Turntable Newbie - High Distortion Issue - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 2Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 38 Old 11-02-2019, 07:36 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Turntable Newbie - High Distortion Issue

Hi everyone,

Long time lurker on the forum... I've recently purchased my first turntable, a brand new Pro-Ject DC Esprit SB w/ Ortofon 2M red cartridge and acrylic platter with a brand new Mies p50 phono stage preamp. When playing a record the sound seems that it is clipping and sounds like a very high distortion.

My setup is a bit weird:
Main Room/HT Setup: Marantz AV7705 Preamp, NuPrime-X MCX-4 Power amp, AppleTV 4K, Artcoustic SL 40/30 4-2 Speakers, SVS PB-3000 Subwoofer,and a Sony 77A9G TV (a 3.1 setup)
Second Room: Pro-Ject Turntable, Mies P50 Phono preamp, NuPrime-X MCX-4 Power amp, and Artcoustic Diablo speakers (a 2.0 setup)

The speakers in the second room are powered from the main room one of MCX-4 power amps through a speaker distribution and the signal from the TT/Mies is sent to the AV7705 (CD input) through a Denon Pro Wireless RCA transmitter/Receiver (I know for the purists I'm converting Anolog to Digital and back, which is a big no-no, but please ignore that for now)

So when I play a record the sound seems as if the signal coming from the TT and into the P50 is "Hot" and causing distortion. I've tried an ART DJPre II phono preamp and even if I set the gain control to the lowest setting the clipping light is solid red. I've also tried adding an RCA volume attenuator and still same issue. I've also tried connecting the TT directly to the RCA matrix and into the AV7705 phono input and still get the same issue and even with setting the Denon transmitted to its lowest gain/volume setting However if I connect just the TT into the AV7705 phono input everything sounds fine and also if I plug any of the phono preamps directly into the AV7705 CD input and use them as an outboard phono stage everything sounds fine.

I've checked the TT setup and used a digital scale as well, the records I'm using are all brand new and sealed. I've also tried cleaning them with a carbon brush and the stylus with a stylus brush and still get the same issue. I've tried different RCA cables as well and still same issue.

I've checked and know that my TT doesn't have an onboard phono preamp. So I'm not sure what is going on... Basically what I'm understanding that the TT is somehow sending a "loud" signal.

Sorry for the long message... l really would appreciate it if someone can shed some light on this issue. Thanks for listening
petrolhd is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 06:23 AM
Member
 
Craig Morris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Ontario
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 11
You seem to have identified the Denon wireless kit as the source of the boosted signal. So at least you know where the problem is. Unfortunately, I don’t know how to help you with that. Have you tried a different source with the wireless kit?
Craig Morris is offline  
post #3 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 07:07 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Morris View Post
You seem to have identified the Denon wireless kit as the source of the boosted signal. So at least you know where the problem is. Unfortunately, I don’t know how to help you with that. Have you tried a different source with the wireless kit?
Thanks for replying

I don't think it's the Denon wireless at fault, because as I mentioned when hooking up the TT directly to the DJPre phono preamp, the clipping light is solid red (which means a high signal is being passed) and then to the Denon transmitter, which also shows that the source (ouput from the phono stage) is clipping. I'm not sure what is the issue, at first I thought it was the TT, but if I plugged directly into the AV7705 phono input everything sounds fine, no clipping or distortion. That's what is confusing me
petrolhd is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 07:14 AM
Member
 
Craig Morris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Ontario
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
However if I connect just the TT into the AV7705 phono input everything sounds fine and also if I plug any of the phono preamps directly into the AV7705 CD input and use them as an outboard phono stage everything sounds fine.
The fact that everything works when plugged directly into the Marantz tells me that it is something about the Denon in the chain that is causing issues.
Craig Morris is offline  
post #5 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 07:35 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 633
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 495 Post(s)
Liked: 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Morris View Post
The fact that everything works when plugged directly into the Marantz tells me that it is something about the Denon in the chain that is causing issues.
Agree. Somehow the Denon is creating gain. Does it have any sort of voltage adjustment? Also, maybe the Phono Pre is not compatible with the cartridge. The phono stage has to come close to matching the voltage requirements of the cartridge.

