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post #1 of 107 Old 12-09-2007, 07:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Due to the OFFICIAL SAMSUNG LNT-XX69 Thread not having the 1st post updated with info, decided to make this thread.
Considering that the 71F and 69F is practically the same (71F has glossy screen while 69F has matte screen), I saved my self the trouble by copying some info that the 71F posters have already accumulated.

The following info posted below is originally made by onund here and just changed at some parts by me.

PM me with error, omissions, updates.

_______________________________________________________


1 How do I ...

1.1 ... get out of shop mode
1.2 ... add my info to the datasheet
1.3 ... get into the service menu
1.4 ... unbrick my TV
1.5 ... piss off the owners thread

1.6 ... complain to Samsung about my problems
2 Firmware

2.1 How to check firmware on my TV
2.2 How to check firmware from the box at the store
2.3 How to update firmware
2.4 What is the latest firmware
2.5 What firmware versions are available for public download
2.6 Is fw20xx better than fw10xx sets
2.7 Why can't I go from fw10xx to fw2004
2.8 Can I downgrade my firmware
2.9 Did Samsung send me the wrong firmware

3 General

3.1 Is the set still 120Hz with AMP off
3.2 Do I need 120Hz HDMI cables
3.3 When will my set work properly
3.4 What is the difference between 69/69F/69FX sets
3.5 When I press Info the frequency says so my TV isn't running at 120Hz
3.6 Power consumption
3.7 What is the difference between the 69F vs the 71F models
3.8 Pictures of the innards!

4 Help ...

4.1 ... there is a small line on the top (or side) of my screen
4.2 ... some faces are blurring when people move
4.3 ... my settings aren't remember when I power down
4.4 ... my remote only works sometimes

5 Issues

5.1 TBE

5.1.1 What is it
5.1.2 Does my set have it
5.1.3 How to test
5.1.4 Can I fix it
5.1.5 What should I do about it

5.2 Stutter

5.2.1 What is it
5.2.2 Does my set have it
5.2.3 How to test
5.2.4 Can I fix it
5.2.5 What should I do about it

6 Where can I find...

6.1 ...

the owners thread
6.2 ... the calibration thread
6.3 ... the TXE thread
6.4 ... the TBE/stutter poll
6.5 ... the TBE/stutter datasheet
7 Glossary

1 How do I ...
1.1 ... get out of shop mode

Shop mode is designed for display models in retail environments. This mode causes the TV to revert back to some predefined calibration setting after a set amount of time. the xx69f defaults to Dynamic mode when in shop.
You can test if you are in shop mode by setting your TV to Movie mode, power off, power on. If you find yourself in Dynamic mode, shop mode is enabled. Follow direction below:

1.Select TV input (one of the antennas)
2.Press the MENU button on your remote
3.select SETUP and press ENTER
4.select PLUG & PLAY and press ENTER
5.select HOME option and press ENTER
6.Exit out after selecting home to prevent from rescanning channels

OR

From the manual:

If the unit is accidentally set to Shop mode and you want to return to Dynamic
(Home) mode, press any Volume button and then hold down the MENU button
for five seconds on the side panel of the TV.
1.2 ... add my info to the datasheet

PM

petrovy with the info requested in the datasheet using your best source.
This data track improvements in the firmware and potentially helps people with issue find a solution. 1.3 ... get into the service menu
WARNING: You can seriously harm your set by monkeying in the service menu. If you are not authourized to be there and touch the wrong thing, the only way to get your set back to normal will be an expensive service call. Your 1 year warranty will not cover you from being bad in here. I believe professional calibrators are authourized to access settings in the service menu.
LOOK BUT DON'T TOUCH!
With the TV off type the following sequence on your remote:

mute-1-8-2-power

with the TV on quickly type the following sequence on your remote:

power-mute-1-8-2-power

When done looking push the power button to exit. 1.4 ... unbrick my TV
WARNING: this is not how you should update your firmware! Use these directions only if you did something like this with your firmware to begin with. To update your firmware, contact Samsung directly.

Some people tried to fool their TV into thinking it was a PEONYM so they could install the fw2004. There is some unknown change to the hardware that caused their sets to become useless if you force the wrong firmware. The following steps are design to once again trick this sets into 'upgrading' to the fw1013 version.
It is possible to brick a TV in the reverse direction, a fw20xx set upgraded to fw1013. If this is what you have done, follow the reverse directions to get fw2004 installed.

Its important to know that your TV now thinks it is the PEONYM (not the PEONY) so you have to trick it to look at the peonyM folder instead of the peony folder to try and fix the issue
2) DL the f/w again so you get a clean copy
3) change the name of the PEONYM folder to PEONYMBACKUP (or anything)
4) change the name of the PEONY folder to PEONYM
5) put the thumb drive in the TV.. since you cant see the TV menu follow these instructions
-. Press Menu Button
-. Press "Up" arrow key 2 Times (Move to Set Up)
-. Press "Enter" (Select Set Up Function)
-. Press "Up" arrow key 1 Time (Move to SW Upgrade)
-. Press "Enter" (Select SW Upgrade)
-. Press "Enter" (Select USB)
==> Then automatically search new firmware (Wait around 20 sec while CPU ident FW)
-. Press "Enter" 3~5 Times for confirmation (Select & Upgrade New firmware)
-. Then wait it's upgrading until TV power off/On again automatically.

provided by kathy 1.5 ... piss off the owners thread

Ask a question covered in this faq or the first post of the owners thread

Seriously though, if you make an honest effort to find your answer here but don't see it, post away. If it turns out the answer is easily found in here, you better make your peace with God.

