Just got into Laserdisc...not too bad. Anyone else have this? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 26 Old 07-26-2016, 09:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Just got into Laserdisc...not too bad. Anyone else have this?

Hi gang, how goes it? haven't been in this forum in quite some time. Back in the 90's i was intrigued by Laserdisc's and recently i decided to venture into this old field. I know that it's an older analogue technology and with all the new flat panels, most wouldn't think of getting into this, but i have to say, i kinda like it. I know the picture isn't "high def" but i don't mind it. I kinda like the roughness of the picture. I also like handling these old shinny discs, they were cool back then and still cool to me today.
I've tried using a DVD recorder machine to try and upscale the image but didn't really like it, found it a little "washed out", so went back to Composite cables.
One thing i have to say...in terms of Sound, i really like the LD, more depth to it, better effects. I find the sound better than most of the new BR movies...anyone see it this way?
As for the player i'm currently using a pioneer CLD-D703 machine, it's not bad, i like that it can play both sides of the disc.

Well, i've gotten a few movies and always on the hunt for more.
Hope to hear from you guys, and if you have any advice, let me know.thanks
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post #2 of 26 Old 07-27-2016, 11:43 AM
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I also still have a laserdisc player and about 80 movies. Instead of the composite output have you tried the S-Video? In terms of video quality it should be better than composite. I have found some movies on laserdisc superior to their DVD counterparts. "The Hunt for Red October" is one example. The first DVD version I saw was very grainy and the sound isn't as good. It wasn't until the Blu-ray came out that I feel the new formats were as good or better than the laserdiscs. Do you have the converter for AC3 (Dolby Digital)? I see your player has an output for it. It would sound much better than the derived from two channel Dolby Pro Logic, or other DSP formats. Enjoy your laserdiscs. Now I want to fire mine up to do some comparisons.
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post #3 of 26 Old 07-27-2016, 12:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Kjfalls, how are ya? I didnt try svideo as my plasma doesn'y have that input. What I did was go out of Wednesday, July 27, 2016 player via svideo into dvd recorder, and out of recorder by compont into tv. It seemed a tad sharper but also very satturated, so went back to old setup. I will try the dolby digital as well.thanks fab
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post #4 of 26 Old 07-27-2016, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Now i'm curious, what is the difference if i use the "dolby digital" ourput jack VS the Red and white cables? also, where does the DD output go into? i have an older Yamaha soundbars that has different inputs, is it just the COax cable input that i would plug it into? thanks
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post #5 of 26 Old 07-27-2016, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Now i'm curious, what is the difference if i use the "dolby digital" ourput jack VS the Red and white cables? also, where does the DD output go into? i have an older Yamaha soundbars that has different inputs, is it just the COax cable input that i would plug it into? thanks
fab
The "Dolby Digital" AC3 output on LD players requires a RF demodulator. To understand what it is, look into LD history. Originally, LD was 100% analog (audio and video). In the late 70's, early 80's with the advent of digital audio (CDs), 2 digital audio tracks were added and the old 2 ch analog tracks were kept in tack for older LD players. Overtime, these analog tracks were multipurposed (director's commentaries, etc..) In order to keep the digital PCM track, Dolby Digital tracks were converted to RF (radio frequency) and placed on the analog track (left ch., if I remember correctly). In order to extract the Digital info, you needed to demodulate the RF to get the bitstream feed. These were often built into AVRs from the mid/late 90's and early 2000's. There were a few outboard RF Demodulators, which can be found cheap on ebay. You also need a LD player with this output. Look for AC3 RF out. Will be a single RCA output. There is no DD over optical/PCM on LD.




When DTS came to LD, they just through out the PCM track. No DTS = no digital sound, back in the day so they had to release both DTS and none DTS versions of movies. This is why you will find some DTS titles have value still, they were more rare.
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post #6 of 26 Old 07-27-2016, 08:11 PM
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Don't worry about not having a S-Video input. Most TV's have extra circuitry processing the composite signal that is skipped when you use the S-Video cable so commonly the composite provides a better picture. It all depends on the electronics in the TV. The actual outputs on the player are pretty equal.