Jolida Fusion Preamp, Jolida JD1000P Amp, VPI Scout turntable with Dynavector 10X5 cartridge, Paradigm Studio 100 v.5 speakers, Sonica DAC streaming lossless files. Furman Elite 15 Power Conditioner.
MSchott is offline  
post #6 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 07:44 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
golfster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 1,926
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 795 Post(s)
Liked: 667
I am a bit confused, but are you basically using an pre-amp and then plugging that pre-amd into your phone inputs on the receiver. If that is the case, that is the problem. The pre-amp should go to an aux or CD input. You only use the phono input if you are not using a pre-amp on your TT..
Ratman likes this.
golfster is offline  
post #7 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchott View Post
Agree. Somehow the Denon is creating gain. Does it have any sort of voltage adjustment? Also, maybe the Phono Pre is not compatible with the cartridge. The phono stage has to come close to matching the voltage requirements of the cartridge.
Yes the Denon has a gain control, even at low setting the sound is distorted. I guess I will try another solution to pass the signal. Thanks
petrolhd is offline  
post #8 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:13 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfster View Post
I am a bit confused, but are you basically using an pre-amp and then plugging that pre-amd into your phone inputs on the receiver. If that is the case, that is the problem. The pre-amp should go to an aux or CD input. You only use the phono input if you are not using a pre-amp on your TT..
When using the phono stage preamp with the TT, I'm connecting its output to the CD line input of the AV7705. But if I'm connecting the TT directly into the AV7705 I'm using the phono input.
petrolhd is offline  
post #9 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:19 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
This is the Denon Pro setup I'm using is DN-202WT transmitter and DN-202WR receiver
petrolhd is offline  
post #10 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:52 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
golfster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 1,926
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 795 Post(s)
Liked: 667
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
When using the phono stage preamp with the TT, I'm connecting its output to the CD line input of the AV7705. But if I'm connecting the TT directly into the AV7705 I'm using the phono input.
Sounds correct. Since the TT works fine when you hook directly to the phono input, the fault must lie in the pre-amp.
golfster is offline  
post #11 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 03:47 PM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 633
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 495 Post(s)
Liked: 344
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
Yes the Denon has a gain control, even at low setting the sound is distorted. I guess I will try another solution to pass the signal. Thanks
Is the phono stage capacitance matched to the output of the cartridge? This is a high output (5.5mV) moving magnet cartridge. Does the phono pre have a setting for mm/mc? If it’s made for a moving coil cartridge, that is your problem.

Jolida Fusion Preamp, Jolida JD1000P Amp, VPI Scout turntable with Dynavector 10X5 cartridge, Paradigm Studio 100 v.5 speakers, Sonica DAC streaming lossless files. Furman Elite 15 Power Conditioner.

Last edited by MSchott; 11-03-2019 at 03:55 PM.
MSchott is offline  
post #12 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 05:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bluewizard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,770
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2330 Post(s)
Liked: 1544
Project Turntable - (no phono pre-amp built in) -

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-b0FKJQ...oss-Black.html

Mies Phono Pre-Amp -


https://www.miesaudio.com/products/m...o-preamplifier

Denon DN-202WR Wireless Audio Receiver -

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...audio-receiver

Denon DN-202WT Wireless Audio Transmitter -

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...io-transmitter

How are you using the Level Control on the Receiver? Do you have it set near 0db or down near Minus Infinity?

Are you using the Unbalanced 1/4" Jacks or the Balanced XLR Jacks?


Other potential problems might be that the system is Oscillating, and that is saturating the Amps Output. I think you would need a oscilloscope to determine that though.

Are the Channel Left/Right Peak lights Red even with no sound is being played? That could also be an indication of an oscillation.

If the Transmitter is OFF, are the Receiver Peak Lights still Red?

What kind of Cables are you using?
Thinking of the general type and quality.

Just a few thoughts.

Steve/bluewizard
bluewizard is offline  
post #13 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchott View Post
Is the phono stage capacitance matched to the output of the cartridge? This is a high output (5.5mV) moving magnet cartridge. Does the phono pre have a setting for mm/mc? If it’s made for a moving coil cartridge, that is your problem.
The Mies P50 and the ART DJPre II phono stage both don't have settings for MM or MC. As far as I know they both are MM phono stages, so I don't think they are the problem in this case
petrolhd is offline  
post #14 of 38 Old 11-03-2019, 08:28 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluewizard View Post
Project Turntable - (no phono pre-amp built in) -

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-b0FKJQ...oss-Black.html

Mies Phono Pre-Amp -


https://www.miesaudio.com/products/m...o-preamplifier

Denon DN-202WR Wireless Audio Receiver -

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...audio-receiver

Denon DN-202WT Wireless Audio Transmitter -

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...io-transmitter

How are you using the Level Control on the Receiver? Do you have it set near 0db or down near Minus Infinity?

