Soundproofing master thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 398Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 01:57 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cw5billwade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: GA
Posts: 1,780
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 329 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post

I'm curious about something you might be able to answer.
My local supply guy asked me to consider using drywall in the T bar instead of the panels.
While considering it I though about the potential for drywall dust falling once installed and wondered about using an acoustic caulk around each edge to seal the seams (lift the panel, caulk around the topside of the lip, set the panel back down, tape all pieces first if necessary).
I'm pretty sure I don't want to go with the drywall in the T bar option (5/8" drywall is about a third of the cost and weighs more) but am still wondering about the potential of the acoustic sealant between the T bar and ceiling tile.
Is it worth while and would you do it? If you were in my position (not being able to hang drywall from the ceiling) which would you have installed?
If you are looking for sound proofing this guy is not telling you correct information and apparently does not know what he is talking. check the information on soundproofingcompany.com. Whisper clips or the cheaper IB-1 clips like I used with hat channel and 5/8" DW/GG/DW or OSB/GG/DW like I used is the recommended practice. If you have a lower ceiling you can put braces between the rafters so that the clips and hat channel are installed on the braces running parallel to the rafters with the hat channel now 1/4" lower than the rafter vise 2". save you some height but not sure it is worth it unless 7' or lower ceiling.
cw5billwade is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 02:15 PM
Advanced Member
 
brwsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 176 Post(s)
Liked: 108
It really comes down to I don't trust the clips with the weight of two layers of drywall (if we're doing it, it would be doubled up)
Just picture you're sitting in your room half cut watching your favorite bomb run or gun fight and bammm you're in the scene, literally.
T bar goes up in 2 days.

"1 MAN CAVE" WITH ADA-1000-4 POWERING 3 M80HP'S
SURROUNDED WITHOUT NEEDING SURROUNDS.
BASS WITHOUT NEEDING THE SUBS. LOVE HAVING OPTIONS.
brwsaw is offline  
post #93 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 04:49 PM
HOME THEATER CONTRACTOR
 
BIGmouthinDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 32,787
Mentioned: 464 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6182 Post(s)
Liked: 5871
I have yet to hear of a single incident of the failure of a clup and channel ceiling. Just follow the recommended spacing.

If I was at home I would post the picture of Ted White hanging between two clips.

The probability of being killed in a car accident is far greater than the drywall failing. T bar is not engineered for the weight of drywall.
BIGmouthinDC is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #94 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 06:29 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
granroth is offline  
post #95 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 06:39 PM
Advanced Member
 
brwsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 176 Post(s)
Liked: 108
Its all good. Thanks though.
T bars paid for and will be onsite tomorrow.
Next time.

"1 MAN CAVE" WITH ADA-1000-4 POWERING 3 M80HP'S
SURROUNDED WITHOUT NEEDING SURROUNDS.
BASS WITHOUT NEEDING THE SUBS. LOVE HAVING OPTIONS.
brwsaw is offline  
post #96 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
So if you're definitively going with T-bars and acoustic ceiling tile, then it's an interesting question if sealing the edges with acoustic caulk would make an appreciable difference. I'm far from an expert (as is evidenced in this thread), so I'm going to just surmise out loud.

Ceiling tiles hang loose in the t-bar, traditionally. During a movie with any decent sound (especially loud bass), the t-bar will vibrate like mad. I can attest that when I fired up a subwoofer in the very un-controlled space of my living room, every single picture and hanging item in the room buzzed with every "boom" -- the vibration was very obvious.

Presumably the ceiling tile won't "buzz", due to the material it's made of. But it will still vibrate and I'm wondering if that vibration will cause the t-bar to vibrate even more. It makes sense that that vibration would allow air to pass and air loss == sound propagation.

Now let's assume you lay down a bed of acoustic caulk and set the ceiling tile in it. This essentially creates a damping layer right there and seals it from any air loss. I'd be very surprised if it didn't do anything, since it's creating a sealed and dampened layer that wasn't there before.

The question that I can't begin to answer is how much of a difference it would make. Would it be noticeable? No idea.
granroth is offline  
post #97 of 3330 Old 02-06-2014, 09:45 PM
Advanced Member
 
brwsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 176 Post(s)
Liked: 108
Yep.
Still hung up.
It would be a pile of work at awkward angles but the idea has a tiny bit of potential.
Were painting the tile and had planned on painting the t bar as well.
I'm now thinking the t bar should stay white just in case.
The fire rated tile weighs quite a bit. I doubt I have to worry about vibrations with my current subs. I actually hope your right though, that's one problem I'd be happy to have.
I'll know in about a week, I don't see placing my equipment any sooner.

