"The Envelope" Home Theatre 2014: Mike R(mtbdudex) DIY 11.3 Audio, 2.35 Scope 130in screen - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 169 Old 09-04-2010, 06:42 AM
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Bathroom looks great. Should help with the appraisal. Good luck on the refi process. I was too contemplating going down the refi route again as my rate is close to 5% and as you stated rates are sub 4%. I have refi'ed in the past but the last time was the most painful for us. Was just a complicated process, the appraiser was a *&^$%# (shorted us on our sq ft. and did not give us credit for work that had been done) and the bank told us our mortgage had been sold prior to us even closing. I'm looking at other options, but it is a hassle (doesn't have to be) so I'll just have to consider all my options.

Good luck.

Regards,

RTROSE

My (slower than molasses) HT build here.
Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
Enjoying my "almost done" theater.
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post #62 of 169 Old 09-05-2010, 03:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RTROSE View Post

Bathroom looks great. Should help with the appraisal. Good luck on the refi process. I was too contemplating going down the refi route again as my rate is close to 5% and as you stated rates are sub 4%. I have refi'ed in the past but the last time was the most painful for us. Was just a complicated process, the appraiser was a *&^$%# (shorted us on our sq ft. and did not give us credit for work that had been done) and the bank told us our mortgage had been sold prior to us even closing. I'm looking at other options, but it is a hassle (doesn't have to be) so I'll just have to consider all my options.

Good luck.

Regards,

RTROSE

Thx RTROSE.
This closes basement and HT version 1, it's done and feels so good to just go down there and "use it".
Planned upgrades:
Version 1.1 will include: acoustic wall treatment in HT room (1st order reflections); Winter 2011
Version 1.2 will include: Install doors instead of open entryway, + mondo bass traps to then manage expected increased bass peaks/nulls; Spring 2012
Version 1.5 3D / PJ / Amp / Speakers / screen upgrade? 2015??


I agree on the re-fi thing, it's crazy, you just "ride the wave" trying to manage your families finance the best method.

Original mortgage: Built our home 2001-2002, move in May-2002. Construction loan converted into conventional loan. 30 yr 6.875%
Re-fi #1 30 yr 5.875% June 2006-ish
Re fi #2 25 yr 4.75% June 2009. very painful, home value dropped yet still above 80/20 rule, I went thru appraisal report with fine tooth comb.
pending Re-fi#3 15 yr 3.75% (and last??)
Being 47 and planning on retiring in 15-ish years, 15 year mortgage fits fine for that as well.
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post #63 of 169 Old 12-23-2010, 08:45 AM - Thread Starter
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After being busy with LIFE, I've got (4) cases of 2" 2' x 4' rigid fiberglass coming to my home shortly, so week of 12/27 I'll be making my DIY acoustic panels and hanging them, taking REW measurments, etc......slowly but surely the HT will get the final things finished......
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post #64 of 169 Old 12-23-2010, 06:47 PM
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I know all to well about being busy with LIFE. I started making pretty good progress in the basement again and lo and behold here comes the holidays and then work gets crazy and the progress slows to a crawl again.

Well my motivation will come in January where not much is going on and it is just to crazy cold outside to do anything. The work to do in the basement will look like a vacation at that point.

Regards,

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post #65 of 169 Old 01-13-2011, 03:40 AM - Thread Starter
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4 day weekend upcoming, hopefully I'll make progress on the acoustic panels for 1st reflections.
Riser is already a Bass trap, and in near future per Dennis E I'll be adding either leftover OC703 ('cause paid for) or OC705 behind the laminate screen.

1st reflection points via software
Side view ---------------------------------------------------- Front view:
.

Initially 3 on LH wall.............................................2 on RH wall (due to opening):
.

For the ceiling I'll hang just cloth wrapped OC703 at 1st reflection points of 1st and 2nd row (2 panels each).