1.6 ... complain to Samsung about my problems
thank you youknowryan for these steps

1800samsung
options 5, 1, 1
tell level 1 you have a tbe AND stutter issue and want to speak with level 2
tell level 2 you want to speak with level 2 in NJ (soon to be titled level 3 which they are). when you get to level 3, ask to be sure that it is the right people. tell your story and how badly you want a fix.

it's a pain, but this gets you to the people that speak directly with the software programmers.

2 Firmware
2.1 How to check firmware on my TV

1. Turn on your TV.
2. Press the MENU button on your remote.
3. Select SETUP, and then press ENTER.
4. Select Function Help, and then press ENTER.
5. Use the Up or Down arrow button on your remote to move down to Function Help to ON,
6. With Function Help ON highlighted (don't actually push ENTER on it), press the INFO button on the remote. Your firmware revision will be listed as two lines of information. The TOP line is your software firmware. The BOTTOM line is the hardware revision number.


2.2 How to check firmware from the box at the store


NOTE: There has been a report in the owners thread of a PC box coming with 1013.1 firmware see post
Another with PB with 1013.1: post

There is no known guaranteed way to determine the installed firmware on a TV without following the directions above. However, it does appear that from some time in October the 20xx firmware variant was released. There is a method to determine the build date of the set from the serial number. A serial number will look something like this:

AK2V3CFPBxxxxx

The 'PB' is the key. The P refers to the year, P=2007, and the number or letter that follows is the build month:
1 – January
2 – February
3 – March
4 – April
5 – May
6 – June
7 – July
8 – August
9 – September
A – October
B – November
C – December
Using this knowledge, a serial # with PA was built in October. It is known that October saw the switch from fw10xx to fw20xx variants therefore a PA serial could yield you a fw20xx variant or a fw10xx variant. A PB or PC serial can also yield a fw20xx variants.
Firmware release dates can help you determine which firmware a certain serial number might indicates, taken from the datasheet:
firmware Date
1003 07/20/07
1005 08/03/07
1007 08/09/07
1009 08/22/07 one reported date of: 09/09/2007
1010 09/12/07
1013 10/26/07
1013 10/31/07 upgrade date
2000.1 09/20/07
2002 10/11/07
2003.2 10/19/2007
2004 11/14/07 upgrade date Again, a PB or PC serial number does not guarantee a 2002 model as has been reported in the owners thread. It sounds like it still will be a crap shoot. You are guaranteed not to get a 2002 set with a serial before PA though.

2.3 How to update firmware

Your best bet is to call Samsung directly to get your firmware updates. Samsung does not seem to be handing out firmwares by just asking, you need to properly describe the TBE, probably without saying 'triple ball effect' because of the AVS effect, to get the update. Some key words to use are 'tripling', 'shadows' and be sure to mention turning AMP off fixes the problem.
To get to a CSR that will help you:

1-800-samsung
options 5, 1, 1

Here's Samsung's Instructions on Downloading The Firmware

Connect a blank USB memory drive to your PC.
Click [Download] and then click [save]
In the "Save in" field, select the USB memory drive and click [Save]
Click [Open Folder] and double click the Zip File.
Click [Run] and an extractor window will open.
Click [Browse] to once again select the USB memory drive and then click unzip. You should see a dialogue box indicating that the files have been unzipped successfully. Click [OK] A folder containing the firmware files has been added to your USB memory drive.
Safely disconnect the USB memory drive by right clicking the green check mark on the taskbar and then left click "Safely Remove".
Click F/W Update Guide and carefully read the instructions before proceeding with the firmware update

And here's a link to the firmware updating guide... in case its needed.

http://support-us.samsung.com/firmwa...rade_Guide.pdf

NOTE:
You may have to take the 2 Folders that is in the firmware update zip file that you have been given and place them in the main area of your Flash/USB Drive.
These 2 folders should be called: Peony and Peonym

2.4 What is the latest firmware

There are two:

1013 and 2004
Sets prior to some time in October use the fw10xx variety while sets after some time in October use the fw20xx variety. The difference is due to an allege FRC board manufacturer change. All fw10xx sets upgrade to fw1013 while all fw20xx sets upgrade to fw2004.

Forcing a fw10xx to fw2004 or fw20xx to fw1013 will brick your set. Do not attempt!

The firmware file download is named [email protected]@71FX(ver 1013).exe. This file contains BOTH 1013 and 2004. Unzip as is, the TV will know which one to install.
2.5 What firmware versions are available for public download

From Samsung, none. You must contact Samsung and request the firmware. See 2.3.
The only firmware currently available for owners to flash their sets is the 1013/2004 firmware.

2.6 Is fw20xx better than fw10xx sets

It's hard to say from the data collected so far. Both sets exhibit the same problems, TBE and stutter. The fw20xx sets appear to have fewer stutter problems and the fw2004 update appears to have reduced the frequency of TBE.

The update still does not completely address these two issues. Problems still exist with fw2004.

2.7 Why can't I go from fw10xx to fw2004

There was a 'manufacturer' change for the FRC board between fw10xx and fw20xx. The new FRC board is not compatible with fw10xx. If you trick your TV into using the wrong firmware it will become inoperable.

petrovy bought a xx71 service manual and found that there is a hardware change on the FRC board between fw10xx and fw20xx sets. See

his post on xx71 owners thread for more details
2.8 Can I downgrade my firmware

I have read one instance in the xx69f owners thread of someone going from fw2002 to fw2004 then getting Samsung to downgrade back to fw2002.
The difficulty with downgrading is that there are no releases for older firmwares. In this case where the owner downgraded a tech had to physically swap the board in the set with one that was loaded with fw2002. Samsung has been reluctant to do any board swaps recently and this appears to have been an unusual case.