Are you using the Unbalanced 1/4" Jacks or the Balanced XLR Jacks?


Other potential problems might be that the system is Oscillating, and that is saturating the Amps Output. I think you would need a oscilloscope to determine that though.

Are the Channel Left/Right Peak lights Red even with no sound is being played? That could also be an indication of an oscillation.

If the Transmitter is OFF, are the Receiver Peak Lights still Red?

What kind of Cables are you using?
Thinking of the general type and quality.

Just a few thoughts.

Steve/bluewizard
This is the ART DJPre II link

How are you using the Level Control on the Receiver? Do you have it set near 0db or down near Minus Infinity? - I have it set near the minus Infinity

Are you using the Unbalanced 1/4" Jacks or the Balanced XLR Jacks? - I'm the unbalanced 1/4" jacks as neither the TT or the phono preamps have XLR outputs

Are the Channel Left/Right Peak lights Red even with no sound is being played? That could also be an indication of an oscillation. - No if nothing is playing no lights are on, but once I start playing the ART DJPre has a solid red which means the signal is clipping and not fluctuating based on the music's high peaks

If the Transmitter is OFF, are the Receiver Peak Lights still Red? If the wireless transmitter is off then the wireless receiver gets no signal sent to it, so no lights light up, but when transmitting, the lights on the receiver is also flickering due to a high input being received.

What kind of Cables are you using? Thinking of the general type and quality. The RCA cables I'm using from the TT to the phono stages is the one provided with the TT, the other RCA cables are these, I also tried adding a volume attenuator in different places along the chain and still same issue, sound is still distorted but volume is lower if I turn the knob down towards low
petrolhd is offline  
post #15 of 38 Old 11-04-2019, 12:37 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bigguyca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: East Turkestan
Posts: 1,874
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1194 Post(s)
Liked: 995
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
Hi everyone,

Long time lurker on the forum... I've recently purchased my first turntable, a brand new Pro-Ject DC Esprit SB w/ Ortofon 2M red cartridge and acrylic platter with a brand new Mies p50 phono stage preamp. When playing a record the sound seems that it is clipping and sounds like a very high distortion.

My setup is a bit weird:
Main Room/HT Setup: Marantz AV7705 Preamp, NuPrime-X MCX-4 Power amp, AppleTV 4K, Artcoustic SL 40/30 4-2 Speakers, SVS PB-3000 Subwoofer,and a Sony 77A9G TV (a 3.1 setup)
Second Room: Pro-Ject Turntable, Mies P50 Phono preamp, NuPrime-X MCX-4 Power amp, and Artcoustic Diablo speakers (a 2.0 setup)

The speakers in the second room are powered from the main room one of MCX-4 power amps through a speaker distribution and the signal from the TT/Mies is sent to the AV7705 (CD input) through a Denon Pro Wireless RCA transmitter/Receiver (I know for the purists I'm converting Anolog to Digital and back, which is a big no-no, but please ignore that for now)

So when I play a record the sound seems as if the signal coming from the TT and into the P50 is "Hot" and causing distortion. I've tried an ART DJPre II phono preamp and even if I set the gain control to the lowest setting the clipping light is solid red. I've also tried adding an RCA volume attenuator and still same issue. I've also tried connecting the TT directly to the RCA matrix and into the AV7705 phono input and still get the same issue and even with setting the Denon transmitted to its lowest gain/volume setting However if I connect just the TT into the AV7705 phono input everything sounds fine and also if I plug any of the phono preamps directly into the AV7705 CD input and use them as an outboard phono stage everything sounds fine.

I've checked the TT setup and used a digital scale as well, the records I'm using are all brand new and sealed. I've also tried cleaning them with a carbon brush and the stylus with a stylus brush and still get the same issue. I've tried different RCA cables as well and still same issue.

I've checked and know that my TT doesn't have an onboard phono preamp. So I'm not sure what is going on... Basically what I'm understanding that the TT is somehow sending a "loud" signal.

