The Beast, Unleashed - Page 208 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6211 of 6894 Old 04-18-2018, 07:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post
Yup--it's definitely cheaper and easer to build the riser....that's the main reason I've only be miiiiildly considering it. but...


On the first row vs. the second row......


Don't discount it!!! We use both rows 50/50 man....you'd be surprised how preferences change. Sometimes, I just feel like going to the second row....like going to a commercial cinema...sometimes I like being further up, sometimes I like being further down. The preferences of humanity change on a whim...


Sometimes, a poorly authored movie (or one with heavy "added" film grain, which I hate) will send me to the rear row. This is particularly frustrating....a sitcom streamed over Hulu on my Apple TV will look razor sharp in the front row, but then I'll pop in a 4k Blu Ray with less than stellar authoring (I'm looking at you, the first half of 4k The Last Jedi), and it's annoying to watch from the front row.


Whatever the reason, you never know why you'll end up in the rear row.

I have also thought about having a 3 or 4 seat reclining couch in the front row for when I watch sports and can lay down for all day on a Saturday or Sunday. Not sure yet. Will see, once I save up enough money to get going strong on the build I will decide on a final width. That will dictate whether 16:9 or scope.

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post #6212 of 6894 Old 04-18-2018, 07:11 PM - Thread Starter
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All this talk about booster risers has me thinking of going 16:9 when front row, and 2:35 when in rear row, or when all rows are in use. I programmed it into the lumagen tonight, and here's the result:

16:9 "Front Row" mode:



2:35 "All Rows" mode:



To be clear, the plan was to always use a booster riser, as it was prescribed by the room designer; however, if I can skip it, I'd like to.


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post #6213 of 6894 Old 04-19-2018, 06:21 PM
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Matt I forget, how much of a height boost do you need?


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post #6214 of 6894 Old 04-20-2018, 04:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mercracing View Post
Matt I forget, how much of a height boost do you need?


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~4" or so should do the trick. I'm thinking of just 2x4 framing on top of 3/4" ply. Should net a 4.25" boost.

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post #6215 of 6894 Old 04-20-2018, 05:00 AM
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So here’s what we did. You might be able to adapt this to your situation.
I found we needed about 1.5-2” more for the rear couch. Instead of making a whole frame and raising the whole couch up, I took a 2x4 and set the rear frame of the couch on it. That gave me enough height. I counter drilled holes about halfway through the 2x4 so the couch wouldn’t move off when we kicked the legs back down to lock them. I cut the 2x4 to the exact length and spray painted it black to match the riser, and screwed it down. You can’t even tell it’s there. Technically the couch is tilted forward. For me it’s hard to tell. If you need 4”ish, you might be able to do this but your tip would be more noticeable.
Given how awesome your theater is, I imagine the best course of action is a smaller riser like you have planned.


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post #6216 of 6894 Old 04-23-2018, 04:04 PM
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Caught up. The screen shots look really great Matt. Have fun enjoying the theater.

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post #6217 of 6894 Old 04-24-2018, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercracing View Post
So here’s what we did. You might be able to adapt this to your situation.
I found we needed about 1.5-2” more for the rear couch. Instead of making a whole frame and raising the whole couch up, I took a 2x4 and set the rear frame of the couch on it. That gave me enough height. I counter drilled holes about halfway through the 2x4 so the couch wouldn’t move off when we kicked the legs back down to lock them. I cut the 2x4 to the exact length and spray painted it black to match the riser, and screwed it down. You can’t even tell it’s there. Technically the couch is tilted forward. For me it’s hard to tell. If you need 4”ish, you might be able to do this but your tip would be more noticeable.
Given how awesome your theater is, I imagine the best course of action is a smaller riser like you have planned.


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Thanks Aaron! Great idea that's right up my alley.....but the curved config adds some complexity. Also, the height wouldn't get me as high as I'd need to be. Def appreciate the idea though!
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Caught up. The screen shots look really great Matt. Have fun enjoying the theater.
Thanks man! Yeah, were enjoying it a lot. We watched Avatar last night....it holds up really well after 9 years. The CGI looks dated up close, but we were genuinely surprised at how well the movie held up overall.

We watch at least 3 or 4 movies a week together since the chairs came! Before that...3 or 4 movies per year in our lawn chair theater seating Lol.

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post #6218 of 6894 Old 04-27-2018, 05:58 AM
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Matt,

How high is your ceiling in the front where your screen is mounted?

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post #6219 of 6894 Old 04-27-2018, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Matt,

How high is your ceiling in the front where your screen is mounted?
94" or 95" methinks.