2.9 Did Samsung send me the wrong firmware


No.
The firmware file download is named

[email protected]@71FX(ver 1013).exe. This file contains BOTH 1013 and 2004. Unzip as is, the TV will know which one to install.
3 General
3.1 Is the set still 120Hz with AMP off

All signs point to

yes.
With earlier versions of the firmware AMP off still seemed to run AMP at a lower setting, evident by the TBE still being present in AMP off. With the newer firmwares it appears that AMP is truly off when selecting AMP off and the set is simply repeating frames to fill the 120Hz refresh.
3.2 Do I need 120Hz HDMI cables

NO. The TV accepts 1080p60 as a max. It does not accept any 120Hz source EVER. The set interpolates frames to arrive at a 120Hz refresh.

3.3 When will my set work properly

According to one CSR in 2009 when broadcast TV switches to all digital the set will magically work on all sources.

3.4 What is the difference between the 69/69F/69FX sets

None. They are all the same

3.5 When I press Info the frequency says so my TV isn't running at 120Hz

It is running 120Hz.
The info button is telling you the details of the source signal. The TV itself does frame interpolation or duplicating to arrive at 120fps.

Note: With game mode on the set may be running at 60Hz.

3.6 Power consumption

credit goes to

ggtronic for collecting this data:
If I understand correctly, data collected from a UPS data info page to display power usage with different backlite level
power cumsumption-5271: (more power also generate more heat in the enclosure... )


backlite at 1 (power save has no effect)= 85watts
backlite at 4 power save at low(ok for me)= 120watts
backlite at 5 power save at low =150watts
backlite at 5 power save OFF =190watts
backlite at 10 power save OFF =300watts!

3.7 What is the difference between the 69F vs the 71F models?


Different specs listed below

xx71F
  • 71F has glossy screen
  • 71F = 25000:1 contrast ratio
  • 40" 46" and 52" screens available

xx69F
  • 69F has matted screen
  • 69F = 20000:1 contrast ratio
  • 40" and 46" screens available, no 52"
The contrast ratio difference is due to the matted screen. Everything else is basically the same
3.8 Pictures of the innards!

Volox had a service tech come by his place do to a board swap. He managed to snag a few pics of the inside. There are two posts, one after the other.:

posts
4 Help ...
4.1 ... there is a small line on the top (or side) of my screen

Your set is not defective, this is closed caption data. Set you P.size to 16:9 so you will not see it if it bothers you.
TVs usually overscan (read: zoom) the frame which cuts out these lines. Setting your TV to 'Just Scan' displays everything in the signal, including closed caption data.

4.2 ... some faces are blurring when people move

This may be due to the Digital Noise Reduction setting. Try setting DNR to off. Also, try enabling AMP-low if previously off.

4.3 ... my settings aren't remember when I power down

You are in shop mode. See 1.1 to get out of shop mode.

4.4 ... my remote only works sometimes

The sensor on the TV is located on the lower right of the set. Try aiming your remote at the lower right of the TV


5 Issues

There are two major issues and both are tied to Auto Motion Plus.

News
Samsung has officially acknowledged the issue on their site, go team!
http://www.samsung.com/us/support/ne..._seq=192&page=

youknowryan is in weekly contact with upper level Samsung support. He reports from his conversations:
  • Samsung is aware of the stutter issue
  • stutter will be fixed
  • Samsung is having some success with a software patch but still working on it
  • If a SW patch wont work, they'll fix it through HW
  • Samsung is 100% behind fixing stutter
  • Fix has been pushed back to "hopefully sometime in January"
See youknowryan's posts here:
Dec 7, 2007
Dec 21, 2007
Still, keep the heat on them, follow steps outlined in 1.6.
5.1 Triple ball effect: TBE
5.1.1 What is it

This is a motion artifact caused by Auto Motion Plus. When a camera pans to track a fast moving object the smoothing algorithm sometimes gets confused when the object passes certain objects in the foreground or background. When this happens the object momentarily breaks into three parts; the main object and a shadow infront and behind of the main object.
This artifact was first observed in football games. When the QB throws a long bomb, the camera tracks the football. When the football passes a yard line it would sometimes break into three objects and hence was coined the triple ball effect, or TBE

An example of TBE (thanks to cmf for the video [

post]and OreoJoe for the stills and composite)

Same shot with Game mode on, no TBE


5.1.2 Does my set have it

To date, owners have reported TBE on all firmware versions. Sets loaded with newer firmware versions disable AMP when set to off. When AMP is off TBE will not occur. Older firmware versions do not completely disable AMP when off and show TBE when set to off.
firmware that disables AMP in off: 1013, 2002, 2004

5.1.3 I don't watch sports so I'm safe right

No. It's just called TBE but it is not limited to balls. TBE artifacts have been observed in video games, broadcast TV and movies.

5.1.4 How to test
With a PS3:

Download the Ninja Gaiden demo. Once the game starts just kill off the two ninjas that try to off you then when you have no more pesky enemies to bother you, spin your ninja in a circle and pay attention to the sword on his back as it turns into three swords as you spin. The swords have a varying degree of how noticeable they are according to what is in the back round behind the swords and how far off the background image is. Try it, it is fun and an easy way to determine if your set has the TBE (sharpjunkies description)

With planet earth:

Episode 1. The impala chase scene exhibits TBE artifacts
Episode 2. The golden eagle crane chase scene exhibits TBE artifacts

With Galdiator DVD:

Chapter 12, The Greatness of Rome: There is a scene with Commodus in a chariot. The top of the chariot drivers helmet experiences TBE. When the driver passes behind a flag pole just before the scene change his head triples.