Sorry for the long message... l really would appreciate it if someone can shed some light on this issue. Thanks for listening

The Miles preamp is rated for 2mV to 5mV+. It is not clear exactly how much overload capacity, if any, the + adds the the 5mV before overload occurs.

https://www.miesaudio.com/blogs/news...0-phono-preamp


Post #6 on the link below has the following text: "In the October issue of hi-fi news they measured the 2M Red to have an output of 6.6mV." The Ortofon 2M Red is rated at an output of 5.5mV, which is already quite high.

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...e-gain.163527/


- Your Ortofon 2M Red may be over driving your Miles preamp and causing significant clipping of the output signal. -
bigguyca is offline  
post #16 of 38 Old 11-04-2019, 01:12 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bluewizard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,770
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2330 Post(s)
Liked: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
...
Are the Channel Left/Right Peak lights Red even with no sound is being played? That could also be an indication of an oscillation. - No if nothing is playing no lights are on, but once I start playing the ART DJPre has a solid red which means the signal is clipping and not fluctuating based on the music's high peaks

...
You are NOT using BOTH the Phono Pre-Amps are you??? I mean both together. That's not going to work. There only needs to be ONE Phono Pre-Amp in the Audio Chain.

As far as signal levels, as mentioned by someone else, according to the Specs, the rated output of the 2M RED is -

https://www.ortofon.com/ortofon-2m-red-p-317-n-1579

Output voltage at 1000 Hz, 5cm/sec. - 5.5 mV


That is 0.0055 Volts, that's very tiny and unlikely to overload any input.

The ART PreII Phono Pre-Amp has a 9v power supply -

https://artproaudio.com/product/djpr...-preamplifier/

Maximum Input Level 40mVrms @1kHz

And the Mies P50 Phono Pre-Amp has a 12v power supply, that is likely the voltage it is going to take to overload the internal amps.

https://www.miesaudio.com/products/m...o-preamplifier

Input specs are not given for the Mies, but I would expect them to be similar to the ART PreII. If you have the Owner's Manual for the Mies it might be listed in there.

Your cables look good, so probably no problems there.

Steve/bluewizard
bluewizard is offline  
post #17 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluewizard View Post
You are NOT using BOTH the Phono Pre-Amps are you??? I mean both together. That's not going to work. There only needs to be ONE Phono Pre-Amp in the Audio Chain.

As far as signal levels, as mentioned by someone else, according to the Specs, the rated output of the 2M RED is -

https://www.ortofon.com/ortofon-2m-red-p-317-n-1579

Output voltage at 1000 Hz, 5cm/sec. - 5.5 mV


That is 0.0055 Volts, that's very tiny and unlikely to overload any input.

The ART PreII Phono Pre-Amp has a 9v power supply -

https://artproaudio.com/product/djpr...-preamplifier/

Maximum Input Level 40mVrms @1kHz

And the Mies P50 Phono Pre-Amp has a 12v power supply, that is likely the voltage it is going to take to overload the internal amps.

https://www.miesaudio.com/products/m...o-preamplifier

Input specs are not given for the Mies, but I would expect them to be similar to the ART PreII. If you have the Owner's Manual for the Mies it might be listed in there.

Your cables look good, so probably no problems there.

Steve/bluewizard
No I'm not using both phono pre-amps together, I know I only need one of them... I was just A/B testing between the two.

I will try to see if I can find the manual for the Mies... But like I mentioned before, with the DJPre II, as soon as I play something on the TT the clipping light is fully on, even if I don't connect the DJPre's output to anything else, that's what confusing me, it's as if the signal from the TT is very high
petrolhd is offline  
post #18 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 11:14 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguyca View Post
The Miles preamp is rated for 2mV to 5mV+. It is not clear exactly how much overload capacity, if any, the + adds the the 5mV before overload occurs.

https://www.miesaudio.com/blogs/news...0-phono-preamp


Post #6 on the link below has the following text: "In the October issue of hi-fi news they measured the 2M Red to have an output of 6.6mV." The Ortofon 2M Red is rated at an output of 5.5mV, which is already quite high.

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...e-gain.163527/


- Your Ortofon 2M Red may be over driving your Miles preamp and causing significant clipping of the output signal. -
If that's the case, then what phono stage would work with the 2M Red, because I thought most MM phono stages are rated at 5.5mV
petrolhd is offline  
post #19 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 11:35 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bluewizard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,770
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2330 Post(s)
Liked: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
No I'm not using both phono pre-amps together, I know I only need one of them... I was just A/B testing between the two.

