not as good as the two Samsungs.
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post #84 of 770 Old 04-10-2020, 07:00 PM
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Black level isn’t my main concern (separate theater). I do plan on using it for mainly tv viewing and gaming. How narrow is the angle on the Sony? Will I be okay with a 12’ wide sectional about 12’ back?
Not nearly as many people in love with their LGs as Sony in this size. If you’re after gaming, the lag would be a deciding factor, right? I doiubt 12x12 would cause any viewing issues but reflections would come into play during daylight/bright light conditions.

Seems that far more Sony fans like their 85+ than LGs.
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post #85 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 05:38 AM
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I’d go with the 950H to help preserve viewing angle but it lacks atsc 3.0 and hdmi 2.1 that the 900H has correct? Is there any reason to the the 950H over the 950G? At least that would save some $.
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post #86 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 06:32 AM
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I’d go with the 950H to help preserve viewing angle but it lacks atsc 3.0 and hdmi 2.1 that the 900H has correct? Is there any reason to the the 950H over the 950G? At least that would save some $.
Yes for reasons known only to Sony, the X950H lacks ATSC 3.0 and HDMI 2.1 that the cheaper 900H has. And it appears that there's currently a $1,000 difference between the 85" X950G and X950H. From the specs, I can't see how anyone could feel the X950H is worth an extra $1,000.
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post #87 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 09:46 AM
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I recently posted in the deals thread that the 900H is up on bestbuy.ca. I'm also in the market for a a 85" and had it narrowed down to the 900F and purchase it soon or wait until the fall and pick up the 900H when the prices drop on new models. But to my surprise, the price of the 900H is already cheaper than the 900F.
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post #88 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 11:43 AM
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I recently posted in the deals thread that the 900H is up on bestbuy.ca. I'm also in the market for a a 85" and had it narrowed down to the 900F and purchase it soon or wait until the fall and pick up the 900H when the prices drop on new models. But to my surprise, the price of the 900H is already cheaper than the 900F.
Don't think of it as a surprise. Think of it as the reality is if these new TVs don't move from the start, they probably won't. The previous year's models are already sunk costs and the makers and retailers just haven't come to grips with it yet. As soon as they can get enough supply of this year's models, last years are going to go on fire sale and be cleared out as quickly as possible. Wouldn't be surprised if last year's models get dropped 50% in one day to clear out. Maybe not, but I bet something like that happens soon. On the daily lookout.

As to the 900H, Sony has to sell these in volume. The pricier TVs are going to sit and collect dust. Bad timing given the market conditions to try to sell premium (not needed) features.
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post #89 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mairj View Post
I recently posted in the deals thread that the 900H is up on bestbuy.ca. I'm also in the market for a a 85" and had it narrowed down to the 900F and purchase it soon or wait until the fall and pick up the 900H when the prices drop on new models. But to my surprise, the price of the 900H is already cheaper than the 900F.
You mean X800H?

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post #90 of 770 Old 04-11-2020, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mairj View Post
I recently posted in the deals thread that the 900H is up on bestbuy.ca. I'm also in the market for a a 85" and had it narrowed down to the 900F and purchase it soon or wait until the fall and pick up the 900H when the prices drop on new models. But to my surprise, the price of the 900H is already cheaper than the 900F.


You mean X800H?
No, the 900H popped up yesterday. The edge lit 800H and the pricier 950H have been available on the best buy canada website for about a month now.
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