F8500 Recommended Settings Thread..... - Page 135 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4021 of 4441 Old 02-12-2015, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post
This isn't ABL. Its something way more than that.
I see no dimming when entering the CMS menu.
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post #4022 of 4441 Old 02-13-2015, 05:25 AM
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I see no dimming when entering the CMS menu.
I just double checked and its not doing it now.

I'm officially loosing my mind. Put me out to pasture.
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post #4023 of 4441 Old 02-18-2015, 08:40 AM
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I realize this is slightly off topic but I pulled out my trusty Spyder 3 last night to calibrate my 8500 and am not confident in the meter after being in storage for about 2 years. Would anyone be able to assist with profiling my meter by providing offsets for HCFR?
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post #4024 of 4441 Old 02-18-2015, 09:17 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Milwaukeesk View Post
I realize this is slightly off topic but I pulled out my trusty Spyder 3 last night to calibrate my 8500 and am not confident in the meter after being in storage for about 2 years. Would anyone be able to assist with profiling my meter by providing offsets for HCFR?
I would suggest renting a Colormunki Photo to profile your meter with:

http://www.lensrentals.com/rent/calibration/colormunki

While this isn't the ideal solution it's pretty cheap and should give you a bit more confidence in your colorimeter. Profile every TV you might eventually calibrate within the rental period.
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post #4025 of 4441 Old 02-18-2015, 10:36 AM
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I would suggest renting a Colormunki Photo to profile your meter with:
Good Call. I didn't realize you could rent these. Wonder if I should just buy a new meter at this point...
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post #4026 of 4441 Old 02-19-2015, 04:39 AM
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For those OCD about calibration, I want to share this experience with you.

In my setup, I use a pattern generator (videoforge HDMI) set to YCbCr 444 (as this is what my TIVO puts out) going into an eecolor box for LUTs calibration or directly to the 64F8500.

I noticed that sometimes my 21pt grayscale pattern will look a little red and my white balance setting would have red gain and cut a bit higher than at other times with what should be the same calibration. It was all very confusing. What I discovered is that the F8500 doesn't always detect the incoming signal from the pattern generator correctly when I hot swap the HDMI cable. If I turn the TV off and then back on, it then detects the incoming signal correctly. Maybe hot swapping the HDMI cable works at times but it apparently doesn't work all the time.

After playing cat and mouse with this for quite a while, I'd strongly recommend that once you get your Bluray player, pattern generator or HTPC connected as your pattern source, restart your display.
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post #4027 of 4441 Old 02-19-2015, 07:02 PM
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I hear different things about having Cinema Smooth on or off. I thought it was best to have Cinema Smooth on and turn the Judder off. Below is what Kevin Miller wrote when he reviewed the tv. Any thoughts?

Also on tap in the F8500 is 96Hz processing for handling 24fps material from Blu-ray movie discs, and it works very well. In fact, this is an area where the Samsung F8500 series handily outperforms the Panasonic VT50 series as it appears the Panasonic first takes the signal to 60Hz inserting 2:3 pull-down before then converting the signal to 96Hz. This produces an unacceptable amount of jitter in the picture and is best left at the 60Hz setting in the Panasonic. The Samsung renders left to right pans with 24p material like the helicopter fly over scene of the aircraft carrier in Chapter 7 of “I am Legend” very smoothly. I looked at this scene repeatedly, and found the best results with Film Mode set to Off, and the Judder Canceller set to Standard. The Race Car clip in 24p from the Spears & Munsil Blu-ray test disc was also reproduced very smoothly and cleanly.Samsung has clarified that the Cinema Smooth feature is 96Hz with no 2:3 pull-down, and that the Dejudder Corrector is frame interpolation played back at 60Hz. The 24 fps judder produced by the Cinema Smooth feature was so severe that it prompted me to shut it off.
He prefers the combo of CS off and Motion Judder Canceller on Standard. I don't like the soap opera look so I've turned judder canceller off. With that off, CS on looks better to me than CS off.