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post #6220 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 07:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Yesterday was a glorious day. Held a small G2G with a very specific audience in mind: local enthusiasts who have helped with the theater build, either physically or through meaningful advice and/or encouragement over the years. Attendees were: @BIGmouthinDC @NYGIANTSFAN23 @RedStripe88 @DougUSMC and @Darkstar757

I began the session by running demo clips on a setting I generated called “Movie Night” which is pretty conservative on the bass. It fits the mold of commercial cinema standards recommended by the leading white papers, ticking all the boxes on level balancing, speaker:sub ratios, etc.

As I played back the clips, in my mind I kept saying “but the system is capable of so much more than this, but they might get not like my personal tweaked mode.” I failed to consider one thing: Everyone in attendance owns an elite theater setup and are not strangers to the extreme!

So after an Interstellar demo (those aren’t mountains), I told the group that I have this setting called “The Beast, Unleashed” programmed to levels of bass and immersion that I believe most people might find uncomfortable. The group, in unison, implored me to engage that mode and replay that Interstellar clip. I did exactly that, and THAT’S when the reallll G2G started.

We played through many clips after that, and I was so glad I could share the room with some of those who have been there for me through this journey in multiple ways.

Yesterday’s experience validated all the years of hard work that went into the room.

I’m proud to say: The Beast.....is Unleashed.

Couple shots (taken after Paul had to leave) below:




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post #6221 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 08:04 AM
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A great time was had, It was fun to see the finish line of the theater long in the making. I look at that second picture and wonder is that a group of theater enthusiasts or over the hill football players?
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post #6222 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 08:21 AM
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Sorry to have missed it, but I look forward to your next GTG!
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post #6223 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 08:39 AM
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So it appears the back row must be the best for audio or was that for the photo pose?

Besides the elevated bass level in the "Beast Unleashed" mode, what else did you do to increase the "levels of bass and immersion". Maybe a little bump in the over head speaker levels??

And congrats on receiving confirmation that your 4 years of HT development really paid off. It's been fun to watch (or rather read about) your journey. Beside your speakers choice, a piece I probably most agree with was your eventual decision to not purchase what you could not afford at the time. Now not only is your theater (nearly - less some room treatment) complete, you have no debt related to the construction. Now you just get to enjoy the fruits of you labor. Congrats ... and looks like you GTC was a success as well!!

Congrats !!!!!!

EDIT: It also appears that I may be a potential candidate for an invite for a future GTG. Limited head hair growth seems to be a constant based upon the photos .... and I qualify.

And what Intersteller scene did you use?
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post #6224 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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The Beast, Unleashed

Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post
A great time was had, It was fun to see the finish line of the theater long in the making. I look at that second picture and wonder is that a group of theater enthusiasts or over the hill football players?
Lolol! I have to find my NFL contract. They told me it got lost in the mail back in 2002.
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Sorry to have missed it, but I look forward to your next GTG!
Yeah man! Going to have a big G2G this summer. Need to start a planning discussion on the Area HT Meets subforum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
So it appears the back row must be the best for audio or was that for the photo pose?

Besides the elevated bass level in the "Beast Unleashed" mode, what else did you do to increase the "levels of bass and immersion". Maybe a little bump in the over head speaker levels??

And congrats on receiving confirmation that your 4 years of HT development really paid off. It's been fun to watch (or rather read about) your journey. Beside your speakers choice, a piece I probably most agree with was your eventual decision to not purchase what you could not afford at the time. Now not only is your theater (nearly - less some room treatment) complete, you have no debt related to the construction. Now you just get to enjoy the fruits of you labor. Congrats ... and looks like you GTC was a success as well!!

Congrats !!!!!!

EDIT: It also appears that I may be a potential candidate for an invite for a future GTG. Limited head hair growth seems to be a constant based upon the photos .... and I qualify.

And what Intersteller scene did you use?
We all piled to the back row for the picture. During playback, the distribution was generally four in back, two in front row.

Ah, with the tweaks....In addition to a diff subwoofer EQ curve and more robust high shelf, there are minor shifts to Atmos, rear surrounds, and front surrounds/wides.

Edit: @audioguy , the interstellar demo we used was the one on the water planet with the HUGE waves.

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post #6225 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 09:30 AM
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EDIT: It also appears that I may be a potential candidate for an invite for a future GTG. Limited head hair growth seems to be a constant based upon the photos .... and I qualify.
I can contribute three more hairs to the group - well, that was at the last count
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post #6226 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I can contribute three more hairs to the group - well, that was at the last count
Lolol! Join the party!