5.1.5 Can I fix it

There are two methods to eliminate TBE .

1.Turn on Game mode
2.If you have firmware 1013, 2002 or 2004, set AMP to OFF

TBE has been reported with fw2004 AMP-off but only in extreme cases.
reports from fw2004 owners indicate that TBE is improved at AMP-low and AMP-med settings but still present at AMP-high.
Communications with Samsung CSR indicate that firmware patches are not targetting AMP-high TBE fixes.

5.1.6 What should I do about it

Call Samsung and tell them your problem. This is the only way they will know about it and fix it. If you update your firmware and still have the problem, call back and let them know!

5.2 Stutter
5.2.1 What is it

This appears to be an apparent drop in frame rate. It has been described as the video becoming choppy, as if you're playing a video game that suddenly slows in frame rate. The frame rate appears to slow down, then jump ahead to catch up. This effect is random. The same scene replayed may or may not experience stutter.

Stutter also appears to be heavily source dependent. The same channel can have some shows with heavy stutter and still have others with none.

5.2.2 Does my set have it

Nearly all fw10xx owners have reported stutter of some sort. Few fw20xx owners report stutter.

According to the datasheet, fw1003 has no reported stutter. In terms of stutter, things seem to be better for the earlier firmware and 20xx variety but still present

5.2.3 How to test

Get a 1080p/24 device (like a Blu-ray player or HD DVD player), set it to output at 1080p/24, hook it to the TV using HDMI, and then put in a movie and turn it on. If there is stutter you'll either see frames dropping or the movie wil have spots where it looks like it moving in slow motion. It's somewhat random and you might need to watch for a bit or skip chapters. On some TVS it's REALLY bad while on others you might just see a jerk every once in a while as a frame or two drops. If it passed this test, then set the player to 1080p/60. If it passes both tests you are very lucky.
(copied from youknowryan's post)

5.2.4 Can I fix it

Toggling AMP off/on clears up stutter for some.
Setting AMP off prevents stutter for some.

There is no known permanent solution to date.

There is a fix in the works expected in January

5.2.5 What should I do about it

Call Samsung and tell them your problem. This is the only way they will know about it and fix it. If you update your firmware and still have the problem, call back and let them know!

6 Where can I find...
6.1 ... OFFICIAL SAMSUNG LNT-XX69 Thread
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=931005
6.2 ... the calibration thread

69F Calibration Thread:

https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=946248

You can also try out the 71F Calibration thread:
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=901174
Popular calibration settings:
RRRRonnn post #98
Studdad's post #274
Drs1nonly's post #210

Or the Hardware-calibrated TV settings for Samsung LNTxx6x TVs (post 1500 - now 1499) by WPWoodJR
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=1499
6.3 ... the TXE thread
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post12238993
6.4 ... the TBE/stutter poll
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post12306488
6.5 ... the TBE/stutter datasheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?k...jiHKvtE4iFSGCw
PM petrovy to be included
7 Glossary
  • AMP - Auto Motion Plus
  • bricked set/TV - A TV that becomes inoperable. It is as functional as a brick
  • FRC board - Frame Rate Conversion board. This is the mystery 3rd printed circuit board which features either a Samsung IC or Micronas IC for doing interpolation and such.
  • stutter - in terms of the xx69 series, this is a side effect of AMP and not related to judder
  • TBE - Triple ball effect
  • TSE - Triple sword effect (same as TBE)
  • TXE - Triple X effect, generic term for TBE
  • VP - Video processor
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post #2 of 107 Old 12-09-2007, 07:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Samsung 69F (Quick Guide) Easy Manual: http://www.samsung.com/us/support/do..._nm=LN-T4069FX
Samsung 69F Users Manual: http://www.samsung.com/us/support/do..._nm=LN-T4069FX

Is expensive cables necessary?

Please read the articles linked below and decide for yourself.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...e/4235717.html
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,12...1/article.html

In my personal opinion.
< 15' you can be fine with a 28 AWG HDMI from any store.
> 15' you may need a thicker cable HDMI so get at least a 24AWG.
I prefer Monoprice or Blue Jeans Cable for cables to save $$$. Power Consumption:

credit goes to ggtronic for collecting this data:
If I understand correctly, data collected from a UPS data info page to display power usage with different backlite level
power cumsumption-5271: (more power also generate more heat in the enclosure... )


backlite at 1 (power save has no effect)= 85watts
backlite at 4 power save at low(ok for me)= 120watts
backlite at 5 power save at low =150watts
backlite at 5 power save OFF =190watts
backlite at 10 power save OFF =300watts!

What is the difference between the 69F vs the 71F models?

Different specs listed below

xx71F
  • 71F has glossy screen
  • 71F = 25000:1 contrast ratio
  • 40", 46" and 52" screens available
xx69F
  • 69F has matted screen
  • 69F= 20000:1 contrast ratio
  • 40" and 46" screens available, no 52"
  • 69F is not as wide as the 71F
The contrast ratio difference is due to the matted screen. Everything else is basically the same

71F vs 69F Dimension Comparisons:
Samsung LN-T4069F_________________________________________________________Samsung LN-T4071F
Samsung LN-T4669F_________________________________________________________ Samsung LN-T4671F
Unconfirmed Info about the Firmware:

PLEASE CONTACT SAMSUNG FIRST TO GET THE OFFICIAL FIRMWARE!
USE THE FILE LINKED BELOW AT YOUR OWN RISK!

