AT (Acoustically Transparent) Theater build thread - Page 26 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #751 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 04:47 AM
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For the fixtures already in place use smart light bulbs, just leave the circuit turned on. Wayfair has an assortment of battery powered sconce lights some with remote switches. Some have dimming capability. I have no experience just know how to Google
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post #752 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 08:10 AM
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That would have been easy but per the attached diagram earlier provided it says to anchor the blocks first before setting in place. Perhaps I misinterpreted. Regardless the end result is good. So I am not going to sweat having wasted a little bit extra time on this one step unless you would recommend taking it down and redoing it by using the nail from the bottom. I can do it and is not a big deal. Just wondering if I should do it. Let me know.
It would be redundant to redo if the assembly is firm and correctly placed. It seems to be.

Going forward, anytime you think you can see that there is a better, more practical way that what seems to be presented...simply ask about it before moving ahead. Little things can be changed before the die is cast....not so much after the fact.

In my rush to get that Drawing out to you as requested, I just left a couple words out and / or misplaced and that was all it took. My original plan was for you to put those blocks onto the section of Top Plate before it was set into place, such as @PreciseD mentioned, which would have also made screwing into the same blocks from underneath very obvious... but again...you just moved a bit faster than any correction or restatement and got the Top Plate up before it was actually needed. (Wall uprights first....remember?) I knew you had the Kreg...and when you told me you had mounted the Top Plate, it just never occurred to me you'd put the pocket holes into the Blocks 1st but put the bottom Plate assembly next. Again...not an issue as everything seems to have worked out...so let's "let it go"


On another front..........

Now I see you bringing up the forward Can lights again when that too has been talked about...a lot, and a readily done, easy solution has already been discussed. That sort of re-discussion is what leads to more indecision when none is needed.

As I have stated before, by simply installing lower wattage Halogen Floods and Wall Wash Can Lens in the Front Cans, Lenses that direct the light toward the rear and away from the screen...and installing Spots in the remaining Cans, you can use a Lutron Maestro IR-RF controlled Dimmer and pretty much make the room illumination be whatever is called for.

Low Voltage Smart Lamps and specialty Dimmers are not inexpensive, and limited in really effective Lumen output. Also, Low Lumen Low Voltage Spots are both rare and more so, just do not come in lamp "Neck" sizes that work with those oversized 6" Cans. Using Halogens eliminates the concerns of Size, availability and expense.


I'm not sure why anytime you have another question you seem to worry that you'll be required to "rip out" or take down existing work. I suppose it's just unfamiliarity with doing things and thinking of the right solutions (...or asking for them...) and then doing. Yeah...that one section of Top Plate needed adjusting, but you made it through that with flying colors after asking for advice. That is the proper sequence.


Now we are heading into the Home Stretch. Don't wander out of your lane. Don't stumble and loose your footing. Just put those Blinders on...follow your lead and listen to the Jockey's instructions. Please, don't think he's on your back....he's just got your back. This last stage is both important and will be pretty straightforward if you ask 1st and then stick to a given plan as given.
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post #753 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 08:26 AM - Thread Starter
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It would be redundant to redo if the assembly is firm and correctly placed. It seems to be.

Going forward, anytime you think you can see that there is a better, more practical way that what seems to be presented...simply ask about it before moving ahead. Little things can be changed before the die is cast....not so much after the fact.

In my rush to get that Drawing out to you as requested, I just left a couple words out and / or misplaced and that was all it took. My original plan was for you to put those blocks onto the section of Top Plate before it was set into place, such as @PreciseD mentioned, which would have also made screwing into the same blocks from underneath very obvious... but again...you just moved a bit faster than any correction or restatement and got the Top Plate up before it was actually needed. (Wall uprights first....remember?) I knew you had the Kreg...and when you told me you had mounted the Top Plate, it just never occurred to me you'd put the pocket holes into the Blocks 1st but put the bottom Plate assembly next. Again...not an issue as everything seems to have worked out...so let's "let it go"


On another front..........

Now I see you bringing up the forward Can lights again when that too has been talked about...a lot, and a readily done, easy solution has already been discussed. That sort of re-discussion is what leads to more indecision when none is needed.