1st Mock-up 2' x 4' panel w/o cloth cover.
1" x 4" pine frame will be stained, just OC703 itself will be wrapped.
There will be 1/2" - 3/4" gap @ back of frame to wall...............................Cutting speaker cloth and wrapping OC703
.

Frontside and backside.
.

Yes, for the frame enclosed panels I plan not to use spray adhesive, just pinned.
At some point in future I'd like to spend a few $'s and have a printed pattern for the panels, this makes that upgrade option easier.

Possible since I've been taking lots of picts with my Canon T1i might be one of my outdoor shots, tbd.
The whole theme of this HT with dark greens and brown ceiling is sorta outdoor/rustic, so appropriate pict might look decent on side panel, possible the Milky Way might be cool also.
.

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post #66 of 169 Old 01-25-2011, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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1 1/2 weeks later progress......
After having the HT "done" for 1 1/2 years (or more...), I've finally started to tackle the RT60 and first reflection issues.
Even Audyessy can't handle just drywall walls/ceiling....
Side acoustic DIY panels made past 2 weeks spare time, installed and calibrated tonight.
I've got a ceiling "acoustic cloud" to make/hang, then corner bass traps. Fun stuff.

Even w/o the ceiling treatments after I re-ran Audyessy I could tell the increased clarity, separation, and spaciousness.
Why'd I wait so long to do this??
As Audyessy ran thru each speaker with its 3 pings, sitting in the front row I could tell the side wall treatments dampened the reflections while the ceiling did not - and how "bright" and muddied it sounded when not dampened (absorbed).

For RH side made and installed (2) 2' x '4 acoustic panels.


For LH side made and installed (3) 2' x 4' acoustic panels, going to make and install a 4th this upcoming weekend.
The mirror revealed the 2nd row outboard seat "saw"part of the center speaker and the frt RH also.


I've maintained symmetry in RH/LH placement, and the RH 6' opening acts as is own absorber for 1st reflection, so adding the 3rd and 4th on the LH side maintain symmetry.

Those boxes hold OC703 which I'll use to make the "acoustic ceiling cloud" and also corner bass traps.
The mic for calibration is shown in 2nd row, 2nd seat position. The "Master" position, I repeat that precisely for each round of measurements.


Plan is Frt RH/Ctr/LH speaker first reflection points will be addressed on the side walls and the ceiling. (Front wall will be addressed also)
Carpeting handled the floor and for back wall I might add some back wall diffusion to keep the room from becoming over dampened, the room measurements I take as add side/ceiling treatment will dictate the back wall treatment....
Might even place some decorations on the back wall, they will act as diffusers and finally I can proudly display some of my sci-fi nit-knacks gathered over 30 years in neat setting.
I'm looking forward to real world experience and more learning acoustics, you read in the various books this and that, but finally doing something is so much more tangible and ties theory to reality.
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post #67 of 169 Old 02-08-2011, 08:56 AM
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Nice looking theater, and I really like the house!

When I first saw the picture of your house I thought I had driven past it before - there is a similar log style house in Brighton heading west out of town. My parents live over by Oak Pointe, so I drive by going to see them... but I saw that you are closer to Hartland.

Did you find a local source for the OC703? I'd like to do some panels for my room at some point in the future, and wasn't sure where to look locally for the materials.

Keep up the good work!

-Aaron
English Way Cinema and Bar - moving on to v3.0... projector time in 2017!
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post #68 of 169 Old 02-08-2011, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by PTAaron

Nice looking theater, and I really like the house!

When I first saw the picture of your house I thought I had driven past it before - there is a similar log style house in Brighton heading west out of town. My parents live over by Oak Pointe, so I drive by going to see them... but I saw that you are closer to Hartland.

Did you find a local source for the OC703? I'd like to do some panels for my room at some point in the future, and wasn't sure where to look locally for the materials.

Keep up the good work!


