Anyone own and use Bryston or MOSFET power amp? - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #91 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
No it won't if you have a cheap 100W or 200W yamaha...........if it is honest about the 100W or 200W. It will not clip, it just poop out.

Now you change the story. You never said about low impedance, you just said as long as the amp is not clip, they all sound the same all this time. Now you are forced to agree with me. As an amp designer, I know how hard it is to drive difficult load with low impedance dips. That's where it cost the big money.

How many times I talked about if you have an easy to drive 8ohm speakers, amp is not that important, only the ones that is hard to drive with sharp impedance peak and dip, that's when a good amp with very high damping factor at high frequencies shine. You have problem reading?

So now you admit for low impedance speaker, not all amps are the same?

Let me give you a lesson from studying a few cheap yamaha circuits, they use only one or max two pairs of output transistors. It's not going to be good in driving hard to drive speakers UNLESS you use small 16 gauge wires to shield the amp from the speakers.





I thought you like to talk science and theory, we are having a good conversation.
Another post filled with so many inaccuracies and falsehoods in nearly every single sentence, it boggles the mind and it would take hours to properly dissect and correct. A waste of my time. Bye.

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post #92 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 12:33 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
It (an amp driven to levels it can't sustain into a difficult load) will go into massive distortion. That is not "being kept within its operational range" a contingency of what makes an amp a candidate for a test. That's not new and I have stated it many times before, for years, but I don't spell out every single tiny picky little detail in every single post. I never claimed all amps have the same power nor low impedance load capability.
You sure never talk about this before. I am glad you finally learn some science.
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You accused me of unethical behavior/conduct and either lieing to customers or laughing at them when they left. That is rude behavior on your part in my book so no this is not friendly conversation. Cracks about fellow forum members reading comprehension is also unfriendly behavior.
No, I just ask you how you feel.
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post #93 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 12:39 AM
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"Finally"? That's absurd. Here I am, for example, over a decade ago and well before you existed on our forum, expressing the importance of keeping an amp within its operational range:

"Amps that are driven past their safe operational range and into any kind of clipping ("soft" or otherwise) have undeniably audible distortion." -m. zillch 01/14/2009

source: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/153-c...l#post15547786

"I don't think there's a single person in this entire thread who thinks all amplifiers can play equally as loudly as one another before exhibiting audible distortion . The real question of the thread is, "Do all amps sound the same, when kept within the operational limits of the weaker of the two?" The question is one of quality, not quantity.

Are more powerful amps capable of playing at a louder level without clipping the peaks, causing audible distortion compared to weaker ones? Sure, that's obvious to everyone. No need to discus that topic; it is a red herring/straw man argument. " - m. zillch 03/30/2011

source: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...l#post20227069

I have understood this concept for many decades and I have never learned anything from you. Your suggestion otherwise by saying "finally" is disingenuous and reflects poorly on you.

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post #94 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 12:48 AM
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So you just laugh after they walked out?
No, but your insinuation is quite clear.
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post #95 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 01:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post
"Finally"? That's absurd. Here I am, for example, over a decade ago and well before you existed on our forum, expressing the importance of keeping an amp within its operational range:

"Amps that are driven past their safe operational range and into any kind of clipping ("soft" or otherwise) have undeniably audible distortion." -m. zillch 01/14/2009

source: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/153-c...l#post15547786

"I don't think there's a single person in this entire thread who thinks all amplifiers can play equally as loudly as one another before exhibiting audible distortion . The real question of the thread is, "Do all amps sound the same, when kept within the operational limits of the weaker of the two?" The question is one of quality, not quantity.

Are more powerful amps capable of playing at a louder level without clipping the peaks, causing audible distortion compared to weaker ones? Sure, that's obvious to everyone. No need to discus that topic; it is a red herring/straw man argument. " - m. zillch 03/30/2011

source: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...l#post20227069

I have understood this concept for many decades and I have never learned anything from you. Your suggestion otherwise by saying "finally" is disingenuous and reflects poorly on you.

But you said a cheap yamaha will sound just as good. Like I said, they only have one pair or max 2 pair of output transistors. That's not good in driving low impedance load.


Let me give you some scientific education.


If you have one pair of output transistors and you drive 4 ohm load. It's is hard of the output transistors because the output impedance is not low and the sound degrade, particularly if the speakers dips even lower than 4 ohm.


If you have two pair of output transistors driving 4ohm, each pair split the load, it's as if each pair driving 1/2 the load or 8ohm ( double of 4ohm).


If you have 4pairs driving 4ohm load, each pair sees 1/4 the load, or 16ohm load, this make it easier for each pair.


If you have 8pairs driving 4ohm load, each pair sees 1/8 the load or 32ohm.



The higher the impedance each pair sees, the more ideal the behavior. That's the reason a good amp has to have many pairs of output transistors so they share the load. With 8pairs, the amp can drive impedance down to 2ohm or lower.


That's the difference between a good amp and cheap yamaha. This is very simple science. The better the speakers, the better the components used in the crossover network, the sharper the impedance spike and dip, the more important to have a good amp with very low output impedance. If you have an easy to drive speaker with mild dip and spike of impedance, then amp really doesn't matter as much.


Stop and read, you might learn something. Don't keep telling people all amps sounds the same as long as it's not clipped. This is science. This is backed up by real text books, not some articles.


And let me correct you, a 100W amp that is not good ( say have one pair of output transistors) will NOT clip by default, clipping is NOT caused by low impedance. You never drive to 100W in normal listening. The transistor might just over heat if you drive low impedance and very high volume, it will NOT clip. Over heat is because of cheap amps usually have small heatsink. And that's another thing the good expensive amps will have bigger heatsink. You can take it to the bank on this. Just read and learn.

Last edited by alan0354; 06-16-2020 at 01:45 AM.
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post #96 of 96 Old 06-16-2020, 03:07 AM
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that's it folks: thread closed
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