The AC-3 soundtrack is also better than DVD and if you find a DTS LD the sound is even better. Laserdisc was mainly owned by people with home theaters and pushed for soundtracks with full quality. Those that normally just connected to a TV had VCR's as they can record. DVD format was designed for everyone so the soundtrack dynamics are limited so you can use your TV speakers. People have been complaining about this from the beginning of DVD. If you search you'll find a lot about this.
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post #7 of 26 Old 07-28-2016, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Kurtis, yes i've been quite impressed with the sound quality and dynamics either on the tv but especially through the sound bar. Is it due to the fact that it's carried via rca cables VS a thin, digital, hdmi cable? I find the effects better on LD than bluray. Is it just me? Thanks.fab
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post #8 of 26 Old 07-29-2016, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Kurtis, yes i've been quite impressed with the sound quality and dynamics either on the tv but especially through the sound bar. Is it due to the fact that it's carried via rca cables VS a thin, digital, hdmi cable? I find the effects better on LD than bluray. Is it just me? Thanks.fab
I use composite over s-video from a Pioneer DVL-909 because I found s-video very noisy vs composite. The composite output is sent to my Marantz pre-pro out to and Epson 5030UB Projector on a 100 inch screen.
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post #9 of 26 Old 07-29-2016, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
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good stuff! so if i were to have an AC-3 output player, what would be the output path from there? would it be:
ac3 out...into RF demodulator....out from there into back of tv via rca(white and red) cable?
Will there by a significant gain in surround sound with the ac3?
on a side note... I have a "dvd coax" input in the back of the sound bar, could i use the ac3 out into this coax input?
thanks
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post #10 of 26 Old 07-30-2016, 03:36 PM
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In the 90ies, I probably spent over 10K on LD equipment and discs I have just resurrected my two pioneers, and I also have a D703. My main purpose for getting one set up was to watch (and own!) the 'faces' , original star wars trilogy that was produced in '95. These were the same discs that were produced two years before, but as individual releases. Outside of bootleg DVD's, this is the only way (besides VHS) to see the UNALTERED version of these films. In 1997, when the 'special editions' came out, the originals were never produced again. It is so amazing to see Jaba's palace: unaltered bliss! And yes, the sound is very good too. I use a monoprice upscaler/converter box to convert to HDMI...works pretty good! OH, and I'm able to watch star wars in a 16:9 frame because I have an anamorphic lens (basically optically converting letterboxed 4:3 to native 16:9). 'Wonderful!' The video looks soooo right, keeping the correct color-timing...a w e s o m e ....
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post #11 of 26 Old 08-02-2016, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Kurtis, yes i've been quite impressed with the sound quality and dynamics either on the tv but especially through the sound bar. Is it due to the fact that it's carried via rca cables VS a thin, digital, hdmi cable? I find the effects better on LD than bluray. Is it just me? Thanks.fab
LD sound (once the LD public demanded it) got the producers to provide full dynamics capable with the audio. It is not compressed. That is all it is DVD and Blu-Ray are compressed more than LD. LD is full CD quality.
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post #12 of 26 Old 08-04-2016, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Kurtis Bahr View Post
LD sound (once the LD public demanded it) got the producers to provide full dynamics capable with the audio. It is not compressed. That is all it is DVD and Blu-Ray are compressed more than LD. LD is full CD quality.
Blu Rays are not compressed, they contain lossless Audio.
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post #13 of 26 Old 08-05-2016, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
good stuff! so if i were to have an AC-3 output player, what would be the output path from there? would it be:
ac3 out...into RF demodulator....out from there into back of tv via rca(white and red) cable?
Will there by a significant gain in surround sound with the ac3?
on a side note... I have a "dvd coax" input in the back of the sound bar, could i use the ac3 out into this coax input?
thanks
fabs
AC3--> RF demodulator --> Digital Optical/PCM in on soundbar/amplifier.
This will only apply to discs with AC3 dolby digital for multi channel sound.
In most cases the red and white RCA jacks will suffice.
I never bothered getting one as they can be expensive. Most discs are just 2ch
I do have a few hundred laserdiscs though use it on a 43 sony UHD TV and looks great for its time.


Last edited by homerx; 08-05-2016 at 09:35 PM.
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post #14 of 26 Old 08-06-2016, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by fabchef
Hi gang, how goes it? haven't been in this forum in quite some time. Back in the 90's i was intrigued by Laserdisc's and recently i decided to venture into this old field.
 
Excellent buddy!!


I love analog myself and would LOVE getting whats called a VIDEODISC player... (Its 100% analogue while laserdisc is not)
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post #15 of 26 Old 08-08-2016, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by trailblazer View Post
Blu Rays are not compressed, they contain lossless Audio.

Sorry, I used the wrong term. I agree Master Audio Blu-Ray is not compressed. I should have said the dynamic range is greater with LD.
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post #16 of 26 Old 08-09-2016, 02:40 PM
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Excellent buddy!!





I love analog myself and would LOVE getting whats called a VIDEODISC player... (Its 100% analogue while laserdisc is not)


You mean the one that had an actual needle, instead of a laser... If so, you've got it BAD... 8-)


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post #17 of 26 Old 08-09-2016, 04:06 PM
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You mean the one that had an actual needle, instead of a laser... If so, you've got it BAD... 8-)


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It was made by RCA and search on Selectavision. The later models were supposed to be better as the needle would jump sometimes on the early ones. It still has RF modulated audio just like the laserdisc analog tracks. It IS NOT like listening to a Record!! Good record pressings sound beautiful.
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post #18 of 26 Old 08-10-2016, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Kurtis Bahr View Post
Don't worry about not having a S-Video input. Most TV's have extra circuitry processing the composite signal that is skipped when you use the S-Video cable so commonly the composite provides a better picture. It all depends on the electronics in the TV. The actual outputs on the player are pretty equal.
My understanding is that the LD has a composite video signal on the disc. It's not separate luminance and chrominance

So the S-Video out from a LD player splits the signal in the player (comb filter?)

