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post #241 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 06:29 PM
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The reason I asked about individual platforms is I was wondering if there would be a way to control them individually to suit different tastes in TR sensation. I'm pretty sure some in my family (and perhaps visitors) won't like the full throttle sensation but might be fine with it dialed down a bit. I'm not an electronics kind of guy but this doesn't seem like it should be too terribly hard. I realize 6 separate amps would work but that is not the solution I am hoping for.

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post #242 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brazensol View Post
The reason I asked about individual platforms is I was wondering if there would be a way to control them individually to suit different tastes in TR sensation. I'm pretty sure some in my family (and perhaps visitors) won't like the full throttle sensation but might be fine with it dialed down a bit. I'm not an electronics kind of guy but this doesn't seem like it should be too terribly hard. I realize 6 separate amps would work but that is not the solution I am hoping for.
miniDSP HD
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8hz ULF TR for the masses and the Cashless. Like a BOSS


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post #243 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 06:33 PM
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Well these showed up way faster than I anticipated, guess I better buy those hemispherical pads. Hopefully I can knock out the rest this weekend.
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post #244 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brazensol View Post
The reason I asked about individual platforms is I was wondering if there would be a way to control them individually to suit different tastes in TR sensation. I'm pretty sure some in my family (and perhaps visitors) won't like the full throttle sensation but might be fine with it dialed down a bit. I'm not an electronics kind of guy but this doesn't seem like it should be too terribly hard. I realize 6 separate amps would work but that is not the solution I am hoping for.
brazensol.....Absolutely, now I know where you're coming from! For the seats that folks won't want much TR, simply get stiffer isolators and put them under those platforms. Something like these linked below kill the TR real fast based on my experiments.....another awesome feature of the BOSS!

Stiffer isolator that attenuates BOSS TR:

https://www.amazon.com/Red-Hound-Aut...r=8-3-fkmrnull
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post #245 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Well these showed up way faster than I anticipated, guess I better buy those hemispherical pads. Hopefully I can knock out the rest this weekend.
Sweet! Won't be long and you'll be enjoying ULF and TR you never thought possible in your theater!
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post #246 of 4074 Old 03-12-2019, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla Killa View Post
miniDSP HD
Or this new option from PE:
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton...audio--230-500
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post #247 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 05:14 AM
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Having a hard time finding an amp that isn't 250-300, would the below work? I have a minidsp2x4HD already to do any DSP work...

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002UL0XH2..._t5_B011JNVIYI
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post #248 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 05:41 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^^ dgrizzard.....remind me, how many JBL's are you going to have in your BOSS? Reason I'm asking, trying to figure out how they will be wired for impedance load before I answer your question.
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post #249 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 05:51 AM
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Originally Posted by trhought View Post
^^^^ dgrizzard.....remind me, how many JBL's are you going to have in your BOSS? Reason I'm asking, trying to figure out how they will be wired for impedance load before I answer your question.
I was going to do 2x12" in series.

Also, one more question - I have a dip between 30-38hz in my room do you think the BOSS is something that could fill that in? I currently have dual subs, but due to reasons I only want to place them in certain spots. I'm willing to go to triple or quad subs, just thinking this might cover that issue as well.
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post #250 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 05:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla Killa View Post
miniDSP HD
Or this new option from PE:
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton...audio--230-500
Michael
Just to be clear and not create any confusion for brazensol or anyone else considering user-adjustable TR. A mini-DSP or the Dayton Audio variant won't be needed for your setup. Simply change the isolators to effect the TR for each BOSS platform. The softer ones i linked to in Post 29 were optimum for delivering comfortable TR.

Basically, TR is directly related to isolator hardness, The isolators I linked to a couple posts above still provide some TR just not as much because they are stiffer.

Conversely, the softer the isolators, the more TR. So, if you really want to get crazy with TR, take the isolators in Post 29 and place those in series (on top of each other) which effectively cuts the spring rate in half.....you probably won't like this much TR, but it's something to try if interested.
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post #251 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 07:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgrizzard View Post
I was going to do 2x12" in series.

Also, one more question - I have a dip between 30-38hz in my room do you think the BOSS is something that could fill that in? I currently have dual subs, but due to reasons I only want to place them in certain spots. I'm willing to go to triple or quad subs, just thinking this might cover that issue as well.
Thanks dgrizzard. The BOSS probably won't help much with your dip since it's not providing much SPL due to the open baffle design.

For the amplifier, yes, the amp you linked above will work for your 2 JBL's. Use 1 JBL per channel since it's rated 80 watts per channel RMS into 4 ohms. Or, if it's easier from a wiring perspective for your setup, run the amp in bridged mode and wire the JBL's in series for 8 ohm operation....this way you only need one speaker wire running to the amp instead of 2.
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post #252 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 07:30 AM
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Great, thanks! I will see how it "feels" and probably add a third sub at some point.
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post #253 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by trhought View Post
Simply change the isolators to effect the TR for each BOSS platform.
Sorry, but if I have a choice between upending the chair/platform and replacing isolators depending on who's sitting there or changing a setting on a GUI, GUI wins, especially since that can be done real time "to taste."
As always, YMMV.
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post #254 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 08:19 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^^ good point about DSP. Absolutely, if anyone has DSP already and multiple amplifier channels, it's easier to change TR on the fly electronically if you have all these tools already for each of your platforms. It can certainly be a tweakers paradise if one chooses.

