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post #1 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 02:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Vinyl Snobs

Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?
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post #2 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 03:13 AM
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Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?
Vinyl doesn't sound good to me. I feel it has rolled off treble and lacks bass. Then there's the constant knowledge that every time you play your LP, it will sound slightly worse the next time. This alone would drive me crazy. There's a reason that this isn't the current tech.
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post #3 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 06:01 AM
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The fact is there are many ways to enjoy music. If you don't like records and TT's listen and enjoy another format. I have streaming, CD's, SACD's, Blu-Ray Surround Music and a TT w/a tube preamp. As they said in the old days "what ever floats your boat". Maybe we should change the title from Vinyl Snobs to Digital Snobs.
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post #4 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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I've never heard digital music listeners telling others you're wasting money upgrading your system when they are asking for system upgrade suggestions....that it what Vinyl Snobs do 😁
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post #5 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 08:31 AM
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Vinyl is retro.
Vinyl is a physical medium.
Vinyl is collectible.
These attributes make it special, and special generates snobbery.
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post #6 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
I've never heard digital music listeners telling others you're wasting money upgrading your system when they are asking for system upgrade suggestions....that it what Vinyl Snobs do 😁
Look around there are MANY people on this forum giving LP guys a hard time for embracing the archaic format.


I like records in the same way I like old cars. They are hands on and fun to play with. Most of my listening is digital however.

live and let live, or something to that effect
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post #7 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
I've never heard digital music listeners telling others you're wasting money upgrading your system when they are asking for system upgrade suggestions....that it what Vinyl Snobs do 😁
Not true. I've read plenty of arguments that a $100 DAC is just as good as a 2K DAC. This is audio. Opinions are like noses everyone has one.
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post #8 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?
Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
I've never heard digital music listeners telling others you're wasting money upgrading your system when they are asking for system upgrade suggestions....that it what Vinyl Snobs do 😁
I don't understand the point (other than to start bickering).
Listen to the format(s) of your choice.
Purchase and/or upgrade you equipment as you desire.
Not a problem for anyone as long as you're enjoying the music/hobby.
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post #9 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 10:07 AM
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Novel concept, but you're allowed to listen to both Vinyl and digital. You don't have to pick a side. Both formats have their positives and negatives, too.
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post #10 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 11:27 AM
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I think where everything goes pear-shaped is when people make the leap from "I prefer the sound of [preferred format]" to "if you don't build your whole system and listening experience around [preferred format] you're not a real hi fi listener and [not preferred format] is garbage."
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post #11 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 12:18 PM
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I think where everything goes pear-shaped is when people make the leap from "I prefer the sound of [preferred format]" to "if you don't build your whole system and listening experience around [preferred format] you're not a real hi fi listener and [not preferred format] is garbage."

The key to having a system that does both digital and vinyl well is separates. Some of the "all in one" solutions on the market right now are pretty crappy and do introduce compromises (one way or the other, or both).

And truth be told, you're not going to get a vinyl experience that's representative of the medium on a $199 turntable with a $499 AVR that has a phono stage. It's like listening to Pandora and declaring that digital is bad.
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post #12 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 12:28 PM
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And truth be told, you're not going to get a vinyl experience that's representative of the medium on a $199 turntable with a $499 AVR that has a phono stage. It's like listening to Pandora and declaring that digital is bad.
Sure you can. Most receivers have a "direct stereo" feature that turns off all the other video & audio processing allowing the phono stage to have sole use of the amplifying circuits with no electronic interference or crosstalk. You don't need a separate phono preamp and amplifier(s) to enjoy vinyl music, and the average person would be hard pressed to tell the difference. And any modern turntable is going to have a solid platter, decent tonearm, silent motor, and vibration/isolating, dampening feet/chassis.