"1 MAN CAVE" WITH ADA-1000-4 POWERING 3 M80HP'S
SURROUNDED WITHOUT NEEDING SURROUNDS.
BASS WITHOUT NEEDING THE SUBS. LOVE HAVING OPTIONS.
brwsaw is offline  
post #98 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 07:23 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
cw5billwade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: GA
Posts: 1,780
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 329 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Are you putting R19 insulation between the joists? prior to installing the tile? That would help as well.
cw5billwade is offline  
post #99 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 08:28 AM
Advanced Member
 
brwsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 176 Post(s)
Liked: 108
I had a layer of Safe and Sound installed tight to the sub floor and had a second layer added at the bottom of the 9 1/2 joist. I'd stressed the importance of the gap between the batts and the guys really came through.
I was being realistic when we started, knowing it wouldn't be sound proof. I'm hoping for 50% reduction but don't think we'll get there. Another week or so and I'll know.
FWIW the main goal wasn't to stop sound going up so much as it was to stop it from effecting the weight bearing wall down the middle of the home. This would travel through the entire home. I think the two insulated walls with the 2-3" average air gap should work pretty well here.

"1 MAN CAVE" WITH ADA-1000-4 POWERING 3 M80HP'S
SURROUNDED WITHOUT NEEDING SURROUNDS.
BASS WITHOUT NEEDING THE SUBS. LOVE HAVING OPTIONS.
brwsaw is offline  
post #100 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 10:48 AM
Senior Member
 
dsteak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 204
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Is there such a thing as overdoing it? I'm not sure how to ask the question specifically, but my builder wants to cover all of my walls (screen wall, side walls, and rear walls) with a Whisper Walls system and ceiling treatments. Inside the walls and ceiling I already have Dynil installed. Will these a create a "too dead" environment?
dsteak is offline  
post #101 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 11:14 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
BasementBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,002
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 137 Post(s)
Liked: 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post

I had a layer of Safe and Sound installed tight to the sub floor and had a second layer added at the bottom of the 9 1/2 joist. I'd stressed the importance of the gap between the batts and the guys really came through.
One layer of batts probably would have been fine.

An amateur built the Ark. Titanic was built by professionals. Of course Noah took a little advice.
BasementBob is offline  
post #102 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 11:42 AM
Advanced Member
 
brwsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 176 Post(s)
Liked: 108
I know, but for the cost and time involved I figured it shouldn't hurt either.
The biggest consideration is I was hoping to stop the direct foot fall sound a bit, another reason I didn't want drywall on the ceiling ( sound transfer through the joist).
I'd agree with a bit more home work and a bit more planning the suspended clipped ceiling would have been way better.

"1 MAN CAVE" WITH ADA-1000-4 POWERING 3 M80HP'S
SURROUNDED WITHOUT NEEDING SURROUNDS.
BASS WITHOUT NEEDING THE SUBS. LOVE HAVING OPTIONS.
brwsaw is offline  
post #103 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 11:56 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
BasementBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,002
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 137 Post(s)
Liked: 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsteak View Post

Is there such a thing as overdoing it? I'm not sure how to ask the question specifically, but my builder wants to cover all of my walls (screen wall, side walls, and rear walls) with a Whisper Walls system and ceiling treatments. Inside the walls and ceiling I already have Dynil installed. Will these a create a "too dead" environment?

Some poor guesses:

I presume that Dynil is 'Mass Loaded Vinyl'. Most times that's placed behind drywall, for sound transmission (room to room noise). I have a feeling you didn't put it behind drywall.

Whisper Walls remind me of the "Owens Corning Basement Finishing System". The Owens is R11 insulation everywhere, which is both not deep enough and too much area, giving two types of home theatre acoustical problems (dead at mid/high frequencies, still has room modes).

If your Whisper Walls are just absorption, then that would the same kind of bad as Owens. If you mix absorption, reflection, and diffusive behind, or in front of, those panels in the correct proportions and at the correct places, then that's better. Whisper Walls absorption seems to come in various thicknesses, the max being 2". I don't know if you can have a 2" air gap behind that, which would help, but it looks to me that they flush screw it to the wall -- it might be better to screw it to studs to get some more depth behind it.
The absorption coefficients for the 2" system are at
http://www.whisperwalls.com/testing_gs/pdf/Acoustical_-_Type_A_-_WhisperSpan_2_inch.pdf
I don't see absorption coefficients for just the fabric only, without insulation.