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post #6227 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 01:28 PM
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So it appears the back row must be the best for audio or was that for the photo pose?
I watched everything from the front row, and I gotta tell you: it's such an immersive experience I'm all but certain to go 16:9 on our next build!

That being said, I was about 1/2 way home when I started thinking "I wish I had checked out what the back row felt like!!"

Awesome fun Matt, thanks for the invite! Great to finally put some faces with the online personalities!
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post #6228 of 6894 Old 04-30-2018, 04:15 PM
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Looks like a good time was had by all.
Mike
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post #6229 of 6894 Old 05-01-2018, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougUSMC View Post
I watched everything from the front row, and I gotta tell you: it's such an immersive experience I'm all but certain to go 16:9 on our next build!

That being said, I was about 1/2 way home when I started thinking "I wish I had checked out what the back row felt like!!"

Awesome fun Matt, thanks for the invite! Great to finally put some faces with the online personalities!
Glad you enjoyed yourself man. That immersive experience was the exacccct dream I had 4 years ago!!! The front row is full immersion, while the rear row offers the....naw, not going to tell you about the rear row experience. You'll just have to come back out with the wife and kids to experience it!!! :-)
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Looks like a good time was had by all.
Mike
Yeah man, it was loads of fun. Hope to see you at the grand opening this summer!

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post #6230 of 6894 Old 05-02-2018, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post
The front row is full immersion, while the rear row offers the....naw, not going to tell you about the rear row experience. You'll just have to come back out with the wife and kids to experience it!!!
Ha, deal!!
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post #6231 of 6894 Old 05-02-2018, 04:00 PM
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Matt, check your pm for a message called "visit".

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post #6232 of 6894 Old 05-04-2018, 08:44 AM - Thread Starter
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So....there's quite a bit of space between my rows. I'm thinking about pulling the rear row up a couple of feet, building a fixed, padded bench over the subs, and a granite back bar directly behind the rear seating row. Is it worth the effort for those who own or have used back bars?

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post #6233 of 6894 Old 05-04-2018, 10:54 AM
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My two cents...keep the room optimized for the number of people who are in there 90% of the time. You, your wife, maybe one or two other couples or friends. Don't worry about that <10% of the time with a permanent solution like a bar. I don't care how comfortable bar seating is, it's hard to sit for a couple hours straight in an upright chair like that. I always used high-quality bean bags for such events, big enough to hold two people each. Bring them in when you need them and throw them in storage (your HVAC room behind the theater??) when they're not in use. Many times I had empty seats because everyone gravitated toward the bean bags.

To look at it another way, you could always have the same chairs you'd normally have at any back bar tucked into storage and brought out as-needed.

I think the trump card of this whole conversation is your speaker positions and acoustic package are already optimized for your current seating placement. Why mess with 100% of your time spent listening for those rare occasions where you have a packed house. Back away from the edge, my friend!
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post #6234 of 6894 Old 05-04-2018, 10:58 AM - Thread Starter
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My two cents...keep the room optimized for the number of people who are in there 90% of the time. You, your wife, maybe one or two other couples or friends. Don't worry about that <10% of the time with a permanent solution like a bar. I don't care how comfortable bar seating is, it's hard to sit for a couple hours straight in an upright chair like that. I always used high-quality bean bags for such events, big enough to hold two people each. Bring them in when you need them and throw them in storage (your HVAC room behind the theater??) when they're not in use. Many times I had empty seats because everyone gravitated toward the bean bags.

To look at it another way, you could always have the same chairs you'd normally have at any back bar tucked into storage and brought out as-needed.

I think the trump card of this whole conversation is your speaker positions and acoustic package are already optimized for your current seating placement. Why mess with 100% of your time spent listening for those rare occasions where you have a packed house. Back away from the edge, my friend!
You, good sir, have brought me back down to reality! Thank you sir! This hobby...we go seeking the symptoms. It's like just getting over a cold, and then immediately taking a nap in an ice bath.

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post #6235 of 6894 Old 05-04-2018, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post
My two cents...keep the room optimized for the number of people who are in there 90% of the time. You, your wife, maybe one or two other couples or friends. Don't worry about that <10% of the time with a permanent solution like a bar. I don't care how comfortable bar seating is, it's hard to sit for a couple hours straight in an upright chair like that. I always used high-quality bean bags for such events, big enough to hold two people each. Bring them in when you need them and throw them in storage (your HVAC room behind the theater??) when they're not in use. Many times I had empty seats because everyone gravitated toward the bean bags.

To look at it another way, you could always have the same chairs you'd normally have at any back bar tucked into storage and brought out as-needed.

