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post #721 of 1353 Old 10-25-2016, 04:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobsocc7 View Post
Mr big wrote on another thread.
for large gaps I stuff pieces of drywall into the gap then seal both sides with acoustical caulk, small gaps you can force some insulation into the gap with a stick leaving the outside 1/2 to 3/4 inch of gap, fill/seal that with caulk. Turn the lights off in the theater and if you see any light coming in from the outside, seal that area.

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Greatly appreciate it Hob
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post #722 of 1353 Old 10-26-2016, 01:06 PM - Thread Starter
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One door caulked, one door to go!

Next up, falsewall and rack construction.



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post #723 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 12:20 AM
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Any intumescent sealant will work well as an acoustic sealant, as these tend to remain more flexible than your regular caulk and silicone sealants, they also tend to be 'anti-slump', so they can more easily fill larger gaps, without falling out of the hole being filled.

Certainly in the UK, many brands of 'fire sealants' are advertised also as being acoustic sealants, and vice versa.

http://www.insulationexpress.co.uk/T...es/Sealant.htm

They're not expensive either.

HTH
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post #724 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 06:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by UK Dreamer View Post
Any intumescent sealant will work well as an acoustic sealant, as these tend to remain more flexible than your regular caulk and silicone sealants, they also tend to be 'anti-slump', so they can more easily fill larger gaps, without falling out of the hole being filled.

Certainly in the UK, many brands of 'fire sealants' are advertised also as being acoustic sealants, and vice versa.

http://www.insulationexpress.co.uk/T...es/Sealant.htm

They're not expensive either.

HTH
Awesome information thanks Dreamer! Uh oh, one door has already been completed with standard '40 year' latex painters caulk...
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post #725 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Awesome information thanks Dreamer! Uh oh, one door has already been completed with standard '40 year' latex painters caulk...
Then I guess you may notice some deterioration in around 40 years! I have no experience of using one over the other - I've always just used the acoustic/fire sealants. Maybe @BIGmouthinDC can chip in with his advice - 99% of me thinks it'll be just fine as you are - but I've been wrong before!
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post #726 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 06:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by UK Dreamer View Post
Then I guess you may notice some deterioration in around 40 years!
LOL! Unacceptable, I'm tearing it out and doing it again JK

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Originally Posted by UK Dreamer View Post
I have no experience of using one over the other - I've always just used the acoustic/fire sealants. Maybe @BIGmouthinDC can chip in with his advice - 99% of me thinks it'll be just fine as you are - but I've been wrong before!
No worries on my end; gonna leave it be. For the second and last door I'll try to find an intumescent product in stock locally. Thanks Dreamer.

As a side note, its interesting you mentioned that the intumescent products are more flexible (and will remain so) over standard latex caulk. I had one Green Glue Sealant tube left and that got me half way around the first door. The other side of the door (and the top) I used latex painters caulk. Just as you mentioned, the Green Glue sealant was definitely more pliable the day after. Both products still had a good seal after drying but the green glue (and apparently other intumescent products) were superior to the latex IMO.
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post #727 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 07:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Look at the large holes around my mains created by the sub array and the side walls. I've been told this is a recipe for reflections and is to be avoided.

Since I can't avoid it, how to mitigate this?

Just stack pink fluffy on ground from floor to ceiling?

@LTD02 posted this in @waterboy build thread. Does something like this make sense for my situation?



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post #728 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 08:30 AM
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@ddigler - how big is your space? Are those Volt 6s or 8s that you're using for surrounds? Also, do the columns affect the sound for the Volts at all?
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post #729 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by VicTorious1 View Post
@ddigler - how big is your space? Are those Volt 6s or 8s that you're using for surrounds? Also, do the columns affect the sound for the Volts at all?
Hey Victorious thanks for stopping by.

My HT is approx 14'w x 24'l x 8'9" h.

Yes I am using Volt 8 LX for my (4) surround speakers.

I do not notice any difference in the sound of the Volts within the columns as opposed to out in the open. To be certain, I do plan to fill the openings in the columns around the speakers with either Linacoustic or pink fluffy before I put the panels on the columns.
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post #730 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Hey Victorious thanks for stopping by.

My HT is approx 14'w x 24'l x 8'9" h.

Yes I am using Volt 8 LX for my (4) surround speakers.

I do not notice any difference in the sound of the Volts within the columns as opposed to out in the open. To be certain, I do plan to fill the openings in the columns around the speakers with either Linacoustic or pink fluffy before I put the panels on the columns.
Did you recess your Volts any before building your columns or do the columns have an approximately 10" depth from the wall to house the Volts? Thanks.
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post #731 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 12:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by VicTorious1 View Post
Did you recess your Volts any before building your columns or do the columns have an approximately 10" depth from the wall to house the Volts? Thanks.
The walls in my basement are constructed as follows:

8"tk concrete --> 1/2" air gap --> 2" tk rigid insulation --> 1/2" air gap --> 2x4 studs --> double drywall with green glue.