  • 69F and 71F "may" share the same Firmware.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ohuigin View Post

    Ok. So I unzipped the file that's been circulating around most of the posts ([email protected]@71FX(ver 1013).exe). Here's what I found...

    7 items are unzipped into 2 folders (peony & peonym).

    Peony folder contents:
    -us folder:
    --us folder contents:
    ---appl.rom (file size: 20.3 mb. DATE MODIFIED: 10/31/2007 @ 4:11pm)
    ---checkversion.exe
    ---appl.rom.chk
    ---info.txt <--"T-PEONAUSC- 1013
    PROJECTNAME APP_VERSION
    DTV_MODEL_NAME CN_VERSION"

    Peonym folder contents:
    -us folder:
    --us folder contents:
    ---appl.rom (File size: 20.4 mb. DATE MODIFIED: 11/14/07 @ 10:43am)
    ---appl.rom.chk
    ---info.txt <--"T-PEONAUSC- 2004
    PROJECTNAME APP_VERSION
    DTV_MODEL_NAME CN_VERSION"

    So there it is. It seems that the file [email protected]@71FX(ver 1013).exe does contain both firmware updates (1013 & 2004). Further evidence lies in the info.txt files from both folders (peony & peonym), as well as the dates that the two appl.rom files were created (modified). HOWEVER!!! To my knowledge it is still unknown that the xx71s and xx69s OFFICIALLY use the same firmware, although as of now most signs are pointing to yes.

    Hope this helps,

    -B

    EDIT The following is a link to the firmware updates (graciously provided by Savior1974) http://www.mediafire.com/?cn0xv1rgmnp AGAIN, to my knowledge I do not know if xx69 and xx71 use the same FW!!!


Rumor about Upcoming Fixes and what is planned:
Quote:
Originally Posted by needlesbox View Post

ok, just got off the phone with Joe who is a Tier 2 technician.

He said that there will absolutely be a fix for the problems.

He recapped the situation of what the current latest firmware fixes.

NO TBE with AMP on low.
Mild TBE with AMP on Med.
SAME TBE with AMP on High.
There is not fix for studder at the moment.

He said there will be a fix for all of that but he doesn't know when. He also said the problem may need to be fixed by a. firmware, b. a new board, or c. a new TV.

So there you go, if you have this model with problems, they are at least saying that you will be taken care of.....

Link to latest 1013.1/2004.1 FW:

PLEASE CONTACT SAMSUNG FIRST TO GET THE OFFICIAL FIRMWARE!
USE THE FILE LINKED BELOW AT YOUR OWN RISK!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Savior1974 View Post

Ok thanks.

Also, what I decided to do was to host the 1013/2004 Firmware update file on my file hosting site so we can always have it for download instead of having to get a link from Samsung. so heres that link.

1013/2004 Firmware Update file link
http://www.mediafire.com/?cn0xv1rgmnp

Renamed Firmware (1013 is now 1013.1) to not confuse people:
http://www.mediafire.com/?c5dz1ucebzg


Question:

Does the Samsung LN-Txx69F capable of 1080p 24FPS?
Unconfirmed at this time.
Was an article somewhere that the 69F has teh capality but needs to be enabled by a fuure firmware update.


Misc:
Forum Poster about Sony vs Samsung LCD TV comparisons:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenEarDrum View Post

I read the XBR4/5 thread too from time to time and I can tell you that the Sony's have some problems of their own.

Bottom line is with either set, you can't lose so you have to weigh out what appeals to you the most and make your own decision.

Just for everyone's information, this is what I have gathered from reading that thread and with personal observation when I was comparing:

* The XBR4/5 also has a trailing problems which is similar to (if not exactly like) TBE.
* They have Motion Enhancer (our AMP) problem that they call "artifacting" wich is similar to stuttering.
* The 71f has one more level of AMP setting (high). This makes this effect more so on the 71f.
* Sony just issued a firmware upgrade also, of which people are reporting problems just like us.
* There are more reports of Mura (clouding) and flashlights with the XBR4/5 than with the 71/69f.
* The 52" XBR4/5 does not have a fan while the other two do.
* XBR4/5 have much better PIP function than 71f.

There are a couple more that I would like to add but I can't think of them right now.

Just a note to add: So even with the XBR4/5 having the UX chip (as has been speculated), it still shows the same similar problem. I'm thinking more that the problem may not be due to this chip at all.

...

What does it mean when I connect my computer to the TV and it says "Mode not supported"?

The TV ONLY supports a limited types of resolution.
When you get this message, then the current resolution on your computer is NOT supported by the TV.
Try a different resolution.

You may also have to update your GPU Driver.

Why is the HDMI Black Level greyed out in my setup menu?

"HDMI Black Level Low (will be grayed out if your HDMI video source is putting out a YCbCr signal instead of RGB - this is OK but RGB may be better as noted above)."

https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=1499

This post is a must-read for 71/69 owners as well as 61/65/66 owners. Why is Film Mode greyed out in my setup menu?

The film mode selections are only available when you feed the TV an interlaced signal. This is explained in the manual.

How to fix scratches on the bezel?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OreoJoe View Post

I removed from two LCD screens, streak marks caused by rubbing with a paper towel. Used a small microfiber cloth from an auto parts store and Meguiar's Mirror Glaze Professional #10 Clear Plastic Polish.
Restores Optic Clarity To:
Boat Windows, Convertible Windows, Helmet Visors
Aircraft Windshields, Eyeglasses, Instrument Panels, Computer Screens
Then I used a clean microfiber cloth with some 5% white vinegar (ascetic acid).