For those seeking the most economical way, or just want to set it and forget it, like I think brazensol was asking for each of his 6-8 platforms, you don't need DSP or separate amplification for each of your BOSS risers. Just simply change the isolators for each seat to tune accordingly. You don't have to change the power to the BOSS, all you have to do is change the response of each BOSS to your liking.

Having said that, I think most everyone will find the isolators in post 29 will provide plentiful and natural feeling TR and ULF. You will be amazed once you feel it.

For those who like to tune and play around, the DSP option is there also....you guys know who you are....lol.
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post #255 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 10:22 AM
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^^^ I kind of like the idea of using DSP because I can then turn off one platform completely if that is what the person sitting there desires (control the seat movement from 100% to 0% if I'm understanding correctly). I'm just not sure how to integrate it into the system. Got some more learning to do.

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post #256 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 11:07 AM
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Provided it’s not an amusement park ride feel, I think a healthy amount of tactile response is natural. There’s a lot of brute force needed to reproduce natural disasters, planes crashing, dinosaur footsteps, explosions, etc. Most people are not used to feeling it because it takes a very capable/ well thought out system to do so. Not to mention if you factor in signal chain roll off, neutered sound on source material, room issues and the list goes on. Once you associate the sounds with the corresponding feel then it all comes together and is more realistic. IMO
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post #257 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 11:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brazensol View Post
^^^ I kind of like the idea of using DSP because I can then turn off one platform completely if that is what the person sitting there desires (control the seat movement from 100% to 0% if I'm understanding correctly). I'm just not sure how to integrate it into the system. Got some more learning to do.
^^^^ Lot of options, just depends on simplicity you seek and your budget. The physical adjustment method using isolators is the most economical way and simplest way for each BOSS platform.

For electronic control, you will need separate amplifier channels for each BOSS platform if that's the path you take. Once you have separate amplifiers, you can sculpt the signal to each BOSS as needed and have more control over them with DSP.

My recommendation would be to get your BOSS platforms setup first, then see if you really want to spend more money on DSP and separate amplification. I think you'll find the experience will be quite pleasant for everyone who sits down to enjoy a movie or music.

I haven't had anyone say, "turn it off" or "it's too much". Quite the opposite....they're instantly drawn into the program material with a look of awe on their faces and words of wonderment. The BOSS delivers a very natural feeling but also with authority. Hard to really describe until you feel it. Maybe it's the authority description that's scaring you, but it shouldn't. It's not as bad as that word might sound....lol.

Now, for yourself, if you want to dabble, yes, a single BOSS platform under your MLP with a separate amplifier and DSP control of that amplifier.....the world is your oyster! Or, if you want to have separate amplification and DSP for maybe 3 or 4 chairs only, the costs start to go up since you'll need a multi-channel amplifier with several separate DSP channels like Michael and Jeff mentioned. The more individual control you want for each seat, the more it will cost and those costs go up exponentially once beyond 4 independent channels.

So many ways to slice it depending on your goals....another idea is to have just 2 separate BOSS platforms. One for your back row with all back row chairs on top and one for the front row with all front row chairs on top. The ones who don't like much TR can sit in the back and the ones who want the full immersion experience can sit in the front. The TR could be controlled either mechanically with the isolator options or electronically through DSP and 2 separate amplifier channels.

Again, I would start with just the standard BOSS formula in post 29 and then decide if you want to customize later. I think you'll be pretty darn happy with that setup as-is. Then if you want to tinker or ask "what-if", you can start to explore other more expensive BOSS setups with individual control of each chair.

You can still build the individual BOSS platforms for each chair now and not sacrifice the BOSS experience at all. That way you'll have the flexibility down the road for custom TR later if you want to add more individual amplifiers and individual DSP for each of those chairs.

Hope some of this feedback helps.
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post #258 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 11:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpmbc View Post
Provided it’s not an amusement park ride feel, I think a healthy amount of tactile response is natural. There’s a lot of brute force needed to reproduce natural disasters, planes crashing, dinosaur footsteps, explosions, etc. Most people are not used to feeling it because it takes a very capable/ well thought out system to do so. Not to mention if you factor in signal chain roll off, neutered sound on source material, room issues and the list goes on. Once you associate the sounds with the corresponding feel then it all comes together and is more realistic. IMO
That's a great point gpmbc and probably why I haven't gotten any complaints from anyone that the TR is too much! @brazensol this is probably why it would be best to start with the standard BOSS formula and see if anyone objects to having too much TR first before exploring other more expensive BOSS power and DSP options.

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post #259 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 12:01 PM
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Tim - Wow - looks great! Strong work there!