In order to recess the volts as far as I wanted to for my shallow columns I had to cut a hole in the insulation (back to concrete). This allowed my to recess all but approx 2.5" of the speaker allowing me to achieve the shallow columns I wanted.

The columns are only 4" deep. Once the treatment panels are on the columns will stick out past only 2"
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post #732 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Look at the large holes around my mains created by the sub array and the side walls. I've been told this is a recipe for reflections and is to be avoided.

Since I can't avoid it, how to mitigate this?

Just stack pink fluffy on ground from floor to ceiling?

@LTD02 posted this in @waterboy build thread. Does something like this make sense for my situation?
I believe the recommendation I have seen in other threads is to fill it in with pink fluffy.
I intend to fill the space around the speakers behind my screen with pink fluffy covered in landscape fabric.
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post #733 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 06:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by PTAaron View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Look at the large holes around my mains created by the sub array and the side walls. I've been told this is a recipe for reflections and is to be avoided.

Since I can't avoid it, how to mitigate this?

Just stack pink fluffy on ground from floor to ceiling?

@LTD02 posted this in @waterboy build thread. Does something like this make sense for my situation?
I believe the recommendation I have seen in other threads is to fill it in with pink fluffy.
I intend to fill the space around the speakers behind my screen with pink fluffy covered in landscape fabric.
Landscape fabric huh? That is to prevent the fibres from going airborne?

How do you plan to support the fluffy, just stack it?

Thx Aaron.
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post #734 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Look at the large holes around my mains created by the sub array and the side walls. I've been told this is a recipe for reflections and is to be avoided.

Since I can't avoid it, how to mitigate this?

Just stack pink fluffy on ground from floor to ceiling?

@LTD02 posted this in @waterboy build thread. Does something like this make sense for my situation?
I am no expert.... I will leave recommendations to those more knowledgeable, but here are some thoughts

Keep in mind that my scenario is a little different than yours in that I have a solid surface around my screen (even more potential for reflections) and you (i believe) are planning for acoustically transparent fabric around yours. You also have to factor in the ports on your subs as you do not want to block those.
I have not (still plan to) put the insulation behind my screen wall..... right now I think it sounds pretty darn good and have not noticed any "echo" from the screen..... @Fattykidd have you noticed any?
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post #735 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 07:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Waterboy77 View Post
I am no expert.... I will leave recommendations to those more knowledgeable, but here are some thoughts

Keep in mind that my scenario is a little different than yours in that I have a solid surface around my screen (even more potential for reflections) and you (i believe) are planning for acoustically transparent fabric around yours. You also have to factor in the ports on your subs as you do not want to block those.
I have not (still plan to) put the insulation behind my screen wall..... right now I think it sounds pretty darn good and have not noticed any "echo" from the screen..... @Fattykidd have you noticed any?
To be totally honest I wasn't in "critical" mode on sunday. The bass being heavier on the left side of your room was interesting, I'd be curious if that changes once stuffed with insulation.


@ddigler line that cavity with with some sort of absorption and treat first reflection on the walls outside the screen.
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post #736 of 1353 Old 10-27-2016, 08:30 PM
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Landscape fabric huh? That is to prevent the fibres from going airborne?

How do you plan to support the fluffy, just stack it?

Thx Aaron.
Yeah, keep it contained, and make it black

Was just going to stack it.
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post #737 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Waterboy77 View Post
I am no expert.... I will leave recommendations to those more knowledgeable, but here are some thoughts
Keep in mind that my scenario is a little different than yours in that I have a solid surface around my screen (even more potential for reflections)
Good point
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Originally Posted by Waterboy77 View Post
and you (i believe) are planning for acoustically transparent fabric around yours.
True - hopefully this will allow sound to pass through the falsewall and be absorbed by materials behind the wall
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Originally Posted by Waterboy77 View Post
You also have to factor in the ports on your subs as you do not want to block those.
Yes this is true as well. Another wrinkle is the hot water heater on the wall next to the Left main speaker. That thing obviously needs some room to breathe. I like @Fattykidd approach of absorption on the walls (not stacked) behind the falsewall but not sure how many inches/what material to use...