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post #4028 of 4441 Old 02-19-2015, 08:37 PM
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For those OCD about calibration, I want to share this experience with you.
...
I think if you have a meter, you're at least obsessive, if not all the way to OCD
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post #4029 of 4441 Old 02-19-2015, 11:10 PM
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Full disclosure: I am a technical illiterate--so please show patience with me.

I have a 51-inch 8500--bought it about three weeks ago. During that time I have been using variants of the most common recommended calibration modes--here, CNET, Consumer Reports, etc.--most of which start from movie mode and turn off all the video processing. In that realm I have found the picture wan and lifeless--disappointing--even with the cell light turned up to 20 at night in a darkened room. So tonight I took the leap into the standard mode. Voila! The picture seemed to spring to life--in fact, I had to turn the cell light down to 12 to tame the brightness a bit; I also turned the sharpness down to 35--zero seemed too fuzzy. Then I turned off the motion adjustment to avoid the soap-opera effect on films. That's it. To me the picture is far more impressive and dimensional now than it was before. I know the measurements will tell me I'm wrong, but my eyes beg to differ--clearly every kind of show or movie I watch locks in in a way that seems right, whereas before it seemed as though I was looking at an eighteenth-century oil painting that needed cleaning. This leads to a few questions for any of you technical whizzes who might be kind enough to oblige me:

1. I thought that the cell light setting was the chief determinant of the overall luminance of the image--yet on Standard, the picture is brighter on 12 than it was on 20 in Movie mode. What explains this apparent discrepancy?
2. Does anyone know what settings were used on the 8500 sets the won the HDTV face-offs in 2013 and 2014?
3. What's the deal on the Standard Mode? To me it looks better. What enhancements, if any, are at work in that mode as opposed to the Movie Mode?

Thanks in advance to anyone who can enlighten me--maybe even wise me up--on any of the foregoing.

Bill
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post #4030 of 4441 Old 02-19-2015, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by William Kaufman View Post
Full disclosure: I am a technical illiterate--so please show patience with me.

Bill
Well, I really can't answer any of your questions as I am even more "technical illiterate" than you.
But I will say this, if you like it and are happy that's all that really maters.
I was also one of the ones who thought "movie mode" was way to dim, and just used "standard mode".
Even after calibration. But after ready post after post of people liking movie mode I switch and tried it out a little longer term.
Now I am a convert! The colors just seem much more "life like". It also vastly depends on just how the film as shot. Some movies are just meant to be on the darker, dimmer side, with muted coloring, others much more brighter and colorfull. I have tried to go back and watch "standard mode" and almost need sunglasses (even with same cell light setting.

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post #4031 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by William Kaufman View Post
Full disclosure: I am a technical illiterate--so please show patience with me.

I have a 51-inch 8500--bought it about three weeks ago. During that time I have been using variants of the most common recommended calibration modes--here, CNET, Consumer Reports, etc.--most of which start from movie mode and turn off all the video processing. In that realm I have found the picture wan and lifeless--disappointing--even with the cell light turned up to 20 at night in a darkened room. So tonight I took the leap into the standard mode. Voila! The picture seemed to spring to life--in fact, I had to turn the cell light down to 12 to tame the brightness a bit; I also turned the sharpness down to 35--zero seemed too fuzzy. Then I turned off the motion adjustment to avoid the soap-opera effect on films. That's it. To me the picture is far more impressive and dimensional now than it was before. I know the measurements will tell me I'm wrong, but my eyes beg to differ--clearly every kind of show or movie I watch locks in in a way that seems right, whereas before it seemed as though I was looking at an eighteenth-century oil painting that needed cleaning. This leads to a few questions for any of you technical whizzes who might be kind enough to oblige me:

1. I thought that the cell light setting was the chief determinant of the overall luminance of the image--yet on Standard, the picture is brighter on 12 than it was on 20 in Movie mode. What explains this apparent discrepancy?
2. Does anyone know what settings were used on the 8500 sets the won the HDTV face-offs in 2013 and 2014?
3. What's the deal on the Standard Mode? To me it looks better. What enhancements, if any, are at work in that mode as opposed to the Movie Mode?

Thanks in advance to anyone who can enlighten me--maybe even wise me up--on any of the foregoing.

