The Official Pioneer 9G North American KRP-500M / KRP-600M Owner's Discussion Pt. II - Page 239 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #7141 of 7227 Old 10-02-2017, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by 34-hfx-83 View Post
I think you should still keep your plasma around (assuming you own a 101FD/500M) for watching sports and other live-broadcast content (there's no appetite for tv stations in America to upgrade to 4K chain live broadcast). You still can't beat plasma's superior NATIVE motion resolution without resorting to using "soap opera" motion interpolation post-processing found in most LEDs and even OLEDs. Current consumer OLED native motion resolution is just 300 lines.
Long live the Kuros!

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post #7142 of 7227 Old 10-02-2017, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 34-hfx-83 View Post
I think you should still keep your plasma around (assuming you own a 101FD/500M) for watching sports and other live-broadcast content (there's no appetite for tv stations in America to upgrade to 4K chain live broadcast).
I live in a small house that only has room for one 50" display. "Lucky" for me I don't watch sports. However I haven't decided what to do with my 500Ms so I'll keep them (at least for a while) in preference to recycling.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7143 of 7227 Old 10-03-2017, 10:32 AM
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I didn't mention this before but ... D-Nice has nominated an OLED to replace (some of) his Kuros. That was sufficient for me to purchase an LG C7.
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I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7144 of 7227 Old 11-18-2017, 10:51 PM
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Just can't bring myself to get rid of the krp600m. I've had it for over 8.5 years. I just bought the speakers for it because I'm moving the floor standers to a media room. That will have a 65" oled and I have a 55" oled in bedroom, but I am keeping the plasma in the living room. Just can't put it in a landfill when it works and it would be a pain to sell. Hope it gives me another few years !
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post #7145 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by bodosom View Post
I didn't mention this before but ... D-Nice has nominated an OLED to replace (some of) his Kuros. That was sufficient for me to purchase an LG C7.
Wow it’s been years since I’ve been in this thread. I actually retired all Kuros and moved completely to OLEDs

* 141FD => 77A1E
* 101FD => 65A1E
* 500M => 65C7P
* 5020FD => 55C7P
* 4280HD => 55A1E (may switch to 55B7A or 55C7P this week)

I will still use my 141FD and 101FD as a reference for 1080p and below content when needed.
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post #7146 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 08:56 AM
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Was wondering if anyone has been using the hdfury linker with their displays. I have the 500m and wanted to get some insight ref getting 4k.
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post #7147 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
Wow it’s been years since I’ve been in this thread. I actually retired all Kuros and moved completely to OLEDs

* 141FD => 77A1E
* 101FD => 65A1E
* 500M => 65C7P
* 5020FD => 55C7P
* 4280HD => 55A1E (may switch to 55B7A or 55C7P this week)

I will still use my 141FD and 101FD as a reference for 1080p and below content when needed.
...looks like lots of candy store visits...
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post #7148 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by rocky1 View Post
Was wondering if anyone has been using the hdfury linker with their displays. I have the 500m and wanted to get some insight ref getting 4k.
Unless you have an older video chain you shouldn't need a Linker. The source should down-sample for you.
What else are you using?

I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7149 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by bodosom View Post
Unless you have an older video chain you shouldn't need a Linker. The source should down-sample for you.
What else are you using?
I have a Marantz sr7012 which I recently got.Have the oppo 203.Also plan on getting the appletv 4k by xmas.thx
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post #7150 of 7227 Old 11-19-2017, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by rocky1 View Post
I have a Marantz sr7012 which I recently got.Have the oppo 203.Also plan on getting the appletv 4k by xmas.thx
I'm sorry I think I may have misinterpreted your question. However the 203 can convert HDR to SDR and native Apple content (iTunes, Netflix etc.) will detect that you don't have a 4K display and retrieve the appropriate data.

I believe the Oppo can also serve as an outboard scaler via the HDMI-in port.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7151 of 7227 Old 11-20-2017, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by irfan View Post
Just can't bring myself to get rid of the krp600m. I've had it for over 8.5 years. I just bought the speakers for it because I'm moving the floor standers to a media room. That will have a 65" oled and I have a 55" oled in bedroom, but I am keeping the plasma in the living room. Just can't put it in a landfill when it works and it would be a pain to sell. Hope it gives me another few years !
I have Four (4) Pioneer KURO Monitors. I have yet to see a 4K TV that looks as organic, real and natural as a plasma. All the 4K Monitors I have seen look fake and way too much like video for my taste. It is kind of like the Bayer Filter and Demosaicing Algorithm in most Digital Cameras. I hate it which is why I shoot with a Fuji XT. They take a totally different approach and it is the closest thing I have seen to film out of a digital camera ... ever.

Basically, I compare all of these things like 4K Monitors and Consumer Cameras to Transistors vs, Tubes. I prefer tubes verses solid state. When I see a 4K set that looks real and when there is enough 4K content out there I care about, I will get one I am sure. I do agree that LG does it best based on what i have seen. However, I am in no rush to invest in this technology since the Pioneer KUROS still look better to me as far as fidelity and transparency to the source is concerned.