I will try to see if I can find the manual for the Mies... But like I mentioned before, with the DJPre II, as soon as I play something on the TT the clipping light is fully on, even if I don't connect the DJPre's output to anything else, that's what confusing me, it's as if the signal from the TT is very high
Where is the Phono Pre-Amp in the chain? Is it before the Transmitter or after the Receiver?

Can we confirm that you have tried both Phono Pre-Amps with a direct connect, and that this method did not cause any problems?

Have you tried Transmitting other content, other than Turntable/PhonoPre-Amp? And how did that work out?

Curious problem.

Steve/bluewizard
bluewizard is offline  
post #20 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
The phono stage is between the TT and transmitter... Yes both phono stages work fine if connected directly to the AV7705
petrolhd is offline  
post #21 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Yes I have tried transmitting other things and works fine... I think as suggested that the 2M red is sending a higher signal than 5.5mV
petrolhd is offline  
post #22 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 07:42 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 1
This is a good one! Some things to try: 1) a different TT through the transmitter. 2) different cartridge on the same TT. I can’t say why but I have a feeling the transmitter is the problem. My guess would be it isn’t getting a strong enough signal off the preamp and is boosting it unnecessarily. Forgive me if this was suggested but 3) try to send a different source over that transmitter. If that works and neither preamp work then for some reason the transmitter just doesn’t like the signal off of a preamp. Good luck, I’m super curious now and sorry for the headache and frustration!
Utahdeej is offline  
post #23 of 38 Old 11-05-2019, 08:15 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Utahdeej View Post
This is a good one! Some things to try: 1) a different TT through the transmitter. 2) different cartridge on the same TT. I can’t say why but I have a feeling the transmitter is the problem. My guess would be it isn’t getting a strong enough signal off the preamp and is boosting it unnecessarily. Forgive me if this was suggested but 3) try to send a different source over that transmitter. If that works and neither preamp work then for some reason the transmitter just doesn’t like the signal off of a preamp. Good luck, I’m super curious now and sorry for the headache and frustration!
It's most likely the TT/cartridge fault, the signal they're producing is too hot... I have tried the transmitter with other sources and all are fine.

Tonight I tried using a Bluetooth transmitter with TT and DJPre II sent to the AV7705 and the sound is "clean" no distortions so far, but the occasional sound dropping (but that's probably due to the clipping, I had the same issue with this and the distortion at the same time). However the clipping the light on the phono is solid red, even with the gain control turned all the way to -10dB

The TT/cartridge are brand new with less than 20hrs of play so far, so I'm not sure if they require a break-in to work "normally"?
petrolhd is offline  
post #24 of 38 Old 11-15-2019, 12:15 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,196
Mentioned: 50 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5549 Post(s)
Liked: 3986
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
The TT/cartridge are brand new with less than 20hrs of play so far, so I'm not sure if they require a break-in to work "normally"?
It is very unlikely.
Ratman likes this.
m. zillch is offline  
post #25 of 38 Old 11-15-2019, 07:57 PM
Senior Member
 
RAART's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Oakville, Canada
Posts: 200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
The phono stage is between the TT and transmitter... Yes both phono stages work fine if connected directly to the AV7705
Why you don't connect TT directly to DN-202WT transmitter and connect DN-202WR receiver first to AUX input on your Marantz. Set gain to 0 (zero) first. If it is to low then try connecting DN-202WR to Phono input on your Marantz. If this works then you do not need those phono stages. As long as I understood the Denon tech it might happen that Denon is set to deal with wide variety of signals and that might include phono signals, speak why otherwise they will add gain adjustment.

Just curious... Are you in Toronto?

Rotel RC-1070; Rotel RB-1050; Rotel RB-1562; Yamaha WXA-50;
NAD Wireless USB DAC 2; Chromecast Audio (4x); Antique Sound Lab MG OTL 32 DT Headphone/Pre amplifier; Sony MDR7506 Pro; Grado SR80e; Beyerdynamics DT931;
Wharfedale Diamond D220; Wharfedale Diamond D10 Sub; PSB G Design GB-1; Totem Mite; Tannoy Sub; Canton Sub; Canton Plus S; Canton Movie 70; Kenwood KD-2055; Pro-ject Debut III USB
RAART is online now  
post #26 of 38 Old 11-16-2019, 09:58 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAART View Post
Why you don't connect TT directly to DN-202WT transmitter and connect DN-202WR receiver first to AUX input on your Marantz. Set gain to 0 (zero) first. If it is to low then try connecting DN-202WR to Phono input on your Marantz. If this works then you do not need those phono stages. As long as I understood the Denon tech it might happen that Denon is set to deal with wide variety of signals and that might include phono signals, speak why otherwise they will add gain adjustment.

