Palace Theater - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 10:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Palace Theater

I suppose every theater needs a name and since I live in a home with someone who thinks she is a queen and a couple more that think they are princesses, I guess the "The Palace Theater" fits perfectly.
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post #2 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
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I know, pics or it didn't happen.
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post #3 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Most of the construction is done, now I am looking for some advice on acoustics.
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post #4 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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I am ready to install my GOM, but want to make sure I get the acoustics in the right place before I cover them.
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post #5 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Also, I needed 5 posts before I could show pictures. The design is nothing new, in my theater design I am used the same method that got me through high school: copying someone else. I have MDF wainscoting and my plan is to put 1" OC 703 in these inserts below the ear level all around the room, and above the ear level put poly batting. The picture will hopefully help.

https://i.imgur.com/QiUmUHD.jpg
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post #6 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
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hopefully is embeds the pictures.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...710434&thumb=1
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...710436&thumb=1

I don't know how to make the pictures larger in the post.

Hopefully someone can tell me if my acoustic treatment plan is OK.
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post #7 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 12:15 PM
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The work you have done looks great. To insert a picture full size open your attachment, right click, copy and paste in a thread. As far as your acoustic treatment plan, 1 inch of absorption below ear level and poly batting above around the room was pretty common 10 years ago and standard in Erskine designs. It will probably solve the problem of overall room echos. I've been in (and helped build) rooms treated that way and they sound great. However today's acoustic designers have moved past that approach and add a mix of reflection and diffusion at the first reflection point so that the room doesn't become too dead collapsing the front sound stage. Additionally some reflection and diffusion is added in the sides and rear corners to improve the surround sound. The norm today is at least 2 inch teatment or more. You haven't mentioned how you intend to treat the front wall or address low frequency room resonances.


Last edited by BIGmouthinDC; 04-15-2020 at 12:32 PM.
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post #8 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 01:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Jeff, thanks for weighing in, you have always been a resource for me. Currently the front wall has 2" linacoustic, I was thinking about adding a thin plastic layer and another layer of 1" linacoustic.

I was thinking the wainscoting and columns would add some reflection points. I have lurked on here long enough to know its a difficult question to answer, but what would you suggest?

Here is what I know:

*ID of the room is 28' x 18'-8"
*Planning for an AT 14'x5' scope screen (curved). In the fall it will just be the Mrs and I left in the house and we would only watch movies. The only exception would be football games when my son comes home on the weekends, planning manual screening for those times.
*Two rows of 4 seats each and a bar at the back
*No light, it will be dark in there.

I have not picked out any equipment.
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post #9 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 01:56 PM - Thread Starter
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I am really old school, I drew this with a pencil and paper. In a previous life this is the way I did it and I still kind of prefer it to CAD for my projects. I didn't have to worry about getting too detailed because I did all the work myself and no one else had to read it. Hopefully this helps.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...710506&thumb=1
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...710508&thumb=1
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post #10 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 02:38 PM
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I assume it is too late now for 2 inch treatments so I will sketch something up, do you have a diagram for the back wall?
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post #11 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 02:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post
I assume it is too late now for 2 inch treatments so I will sketch something up, do you have a diagram for the back wall?
2" is possible, I have 1.5" deep frames now so I could add another piece of plywood to make them 2" thick.

I don't have a diagram for the back but I could put one together, give me a few minutes.
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post #12 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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https://i.imgur.com/sNCa4Ds.jpg

This is the back wall, I highlighted the areas of the back wall that I can place treatments
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post #13 of 28 Old 04-15-2020, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post
I assume it is too late now for 2 inch treatments so I will sketch something up, do you have a diagram for the back wall?
I'm assuming 2" just makes it better? Trying to soak in everything before fully laying out my plan in my "small" space.

@Ignorant , this build looks amazing so far! Can't wait to see how it goes.
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post #14 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 06:56 AM
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my thoughts, others will disagree I'm sure





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post #15 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 06:58 AM
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another project, a little higher than I would like due to the wainscotting.
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post #16 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theedj View Post
I'm assuming 2" just makes it better? Trying to soak in everything before fully laying out my plan in my "small" space.

if one of the objectives of treatment in a home theater is the clarity of dialog look at the difference in absorption effectiveness at the frequencies associated with speech in these two tables, (it is the left two columns)

https://www.bobgolds.com/AbsorptionCoefficients.htm
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post #17 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 08:44 AM
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my thoughts, others will disagree I'm sure
We sure won't Jeff.
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post #18 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 12:12 PM
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just a small detail, anyone doing the FSK tape treatment needs to be mindful that the self adhesive backing on the tape won't last overnight, you need to also use 3M 77 spray adhesive
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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post #19 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 01:10 PM
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Sorry this took so long to get back, I had a problem with my account, I am now (back to) LJT. Long story...

Thanks BIG, I wanted to get some clarifications so I understand what you are recommending.
1. Put OC703 part way up the wall:
a. How high, about 5 or 6 feet?
b. Should I use 2" thick 703?
c. What goes above that, poly batting?

2. For the front wall behind the screen, it has 2" Linacoustic already:
a. should I add a layer of poly sheeting and another layer of 1" Linacoustic?
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post #20 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LJT View Post
1. Put OC703 part way up the wall:
a. How high, about 5 or 6 feet?
b. Should I use 2" thick 703?
c. What goes above that, poly batting?

2. For the front wall behind the screen, it has 2" Linacoustic already:
a. should I add a layer of poly sheeting and another layer of 1" Linacoustic?