I'm sure that it is here somewhere but I'm not seeing what amp you are using for your setup of 6 JBLs? You need at least 500 watts correct? Recommendations?

Thanks!
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post #260 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
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^^^^^ Mike. Thanks! The power is from a hand assembled amp my dad gave me this past summer. It's about 450W into 6 ohms load with the 6 JBL's.

For the money, it's hard to beat the Behringer 1000 amps with DSP. With those amps you can dial in the power at 80 watts per driver once you enter the impedance into the DSP settings. Just make sure to get the DSP version of the Behringers so you can the control power to 80 watts max. They sell DSP models and non-DSP models.
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post #261 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 12:56 PM
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^^^^^ Mike. Thanks! The power is from a hand assembled amp my dad gave me this past summer. It's about 450W into 6 ohms load with the 6 JBL's.

For the money, it's hard to beat the Behringer 1000 amps with DSP. With those amps you can dial in the power at 80 watts per driver once you enter the impedance into the DSP settings. Just make sure to get the DSP version of the Behringers so you can the control power to 80 watts max. They sell DSP models and non-DSP models.
Great - thanks Tim! I'll take a look
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post #262 of 4074 Old 03-13-2019, 05:07 PM
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^^^ I kind of like the idea of using DSP because I can then turn off one platform completely if that is what the person sitting there desires (control the seat movement from 100% to 0% if I'm understanding correctly). I'm just not sure how to integrate it into the system. Got some more learning to do.
All you have to do is mute the channel coming out of the dsp your using for that seat, you can also turn it down a little or a lot depending individual tastes for each channel. Easy enough
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post #263 of 4074 Old 03-14-2019, 04:16 AM
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Ok, heres some objective data and response from someone up on measuring TR. If you had plans this weekend, change them. This shows what Tim has known for a while, and what I found out over the weekend.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...thread-67.html

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post #264 of 4074 Old 03-14-2019, 09:20 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^^ LOL. Love that GIF!

Any techies who want to know more about the ins and outs of BOSS riser TR and ULF responses, follow along using the link Gorilla Killa posted above. I'm sure there's gonna be a whole lot of other experiments and tweaking that come out in that thread if interested in following along.

For those who just want to experience what a BOSS is all about, go to post 29 and follow those instructions. Let me know if you have any questions about your own BOSS here in this thread.

Most of all.....enjoy your newfound BOSS ULF and TR!
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post #265 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 05:56 AM
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theater seats arriving ~10 days and all my BOSS stuff has been ordered, can't wait to try it out.
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post #266 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 08:41 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^^^ Awesome dgrizzard.....can't wait to see your BOSS build and hear your impressions!
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post #267 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
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For all you BOSS fans out there......member @Chris Young just retrofitted his BOSS platform with Buttkickers. He describes the experience as quite natural but violent when it should be. Makes a lot of sense, as the BOSS is providing a solid bed of singe digit ULF and TR and the Buttkickers "kick" in at higher volume levels and frequencies....pretty awesome!

If interested in his "Earthquake Series" BOSS, check out his thread below.

Pretty cool to see the BOSS platform ideas starting to flow now!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-ge...theater-3.html
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post #268 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 09:06 AM
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@trhought - i am so intrigued by the BOSS; I want it! Thanks for developing and sharing your ideas for what, to me, is one of the most intriguing designs I have seen to bring TR to a HT!

Problem is I don't know if I have room under my reclining seats for the drivers. See below. I really want to build this thing. Suggestions, thoughts? I will pull any measurements from my seats if that helps?

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post #269 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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ddigler.....Thanks for the picture. There's several members who have a similar dilemma and are trying a BOSS platform with the drivers directly behind the seats. Imagine my BOSS platform with the footrest in the front. Instead of that footrest in the front, imagine that being a ledge on the back of the BOSS platform. Mount the JBL's on that ledge instead of under your seats....member gpmbc is going to do this....just check for his posts above.

If you don't have the room behind your seats, you can start to make the BOSS platform thicker which will reduce the height of the JBL's sticking out of the top of the BOSS platform.....member Gorilla Killa posted some pics above where he fit an 18" sub under his chair using this method. This will make the BOSS platform a bit higher, but hopefully not too high for your theater setup and sight lines.

Hope this helps give you some other ideas.

I think the first good step, at least for me, was to buy one of the JBL's and place it under your chair to see if it will fit OK...you may find it fits just fine. If it doesn't fit OK under your recliner, just measure how thick you need to make the platform.

Do this by standing behind your recliner and tilting the chair upward. Place the JBL underneath where it looks like it will fit. Slowly lower the chair until it hits the JBL magnet or basket. Once it hits, measure the distance from the leg of the chair to the floor. That's how thick you'll need to make your BOSS riser so the JBL's fit underneath the recliner.

Hope this makes sense.
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post #270 of 4074 Old 03-15-2019, 10:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Public Service Announcement

PSA: These JBL's are on sale right now at Best Buy for $29.99.....the GX1200's. Get 'em while you can!
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