Just curious... Are you in Toronto?
Yup, I've tried that already and still no luck... I'm going to take the TT back to the dealer for them to check it and see what they come up with


Yup, I'm based in Toronto
petrolhd is offline  
post #27 of 38 Old 11-17-2019, 08:23 AM
Senior Member
 
RAART's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Oakville, Canada
Posts: 200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
Yup, I've tried that already and still no luck... I'm going to take the TT back to the dealer for them to check it and see what they come up with


Yup, I'm based in Toronto
Highly unlikely something is wrong with turntable... which dealer Bay Bloor Radio or Vinyl Sound. I guess former...

Rotel RC-1070; Rotel RB-1050; Rotel RB-1562; Yamaha WXA-50;
NAD Wireless USB DAC 2; Chromecast Audio (4x); Antique Sound Lab MG OTL 32 DT Headphone/Pre amplifier; Sony MDR7506 Pro; Grado SR80e; Beyerdynamics DT931;
Wharfedale Diamond D220; Wharfedale Diamond D10 Sub; PSB G Design GB-1; Totem Mite; Tannoy Sub; Canton Sub; Canton Plus S; Canton Movie 70; Kenwood KD-2055; Pro-ject Debut III USB
RAART is online now  
post #28 of 38 Old 11-17-2019, 09:09 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
m. zillch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,196
Mentioned: 50 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5549 Post(s)
Liked: 3986
Good turntables don't make sound: cartridges do. The TT and tonearm system is merely a mechanism to deliver the cartridge to the exact position where it needs to be and hopefully without any imprecision nor vibration.
m. zillch is offline  
post #29 of 38 Old 11-17-2019, 10:16 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAART View Post
Highly unlikely something is wrong with turntable... which dealer Bay Bloor Radio or Vinyl Sound. I guess former...
I bought from Planet of Sound... So I took it to them today, got it hooked from my Mies p50 phono to an NAD hybrid DAC amp (not sure which model 3020 or 3045) and everything sounded perfect. They suggested to maybe check the gains on the AV7705 preamp. I tried playing with it and still same problem... Now I'm thinking it could be the impedance input into the Denon transmitter that is causing an issue. No idea what else it could be
petrolhd is offline  
post #30 of 38 Old 11-17-2019, 11:29 PM
Senior Member
 
RAART's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Oakville, Canada
Posts: 200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by petrolhd View Post
I bought from Planet of Sound... So I took it to them today, got it hooked from my Mies p50 phono to an NAD hybrid DAC amp (not sure which model 3020 or 3045) and everything sounded perfect. They suggested to maybe check the gains on the AV7705 preamp. I tried playing with it and still same problem... Now I'm thinking it could be the impedance input into the Denon transmitter that is causing an issue. No idea what else it could be
As I said highly unlikely that TT is faulty. Do you have another amp or preamp, even headphone amp?

I am still thinking that Denon is amplifying the signal as I said before...

Try connecting TT to input 4 GAME directly without any pre-amp in between. The signal should be low but you still be able to hear it. If this is how I described then connect TT to Denon transmitter, directly, nothing in between and connect the Denon receiver to the same input. If Denon works properly then you should hear the sound on the same level as when TT was connected directly. If you hear any difference in volume then it is DENON. If you hear the same then this should eliminate the Denon TX/RX combo as faulty.

When you check and follow those steps exactly as described we will know more and take it from there.

All the best.

Rotel RC-1070; Rotel RB-1050; Rotel RB-1562; Yamaha WXA-50;
NAD Wireless USB DAC 2; Chromecast Audio (4x); Antique Sound Lab MG OTL 32 DT Headphone/Pre amplifier; Sony MDR7506 Pro; Grado SR80e; Beyerdynamics DT931;
Wharfedale Diamond D220; Wharfedale Diamond D10 Sub; PSB G Design GB-1; Totem Mite; Tannoy Sub; Canton Sub; Canton Plus S; Canton Movie 70; Kenwood KD-2055; Pro-ject Debut III USB

Last edited by RAART; 11-17-2019 at 11:33 PM.
RAART is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply 2-Channel Audio

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off