Thx, the HT its a work in progress, and with winter here I'm trying to get the acoustics done by Feb-end, 3 more weeks...
Our log home built 2001-2002 by M59/US23 area, I know the log home you are refering to, I go by those on my way to Brighton Rec area for MTB riding.

If 2-3 people did a group buy then Home Depot might make sense for OC703/OC705,
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post19956354

but for individual buying ats acosutics is decent price and very convient (I used them)
http://www.atsacoustics.com/cat--DIY...ials--102.html

other online place or local HVAC - they are there I just don't know them, good luck.

[edit]
added acoustic changes for screen

This past weekend continuing with improving the HT acoustics, I put (6) sheets of 2" thick 2' x 4' Roxul Rockboard on my screen to make is a "dead zone" instead of a resonance/reflection zone.
http://www.atsacoustics.com/item--Ro...f-6--RB60.html
Quote: This is a case of 6 pieces of 24 x 48 x 2 inch Rockboard 60 manufactured by Roxul. It is rigid mineral wool board similar to Owens Corning 705 at a density of 6 pounds per cubic foot.


I used Roxul Rockboard instead of OC705 because I am NOT going to cover it, so did not want itchy stuff.

This was on my "to do" list for almost 2 years.....finally did it this weekend.

This is on back of my DIY screen, there is a controlled 3/4" gap to the screen via the metal plates I added for supporting, secured the panels by suspended ceiling 14ga wire.


Final product done and secured, the outside portion has (2) 2" thick 2 ' x 4'pieces fitting, the inside 1 due to screen curve allows more on outside.


It's also with about a 3" air gap to the wall now.




screen hung, btw It's also 50 lbs heavier.....my wife complained I'm "slaving her" with all this heavy lifting.:

(that's my acoustic cloud I'm making just today, i was not there when I did the Audyessy re-run)

I immediately could tell improved bass, I've not taken REW plots yet, but I did re-run my Audyessy and it shows how its EQ is applied, look at the before/after for the center channel!
Yes, I was very careful about having my mic in repeatable positions as well for before/after check..
Before............................................ .......... .After
.

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post #69 of 169 Old 02-08-2011, 04:39 PM
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Well done. Panels look great. Amazing what some actual sound treatments and proper placement can do. Just like having a brand new theater I bet. Enjoy.

Regards,

RTROSE

My (slower than molasses) HT build here.
Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
Enjoying my "almost done" theater.
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post #70 of 169 Old 03-03-2011, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by RTROSE

Well done. Panels look great. Amazing what some actual sound treatments and proper placement can do. Just like having a brand new theater I bet. Enjoy.

Regards,

RTROSE


Agreed on acoustic treatments making day/night difference!
A "free" speaker upgrade.

Update status:
-Added (2) Ceiling Acoustic Clouds for 1st/2nd row seating for Mains LH/Ctr/RH ceiling first reflection.
Currently I'm 12" below the ceiling with 4" depth of OC703.
By the 1/4 wave guideline I should be using 6" depth currently, I've got 6 sheets of OC703 unused, if I don't use them for some limited rear wall absorber (instead of diffuser since 2nd row is quite close to rear wall) then they will go "in the clouds" ..


Rear wall broadband bass treatments finished, details in my signature DIY Acoustic treatments link:


Home Theatre on deck (next 4-6 weeks, sorta in order as shown):
1) Replacing the 20 year old 1st row getto couch with HT seats.
(I'm working thru AVS store and Roman right now on specific Berkline HT seats.)
2) Storage for DVD/Blu-ray beneath the A/V equipment....I was supposed to have this done 1+ year ago..
3) Front wall LH side full floor-ceiling broadband bass trap (24" x 24" x 34
triangle). RH side has IB subwoofer, I might put a triangle bass trap above it, tbd.
4) Rear wall treatment, diffusor vs thin absorber, still studying.

Basement on deck:
1) Install base cabinets, make "L" countertop, make shelfs OR install wall cabinets, tbd. Also, possible make Island or counter extension like option#2 shows.