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Originally Posted by Fattykidd View Post
@ddigler line that cavity with with some sort of absorption and treat first reflection on the walls outside the screen.
Thx Fatty - I already have 1-2" tk Linacoustic wrapping those walls. You suggest more than that? As @PTAaron mentioned, should I be using pink fluffy?
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post #738 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 06:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, keep it contained, and make it black

Was just going to stack it.
This approach (landscape fabric) makes using pink fluffy so much nicer! Thanks Aaron.
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post #739 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 07:10 AM
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Big is right about what you can do for cheap soundproofing, Big is often right here, I do not know why, but seems replicable

Now, with so much holes in your soundproofed room, you might end up throwing your money out of the windows. You might be better off with sound treatments to absorb the sound.

It might also be truth than you cannot soundproof your room the way it is built. If this is the case, do not spend $1,500. Make sure you treat the room so that you have a good sound inside and live with the sound leftover outside .

If were you, I would explore more the room in room for $1500. At least you have a real enclosed room with such a design, no window, a door. You can still add the 25 Ga channel as big said and craiglist green glue, not sure about his home made clip but a really good idea on the paper.
While this is a good idea, what if you want to maximize interior space? What would be the most effective means of soundproofing while maintaining reasonable room widths?
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post #740 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 08:00 AM
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Landscape fabric huh? That is to prevent the fibres from going airborne?

How do you plan to support the fluffy, just stack it?
I built a frame out of 1x2s. I was initially going to use landscape fabric for the support shelves but I wasn't happy with the sagging, so I used a couple of 1x2s to support the fiberglass. I used plastic covered fiberglass which is nicer to work with and the plastic has minimal or no effect on the sound absorption. I then stapled landscape fabric over the frame to black it out and further enclose the fiberglass. You might want to test the landscape fabric for flammability if you are concerned about such things. Some have reported it to be very flammable. I tested what I had and it would only melt if a flame was held to it. As soon as I removed the flame, it went out.

I also made a corner bass trap for the left side the same way and left the frame free standing so I could move it to get to my main water and gas valves if ever needed. I also used rockwool on the bare basement floor because the rockwool is more resistant to water damage and moisture.

A work in progress pic (it's a mess):
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post #741 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 08:03 AM - Thread Starter
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While this is a good idea, what if you want to maximize interior space? What would be the most effective means of soundproofing while maintaining reasonable room widths?
Hi Meister!

This is a loaded question you ask. I am no authority (but there are a few that frequent my build thread who may chime in) but heres what I have learned:

You are going to lose some room width if you take 'soundproofing' seriously. Soundproofing requires isolation and mass on the walls/ceilings, far exceeding typical residential construction, and these requirements will cost you room width/height. The approach you take determines the extent of lost space. Clips and channel w/ DD and GG will only cost you a few inches per surface (depending on the clips/channel chosen) while the 'room within room' approach will cost you a great deal more (but IMO is the most effective method). There is also an in between approach which consists of staggered studs.
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post #742 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 08:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gworrel View Post
I built a frame out of 1x2s. I was initially going to use landscape fabric for the support shelves but I wasn't happy with the sagging, so I used a couple of 1x2s to support the fiberglass. I used plastic covered fiberglass which is nicer to work with and the plastic has minimal or no effect on the sound absorption. I then stapled landscape fabric over the frame to black it out and further enclose the fiberglass. You might want to test the landscape fabric for flammability if you are concerned about such things. Some have reported it to be very flammable. I tested what I had and it would only melt if a flame was held to it. As soon as I removed the flame, it went out.

I also made a corner bass trap for the left side the same way and left the frame free standing so I could move it to get to my main water and gas valves if ever needed. I also used rockwool on the bare basement floor because the rockwool is more resistant to water damage and moisture.

A work in progress pic (it's a mess)
So many great suggestions - thanks Worrel!

Your speaker setup is awesome!!
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post #743 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 08:25 AM
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I'm comfortable with landscaper fabric mounted between OC703/705 and GOM, I'm not comfortable hanging landscape fabric over loose fill fiberglass. I've done a flame test of the landscape fabric mounted in position as it would be on a wall panel and hanging in free space. It is an eye opener. A client couldn't let go of the piece of fabric fast enough and burned his fingers. Use a dark fire rated fabric like FR701 for safety.

When it is sandwiched between OC705 and GOM it would not sustain a flame.
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post #744 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 09:21 AM
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Hi Meister!

This is a loaded question you ask. I am no authority (but there are a few that frequent my build thread who may chime in) but heres what I have learned:

You are going to lose some room width if you take 'soundproofing' seriously. Soundproofing requires isolation and mass on the walls/ceilings, far exceeding typical residential construction, and these requirements will cost you room width/height. The approach you take determines the extent of lost space. Clips and channel w/ DD and GG will only cost you a few inches per surface (depending on the clips/channel chosen) while the 'room within room' approach will cost you a great deal more (but IMO is the most effective method). There is also an in between approach which consists of staggered studs.