I think the trump card of this whole conversation is your speaker positions and acoustic package are already optimized for your current seating placement. Why mess with 100% of your time spent listening for those rare occasions where you have a packed house. Back away from the edge, my friend!
Having just been in your room, let me pile onto this.

As I mentioned, I spent most of the G2G in the front row, so that's where I consumed all of the content. From the demos, to the clips, and the music. I spent all of about 5 minutes in the back row, for the pics that were posted above. My summary of thoughts:

From the front row, I thought:
- Wow, that's a really big screen, I hope I'm not too close.
- Hmmm, that's actually not bad, and I'm not even in the middle seat.
- This is super immersive, I love it.
- I wonder if it's the aspect ratio that lets him be so close w/o feeling TOO close?
- Screen design = stolen!
Then I sat in the back and I thought:
- Wow, that's a LOT of extra space on the riser there (3-4 ft)
- It's pretty expansive back here
- Man, I should've watched a few clips from here to see the difference
- I'd SO put a small coffee table w/snacks up there, or even better - sink a minifridge in the riser! (This is how my brain works ppl, deal w/it)

Other thoughts:
- In what world do you think you have the ceiling height for a back bar on your riser? :P
- Would that world be the one where your HVAC solution can COVER a back row's worth of people??

Final answer: I agree w/Tim - you're thinking of things to do b/c the room is "done", don't - It's a Trap!! (Happy SW Day, MTFBWY)

Better uses for that funding:
- Minisplit
- Pro cal
- Walls in the workout room




TLDR: The back row is great, I wouldn't mess w/it.
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post #6236 of 6894 Old 05-04-2018, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Having just been in your room, let me pile onto this.

As I mentioned, I spent most of the G2G in the front row, so that's where I consumed all of the content. From the demos, to the clips, and the music. I spent all of about 5 minutes in the back row, for the pics that were posted above. My summary of thoughts:

From the front row, I thought:
- Wow, that's a really big screen, I hope I'm not too close.
- Hmmm, that's actually not bad, and I'm not even in the middle seat.
- This is super immersive, I love it.
- I wonder if it's the aspect ratio that lets him be so close w/o feeling TOO close?
- Screen design = stolen!
Then I sat in the back and I thought:
- Wow, that's a LOT of extra space on the riser there (3-4 ft)
- It's pretty expansive back here
- Man, I should've watched a few clips from here to see the difference
- I'd SO put a small coffee table w/snacks up there, or even better - sink a minifridge in the riser! (This is how my brain works ppl, deal w/it)

Other thoughts:
- In what world do you think you have the ceiling height for a back bar on your riser?
- Would that world be the one where your HVAC solution can COVER a back row's worth of people??

Final answer: I agree w/Tim - you're thinking of things to do b/c the room is "done", don't - It's a Trap!! (Happy SW Day, MTFBWY)

Better uses for that funding:
- Minisplit
- Pro cal
- Walls in the workout room




TLDR: The back row is great, I wouldn't mess w/it.
Appreciate this post! Great to get some insight into how The Beast, Unleashed experience is viewed through another's eyes. Also, you have demolished, TNT-style, the two story building that contained the shallow ledge that Tim just walked me off of!

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post #6237 of 6894 Old 05-05-2018, 08:13 AM
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Appreciate this post! Great to get some insight into how The Beast, Unleashed experience is viewed through another's eyes. Also, you have demolished, TNT-style, the two story building that contained the shallow ledge that Tim just walked me off of!

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The thing I have thought of doing for a back row is tall Billiard chairs with arms and cup holders. Then no need for a bar. I like the looks of the big screen, but if I went scope I could get the third row in better since my room is around 26' long.

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post #6238 of 6894 Old 05-05-2018, 09:22 AM
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The thing I have thought of doing for a back row is tall Billiard chairs with arms and cup holders. Then no need for a bar. I like the looks of the big screen, but if I went scope I could get the third row in better since my room is around 26' long.
You would want to sit in those billiard chairs for 2 hours and see how your body feels afterwards; if they are going to be used as theater seating. I had to go with actual theater seating (not recliners) due to space and size of extended family, and there is not a day that doesn't go by where I am sitting in them and wish I had ignored my wife and gone recliners instead. Plan for what you will need 90% of the time, and leave enough room to bring in additional seating as needed for the 10%. To me, having a snack bar in the room is invaluable during movies (as I don't have to leave to get more popcorn, etc), but that is not the same thing as a complete bar with seating.

