Is power line conditioner really necessory for plasma HDTV? - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 270 Old 01-22-2008, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joemama127 View Post

....and it was for a "power line conditioner" which isn't the same as a surge protector.

i wonder why manufacturers make huge amounts of money then, selling power conditioners (disguised in many forms) to data centers and other mission critical facilities? my TV is just as important as a bladed server.
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post #32 of 270 Old 01-22-2008, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by leo95se View Post

new construction doesnt create more voltage. higher voltage is typically related to proximity to the substation.

I know, I was just throwing that out there if anybody asked the age of the property. We are VERY close to a substation (look up THproperties, they build all of their homes near power lines/plants).

In fact, we go through lightbulbs pretty quickly in our house due to this.
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post #33 of 270 Old 01-22-2008, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Ericthemidget View Post

I know, I was just throwing that out there if anybody asked the age of the property. We are VERY close to a substation (look up THproperties, they build all of their homes near power lines/plants).

In fact, we go through lightbulbs pretty quickly in our house due to this.

that stinks.. your small appliances ok? they can suffer the most. from an electronics/charging standpoint, maybe you benefit, more power, less time

have you considered a voltage regulator for your house?
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post #34 of 270 Old 01-24-2008, 09:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I personally is not a big fun of the line conditioner. But hey, if you can get one at 30 bucks with 10 outlets, functioning as line conditioner as well as surge protector, why not?
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post #35 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 10:58 AM
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Does anyone know if the Belkin PureAV PF30 has sufficient bandwidth to pass a HDTV signal? Thanks so much.
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post #36 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 11:26 AM
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For those of you who are saying absolutely not, have you guys measured actual line voltage in a house? Electricity is a flucuating thing. Yes appliances can take a range of voltage but things like brown outs, inconsitant voltage, surges when power outages come back online, or on and off outages, etc can affect the longevity of an electronic device. And yes AV equipment, DVRs, computers, are more at risk then a fridge or something.

I live in a major metro area and every so often there's a brownout or a spike or a drop and I've had no issues since using a UPS, while others have lost equipment. Everything likes consistancy and that's what a line conditioner or ups gives you.

I'd say buy one, but don't go crazy...
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post #37 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 01:03 PM
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Does anyone have a suggestion for a <$150 power conditioner that has the frequency range to pass the HDTV signal? I've read elsewhere on this forum that some of the conditioners only run at 900mHz, which I think would cause you to lose your HDTV signal if you used the coax protection... Thanks.
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post #38 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 01:16 PM
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Snake oil.
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post #39 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bosoxbw View Post

Does anyone have a suggestion for a <$150 power conditioner that has the frequency range to pass the HDTV signal? I've read elsewhere on this forum that some of the conditioners only run at 900mHz, which I think would cause you to lose your HDTV signal if you used the coax protection... Thanks.

I would not get wrapped up with specifications. I would go with APC, PureAV, Monster Power, Panamax. However, the steal of the century looks like the Newpoint 204220.

Chris
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post #40 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by creemail View Post

I would not get wrapped up with specifications. I would go with APC, PureAV, Monster Power, Panamax. However, the steal of the century looks like the Newpoint 204220.

Chris

Hi Chris--

Why do you say not to get caught up in the specs? Seems like it would be a problem if the coax on the filter could not pass the HD signal...

I like the Newpoint option, and its discounted because of a branding issue as I understand it, but overall it seems pretty comparable to the Belkin PF30 and I like the Belkin better aesthetically (in black, matched my other components)...
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post #41 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by bosoxbw View Post

Hi Chris--

Why do you say not to get caught up in the specs? Seems like it would be a problem if the coax on the filter could not pass the HD signal...

I like the Newpoint option, and its discounted because of a branding issue as I understand it, but overall it seems pretty comparable to the Belkin PF30 and I like the Belkin better aesthetically (in black, matched my other components)...

Instead of the coax going through the line conditioner I would have the coax go from wall to cable box to display, rather than wall to line conditioner to cable box then to the display.

Specifications aren't going to make a huge difference with line conditioners. It would be very hard to compare joules, mhz, etc.... So my reasoning is that even a inexpensive, cheap $10 surge protector will get the job done with minimum interference. However, its not the most ideal way of protection. When you start adding more audio and video components or your computer on the same line, that is when interference can occur.

Chris
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post #42 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creemail View Post

Instead of the coax going through the line conditioner I would have the coax go from wall to cable box to display, rather than wall to line conditioner to cable box then to the display.