Thanks for the quick response. I think have read this forum and others from A-Z digesting as much information as I can as I prepare to start my home theater build (will post separately).

Many, myself included, end of compromising in some areas to obtain a functional area for movie night. And that is why I love forums like this, many others skyway more experience offering suggestions to others to reach the right balance. I swear, this is like a research project that I have done for any of my graduate degrees.

I am personally leaning on mixing some ideas from BIg in DC with my project build.
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post #745 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post
I'm comfortable with landscaper fabric mounted between OC703/705 and GOM, I'm not comfortable hanging landscape fabric over loose fill fiberglass. I've done a flame test of the landscape fabric mounted in position as it would be on a wall panel and hanging in free space. It is an eye opener. A client couldn't let go of the piece of fabric fast enough and burned his fingers. Use a dark fire rated fabric like FR701 for safety.

When it is sandwiched between OC705 and GOM it would not sustain a flame.
Good to know - my plans will be changed accordingly.
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post #746 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Look at the large holes around my mains created by the sub array and the side walls. I've been told this is a recipe for reflections and is to be avoided.

Since I can't avoid it, how to mitigate this?

Just stack pink fluffy on ground from floor to ceiling?

@LTD02 posted this in @waterboy build thread. Does something like this make sense for my situation?



Since you already treated the front wall with Linacoustic, isn't that enough? Seems to me that if you stuff pink fluffy all around the main speakers, then there was no point in the Linacoustic. Plus, if your intent was to follow the recommendation of 2 layers of 1" Linacoustic with a 3-6mil plastic sheet between, then you have totally defeated that and made the front of the room much more dead.
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post #747 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post
I'm comfortable with landscaper fabric mounted between OC703/705 and GOM, I'm not comfortable hanging landscape fabric over loose fill fiberglass. I've done a flame test of the landscape fabric mounted in position as it would be on a wall panel and hanging in free space. It is an eye opener. A client couldn't let go of the piece of fabric fast enough and burned his fingers. Use a dark fire rated fabric like FR701 for safety.

When it is sandwiched between OC705 and GOM it would not sustain a flame.
Apparently not all landscape fabric is the same. I saw a post about that some time ago, so I tested 2 different rolls of landscape fabric I had, and neither one would burn. I could get it to melt when I held a flame to it, but as soon as the flame was removed, the fabric stopped burning. I had no problem holding it in my hand, applying a flame, then removing the flame. YMMV. One roll I bought at Costco, the other at Menards.
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post #748 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by ddigler View Post
Thx Fatty - I already have 1-2" tk Linacoustic wrapping those walls. You suggest more than that? As @PTAaron mentioned, should I be using pink fluffy?
I should mention that I'm going the "pink fluffy" route mostly for budget reasons vs lining the wall with linacoustic.
Discussion about my front wall is right here if you're curious - it's no where near as nice as what you've got going on but its my plan: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-gen...l#post46683449
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-Aaron
English Way Cinema and Bar - moving on to v3.0... projector time in 2017!
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post #749 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by analogmeister View Post
Thanks for the quick response. I think have read this forum and others from A-Z digesting as much information as I can as I prepare to start my home theater build (will post separately).

Many, myself included, end of compromising in some areas to obtain a functional area for movie night. And that is why I love forums like this, many others skyway more experience offering suggestions to others to reach the right balance. I swear, this is like a research project that I have done for any of my graduate degrees.

I am personally leaning on mixing some ideas from BIg in DC with my project build.
@BIGmouthinDC is a WEALTH of knowledge and a good dude. His expertise has helped me a great deal during the course of my HT build.

Oh absolutely; compromises are commonplace when building a HT. I made lots of them thats for sure. All in all though I'm happy with the way its turning out which is what matters

Totally agree - everyone talks about the hours involved actually building (if your diy some of the project). On the other hand I don't see many people talking about the time required to RESEARCH! That is a huge time investment IMO. I suppose for one who pays someone to fully design/draw the project its considerably less...
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post #750 of 1353 Old 10-28-2016, 10:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by VTstang View Post
Since you already treated the front wall with Linacoustic, isn't that enough?
its a great question. Thoughts from those more experienced?

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Originally Posted by VTstang View Post
Seems to me that if you stuff pink fluffy all around the main speakers, then there was no point in the Linacoustic. Plus, if your intent was to follow the recommendation of 2 layers of 1" Linacoustic with a 3-6mil plastic sheet between, then you have totally defeated that and made the front of the room much more dead.
not sure Stang; thanks for the thoughts! I must defer to someone who knows more...

My understanding is that the large 'holes' around the main speakers created by the subs and the sidewalls complicate matters. This is why people spend time and $ on building baffle walls (to completely eliminate those areas around the speakers).
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