Now, cartridges are a different story, of course. There, money = quality and the sonic differences are noticeable.
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post #13 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 12:39 PM
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post #14 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 12:50 PM
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Sure you can. Most receivers have a "direct stereo" feature that turns off all the other video & audio processing allowing the phono stage to have sole use of the amplifying circuits with no electronic interference or crosstalk. You don't need a separate phono preamp and amplifier(s) to enjoy vinyl music, and the average person would be hard pressed to tell the difference. And any modern turntable is going to have a solid platter, decent tonearm, silent motor, and vibration/isolating, dampening feet/chassis.

Now, cartridges are a different story, of course. There, money = quality and the sonic differences are noticeable.

The difference in phono stages are much different than you are trying to lead us to believe. I don't want to get into specifics, but such features as "direct stereo" don't make up for inferior engineering and/or cheap components on an integrated amp/receiver.

Vinyl will sound "ok" on a $200 TT and $499 AVR, such as digital will sound "ok" via lossy streaming. One could enjoy both but they are far from representative of their respective medium.
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post #15 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?
Before this thread spirals into the crapper, perhaps the OP can provide links to threads on AVS where that was stated?
I'm curious. I've not seen any that specifically made that claim.
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post #16 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by dfa973 View Post
Vinyl is retro.
Vinyl is a physical medium.
Vinyl is collectible.
These attributes make it special, and special generates snobbery.

I disagree. It makes collecting vinyl for those of us who like vinyl fun. I also stream, play CDs, cassettes so I know I'm not a snob
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The most vitriolic opinions I've seen on the topic were from either audiophile press or hifi dealers, both of whom have an inherent interest in the mystique and expense of hifi vinyl.
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post #18 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by _tk View Post
The difference in phono stages are much different than you are trying to lead us to believe. I don't want to get into specifics, but such features as "direct stereo" don't make up for inferior engineering and/or cheap components on an integrated amp/receiver.

Vinyl will sound "ok" on a $200 TT and $499 AVR, such as digital will sound "ok" via lossy streaming. One could enjoy both but they are far from representative of their respective medium.

To start with, new AVRs retailing for $500 will not have a phono stage. Secondly tolerances of components used to build said phono stages in AVRs have much tighter tolerances and quality in their manufacturing then components produced/used in the 70 and 80s. The one thing phono stages lack in AVRs are adjustable impedances for some of the more out of bell curve cartridges. I see myths still run rampant here.
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I have not listened to vinyl in over 35 years. I now have a heck of a nice 7.1 system and I listen to mainly surround discs. A friend of mine gave me a stack of surround discs made by someone who really knows how to create surround discs from stereo. Included was basically the entire Beatles catalog. All the disc sound great especially Abbey Road. However the Revolver disc was cut from a record and the beginning of Love You To the noise of the vinyl surface nearly drives me to kill myself. I don't miss vinyl for one second.
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post #20 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 02:34 PM
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I have not listened to vinyl in over 35 years.
Your choice. It doesn't make you a bad person.


Quote:
I now have a heck of a nice 7.1 system and I listen to mainly surround discs.
Personal preference.


Quote:
A friend of mine gave me a stack of surround discs made by someone who really knows how to create surround discs from stereo.
Who was that?


Quote:
Included was basically the entire Beatles catalog. All the disc sound great especially Abbey Road. However the Revolver disc was cut from a record and the beginning of Love You To the noise of the vinyl surface nearly drives me to kill myself. I don't miss vinyl for one second.
Do you have catalog numbers of those "surround discs"? Or... are they bootlegs?



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post #21 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 02:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Before this thread spirals into the crapper, perhaps the OP can provide links to threads on AVS where that was stated?
I'm curious. I've not seen any that specifically made that claim.
Funny you should ask because there is a thread in this very 2.0 topic of which you were the first to reply and tell someone upgrading their system used to listen to digital is useless. And in fact 2 of the first 3 response told this person don't upgrade. I'm not trying to pick on you but you asked the question and it just so happens that is a recent thread that I read where I noticed it. As a newbie around here the "Vinyl Snob" mentality is something I picked up on immediately when I started browsing around. For guys that have been around a long time you're probably numb to it.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/173-2...r-upgrade.html