The screens are restored to new condition.

You may have to first use Meguiar's Plastic Cleaner #17 if the scratches are deeper. Read the directions on the package.

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post #3 of 107 Old 12-09-2007, 09:26 AM
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great post! thanks

and that username for the firmware update has expired.
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post #4 of 107 Old 12-09-2007, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haulin oats View Post

great post! thanks

And that username for the firmware update has expired.

Thanks, just removed it from the FAQ.

When I have more time I will add/remove/edit some more stuff in the 1st post.

Main plan about this thread is to have a hub of updated info about the 69F instead of sifting thru hundred of pages.
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post #5 of 107 Old 12-10-2007, 11:31 AM
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great post!!! Thanks for starting it
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This LCD is 1080p 24fps rated as far as I can tell and I am asking if you hook it to a Blu-Ray player that is also 24fps is it necessary or usefull to turn the 120hz on?
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post #7 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 09:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnolia039 View Post

This LCD is 1080p 24fps rated as far as I can tell and I am asking if you hook it to a Blu-Ray player that is also 24fps is it necessary or usefull to turn the 120hz on?

I tought that the 69F/71F is capable of 1080p 24FPS "after" a FW update that Samsung is working on.
Tought I read that somewhere, still looking for hard info on that 1.

Please reply back if you find it before I do so I can add in FAQ.
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post #8 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 11:30 AM
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The next time I work I will check the 4069 and see if the blu ray player works on it at 24fps. Does this 69 model differ from the 71 model in reguards to 24fps standard?
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post #9 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 01:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I have a Toshiba A30 and it has an option for 1080p 24fps.
I have it set on that and not sure exactly if it is running on that.
But it shows a message about 1080p/24fps when my A30 loads up.

I also just got my PS3 today.
I got both A30 and PS3 to do the 1080P/24fps setting, but not sure if it is running right or not.

I also just watched Spiderman 3 on Blu-Ray DVD on my PS3.
Considering I have also seen the same movie on a 71F, I must say that the 69F is really very close if not same PQ as the 71F.
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post #10 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 06:46 PM
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getting ready to purchase and have the following questions:

1) is burn-in a huge problem? i have kids... (but probably can sell them)
2) can you turn the blue light off?
3) lag using harmony remote?
4) confidence that 120hz can/will be fixed by fw?
5) 6ms, or 8ms? i've seen both...
6) does this unit have screen saver for regular tv viewing? (if say, my wife pauses the tivo in 4:3, and her A.D.D. kicks in...four hours later i walk in and have a fit)
7) have most of you updated fw successfully...i build pc's as a hobby and ht enthusiast..have NEVER fubar'd a single bios, or other equip. as a result of a bad flash...
8) having owned this hdtv, any regrets not having purchased a sony? other?
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post #11 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 08:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamthehunter View Post

getting ready to purchase and have the following questions:

1) is burn-in a huge problem? i have kids... (but probably can sell them)
2) can you turn the blue light off?
3) lag using harmony remote?
4) confidence that 120hz can/will be fixed by fw?
5) 6ms, or 8ms? i've seen both...
6) does this unit have screen saver for regular tv viewing? (if say, my wife pauses the tivo in 4:3, and her A.D.D. kicks in...four hours later i walk in and have a fit)
7) have most of you updated fw successfully...i build pc's as a hobby and ht enthusiast..have NEVER fubar'd a single bios, or other equip. as a result of a bad flash...
8) having owned this hdtv, any regrets not having purchased a sony? other?

1) Burn-in is a non-issue with LCD AFAIK.
Keep the kids, I know I love my 5yo son
(Sides, can train 'em to make soccerballs!)
2) Yes you can. It can be On, off, On standby, or when TV is on options.
3) I have a Harmony 880 and its pretty responsive.
4) TBH, I really do not see or notice TBE much since I updated to latest FW, so I am sure they can make it better with future FW (praying for sooner than later)
5) I belive its 8ms just like the 71F
6) Burn-in is a non-issue for LCD AFAIK.
I also just checked my TV Options and didn't notice any screensaver features.
7)Updated to latest FW with no problems for me, took like 5 minutes I think.
8)Only regret I have is not having enough money to buy the 46" instead of my 40"

Hmm.
Mental note: Add basic info and features in FAQ just liek in the 71F Owners thread.
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post #12 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 08:41 PM
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many thanks kilim...

basic info/features a great idea..especially since basic info is tougher to locate than i expected..after reading 20 or so threads for various lcd's i believe that the 4069 is the hdtv for me...i love my sony hdtv (60" xbr2) but something keeps telling my to buy the samsung...

samsung website shows 6ms, which i believe is incorrect. i need to download the manual but have a few more questions...

1) are the inputs (all) assignable?
2) can each input be configured with separate tuning/calibration?
3) channel labeling?
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post #13 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 09:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamthehunter View Post

many thanks kilim...

basic info/features a great idea..especially since basic info is tougher to locate than i expected..after reading 20 or so threads for various lcd's i believe that the 4069 is the hdtv for me...i love my sony hdtv (60" xbr2) but something keeps telling my to buy the samsung...

samsung website shows 6ms, which i believe is incorrect. i need to download the manual but have a few more questions...

1) are the inputs (all) assignable?
2) can each input be configured with separate tuning/calibration?
3) channel labeling?

1 & 2)Yes, each input saves its own settings. (Thank God! lol)
3) I use a HD DVR Cable box from cablevision so I don't have this option.
I guess If you just use OTA you can label the channels on the TV Input but not exactly sure.
(I have to try and find my manual to look for that)
But I use Component for my 1080i cablebox.
I think You can have PIP if you connect 2 antennas in the back for the TV Inputs.