As I have stated before, by simply installing lower wattage Halogen Floods and Wall Wash Can Lens in the Front Cans, Lenses that direct the light toward the rear and away from the screen...and installing Spots in the remaining Cans, you can use a Lutron Maestro IR-RF controlled Dimmer and pretty much make the room illumination be whatever is called for.

Low Voltage Smart Lamps and specialty Dimmers are not inexpensive, and limited in really effective Lumen output. Also, Low Lumen Low Voltage Spots are both rare and more so, just do not come in lamp "Neck" sizes that work with those oversized 6" Cans. Using Halogens eliminates the concerns of Size, availability and expense.


I'm not sure why anytime you have another question you seem to worry that you'll be required to "rip out" or take down existing work. I suppose it's just unfamiliarity with doing things and thinking of the right solutions (...or asking for them...) and then doing. Yeah...that one section of Top Plate needed adjusting, but you made it through that with flying colors after asking for advice. That is the proper sequence.


Now we are heading into the Home Stretch. Don't wander out of your lane. Don't stumble and loose your footing. Just put those Blinders on...follow your lead and listen to the Jockey's instructions. Please, don't think he's on your back....he's just got your back. This last stage is both important and will be pretty straightforward if you ask 1st and then stick to a given plan as given.
Hi Maurice - my question was about adding additional wall sconces. I already have your information for modifying the cans. This is something different I am asking about adding additional wall sconces.

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post #754 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 09:28 AM
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Hi Maurice - my question was about adding additional wall sconces. I already have your information for modifying the cans. This is something different I am asking about adding additional wall sconces.

That Train has left the Station.


Low Voltage Sconces are not really all that effective as light sources...you only paying for "appearances". Also, a lot of people opt to install Sconces and then find they are only good for when there is no production being seen...because just being a "Sconce" does not mean it is suitable for use in a Theater.

If any decent and appropriately designed Sconce is used, it should NEVER allow for light to come into the generalized seating / viewing area. Light is directed only upwards and downwards...or only one or the other. The face of such Sconces may have decorative stencils, of greatly muted colors via Stained Glass or Plastic Gels. They are supposed to be decorative...not utilitarian in nature. Otherwise, they...like the Forward Cans without proper Lenses.....will have to be "off" far more than on, and that would equate to being a waste.

So now let's assume the Sconce Tick is firmly embedded in your ear. To make it work at this late date, both a combination of Battery / Low voltage would be required, along with a absolutely necessary focus on design and light distribution. And then there is the additional cost.

Space any such considerations until after everything is in place and you've had the opportunity to evaluate things. You have lots more important things on your plate right now than anything that can be construed as being an "anytime" Add-On.

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post #755 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 09:33 AM - Thread Starter
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That Train has left the Station.


Low Voltage Sconces are not really all that effective as light sources...you only paying for "appearances". Also, a lot of people opt to install Sconces and then find they are only good for when there is no production being seen...because just being a "Sconce" does not mean it is suitable for use in a Theater.


If any decent and appropriately designed Sconce is used, it should NEVER allow for light to come into the generalized seating / viewing area. They are supposed to be decorative...not utilitarian in nature. Otherwise, they...like the Forward Cans without proper Lenses.....will have to be "off" far more than on, and that would equate to being a waste.


So now let's assume the Sconce Tick is firmly embedded in your ear. To make it work at this late date, both a combination of Battery / Low voltage would be required, along with a absolutely necessary focus on design and light distribution. And then there is the additional cost.


Space any such considerations until after everything is in place and you've had the opportunity to evaluate things. You have lots more important things on your plate right now than anything that can be construed as being an "anytime" Add-On.
Ok. Will hold off on sconces and just focus on finishing up the theater.

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post #756 of 998 Old 11-18-2019, 10:14 PM - Thread Starter
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If you look at the left side there is a gap at the top where I don't have the frame. This is because the wall has a wedge. Is this ok? Our fabric panel for the left will likely not be a full rectangle then isn't it? On the right I did not want to rip out the outlets. That's why you don't see a continuous top to bottom.

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Ok. So i guess I have the green light to move forward with the screen build per the diagram here with the only exception being no French cleats. Also just to clarify the external frame needs to be assembled in such a way that the 1 inch faces forward. The vertical supports need to be done the opposite way with the 3 inch facing forward and assembled being flush against the back.

Will panel design be the same?

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post #757 of 998 Old 11-19-2019, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Placed the order for spandex today. 15 yards black to cover screen and double layer for left and right panels and 3 yards white for screen.