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post #22 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 03:17 PM
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Funny you should ask because there is a thread in this very 2.0 topic of which you were the first to reply and tell someone upgrading their system used to listen to digital is useless. And in fact 2 of the first 3 response told this person don't upgrade. I'm not trying to pick on you but you asked the question and it just so happens that is a recent thread that I read where I noticed it. As a newbie around here the "Vinyl Snob" mentality is something I picked up on immediately when I started browsing around. For guys that have been around a long time you're probably numb to it.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/173-2...r-upgrade.html
And look at my last post. It has nothing related to Vinyl vs. digital (streaming).
I'm not "numb" to anything.



As a newbie... stop misinterpreting previous threads/posts and focus in your own questions/needs/desires without criticism of other. (And perhaps out of context)



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And look at my last post. It has nothing related to Vinyl vs. digital (streaming).
I'm not "numb" to anything.



As a newbie... stop misinterpreting previous threads/posts and focus in your own questions/needs/desires without criticism of other. (And perhaps out of context)
Not looking to conversing with anyone only interested in increasing their post count. Bye
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Vinyl doesn't sound good to me. I feel it has rolled off treble and lacks bass. Then there's the constant knowledge that every time you play your LP, it will sound slightly worse the next time. This alone would drive me crazy. There's a reason that this isn't the current tech.
I enjoy LPs and digital. Your experience with vinyl differs dramatically from mine. From clean, detailed, and tight bass that shakes my music room and hits me in the chest, to gorgeous treble with extended highs that provide all the shimmer and air available from the best CDs.

As for wear, having always used excellent turntables and phono cartridges, my LPs still sound as good as new, going back to original Beatles LPs, many other bands, and classical recordings purchased since the early 1960s. Every one of those old records have been played countless times, particularly the Fab Four and The Who. In fact, I bought duplicates of several favorites as insurance against wear, but have yet to open any of them.

Plus, using record-cleaning accessories since those early days (such as Cecil E Watts products) and a VPI record-cleaning machine since the early 1980s, my records, with rare exceptions, are noise-free.

Yes, LPs require more "work" than does digital, but they can and do sound beautiful.
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post #25 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 03:30 PM
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Not looking to conversing with anyone only interested in increasing their post count. Bye
Bye...


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Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?


The answer is in your title... Each to their own. I can’t imagine anything in vinyl having the quality of Tidal Masters, but I believe for lovers of vinyl, it isn’t about SQ, but rather nostalgia and collecting. At least that’s what I see from friends who own vinyl.
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post #27 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by happycamper820
Why is that if you don't listen to vinyl you're wasting your money upgrading your system if you're only listening to streaming media?
If you're a self-proclaimed "audiophile" you're likely wasting your money no matter what you're listening to. But it's entirely your right to do so.
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post #28 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Ratman View Post
Before this thread spirals into the crapper, perhaps the OP can provide links to threads on AVS where that was stated?
I'm curious. I've not seen any that specifically made that claim.


This thread was destined for the crapper Bro!

Digital Streaming Snob here...
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post #29 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 04:35 PM
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Funny! Those who spend the money for a true Hi-Fi vinyl system are entitled to a little snobbery IMO...
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post #30 of 276 Old 10-01-2019, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
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My dad was a big stereophiliac in his younger days. He probably had over 500 LPs from mostly the 60s and 70s. In fact when I looked in his cabinet most of the LPs are still there. I think he sold off some when CDs began replacing LPs but he was never able to migrate to digital as his health and age prevented it. He said I could throw out his old equipment so I recently tossed a turntable, some cassette decks, some AV receivers, and over a dozen speakers all over 20 years old. I just found a brand new Yamaha preamp in his storage closet. It was unopened but probably over 20 years old too...local stereo shop says they don't want it so I'll probably end up throwing it away as well, was hoping I could get a few bucks for some of the better stuff. Some of the LPs might be worth something but I'm not really interested in sorting through it and looking for a buyer.
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