As far as scope vs 16:9, size is not the limiting factor. You can have a very large scope screen (curved perhaps) and experience the immersion without image distortion. The limiting factor with a scope screen is how you will manage 1.85 or 1.9 content without an anamorphic lens. Most owners of scope screens simply zoom in their 2.35 or 2.4 content and will either live with the black bars on the side for 1.85 or plop $5K for a Lumagen processor to scale the image horizontally 1.33x to fit the screen. Others (myself included) will find an excellent used anamorphic lens and instead use the projector to resize the image for 1.85 to fit correctly onto the scope screen.

With a large 16:9 screen, a masking system is one option (if you want to maintain correct geometry for scope movies), or a $5K Lumagen Pro to stretch and size the image to fit the IMAX screen, zooming in and cropping the image in the process. Both ways work, but at the end of the day having a large screen translates into spending lot more to make it look right.
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post #6239 of 6894 Old 05-05-2018, 12:21 PM
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You would want to sit in those billiard chairs for 2 hours and see how your body feels afterwards; if they are going to be used as theater seating. I had to go with actual theater seating (not recliners) due to space and size of extended family, and there is not a day that doesn't go by where I am sitting in them and wish I had ignored my wife and gone recliners instead. Plan for what you will need 90% of the time, and leave enough room to bring in additional seating as needed for the 10%. To me, having a snack bar in the room is invaluable during movies (as I don't have to leave to get more popcorn, etc), but that is not the same thing as a complete bar with seating.

As far as scope vs 16:9, size is not the limiting factor. You can have a very large scope screen (curved perhaps) and experience the immersion without image distortion. The limiting factor with a scope screen is how you will manage 1.85 or 1.9 content without an anamorphic lens. Most owners of scope screens simply zoom in their 2.35 or 2.4 content and will either live with the black bars on the side for 1.85 or plop $5K for a Lumagen processor to scale the image horizontally 1.33x to fit the screen. Others (myself included) will find an excellent used anamorphic lens and instead use the projector to resize the image for 1.85 to fit correctly onto the scope screen.

With a large 16:9 screen, a masking system is one option (if you want to maintain correct geometry for scope movies), or a $5K Lumagen Pro to stretch and size the image to fit the IMAX screen, zooming in and cropping the image in the process. Both ways work, but at the end of the day having a large screen translates into spending lot more to make it look right.
The billiard chairs would mostly be used for when having people over to watch sporting events. Also I would think they would be just as comfortable as sitting in a bar stool for 2 hours with a table. Another thought was an office height table and office chairs. If I went with the screen Matt did it would only be 2 rows and I think I can get 2 rows of recliners in.

As for screens, I'm not sure yet i will probably just go with my current 104" wide screen and build the rest for the future.

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post #6240 of 6894 Old 06-18-2018, 05:02 AM - Thread Starter
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I managed to slip in three movies yesterday (it’s all I wanted for Father’s day), but there are two I need to focus on, and I’ll get to the third afterwards. The two movies I need to contrast are one released theatrically this year, and one released in 2006. The first was the new Tomb Raider (2018), the second was Children of Men (2006). Where do I begin...

I picked up Tomb Raider in 4K after reading that it was a visual treat. Popped the disc into my Oppo and pressed play. The video quality is indeed superb, and I absolutely loved the beginning, but it definitely took quite a while for the pace to pick up once the opening excitement died down. I rather liked the premise overall, but something intangible was missing in the ultimate execution. I guess it was equal to *less* than the sum of its parts? So I was a little disappointed that I had spent one of my “father’s day movies” on that.

FFWD to the evening time, and I watched Children of Men for the first time since 2006....

Wow.

What a movie. It’s one of those rare movies that not only has a great original story and sufficient action, but it really makes you think. The intensity is so palpable—i felt like the movie was good enough to make up for Tomb Raider earlier in the day.

On to the third movie I saw: Jurassic World. I’d used this movie so much for dialing in bass, I was almost desensitized to its awesomeness, but we had some friends over in the afternoon and that was the movie they chose, so as we watched, i was reminded of how amazing that movie is. But....the picture quality is not as good on 4k as I was expecting. Compared do Red Sparrow or Tomb Raider, the picture quality was downright 1080p-ish. I expected this from the other Jurassic movies, but NOT from Jurassic World. But the audio more than made up for it.

Undoubtedly, Children of Men was the highlight of the day. I can’t believe it’s been 12 years since I had seen it.

It’s actually going to be the measuring stick by which i rate movies henceforth, in terms of overall immersion and story/action balancing. That’s a tall order in this modern day of whiz-bang boom flicks.

Just had to share this.


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