The TV does this with a composite input using it's own filter (eventually getting to RGB signals).
The S-Video input bypasses this first filter in the TV.

Which you should use depends on which filter is better.
It could be either device. Have to test both and pick the better one. (My 36" CRT was better than my LD player, but the player was better than the earlier 27" CRT. With my plasma it's a wash.)

If you use convert/upscale to HDMI, then you have another filter to test. The converter could be better or worse than the player. The TV could still be better. If the AVR converts it could be the best one.

There's just no hard and fast rule.
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post #19 of 26 Old 08-21-2016, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Kurtis Bahr View Post
LD sound (once the LD public demanded it) got the producers to provide full dynamics capable with the audio. It is not compressed. That is all it is DVD and Blu-Ray are compressed more than LD. LD is full CD quality.
Completely wrong. Hilariously wrong actually. Blu-Ray audio is far better than any Laser Disc.
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post #20 of 26 Old 08-26-2016, 09:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the great replies. So if you had to choose between a surround receiver with ac-3 feature or a newer receiver for a LD player, which would you choose? does it make a difference at all? will i see a difference with the AC-3 feature? thanks
fab
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post #21 of 26 Old 08-26-2016, 02:37 PM
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Buy any new receiver/processor, All you need is the AC-3 RF demodulator to convert the RF encoded AC-3 into a regular bitstream and then it works with any receiver/processor that DVD or Blu-Ray works with.
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post #22 of 26 Old 08-26-2016, 03:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Kurtis, i know what you mean....thing is that RF demodulator is hard to find. I have a choice of getting an older S-Sound receiver that has the RF AC-3 connector in it....OR the other option is just getting a newer receiver, having no RF demod. and use it like that. What i'm asking is...is it worth using the AC-3 option in the first place, or just use regular surround sound? thanks fab
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post #23 of 26 Old 08-27-2016, 10:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Unhappy

Hey Kurtis, well i ended up getting an older receiver (yama dsp-a1). heavy sucker! the issue i have is that it came with the wrong remote, and the one i got doesn't really respond to the receiver (it is a yamaha remote, just not for this one). The remote does have a "reset" or "learn" button on it, but not sure if it can pair up with this receiver. I was looking around and saw one or two original remotes for sale, thinking of maybe getting one. It seems difficult to do the adjustments with out it.
I played a few movies, seems that the center channel isn't working (have to check it out), but the rest is ok. I hooked up the AC-3 from LD player, but in the receiver menu it seems that AC-3 is not on when playing a movie, i take it, i need a movie that HAS ac-3 in order to get the effects?
thanks
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post #24 of 26 Old 08-28-2016, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Hey Kurtis, well i ended up getting an older receiver (yama dsp-a1). heavy sucker! the issue i have is that it came with the wrong remote, and the one i got doesn't really respond to the receiver (it is a yamaha remote, just not for this one). The remote does have a "reset" or "learn" button on it, but not sure if it can pair up with this receiver. I was looking around and saw one or two original remotes for sale, thinking of maybe getting one. It seems difficult to do the adjustments with out it.
I played a few movies, seems that the center channel isn't working (have to check it out), but the rest is ok. I hooked up the AC-3 from LD player, but in the receiver menu it seems that AC-3 is not on when playing a movie, i take it, i need a movie that HAS ac-3 in order to get the effects?
thanks
fab
The LD needs to be Dolby Digital encoded, it's on the right analog channel, to get the Dolby Digital or AC-3 audio.
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post #25 of 26 Old 08-29-2016, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Hi Kurtis, i know what you mean....thing is that RF demodulator is hard to find. I have a choice of getting an older S-Sound receiver that has the RF AC-3 connector in it....OR the other option is just getting a newer receiver, having no RF demod. and use it like that. What i'm asking is...is it worth using the AC-3 option in the first place, or just use regular surround sound? thanks fab

I find the LD Dolby Digital (AC-3) rivals Blu-ray easily and in many cases surpasses the DVD quality. I have the B&K demodulator (not to be confused with the Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator). Is it worth it? Well it certainly was at the time, but now, that would be a personal preference.
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post #26 of 26 Old 08-31-2016, 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by fabchef View Post
Hey Kurtis, well i ended up getting an older receiver (yama dsp-a1). heavy sucker! the issue i have is that it came with the wrong remote, and the one i got doesn't really respond to the receiver (it is a yamaha remote, just not for this one).
I think you'd have been better served with a modern AVR and an external demodulator. Then you'd have the right remote, know everything works, and be prepared for modern formats too.

I just looked and saw a few demodulators on eBay.

Yes you should get the right remote (or return the AVR).

Yes you need a disc with AC3 to use it. Otherwise you just get 2 channel audio.

Last edited by ST Dog; 02-26-2017 at 12:31 AM.
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