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post #71 of 169 Old 03-03-2011, 04:37 PM
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I know you called your couch ghetto, however I think my wife an I had a couch just like that or very close to that 20 years ago when we first got married. I loved that couch.

I know the update was for the acoustical treatments, however this is the first time I actually paid attention to your sconces. Very nice, they fit your room very well.

Oh, and the room treatments look very nice as well ;-)

Regards,

RTROSE

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Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
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post #72 of 169 Old 03-30-2011, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by RTROSE

I know you called your couch ghetto, however I think my wife an I had a couch just like that or very close to that 20 years ago when we first got married. I loved that couch.

I know the update was for the acoustical treatments, however this is the first time I actually paid attention to your sconces. Very nice, they fit your room very well.

Oh, and the room treatments look very nice as well ;-)

Regards,

RTROSE


Thx RT, those sconces are from Lowes, when I first got them tried to add more diffusion via paper over the glass.....did not work so well, they are on a dimmer.

We watched "The Fighter" on blu-ray this weekend, and saw the exact same couch/pattern in the younger boxers appt!
(what a great movie, I give it an A+, and I'm not a boxing fan either)

btw, I ordered Berkline 12006's via avs store Roman, here they are installed:
(I'll post a seperate review thread of those vs my 2nd row HT seats vs ones I've tried out in local stores)


I'd also like to do a "plug" for the upcoming meet Nick G and I are organizing, Spring HEMI Meet - Saturday May 14th
Any of you are welcome to join also, please post in the meet thread if you'd like to join, as Nick is using that to organize/announce stuff.


Quote: Originally Posted by NGiovas

Spring HEMI Meet
Hartland, MI
(US23/M59 area)
Saturday, May 14th
5pm - 8pm


Agenda:
  1. Remote Controls
    1. Using your Ipod Touch/Ipad as a remote
    2. Universal/Programmable remote technologies
  2. Acoustic Treatments Discussion (feel free to bring photos, samples, etc.)
  3. Show the group 2-3 photos of your Home Theatre for general discussion/feedback of any HT topics (bring jpeg files on USB stick)
  4. Sub Showdown!!!! (with REW5 running for freq charts)
  5. Demo Disc playback with IB sub + sub showdown winner - how many db's can we get! (2011 CES DTS disc and avs "another demo disc" by scubasteve)
Well, it appears that we have enough interest to plan a Spring HEMI meet!! Special thanks to Mike (mtbdudex) for offering to host the meet! If you are interested in attending, please PM myself and mtbdudex so that we can add you to the list and provide directions.


If you would like to participate in the Sub Showdown, please let us know in advance so that we can make sure we can accomodate your setup at the meet. This is a friendly, fun competition, so please bring a sub regardless of type/size. There will be fun awards for those who participate.

If you have any comments or questions, please feel free to contact us via PM (or post here for others to see).

We hope to see you in May.

Nick

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post #73 of 169 Old 03-30-2011, 09:20 AM
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Great job all the way around! I like the exposed wood on the absorption panels. I was considering doing this as well to break up the boring lines of a solid fabric panel...
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post #74 of 169 Old 05-02-2011, 11:28 AM
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I can't wait for the meetup! I'll have my measurement rig also to compare notes, and I'm super-eager to see waterfall and ETC for this room!
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post #75 of 169 Old 05-27-2011, 05:46 AM
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Mike,

How does that IB array work out being on the right side of the wall only? I've earmarked an IB installation myself (Thinking 4 FiCar 18s) but they will have to be on the left side wall of my theater, where the side wall meets the front wall. I've not listened to an IB arrangement in person and didn't know if there'd be an localization concerns if the arrangment is shifted to one side.

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Theater = Epson 5040UB, Denon S940, Klipsh RF 7.2, 4-FiCar 18" IB, HTMarket Pembrokes, Aura BassShaker
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post #76 of 169 Old 05-27-2011, 06:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aackthpt View Post

I can't wait for the meetup! I'll have my measurement rig also to compare notes, and I'm super-eager to see waterfall and ETC for this room!