Your ears are about 36 and 52 inches off the floor in your plan , you want at least 12 inches above in the back of the room

If you were starting from scratch I would say 2 inches, but you have a lot of materials and time invested in 1 inch, if they had 1 1/2 inch that would fit your frames I would use that I don't know if you can find two layers of something that would be 1 1/2. As I mentioned earlier 10 years ago 1 inch was prevalent and the rooms sounded good. If you can make 2 inches look good with what you have done already do it.

Above the 703 You can do poly or do 703 covered with construction paper. Some projects just leave it bare hidden by fabric.

Front wall yes add the poly and another layer or remove one layer add the poly and replace. your call.

Acoustic treatments are not a precise science, if you asked 10 designers you would get 10 different plans, a few guys experiment by putting up different treatments and moving them around until they like the result. You are looking for Clarity of dialog, spaciousness of the apparent room. Close your eyes and a live recording in a jazz club should sound like it was recorded in a room bigger than your theater. Envelopment of the surround sound, it should sound all around you not just sound out of the specific speaker locations.

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post #21 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 02:10 PM
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Thanks Jeff, you are are a huge help. This should keep me going for a while.

My dilemma now is a screen. I have an AT SMX screen still rolled up in the box from when Ruben sold them 13 years ago, should I hang it up and use it, or donate it to the Smithsonian and get something better?

After that my next two decisions will be lighting control, and speakers.

I am trying to decide if I get the SVS Prime Towers or go with the DIY Sound Group 1099's
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post #22 of 28 Old 04-16-2020, 02:49 PM
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I'm proudly flying the SMX flag in my castle. Lighting it up with a sharp as a tack Planar 8150 DLP projector. No plans to upgrade until it dies. I've placed some newer material samples up next to it and nothing has motivated me to change. If yours is the right size use it, The frame will last forever. If you want to upgrade fabric that is very possible given the SMX fabric attachment design. You can get off the roll fabric from SeymourAV, Severtson, AVS and others.
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post #23 of 28 Old 04-17-2020, 06:42 AM
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Can someone explain what the linacoustic is used for / how it's implemented?
I looked it up and it looks like duct liner?

Was wondering to learn a little more about it's implementation and what you guys are doing here.
I'm still in final framing stages of my build and looking at any and all methods people are using in the beginning stages
(obviously easier to implement now than later once we're sealed up!)

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post #24 of 28 Old 04-17-2020, 06:59 AM
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Linacoustic is compressed fiberglass insulation with a coated side to resist the fibers from becoming airborne with the passing of air inside a HVAC duct. It's original purpose was to line metal ducts to reduce fan noise into a room and to reduce room to room transfer of sound. In my area DC a lot of office designers specify the use of duct liner to reduce the chance of eavesdropping from room to room.

Now for theater rooms it was found that a plain drywalled room sounds pretty bad with uncontrolled echos. Various materials have been used for acoustic treatments to tame echos and it was found that Linacoustic worked pretty well. Since it has the coating it is ideal for in room use as the fibers are contained. As far as what treatments should go where, that is another conversation. and you may want to plow through the sticky thread on the subject or watch and listen to Grimani's two part master class on room acoustics. One thing to keep in mind is not all acoustic treatments are absobers, some are diffusers or reflectors.

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post #25 of 28 Old 04-17-2020, 08:42 AM
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Ah, i see. I thought you were all using this to almost line an entire bottom 3-4ft of the entire theater.
i know a lot of DIY acoustic panels i've seen instructions for have been using roxul, so is it you guys are just using this instead for that purpose? (and suggesting 2 in vs 1 in)

Once my theater is done i was going to start putting some panels in where needed, absorption at the 1st reflection point.
i've heard diffuses at the sides of the listening area have been good to create a wider feeling theater for small spaces.

i still need to look more into the front and back wall and bass traps, but this is all well down the line.

since i do have metal duct that's gonna be in a soffit in my theater is this something i should consider inside the duct?
and is this recommended instead of roxul for DIY acoustic panels?

i learn so much from these threads and i love following the builds and seeing all the different details and ideas people have been incorporating!!!!

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post #26 of 28 Old 06-22-2020, 03:37 PM
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When I was picking out "Black" for the stage carpet, this stuff looked like a black hole in the showroom, but now that it's installed, it looks grey next to my wall color. The picture makes the contrast look worse, but it is still noticeable. This was my first attempt at laying carpet and I think the installation turned out pretty good.

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post #27 of 28 Old 06-22-2020, 04:50 PM
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Big thanks to Big (Jeff Parkinson) for helping me to get this far. In case anyone was wondering, the insulation on the walls is an OC703 equivalent made by Knauf. We buy Knauf soundliner by the truckload (yes, literally) from the factory so I asked the rep about it and he put some on the next truck for me. The bonus is that it is a little darker and it doesn't show the GOM like the OC703 yellow.

Now I need to get my equipment and I am completely lost.

The only thing I am certain of is my subs. I am currently building two mini-marty subs with the Dalton UM18-22 Drivers and the Behringer NX6000D Amplifier.

I want to order the 1099's for the LCR's and three sets HT-8's for the two sets of side surrounds and the set of rears, but ll of them have been out of stock for a long time.

I am looking for recommendations for a projector and a receiver

Projector: I looked at the Epson 5050UB, but for $2,000 more, the JVC NX5 looks pretty good. Can you tell I have no idea?

Reciever. I dont see myself doing Atmos, I will likely sell my place in a few years and i want to use it now, not doing more construction.

Thanks to everyone's help
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post #28 of 28 Old 06-22-2020, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LJT View Post
When I was picking out "Black" for the stage carpet, this stuff looked like a black hole in the showroom, but now that it's installed, it looks grey next to my wall color. The picture makes the contrast look worse, but it is still noticeable. This was my first attempt at laying carpet and I think the installation turned out pretty good.
I'd say it looks really good!! Great job!

My Theater Build - Full Circle Cinema
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