That is my 2 cents worth and maybe that is all it is is worth. This is a Forum after all and nobody ever agrees to much of anything in a forum...especially once based on science when someone has a different opinion based on a user experience. After all, a user experience can easily defy science. In addition, you cannot quantify a user experience on a piece of test equipment.

Uh Oh, I am probably going to be flamed for causing trouble now even though a threw in a bit of science to show that I understand science ... and I often disagree with it..

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post #7152 of 7227 Old 11-20-2017, 02:21 PM
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Long live the Kuros!

bob
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I agree.
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post #7153 of 7227 Old 11-20-2017, 09:08 PM
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i agree.. the plasma still looks smoother than the OLEDs. i have no reason to change it out. the OLED has 5" on it tho
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post #7154 of 7227 Old 11-21-2017, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I will still use my 141FD and 101FD as a reference for 1080p and below content when needed.
Yes! I can still use this to defeat LCD trolls! lol
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post #7155 of 7227 Old 12-09-2017, 03:02 PM
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ISF patch

Hi all, so happy to see this thread and this tv still in discussion. I never applied the ISF patch to my krp-500m and am wondering if that's something I can still do. ANy advice on where to get it from and how to apply it?
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post #7156 of 7227 Old 12-11-2017, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post
Wow it’s been years since I’ve been in this thread. I actually retired all Kuros and moved completely to OLEDs

* 141FD => 77A1E
* 101FD => 65A1E
* 500M => 65C7P
* 5020FD => 55C7P
* 4280HD => 55A1E (may switch to 55B7A or 55C7P this week)

I will still use my 141FD and 101FD as a reference for 1080p and below content when needed.
in your opnion does the sony have less judder with a 24p source vs the lg oleds ?

greatone99
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post #7157 of 7227 Old 12-11-2017, 06:11 PM
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Hi all, so happy to see this thread and this tv still in discussion. I never applied the ISF patch to my krp-500m and am wondering if that's something I can still do. ANy advice on where to get it from and how to apply it?
There are/were some sources:
Turbe/Controlcal [edit]
The Kuro tweaker makaveddie81.

The solution we discovered was to set the 'type' to J (for Japan). According to D-Nice this is not what Turbe's patch does. Then my now cryptic notes say enable ISF and have at it. The unofficial way is to use the web interface to enter ISF mode calling <kuro>/cgi/isf_reopen.cgi. I have reference to the ISN command but at the moment I can't find the details. It's time for @jdbimmer to weigh in.

There's another way but I don't believe it's public.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
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Last edited by bodosom; 12-12-2017 at 07:27 AM.
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post #7158 of 7227 Old 12-11-2017, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by bodosom View Post
There are/were some sources:
Turbe
Controlcal
The Kuro tweaker makaveddie81.

The solution we discovered was to set the 'type' to J (for Japan). According to D-Nice this is not what Turbe's patch does. Then my now cryptic notes say enable ISF and have at it. The unofficial way is to use the web interface to enter ISF mode calling <kuro>/cgi/isf_reopen.cgi. I have reference to the ISN command but at the moment I can't find the details. It's time for @jdbimmer to weigh in.

There's another way but I don't believe it's public.
Was it Japan or Europe and then enable ISF? I don't recall. Either way, that would require going into the service menu which has its risks. The patch is still available for purchase from Turbe at controlcal.com and comes with an ISF GUI, even if it is a bit clunky to use, assuming you have some tools to calibrate it properly.

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post #7159 of 7227 Old 12-12-2017, 07:36 AM
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Was it Japan or Europe and then enable ISF? ... assuming you have some tools to calibrate it properly.
My notes say Japan. The Contralcal kit is worth getting if one isn't interested in writing your own ISF control software. And yes you do need good tools. E.g. common meters can't read low enough to get black/near black just right on a (happy) 500M.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
UDP-203/ATV4K(6,2)/X3500H/LG C8
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post #7160 of 7227 Old 12-12-2017, 05:53 PM
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My notes say Japan. The Contralcal kit is worth getting if one isn't interested in writing your own ISF control software. And yes you do need good tools. E.g. common meters can't read low enough to get black/near black just right on a (happy) 500M.
I used ControlCal. Easy to use by using the forum over there but it is pay to play.
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post #7161 of 7227 Old 12-12-2017, 06:08 PM
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Thank you so much for this information. I'm going to get in touch with turbe and see what I can do.
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post #7162 of 7227 Old 12-12-2017, 06:26 PM
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I used ControlCal. Easy to use by using the forum over there but it is pay to play.
I didn't mean to suggest Turbe's product was unsuitable. I was one of his first customers for the KRP. I simply preferred my own (simple, command line, non-Windows) interface for running a calibration.

Frankly at this point if I hadn't switched to OLED I'd hire someone to come and do the patching and calibration. My spare time is too valuable to spend it getting imperceptible dE when there are professionals.