Specifications aren't going to make a huge difference with line conditioners. It would be very hard to compare joules, mhz, etc.... So my reasoning is that even a inexpensive, cheap $10 surge protector will get the job done with minimum interference. However, its not the most ideal way of protection. When you start adding more audio and video components or your computer on the same line, that is when interference can occur.

Chris

So I take it that you don't see much benefit to filtering the coax, or shielding the components from a surge through the coax?

Anyone else have an opinion on running the coax through at least a surge protector-- do people out there there just use a surge protector use the coax, or do you just plug the coax into the set-top box?
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post #43 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 03:01 PM
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I thought I read on one of the warranty pages, that everything had to go through the power strip/protector for the warranty to be valid. Like if you did get a surge that wiped out your tv or receiver, everything had to be connected to it for it to be covered otherwise they wouldn't be able to tell where the surge came in from.
I.E. you just plugged your tv's power cord into it, but not the cable signal.
I think it might be in the fine print.....
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post #44 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Maximum7 View Post

I thought I read on one of the warranty pages, that everything had to go through the power strip/protector for the warranty to be valid. Like if you did get a surge that wiped out your tv or receiver, everything had to be connected to it for it to be covered otherwise they wouldn't be able to tell where the surge came in from.
I.E. you just plugged your tv's power cord into it, but not the cable signal.
I think it might be in the fine print.....

I'll take a look at that, Maximum. Seems to make sense. That makes the question even more important as to whether people think I could plug the coax into the Belkin without losing signal quality, and if not suggest a line conditioner or surge protector that can pass the HDTV signal.
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post #45 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by joemama127 View Post

Unless you live in an old house with old wiring...you most likely have surge protection built in that covers every outlet.



Hmmm, automatic surge protection. Thats news to me.
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post #46 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joemama127 View Post

Yes, absolutely. It is just as neccessary as $150 Monster cables and a 4 year extended warranty for $500. Oh...and the $25 Monster plasma cleaning kit as well.


edit- in case my sarcasm was missed here is my real answer: if your house wiring is bad enough to actually require "line conditioning" then you might want to consider a whole house rewire before using any expensive electronics.



I can agree with you that monster cables and extended warranties are over priced. Some just feel better having that piece of mind when it comes to protecting your equipment. I am and would be more concerned about voltage fluctuations such as brownouts and surges. These are not the fault of your home wiring and you have no control over this. This is why I would recommend a surge protector with AVR (automatic voltage regulation) rather then a line conditioner. On a side note I called my insurance company and was curious if my homeowners would cover my lcd (without a ryder) if damaged by a lighting strike. They said yes but make sure I have it connected to a surge protector. Just want to make sure I have my bases covered in case of a claim. Also when you see that big equipment warranty that all these companies have that's a good marketing gimmick. Now I know that there are renters out there and if you don't have rental insurance I don't know how many hoops you need to jump threw to get your equipment covered but for most of us with a homeowners policy if you ever have damage to your equipment while plugged into one of these devices your homeowners ends up footing the bill less your deductible which is paid by the company you bought your surge from.
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post #47 of 270 Old 01-26-2008, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by bosoxbw View Post

I'll take a look at that, Maximum. Seems to make sense. That makes the question even more important as to whether people think I could plug the coax into the Belkin without losing signal quality, and if not suggest a line conditioner or surge protector that can pass the HDTV signal.

anyone?
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post #48 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 09:09 AM
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one last bump-- i know you guys hate talking about line conditioners, but I need to make the purchase today-- does anyone know whether I should plug the coax into the surge protector/line conditioner, or will I lose HDTV?

Thank you
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post #49 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bosoxbw View Post

one last bump-- i know you guys hate talking about line conditioners, but I need to make the purchase today-- does anyone know whether I should plug the coax into the surge protector/line conditioner, or will I lose HDTV?

Thank you

I have an APC J15 which is a 1.5kVA Power Conditioner with UPS. It carries the HD signal just fine.

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post #50 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 11:35 AM
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I have the APC H15 and I have my HD cable going through it. No problems at all. I think it's rated up to 1ghz.

Sometimes I think my brain has a mind of its own.
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post #51 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 01:44 PM
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I have the J15 and the H10 and they work fine. The J15 has battery backup capapbilities too.
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post #52 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 02:35 PM
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Anyone notice any adverse effects on your HT gear with the APC Jxx and its "stepped approximation to a sinewave" output when on battery? I'm tryng to decide on whether to get a J-type unit or go for the S-type with true sinewave output.

Sometimes I think my brain has a mind of its own.
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post #53 of 270 Old 01-27-2008, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace of Space View Post

Anyone notice any adverse effects on your HT gear with the APC Jxx and its "stepped approximation to a sinewave" output when on battery? I'm tryng to decide on whether to get a J-type unit or go for the S-type with true sinewave output.