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post #758 of 998 Old 11-19-2019, 06:55 PM - Thread Starter
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One important learning that I would advise anyone new starting this is to think 10 times before doing it the way I am doing. What I am doing is certainly extremely stable and extremely good. But it is also something where I have had absolutely no experience in the past and have had to rely on folks here, especially @MississippiMan who has been very helpful and has spent countless hours helping me out. However, he is probably at his wits end dealing with all my simple and stupid questions (and others that might be repetitive). And I feel bad troubling him as well as others with questions that may appear rudimentary to them but are not to me given my lack of experience. The other issue I have had is also when a decision is made and I research further more I come across other information which leads me to question the original decision resulting in more back and forth. If I had any experience doing this I would probably have been able to use my mind to figure out the right from wrong instead of ending up confused. I think I have certainly bitten off more than I can chew. Next time around if I were doing this fresh I would certainly just recommend keeping it simple and going with the minimalist goal post design and silver ticket screen with this kind of more advanced build that I am resorting to be done once you have enough experience under your belt and have done atleast one theater. My frustration levels are through the roof right now with stuff that still needs to be done. I am 70 pct along the way that I cannot call it quits at this time. Caught between a rock and a hard place. Hopefully I can make it through. We will see.

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post #759 of 998 Old 11-19-2019, 09:47 PM
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...Hopefully I can make it through. We will see.

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As you stated ultimately you have no choice but to finish. Having said that I bet when you are done and watching movies with your family you will feel pretty proud of what you have accomplished here, you got this!
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post #760 of 998 Old 11-20-2019, 07:11 AM
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One important learning that I would advise anyone new starting this is to think 10 times before doing it the way I am doing. What I am doing is certainly extremely stable and extremely good. But it is also something where I have had absolutely no experience in the past and have had to rely on folks here, especially @MississippiMan who has been very helpful and has spent countless hours helping me out. However, he is probably at his wits end dealing with all my simple and stupid questions (and others that might be repetitive). And I feel bad troubling him as well as others with questions that may appear rudimentary to them but are not to me given my lack of experience. The other issue I have had is also when a decision is made and I research further more I come across other information which leads me to question the original decision resulting in more back and forth. If I had any experience doing this I would probably have been able to use my mind to figure out the right from wrong instead of ending up confused. I think I have certainly bitten off more than I can chew. Next time around if I were doing this fresh I would certainly just recommend keeping it simple and going with the minimalist goal post design and silver ticket screen with this kind of more advanced build that I am resorting to be done once you have enough experience under your belt and have done at least one theater. My frustration levels are through the roof right now with stuff that still needs to be done. I am 70 pct along the way that I cannot call it quits at this time. Caught between a rock and a hard place. Hopefully I can make it through. We will see.

Beating yourself up because you depended upon others would only be right if you had to coerce them to get their help. You did not.


Absolutely, many...if not most newcomers who aspire to creating a dedicated Theater need advice, and to some degree or another assistance or outright help.


A lot of your past frustration was due to the people around you you had to deal with. And....yes, repeatedly asking the same questions across several threads, especially after having already determined a course is frustrating to those who have been working to get you to your desired destination. But if it was absolutely intolerable, you should better believe people (or certain people) would have voted with their feet (or keyboard). Long ago.



That didn't happen, and you also must realize that when an attempt is made to make you understand that your being redundant or repetitive, only those who care would do so, hoping that such a notice will help things go more smoothly for everyone involved.


Discounting the effort you've expended to get where you are now as not being worth the trouble or effort (...and expense...) when your on the cusp of having exactly what you hoped for instead of a simple make-do isn't just wrong....it speaks against your already well known priorities and desires you've had from the start, and belittles the efforts made by others....so don't go there.


Set your eyes and expectations on what is still to come. It represents a LOT LESS to be concerned about. Narrow your focus ...again, as you've done before when a decision was made, adhered to, and acted upon. Each time you have done so, things have gotten done.


Next up are your Fabric Frames and Speaker Stands.....both being pretty simple and straightforward. Don't fear the Reaper....just yet. He's busy elsewhere.

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post #761 of 998 Old 11-20-2019, 07:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Beating yourself up because you depended upon others would only be right if you had to coerce them to get their help. You did not.