I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7163 of 7227 Old 12-15-2017, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by bodosom View Post
My notes say Japan. The Contralcal kit is worth getting if one isn't interested in writing your own ISF control software. And yes you do need good tools. E.g. common meters can't read low enough to get black/near black just right on a (happy) 500M.
I wrote my own Kuro ISF control software (with many bells and whistles not seen in any other programs including a copy to all button that copies an ISF mode to all inputs) and the ISF patch for the KRP models is simply changing the region Japan or Europe.

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post #7164 of 7227 Old 12-21-2017, 06:36 AM
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Quick Question:


How is the 500M holding up performance wise compared to today's newer TVs? I have a pristine, lightly used 500M that was calibrated by D-Nice years ago that's currently not being used.


I'm debating whether I should purchase my Dad a 50-55 inch TV ($500 budget) or give him my 500M or my Sony XBR-55X850C (2015 brand new). My Dad isn't concerned with tech at all. I'm just wondering where the best value is for me considering TVs seem to be getting cheaper and more advanced.


I wouldn't mind giving him one of the above and spending $1000-$1500 on a new TV a year from now, but is that budget going to get me something considerably better than what I already have?
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post #7165 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 07:28 AM
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Quick Question:


How is the 500M holding up performance wise compared to today's newer TVs? I have a pristine, lightly used 500M that was calibrated by D-Nice years ago that's currently not being used.


I'm debating whether I should purchase my Dad a 50-55 inch TV ($500 budget) or give him my 500M or my Sony XBR-55X850C (2015 brand new). My Dad isn't concerned with tech at all. I'm just wondering where the best value is for me considering TVs seem to be getting cheaper and more advanced.


I wouldn't mind giving him one of the above and spending $1000-$1500 on a new TV a year from now, but is that budget going to get me something considerably better than what I already have?
I'm also considering moving on from my 500m, but the performance is still amazing to me. Blacks are deep, but a little higher than what I remember them, but I've thought of going to OLED or seeing what these local dimming quantum dot color filter sets bring in the next year or two. I don't want to attempt doing a panel reset, but may look to getting a calibration done in the near future.

One thing I'm wondering about is the DRE setting and how much that throws off calibration if anyone has experience with this. I honestly enjoy the look of the DRE high setting, but curious of others thoughts on keeping this on and if it's introducing a lot of artifacts. I haven't actually seen an HDR content, but wondering if this setting offers a somewhat similar effect, although I suspect it's probably not close.

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post #7166 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 07:33 AM
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I’d say if you have a working non-red tint 500M keep it for another year or two. I jumped the Kuro 500M ship (after a reset and blacks almost as inky as an OLED) last year. There are too many OLED issues (of course just my opinion) for my liking including banding and color tinting. While 4K and HDR/DV can be amazing, the trade-offs aren’t enough in my opinion if you have a keen eye for uniformity issues.

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post #7167 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmarceau View Post
One thing I'm wondering about is the DRE setting and how much that throws off calibration
No Kuro calibrator will use DRE so turning it on afterward defeats calibration.
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I jumped the Kuro 500M ship (after a reset and blacks almost as inky as an OLED)
You usage of "almost" is pretty broad.
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I might type 2K for 1080p.
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post #7168 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 08:31 AM
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No Kuro calibrator will use DRE so turning it on afterward defeats calibration.

You usage of "almost" is pretty broad.
Unfortunately I didn’t have a meter to check so that’s the best I can go with at the moment.

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post #7169 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 08:43 AM
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I have no idea what the reset panel blacks look like, but I remember seeing some test patterns with a D-Nice tweaked 500m ( mll was maybe .0003 ftL) next to an LG OLED (may have been the EC9300). I think it was the 2014 shootout and from what I can remember, the difference was marginal at best and this was before LG was even close to getting shadow detail right.

I haven't been to one of Robert's events in a while, but it seems the OLED is winning HDR because of deeper blacks, despite getting half as bright as the LCDs. Anyway, it's that feature that has me really considering upgrading to an 8 series LG this year, but I am still blown away by movies on my Kuro. Even streaming looks great most of the time.

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post #7170 of 7227 Old 02-05-2018, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post
My notes say Japan. The Contralcal kit is worth getting if one isn't interested in writing your own ISF control software. And yes you do need good tools. E.g. common meters can't read low enough to get black/near black just right on a (happy) 500M.
So does the Spectracal C6 or i1 Display Pro (Display 3 w/Chromapure) not qualify. I'm looking at getting into DIY calibration this year and was hoping I might eek a little more performance out of the 500M and my ZT60. Plus I'm planning on getting a JVC pj this year as well. Sounds like I'll need a Spyder 5 Elite for the auto calibration JVC has but I'm sure that isn't nearly good enough to calibrate the plasmas properly. I guess they also support the EyeOne Pro 2 spectroradiometer so maybe I'll need to go that route but I thought I read they don't read really low black levels either.

Glad to see there's still some talk of these old Kuro's. My 500M is on bedroom duty since the I got the 60ZT60 in the living room. After much deliberation I expect I'll keep them both until they die (*subject to change ). Viewing distance is too far on either of them to make much difference going to 4K resolution. Sure HDR, yada yada but I'm still pretty darned pleased with the picture on both of my plasmas. If I learn to calibrate well enough and they get even better, well that's even better yet.

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