What's he doing on the ceiling? More Whisper Ceiling ?

I vaguely remember a design where the walls from floor to 1' below ear level were covered in absorption, and a ring 1' below ear level to the ceiling were reflective. Might have been one of Denis Erskine's.

Nonetheless its better than carpet.

An amateur built the Ark. Titanic was built by professionals. Of course Noah took a little advice.
BasementBob is offline  
post #104 of 3330 Old 02-07-2014, 12:48 PM
Senior Member
 
dsteak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 204
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Yes, Dynil is the same stuff they put in car doors. It's behind my dry wall, stapled to the joists. The goal was to stop as much sound from traveling upstairs (from the basement) as possible and to block the furnace noise coming from the other side of the basement. The room is sealed off with sliding doors that have been acoustically treated, but...

The room is somewhat echo-y as you can hear reverberations when speaking, whistling, etc. It's also rather small, 13x16x7.5. He wants to use 1" thick. In between the 60" wide fabric wrapped whisper panels would be a 2" wood panel to mount sconces on, and wooden flutter echo treatments in place of acoustic backing. On the ceiling he wants to put a 6'x4' acoustic treatment (cloud) front center, between the center channel and the listening positions.

Would I just be better off with strategically placed Acoustic Treatments than doing the entire room floor to ceiling? I have to read more about absorption, reflection, and diffusion.

Thanks so much for the response, I really appreciate it.
dsteak is offline  
post #105 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 03:59 PM
Member
 
rabindu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
We're building a new house, and I have the good fortune of being "allowed" a 24x18x12 media/family room. I'm planning to go the distance building a room within a room with hat channel/green glue/DD/ separate HVAC run. The problem is, along the perimeter wall, my wife wants windows! Not big windows, but she insists on some natural light. How am I going to accomplish a high STC rating if I have 2-3 gaping holes in all my hard work? I've tried researching all over the net, but I can't seem to find anything that isn't about blocking sound out. I'm not concerned about outside noise coming in. I want to prevent the theater noise from getiing to the rest of the house. Is this a solvable problem? Thanks, in advance, for any advice.
rabindu is offline  
post #106 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabindu View Post

We're building a new house, and I have the good fortune of being "allowed" a 24x18x12 media/family room. I'm planning to go the distance building a room within a room with hat channel/green glue/DD/ separate HVAC run. The problem is, along the perimeter wall, my wife wants windows! Not big windows, but she insists on some natural light. How am I going to accomplish a high STC rating if I have 2-3 gaping holes in all my hard work? I've tried researching all over the net, but I can't seem to find anything that isn't about blocking sound out. I'm not concerned about outside noise coming in. I want to prevent the theater noise from getiing to the rest of the house. Is this a solvable problem? Thanks, in advance, for any advice.

To start, if you are doing a true room-within-a-room, then there's no need for hat channel. The interior walls already give the coupling that the hat channel and clips would accomplish -- and they do a better job of it, too.

Dealing with windows (that must remain windows) in a theater is relatively common. The two ways that they are typically dealt with is to either hang thick drapes or to create a window plug.

Thick drapes are surprisingly effective for how simple they are. If your primary concern is not incoming noise but outgoing noise leaking back into the house, then drapes might be all that you need. The sound is already going to be muted quite a bit by the distance outside and the little extra damping done by the drapes might be good enough.

That said, the drapes themselves do not have a great STC rating. For that, you're going to need to create a custom "plug" for the window. See post 2 in this thread for a couple links to building your own plug: Notable Soundproofing Threads and Links. There is also a small discussion on the topic in this thread starting at post 31.

The advantage of a plug is that it offers fantastic sound proofing, while still being removable when you aren't watching a movie.
granroth is offline  
post #107 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 05:07 PM
Member
 
rabindu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Really..........that's some good info about the hat channel. Thank you. As for the ceiling, they would still be required? Or would you think floating joists would be the better way to go?
rabindu is offline  
post #108 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 05:42 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
If you have room for floating joists, then they are definitely the way to go. And no, hat channels would not be necessary on the ceiling, either.

Think of it this way. The goal for 'inner walls and ceilings' and for channels and clips are the same. In both cases, they are breaking the most reactive sound paths and forcing the sound to convert to another form to get to the next stage in the construction. This takes energy, which reduces the volume of the sound as it goes. Clips work by "buffering" the vibrations through a non-rigid layer.

BUT, it's not a perfect system, since there is still a physical connection between the drywall and the studs. It's a pretty decent connection, as far as physical connections go... but still a connection.