Bill
Try these settings on movie mode. I find that mode fantastic and my pic is not too dark nor too bright. They were done by Kevin Miller a pro calibrator for Tweaktv and Value Electronics.

Picture Mode: Movie
Color Temp: Warm 2
Gamma: 0
Backlight: 16
Brightness: 47
Contrast: 95
Color: 50
Tint: G50/R50
Sharpness: 0
Low Red: 22/
Low Green: 25/
Low Blue: 24/
High Red: 25/3=*1,6=*4,8=*1,9=*2
High Blue: 25/3=*1,4=+2,7=+2,8=*3,9=*2,10=+3
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post #4032 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 09:13 AM
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Incredibly specific gripe: I have to turn on motion smoothing when watching The Simpsons, or the lines blur. Anybody else?

I actually like the smoothing on live sports, it only rarely bothers me on other content. When it is bad, it's pretty distracting though, last noticed it on TWD.
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post #4033 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 09:20 AM
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Do any of you guys find Warm 2 too green? I forget what movie I was watching, but it looked like I was watching The Matrix. I've switched to Warm 1 and it seems much better.
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post #4034 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 09:31 AM
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Do any of you guys find Warm 2 too green? I forget what movie I was watching, but it looked like I was watching The Matrix. I've switched to Warm 1 and it seems much better.
If you don't plan to calibrate the white balance/grayscale, warm 2 will push green, and you'd be better of using warm 1, as you have already discovered.
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post #4035 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 10:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by ermghoti View Post
Incredibly specific gripe: I have to turn on motion smoothing when watching The Simpsons, or the lines blur. Anybody else?

I actually like the smoothing on live sports, it only rarely bothers me on other content. When it is bad, it's pretty distracting though, last noticed it on TWD.
I've gone back and forth on my motion settings. I always leave smoothing off. Standard should be called 'too high' and Smooth should be called 'way too high'. I think the Panasonics do this better. Their low setting is pretty good. I also like their 60hz 'secret sauce'. I didn't care for their 96hz mode.

On the F8500 I've been a big proponent of Cinema Smooth being on but I'm testing without this week and so far I might end up liking it better. The picture just seems more 'stable' for lack of a better term. I may just be imagining it but their appears to be less flicker and while I don't think there is as much motion resolution the blur that is there is actually fairly soothing. I'm probably not explaining it well....
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post #4036 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 10:52 AM
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I've gone back and forth on my motion settings. I always leave smoothing off. Standard should be called 'too high' and Smooth should be called 'way too high'. I think the Panasonics do this better. Their low setting is pretty good. I also like their 60hz 'secret sauce'. I didn't care for their 96hz mode.

On the F8500 I've been a big proponent of Cinema Smooth being on but I'm testing without this week and so far I might end up liking it better. The picture just seems more 'stable' for lack of a better term. I may just be imagining it but their appears to be less flicker and while I don't think there is as much motion resolution the blur that is there is actually fairly soothing. I'm probably not explaining it well....
Yeah.....I keep going back and forth on these settings and film mode. Seems to me that if you're playing a movie shot on film (not digital) then you benefit by having cinema smooth on. If its not on shot on film, say a more recent movie shot digitally or most current TVshows and sports events, then I prefer cinema smooth turned off. But you know, some people prefer a different look where they actually like a little of the soap opera effect.
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post #4037 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 11:02 AM
 
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Yeah.....I keep going back and forth on these settings and film mode. Seems to me that if you're playing a movie shot on film (not digital) then you benefit by having cinema smooth on. If its not on shot on film, say a more recent movie shot digitally or most current TVshows and sports events, then I prefer cinema smooth turned off. But you know, some people prefer a different look where they actually like a little of the soap opera effect.
Good point. Sadly it really affects the calibration so not super easy to change for each movie.
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post #4038 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 11:33 AM
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I have been trying to find an answer to how the PN64F8500 does its internal color processing, and I read somewhere that the F8500 works in 4:2:2 (or 4:2:0) YCbCr until it finally converts it to RGB for display. If that's the case, then the ideal color space setting of my Oppo BDP-93 for use with the F8500 should be YCbCr 4:2:2? I have also been unable to get the Spears and Munsil second edition Chroma Range Check to pass using my BDP-93 and F8500.
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post #4039 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 12:03 PM
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I have found the picture wan and lifeless--disappointing--even with the cell light turned up to 20 at night in a darkened room.
Bill
May I suggest you try Pie's cal for your 51" set? Be careful with Sharpness; some newer sets want 35-50 rather than 0-6, perhaps due to EVO kit??