Absolutely, many...if not most newcomers who aspire to creating a dedicated Theater need advice, and to some degree or another assistance or outright help.


A lot of your past frustration was due to the people around you you had to deal with. And....yes, repeatedly asking the same questions across several threads, especially after having already determined a course is frustrating to those who have been working to get you to your desired destination. But if it was absolutely intolerable, you should better believe people (or certain people) would have voted with their feet (or keyboard). Long ago.



That didn't happen, and you also must realize that when an attempt is made to make you understand that your being redundant or repetitive, only those who care would do so, hoping that such a notice will help things go more smoothly for everyone involved.


Discounting the effort you've expended to get where you are now as not being worth the trouble or effort (...and expense...) when your on the cusp of having exactly what you hoped for instead of a simple make-do isn't just wrong....it speaks against your already well known priorities and desires you've had from the start, and belittles the efforts made by others....so don't go there.


Set your eyes and expectations on what is still to come. It represents a LOT LESS to be concerned about. Narrow your focus ...again, as you've done before when a decision was made, adhered to, and acted upon. Each time you have done so, things have gotten done.


Next up are your Fabric Frames and Speaker Stands.....both being pretty simple and straightforward. Don't fear the Reaper....just yet. He's busy elsewhere.
Thank you. Could not have gotten where I am without your support. Really grateful for the same and some gratefulness would have come your way last night if you check your email .

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post #762 of 998 Old 11-20-2019, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Placed the order for 3 yards of sy triple black velvet for the panels at the top and bottom.
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post #763 of 998 Old 11-20-2019, 08:18 AM
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Discounting the effort you've expended to get where you are now as not being worth the trouble or effort (...and expense...) when your on the cusp of having exactly what you hoped for instead of a simple make-do isn't just wrong....it speaks against your already well known priorities and desires you've had from the start, and belittles the efforts made by others....so don't go there.


Set your eyes and expectations on what is still to come. It represents a LOT LESS to be concerned about. Narrow your focus ...again, as you've done before when a decision was made, adhered to, and acted upon. Each time you have done so, things have gotten done.


Next up are your Fabric Frames and Speaker Stands.....both being pretty simple and straightforward. Don't fear the Reaper....just yet. He's busy elsewhere.
Once again I agree with MM. Take a deep breath and focus on getting one thing done. Then another. Move forward step by step and focus on the process and you're going to be fine. All of us that occasionally (or in MM's case often) say things to you or jump on a topic do so because we are rooting for you. We want to see you in your completed theater, watching a movie in awe of what you built. And you're going to get there. Hang in there and it will happen.

I know exactly what you're feeling. Many many times as I'm building a complicated project I reach a point where I'm just over it and don't have the fire to keep going. But at that point what it takes is willpower - forcing yourself to move forward - and the desire will come back. You can do this.
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post #764 of 998 Old 11-20-2019, 08:25 AM
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When you finish up, you'll be a great example of what you can accomplish when you step WAY outside your comfort zone. That's where personal grown happens. You have gained incredibly valuable experience in working on your home and dealing with contractors, as well as a new collection of skills and confidence to deploy on problems in front of you for the rest of your life. Everybody here is pulling for you, and there is no way you will give up now.
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post #765 of 998 Old 11-21-2019, 05:39 PM - Thread Starter
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The chairs are getting delivered tomorrow. This weekend I am going to try building the screen frame and top and bottom panels. If time permits I will wrap spandex on the screen and velvet on the top and bottom panels. Getting into a very difficult stretch. Hopefully I will be able to pull through.

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post #766 of 998 Old 11-22-2019, 09:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Chairs are in.

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Chairs are assembled.

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post #768 of 998 Old 11-22-2019, 07:58 PM
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Chairs are assembled.

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Nice choice! They look great. Happy to help you with the star ceiling when you’re ready for it


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post #769 of 998 Old 11-23-2019, 07:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Nice choice! They look great. Happy to help you with the star ceiling when you’re ready for it


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Thank you. I will take you up on your offer.

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post #770 of 998 Old 11-23-2019, 08:00 PM - Thread Starter
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So today I spent almost the whole day looking for straight 1x3 poplar for the screen and panel build out. I visited three home depot and one Lowe's and finally took something that I think will be sufficient. The only downside is that with so much of running around I did not have the energy for framing.