Compare that to a room-within-a-room with inner walls and floating joists. Now, there is NO connection between the inner solid membrane and the outer layer of studs. No connection is always going to trump a decent connection.
granroth is offline  
post #109 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 05:52 PM
Member
 
rabindu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Seems completely logical. Would I still do the double drywall with green glue?
rabindu is offline  
post #110 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
Yes. Doing the floating walls and ceiling takes care of the Decoupling part of soundproofing, but it doesn't address the other three pillars -- namely Mass, Damping, and Absorption. All four factors need to be addressed to truly achieve the best results.

Double drywall with Green Glue in between covers both Mass and Damping. The dual layers create more Mass while the Green Glue creating a Damping layer.

I strongly suggest reading the two "Essential" links listed in the first post of this thread:

Advice from Anthony Grimani (PMI) - Soundproofing 101: How to Keep Your Home Theater Quiet
Advice from Ted White (Soundproofing Company) - 4 Elements of Soundproofing

Both are far better writers than me and know the subject inside and out. These are very readable articles, too. I guarantee that you'll learn tons!
granroth is offline  
post #111 of 3330 Old 02-09-2014, 06:29 PM
Member
 
rabindu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thank you.
rabindu is offline  
post #112 of 3330 Old 02-10-2014, 08:49 PM
Member
 
sonaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Eagle River, AK
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by granroth View Post

To start, if you are doing a true room-within-a-room, then there's no need for hat channel. The interior walls already give the coupling that the hat channel and clips would accomplish -- and they do a better job of it, too.

I've seen several others combine both room-within-a-room and clips and channel; here's one BIG worked on:
(from: https://www.avsforum.com/t/1437336/fall-frenzy-curve-frenzy-man-of-steel-theater-you-pick-bigmouthindc-hits-the-road-again-destination-columbus-indiana)

If there's no benefit why are they doing it?

Don't most double stud walls end up using IB-3 clips, or the like, to connect the top wall plate to the joists above or to the other wall? If so, wouldn't the clips and channel then help to further decouple that connection? It seems like a true "room-within-a-room" wouldn't benefit from clips and channels, so I have to assume that many of the builds using both methods are not true rooms-within-rooms, but have some other connections they are trying to decouple.
sonaps is offline  
post #113 of 3330 Old 02-10-2014, 10:23 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonaps View Post

I've seen several others combine both room-within-a-room and clips and channel; here's one BIG worked on:
(from: https://www.avsforum.com/t/1437336/fall-frenzy-curve-frenzy-man-of-steel-theater-you-pick-bigmouthindc-hits-the-road-again-destination-columbus-indiana)

If there's no benefit why are they doing it?

I've wondered the same thing. My assumption, based on reading the entire build thread, is that it was an example of a local company doing overkill. @BIGmouthinDC occasionally stops by and maybe he can give more details on the "why".
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonaps View Post

Don't most double stud walls end up using IB-3 clips, or the like, to connect the top wall plate to the joists above or to the other wall? If so, wouldn't the clips and channel then help to further decouple that connection? It seems like a true "room-within-a-room" wouldn't benefit from clips and channels, so I have to assume that many of the builds using both methods are not true rooms-within-rooms, but have some other connections they are trying to decouple.

Hmm... that's an interesting thought. Yes, most double stud walls I've seen are connected to the joists using some kind of isolation clips. Having channels and clips on the walls could possibly make sense in increasingly the decoupling effect with the ceiling.

That's definitely something that I can't give a definitive answer to. Hopefully somebody with a bit more knowledge on this particular subject will step in.
granroth is offline  
post #114 of 3330 Old 02-11-2014, 06:28 AM
HOME THEATER CONTRACTOR
 
BIGmouthinDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 32,787
Mentioned: 464 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6182 Post(s)
Liked: 5871
Rule one, in this Home Theater hobby there is no such thing as OVERKILL. Only a diminishing return on your investment. The average theater can skip the clips and channel on the side walls it the framing is truely decopled from the start. and if the walls aren't common with other rooms where sound management is crucial.
LydMekk likes this.
BIGmouthinDC is offline  
post #115 of 3330 Old 02-11-2014, 07:16 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
Where are some good build threads with staggered stud walls?

The conventional wisdom has decoupling methods ranked in this order: double walls, staggered studs, clips and channels. There are a number of build threads with double walls and loads of threads with clips and channels. I've yet to find any detailed thread with staggered studs. The closest I've come is a couple threads where one wall is staggered stud... but the main decoupling seems to be clips and channels in those ones.