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post29845386
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post #4040 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post
Yeah.....I keep going back and forth on these settings and film mode. Seems to me that if you're playing a movie shot on film (not digital) then you benefit by having cinema smooth on. If its not on shot on film, say a more recent movie shot digitally or most current TVshows and sports events, then I prefer cinema smooth turned off. But you know, some people prefer a different look where they actually like a little of the soap opera effect.
Cinema Smooth is only for 24fps content, wouldn't apply to sports or TV shows...

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post #4041 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post
Good point. Sadly it really affects the calibration so not super easy to change for each movie.
Didn't they fix that with a firmware upgrade?

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post #4042 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 12:55 PM
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I've hesitated to post this because I keep thinking that I've done something stupid to cause it. But I've checked and re-checked and I've definitely got an issue. The red in my white balance is decreasing over time. I've checked it with an iD3 and a ColorMunki Spectro.

Here's a calibration done on January 19th on HDMI3:


Here's a sweep done on Feb 17th, no changes to TV settings:


Red has lost 3-5%!! So I recalibrated on Feb 17th. Here's the sweep:


Then last night I did another sweep and lost red again:


Help! Any ideas what is going on?
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post #4043 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 12:56 PM
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Thanks, WantsNWarrants. Unless I'm missing it, Pie cal's calibration doesn't list a picture mode. Should it be movie mode? Standard?

Also, do Pie cal's adjustments correct the tendency of warm2 to push green?

Finally, I was wondering why so many suggested calibrations start from movie mode rather than standard. Is the former inherently more accurate?
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post #4044 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 01:12 PM
 
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Didn't they fix that with a firmware upgrade?
I think the firmware upgrade fixed the rise in black levels with Cinema Smooth on. But that was before my time with the TV. My black levels measure the same with it on or off.


But grayscale is affected (See attached). It roughly amounts to about two points of blue offset and gain.
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post #4045 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by William Kaufman View Post
Thanks, WantsNWarrants. Unless I'm missing it, Pie cal's calibration doesn't list a picture mode. Should it be movie mode? Standard?
Movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by William Kaufman View Post
Also, do Pie cal's adjustments correct the tendency of warm2 to push green?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by William Kaufman View Post
Finally, I was wondering why so many suggested calibrations start from movie mode rather than standard. Is the former inherently more accurate?
Most\all professional calibrators set\calibrate Movie mode, from which I conclude that YES, Movie is inherently more accurate. EDIT 1: I should have been more clear here. If you check other modes, you will see that certain setings that are available in Move (and CalDay\Night if enabled) are greyed out; thus cannot be set at all in that particular mode.

EDIT 2: Glenee also posted settings in this thread for the 51" set which you might want to check out.

Last edited by WantsNWarrants; 02-20-2015 at 01:24 PM.
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post #4046 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 01:57 PM
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Thanks again, WantsNWarrants. Just curious--is Pie a professional electrical engineer and/or tv calibrator (same question for Glenee).

Also, I assume that after making these adjustments, if you press picture reset, everything reverts to the factory presets?
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post #4047 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 02:09 PM
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I've hesitated to post this because I keep thinking that I've
What are you using for your pattern generator?
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post #4048 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 02:11 PM
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post #4049 of 4441 Old 02-20-2015, 09:44 PM
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My 8500 currently has the firmware 1204 and it's asking to update to 1206. Should I update or will I loose black levels in doing so?
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post #4050 of 4441 Old 02-21-2015, 12:04 AM
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My 8500 currently has the firmware 1204 and it's asking to update to 1206. Should I update or will I loose black levels in doing so?
You won't lose black levels. You won't lose anything. All it does is update the smart hub. The updates have been basically useless since the early updates in 2013. If you don't use smarthub, then don't bother.
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