I haven't noticed any issues.

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DragonFly: 16:9 133" High Contrast Screen, Apple: AppleTV, Roku: Roku4
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post #54 of 270 Old 01-28-2008, 06:35 PM
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On my plasma i can see quite a bit of noise, anyone know where i can find a review for the Newpoint 204220? If not i can go with the Belkin PF30 since it will match most of my gear

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post #55 of 270 Old 01-28-2008, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingcarcas View Post

On my plasma i can see quite a bit of noise, anyone know where i can find a review for the Newpoint 204220? If not i can go with the Belkin PF30 since it will match most of my gear

Not many reviews on the 204220, however, it will get the job done.

Chris
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post #56 of 270 Old 02-11-2008, 02:04 PM
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Chris, do you have this product? I am considering getting it, but I was wondering if it has phone line jacks. (for my dish conn.)
Also, if you do, do you like it?
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post #57 of 270 Old 03-14-2008, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chaz01 View Post

Snake oil.

Anyone that doesn't understand the science of something will naturally chalk it up to something supernatural. Works both ways. If you don't understand the reason for something, educate yourself somewhere else. All you get here are parrots that largely don't actually own/use/have any experience or training with any of these devices.

There should be a mod that patrols for posts like yours and the ones that insist that $25 "surge protectors" are good enough. After all, you're personally responsible for the thousands of dollars in inevitable loss that comes from people heeding advice like that.

The First Clarke Law states, 'If an elderly but distinguished scientist says that something is possible he is almost certainly right, but if he says that it is impossible he is very probably wrong.'
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post #58 of 270 Old 03-14-2008, 11:31 PM
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Originally Posted by schticker View Post

Anyone that doesn't understand the science of something will naturally chalk it up to something supernatural. Works both ways. If you don't understand the reason for something, educate yourself somewhere else. All you get here are parrots that largely don't actually own/use/have any experience or training with any of these devices.

There should be a mod that patrols for posts like yours and the ones that insist that $25 "surge protectors" are good enough. After all, you're personally responsible for the thousands of dollars in inevitable loss that comes from people heeding advice like that.

Sounds like a snake oil salesman.

By the way, saw this post in another thread...

Quote:
Originally Posted by schticker View Post

None of those are relevant in today's climate. Video switching through receivers, cable card that nobody uses because cable companies hate the one-way aspect of it, and TV Guide that matters not when you tune through a dish/cable box anyway. I'll drop those for a grand in savings and tell my clients to do likewise. That's money that can go to better audio.


Do you make money selling power conditioners? Why so emotional a response? Afraid someone might think twice if they see an opposing view?

Geez, lighten up.

If you insist on continuing the banter, perhaps you would be so kind as to quantify how the thousands in inevitable loss saved is more than the thousands spent on power conditioners for prevention.
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post #59 of 270 Old 03-15-2008, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by chaz01 View Post

Sounds like a snake oil salesman.

Sounds like an ad hominem. But that's how AVSers defend themselves; look for a person with a vested interest in something and assume they can't be trusted as a result. In the real world, if you have a longstanding and successful career in anything, chances are you have overkill amounts of training, real world experience to fall back on, and as a result of your skill set, happen to make money at it. Doesn't do anything but reinforce my point rather than destroy it.

Quote:


Afraid someone might think twice if they see an opposing view?

It's their gear. The IT and pro audio industry doesn't think devices like this are snake oil, so if you want to indict entire industries' decisions on their gear choices feel free.

Quote:


If you insist on continuing the banter, perhaps you would be so kind as to quantify how the thousands in inevitable loss saved is more than the thousands spent on power conditioners for prevention.

My banter? Plug all your stuff into a cheapo power strip and report back. It isn't about much else than protection, and although it isn't sexy, that doesn't make it irrelevant.

The First Clarke Law states, 'If an elderly but distinguished scientist says that something is possible he is almost certainly right, but if he says that it is impossible he is very probably wrong.'
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post #60 of 270 Old 03-15-2008, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingcarcas View Post

On my plasma i can see quite a bit of noise, anyone know where i can find a review for the Newpoint 204220? If not i can go with the Belkin PF30 since it will match most of my gear

I have the PF60 which is one hell of a surge/power conditioner. Purchased it a couple of years ago for under $200.00 which was a great price. I am looking at the PF30 now also for my bedroom. Amazon or Buy.com have this for a fair price with free shipping. Besides the fact my PF60 provides me with 13 outlets, the protection alone against any surges is worth the price alone. My power fluctuates and is constantly going out during storms in the summer months.

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