What am I missing?
akoutin likes this.
granroth is offline  
post #116 of 3330 Old 02-11-2014, 07:33 PM
Senior Member
 
panino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Indy
Posts: 248
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked: 52

I'm still in the planning stage of my room.  I'd like to be able to isolate some of the walls with clips and/or DD w/ GG, but a few of the other walls, including the ceiling will be problematic.  Is there any use in soundproofing some of the walls but not the entire room?  Or is this just a waste of time.  In other words will I get any benefit from a partial room isolation or do I need to isolate all the walls and ceiling?

panino is offline  
post #117 of 3330 Old 02-11-2014, 07:45 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Tom Bley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: IL. USA
Posts: 3,444
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 941 Post(s)
Liked: 917
Quote:
Originally Posted by granroth View Post

Where are some good build threads with staggered stud walls?

The conventional wisdom has decoupling methods ranked in this order: double walls, staggered studs, clips and channels. There are a number of build threads with double walls and loads of threads with clips and channels. I've yet to find any detailed thread with staggered studs. The closest I've come is a couple threads where one wall is staggered stud... but the main decoupling seems to be clips and channels in those ones.

What am I missing?

I am using a staggered stud wall for the left side and front wall of my ht room. I don't have a build thread. I've been very slow at building the basement. The electric is happening now. I'm the only one in the house and the shared walls will be a bar and guest room.
I forgot to mention the walls are decoupled from the floor joists above.
Tom Bley is online now  
post #118 of 3330 Old 02-12-2014, 05:50 AM
HOME THEATER CONTRACTOR
 
BIGmouthinDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 32,787
Mentioned: 464 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6182 Post(s)
Liked: 5871
Staggered stud walls built by typical contractors and DIYers are coupled to the ceiling joists and floor above and sound will be transferred, if you go with staggered studs use the framing isolation techniques or clips and channel. Otherwise you will be disappointed in your soundproofing efforts.
BIGmouthinDC is offline  
post #119 of 3330 Old 02-12-2014, 05:53 AM
HOME THEATER CONTRACTOR
 
BIGmouthinDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 32,787
Mentioned: 464 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6182 Post(s)
Liked: 5871
Quote:
Originally Posted by panino View Post

I'm still in the planning stage of my room.  I'd like to be able to isolate some of the walls with clips and/or DD w/ GG, but a few of the other walls, including the ceiling will be problematic.  Is there any use in soundproofing some of the walls but not the entire room?  Or is this just a waste of time.  In other words will I get any benefit from a partial room isolation or do I need to isolate all the walls and ceiling?

doing a partial job will produce partial results it would be impossible to predict your results it could be 10-50% as effective. If you would be happy with a 10% result just do a couple of walls.
BIGmouthinDC is offline  
post #120 of 3330 Old 02-12-2014, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
granroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,484
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by panino View Post

I'm still in the planning stage of my room.  I'd like to be able to isolate some of the walls with clips and/or DD w/ GG, but a few of the other walls, including the ceiling will be problematic.  Is there any use in soundproofing some of the walls but not the entire room?  Or is this just a waste of time.  In other words will I get any benefit from a partial room isolation or do I need to isolate all the walls and ceiling?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

Staggered stud walls built by typical contractors and DIYers are coupled to the ceiling joists and floor above and sound will be transferred, if you go with staggered studs use the framing isolation techniques or clips and channel. Otherwise you will be disappointed in your soundproofing efforts.

These are related, in my case. I tried to soundproof the shared wall between two bedrooms a couple years ago. I created a staggered stud wall on a 2x6 plate and filled it with insulation. I didn't decouple it from the ceiling; didn't double up the drywall; didn't do any damping; and didn't treat the ceiling or shared hallway wall.

The end result is as if I didn't do anything at all. I mean, if you play a sound on one side of the wall and listen carefully on the other side of the wall, then yeah, you can tell that it's muted a little. But who cares, because that sound is as clear as day coming from every other direction. And honestly, the staggered studs on their own didn't help as much as I thought they would, either.

So I can attest from personal experience that doing a partial job can be essentially as effective as doing no soundproofing at all AND that the benefits of staggered studs is essentially nullified if you connect it right to the ceiling joists.

BTW, panino, the keyword that governs your experience is going to be "flanking." As in, the sound issues you'll have are due to flanking. There's lots of really good info on that online (starting with the two "Essential" links in the first post of this thread).
granroth is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Dedicated Theater Design & Construction

Tags
green glue; noiseproofing; soundproofing

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off