For yoru reading pleasure:

Samsung 69F (Quick Guide) Easy Manual: http://www.samsung.com/us/support/do..._nm=LN-T4069FX
Samsung 69F Users Manual: http://www.samsung.com/us/support/do..._nm=LN-T4069FX
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post #14 of 107 Old 12-11-2007, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilim View Post

I tought that the 69F/71F is capable of 1080p 24FPS "after" a FW update that Samsung is working on.
Tought I read that somewhere, still looking for hard info on that 1.

Please reply back if you find it before I do so I can add in FAQ.

When the tv is set to AMP = Off it is capable of 5:5 pulldown with a 24fps source. However, because we in the 71 thread have found that AMP is still ON to a small degree when AMP is set to OFF, you may have some problems. The update for the 71's appears to have set AMP to truely off when it is set to OFF, but some have said they still see TBE, which would indicate it is still on to a small degree. Really, the update was just a workaround, and we are all over Samsungs ass on this issue.

Once the AMP is fixed (if it is) then if you want a true 5:5 pulldown, you will want to set AMP to off. Remember this. When AMP is off, the set is still doing 120hz, but it is just multiplying frames to get there. So a 60hz signal is having its frames doubled. A 24hz signal (24fps) will have it framed multiplied by 5 (5:5 pulldown). What AMP does is interpolate frames instead of muliplying existing frames. So, there would be no point to turning on AMP during a 24fps source, and if you did, you may have problems.

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post #15 of 107 Old 12-12-2007, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studdad View Post

When the tv is set to AMP = Off it is capable of 5:5 pulldown with a 24fps source. However, because we in the 71 thread have found that AMP is still ON to a small degree when AMP is set to OFF, you may have some problems. The update for the 71's appears to have set AMP to truely off when it is set to OFF, but some have said they still see TBE, which would indicate it is still on to a small degree. Really, the update was just a workaround, and we are all over Samsungs ass on this issue.

Once the AMP is fixed (if it is) then if you want a true 5:5 pulldown, you will want to set AMP to off. Remember this. When AMP is off, the set is still doing 120hz, but it is just multiplying frames to get there. So a 60hz signal is having its frames doubled. A 24hz signal (24fps) will have it framed multiplied by 5 (5:5 pulldown). What AMP does is interpolate frames instead of muliplying existing frames. So, there would be no point to turning on AMP during a 24fps source, and if you did, you may have problems.

Then why does a Blu Ray 24fps movie look better with the processing on. From what I have seen if the TBE and stutter could be controlled the additional processing ads depth and natural movement. The 66 series of samsung lcds don't look as real life with the 24fps and no 120hz processing. Confused.
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post #16 of 107 Old 12-12-2007, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
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New Info to add later:
  • 69F and 71F Shares the same Firmware.

Rumor about Upcoming Fixes and what is planned:
Quote:
Originally Posted by needlesbox View Post

ok, just got off the phone with Joe who is a Tier 2 technician.

He said that there will absolutely be a fix for the problems.

He recapped the situation of what the current latest firmware fixes.

NO TBE with AMP on low.
Mild TBE with AMP on Med.
SAME TBE with AMP on High.
There is not fix for studder at the moment.

He said there will be a fix for all of that but he doesn't know when. He also said the problem may need to be fixed by a. firmware, b. a new board, or c. a new TV.

So there you go, if you have this model with problems, they are at least saying that you will be taken care of.....

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post #17 of 107 Old 12-12-2007, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnolia039 View Post

Then why does a Blu Ray 24fps movie look better with the processing on. From what I have seen if the TBE and stutter could be controlled the additional processing ads depth and natural movement. The 66 series of samsung lcds don't look as real life with the 24fps and no 120hz processing. Confused.

We will have to wait and see how it looks once all is fixed. In theory, if you are feeding the tv 24p, and have AMP on, then you are interpolating frames, and each one of those interpolated frames (between each normal frame) is being shown 5 times. Any error in interpolation would probably be magnified. If it works, fine. But for a true 5:5 pulldown, you are showing each REGULAR frame 5 times, not 5 regular frames, then 5 interpolated frames, then 5 regular, etc.

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post #18 of 107 Old 12-13-2007, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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From the 71F Owners thread.
A link for the latest 1013.1/2004.1 FW.
Unofficially, 69F and 71F Shares the same FW (This is just an assumption)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Savior1974 View Post

Ok thanks.

Also, what I decided to do was to host the 1013/2004 Firmware update file on my file hosting site so we can always have it for download instead of having to get a link from Samsung. so heres that link.

1013/2004 Firmware Update file link
http://www.mediafire.com/?cn0xv1rgmnp

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilim View Post

From the 71F Owners thread.
A link for the latest 1013.1/2004.1 FW.
Unofficially, 69F and 71F Shares the same FW (This is just an assumption)

Has anyone been brave enough to try this assumption?
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post #20 of 107 Old 12-14-2007, 06:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnolia039 View Post

Has anyone been brave enough to try this assumption?

They are the same exact TVs internally. Only difference is the matte vs. glass panel and the bezel design. The 69 was made for those who prefer the older matte style screen.
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post #21 of 107 Old 12-14-2007, 09:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnolia039 View Post

Has anyone been brave enough to try this assumption?

When I called Samsung and was given a link to download the firmware, its filename was: T[email protected]@71FX(ver 1013). This is for my LN-T4069FX set, and yes I tried it and it updated to 2004 successfully.
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post #22 of 107 Old 12-14-2007, 10:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Parr View Post

When I called Samsung and was given a link to download the firmware, its filename was: [email protected]@71FX(ver 1013). This is for my LN-T4069FX set, and yes I tried it and it updated to 2004 successfully.