Instead I wired one electrical outlet that I had earlier run Romex by myself. The electrician had given me a bad attitude earlier and I wanted to do this myself. So I went to harbor freight in the morning and picked up a wire stripping tool. I already have a receptacle tester. I looked up some you tube videos and wired the outlet. Then I installed an inlet on the other side and powered it from a dedicated 20 amp outlet. I plugged in the receptacle tester and it said open ground. So I disconnected and opened up the outlet to find that I had put the ground somewhere else. I rectified it, closed it up and tested again and the receptacle tester showed outlet is good. I then also plugged in my cell phone charger and it started charging. With this I conquered one more DIY skill I did not have earlier.

This entire journey so far has pushed me to uncover and learn things I did not believe I could do. Regardless of how the theater ends up I think it has been a great journey of personal growth.

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post #771 of 998 Old 11-23-2019, 08:55 PM
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you just learned the value of the outlet tester. Another tool worth the price is a non contact voltage detector. When you turn it on stick it somewhere you know there is power and hear it beep then test all the wires you are working with to make sure they won't give you a buzz. It clicks off and on just like clicking a pen.



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post #772 of 998 Old 11-23-2019, 09:15 PM - Thread Starter
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you just learned the value of the outlet tester. Another tool worth the price is a non contact voltage detector. When you turn it on stick it somewhere you know there is power and hear it beep then test all the wires you are working with to make sure they won't give you a buzz. It clicks off and on just like clicking a pen.



Thank you. I have a multimeter. Would it perform almost similar test?

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post #773 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 04:39 AM
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A multi meter needs to make metal to metal contact. This thing beeps when it his held next to an unstripped wire that is live.

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post #774 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 04:42 AM - Thread Starter
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A multi meter needs to make metal to metal contact. This thing beeps when it his held next to an unstripped wire that has current
Got it. Thanks.

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post #775 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 12:44 PM
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As a home automation guy, a non-contact voltage sensor has prevented my death on numerous occasions. Not a complete replacement for a multimeter, but soooo easy to use it is part of my tinkering opsec.
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post #776 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 01:04 PM
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Now that you have experience with the outlet tester, use it. Last year on small job I was helping with a few details and I had the contractor place the power inlet and projector outlet just like you did. And they did it without a complaint. The day came for me to hang the new $5000 projector arrived and I thought to myself maybe I should just check the outlet. Glad I did they had reversed the hot and neutral wires on the back of the inlet. Not sure if that might have damaged the projector or not but I'm glad I checked it. When you ask for something to be done that they don't do often, who knows how it will turn out.
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post #777 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Now that you have experience with the outlet tester, use it. Last year on small job I was helping with a few details and I had the contractor place the power inlet and projector outlet just like you did. And they did it without a complaint. The day came for me to hang the new $5000 projector arrived and I thought to myself maybe I should just check the outlet. Glad I did they had reversed the hot and neutral wires on the back of the inlet. Not sure if that might have damaged the projector or not but I'm glad I checked it. When you ask for something to be done that they don't do often, who knows how it will turn out.
Yes Jeff. Will do. As an aside I did check that a lamp was working when I connected the outlet but will plug in the outlet tester and check as well.

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post #778 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 05:04 PM - Thread Starter
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So today 50 pct of the day was spent in building the screen and 50 pct in rework. See attached pics. When I sat on the chairs to see where the screen would appear I immediately felt it was too high. So I had to spend a lot of time in disassembling the top panel support and moving it down. For the screen we had wanted to put tabbed connection between the main frame and the screen. When I kept the screen on top of the support frame I noticed it was plush with one of the vertical support 2x4 running from bottom plate to top plate but was inside of the other vertical support on the opposite side. So I had to place a furring strip on the left side and wiggle it in to hold. I will now install similar tabs all along both of the sides and the bottom. The same thing I did for the top panel support where I moved it down needs to also be done for the bottom panel support. With the new screen location I will have 40pct of the screen below my eye level. I know the standard is 33pct but we felt it was too high for us. 40pct seems more comfortable.

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post #779 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 05:16 PM
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I like the new lower position particularly for a one row theater.
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post #780 of 998 Old 11-24-2019, 05:38 PM
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I like the new lower position particularly for a one row theater.
Until the lower 1/4 of the screen is blocked by your feet when in full recline...
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