Yup, I was given the exact same file by Samsung.
I couldn't make a file attachment that large to attach in this forum and saw that someone already made the same file available for download why I just linked it here.

The file linked here is the same file size/name/etc compared to the file I have.
BUT It is still HIGHLY Suggested to get the FW from Samsung yourself just to be safe.

Personal opinion:
I think its the same file and that the 69F and 71F shares the exact same FW, considering the ONLY real difference between teh 2 is teh screen type (Matte vs glossy)

PS:
I added a Dimension Comparison of 69F vs 71F.
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post #23 of 107 Old 12-14-2007, 11:29 PM
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I recently bought the LNT-4669 and also a bose V20. Bose's HDMI version is 1.2a, while the samsung is 1.3. The manual for the TV said that for lower versions of HDMI it wont have sound and also picture might be bad. Is there any way around this or is the only option available to me is to get a receiver that supports 1.3? This is my first LCD tv and also home theater so any advise would be great.
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post #24 of 107 Old 12-15-2007, 03:18 PM
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Just bought 4669, TBE is presant, I think it's a minor annoyance but I've only been playing Halo 3 so this minor annoyance (rare triple crosshair) could become a major one once I start watching hockey or movies. I do have a more pressing issue and that's FLICKER.
I'm getting weird flickering when I'm at the dashboard on the 360 and becomes even more pronounced when I'm the Halo 3 lobby screens and is at it's worst when I bring up my friends list (a gray themed guide that really brings out the flicker).
I've tried all 3 HDMI ports, different HDMI cables and all levels of AMP and still have flckering.
Anyone else experincing this ?

p.s. Just took back a banded Sharp 46U for this and I've got to say the PQ on this puppy spanks the Sharp but the Sharp did not have this flickering whatsoever.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ananduta View Post

I recently bought the LNT-4669 and also a bose V20. Bose's HDMI version is 1.2a, while the samsung is 1.3. The manual for the TV said that for lower versions of HDMI it wont have sound and also picture might be bad. Is there any way around this or is the only option available to me is to get a receiver that supports 1.3? This is my first LCD tv and also home theater so any advise would be great.

If you already have the HDMI Cables, doesn't hurt to just test it out 1st
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post #26 of 107 Old 12-15-2007, 03:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrek View Post

Just bought 4669, TBE is presant, I think it's a minor annoyance but I've only been playing Halo 3 so this minor annoyance (rare triple crosshair) could become a major one once I start watching hockey or movies. I do have a more pressing issue and that's FLICKER.
I'm getting weird flickering when I'm at the dashboard on the 360 and becomes even more pronounced when I'm the Halo 3 lobby screens.
I've tried all 3 HDMI ports, different HDMI cables and all levels of AMP and still have flckering. Anyone else experincing this ?

What is your FW Version?
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post #27 of 107 Old 12-16-2007, 11:14 AM
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Kilim, thanks for the reply.
fw version is 2002.0, hardware is 2000 cs .. the serial is indeed PA
If you think I should try fw upgrade can you point me to the right spot.

I took my 360 to a friends place last night, he owns the 71, and there was absolutely no flickering.

BB is delivering a replacement, was supposed to be today but the weather here has killed that plan so hopefully tomorrow.

Last thing .. On my friends 71 we tested out a movie, Carlito's Way and I got to say the 120hz really killed that movie .. it looked too real .. I guess 120hz is material dependant huh ?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrek View Post

Kilim, thanks for the reply.
fw version is 2002.0, hardware is 2000 cs .. the serial is indeed PA
If you think I should try fw upgrade can you point me to the right spot.

I took my 360 to a friends place last night, he owns the 71, and there was absolutely no flickering.

BB is delivering a replacement, was supposed to be today but the weather here has killed that plan so hopefully tomorrow.

Last thing .. On my friends 71 we tested out a movie, Carlito's Way and I got to say the 120hz really killed that movie .. it looked too real .. I guess 120hz is material dependant huh ?

I guess we figured out the Flickering is due to a defective product and hopefully you get your replacement sooner than later
As for the FW Upgrade, read up above on how to get the latest FW and how to install it.

As for the AMP Effect, I belive the 3D Effect is caused by AMP not it being 120hz..
Some people like it while others don't.
I personally like it.
Did you guys try it in different AMP Settings?
And yes, the AMP Effect can be material dependent.
The 3D like effect can be more or less depending on the feed.

Also, AFAIK, the 120hz works even if you have AMP Off.
So I think the 3D Effect is due to AMP and not being 120hz, hope that makes sense.
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post #29 of 107 Old 12-16-2007, 04:35 PM
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Do you think I should ask BB if they can locate or order me a PB or a PC serial # even if I have to wait ? ( Not sure if there is any benefit )

Also, yeah I saw the fw's you posted that are above but when I click on the links and get to the download page it's still unclear to me which one to use cuz they both say almost the same thing .. I dont want to install the wrong one.

Last thing .. I really think when I turn AMP off, it's off .. looks like the standard 60hz to me but it could very well be 120, I dont see a whole lot of difference between the two.
I say this because I notice no difference in Halo 3's framerate when AMP is off. The difference is in the games motion when going from AMP off to even the low setting, the effect is dramatic !
But I could be interpreting normal judder in a games framerate for what the AMP setting is doing to smooth everything out.
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I did try it out and there is no sound. The picture was displayed in 4:3.
ananduta is offline  
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