John,
I'll post both Monday, driving to wedding now in s carolina (wife driving now actually, I don't text n drive)
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post #77 of 169 Old 05-27-2011, 06:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scubasteve2365 View Post

Mike,

How does that IB array work out being on the right side of the wall only? I've earmarked an IB installation myself (Thinking 4 FiCar 18s) but they will have to be on the left side wall of my theater, where the side wall meets the front wall. I've not listened to an IB arrangement in person and didn't know if there'd be an localization concerns if the arrangment is shifted to one side.

Steve;
John was at the recent hemi meet, so maybe he'll give un-biased feedback.

Monday I'll post freq graphs showing response. I'm 100% satisfied and cannot localize the bass at all.

4 18" drivers should give you plenty of headroom, what size is your ht?
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post #78 of 169 Old 05-27-2011, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

Steve;
John was at the recent hemi meet, so maybe he'll give un-biased feedback.

Monday I'll post freq graphs showing response. I'm 100% satisfied and cannot localize the bass at all.

4 18" drivers should give you plenty of headroom, what size is your ht?

My HT is 17 x 14, on the small side for most around here.

I wasn't thinking 4 18s for the purpose of output, but for the purpose of playing as low as possible with the headroom for tuning towards the flatest response. Mind you, I really havn't dug into all of the research and homework needed for a final design.

"The Scuba Tank" thread here
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Theater = Epson 5040UB, Denon S940, Klipsh RF 7.2, 4-FiCar 18" IB, HTMarket Pembrokes, Aura BassShaker
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post #79 of 169 Old 05-27-2011, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scubasteve2365 View Post


My HT is 17 x 14, on the small side for most around here.

I wasn't thinking 4 18s for the purpose of output, but for the purpose of playing as low as possible with the headroom for tuning towards the flatest response. Mind you, I really havn't dug into all of the research and homework needed for a final design.

Go to the IB cult forum, ask thomasW/chrisb your q's.
Also look at the build gallery there for what others have done.

Have fun with building your IB sub also.
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post #80 of 169 Old 06-18-2011, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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March-May 2011 update on the rec area cabinets...a few hours here and there over weeks.....slow and steady like the turtle...

We like the new Hickory cabinets from Lowes look, but their build quality was sub-par, leaving me to fix some of the cabinets:

Both corner supports on this base cabinet broke off, I had to glue/stregthen them
.

I also had to strengthen this corner cabinet, including added top supports:
.

Installed top cabinets first, then the base cabinets, these are in a "L" config:
Also, added (1) more can light and move the other one for better light distribution.
.

Made the "L" top, this will be laminate with maple hardwood edging.
It's 9 1/2 feet x 4 1/2 feet, so I had to join 2 pieces together.
Also on the edge I doubled up the thickness for the hardwood attachment, and screw down zone.
Top finished, but not attached yet of course, as I need to cement the laminate down and router it on all sides.
Now layout the cuts onto the 5' x 12' Formica, one big piece no seam!
.

This battery trim saw cut fine thru the laminate, I pre-drilled 1/2" dia relief holes at all the corners so no cracking.
.

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post #81 of 169 Old 06-18-2011, 02:23 PM - Thread Starter
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cont...March-May 2011 update on the rec area cabinets...a few hours here and there over weeks.....slow and steady like the turtle...

So, now a big freaking "L" piece of laminate, how the heck will I get this layed down correctly w/o breaking/cracking it and w/o bubbles?

1) I have a great helper, my wife
2) we practice dry run for the process
3) use dowel rods to hold the tacky laminate above the tacky board
4) remove dowel rod 1 at time, use "j" roller to apply pressure


Dry run trial, we practice who leads, who follows, flipping arms over, etc.
Oh, I had to remove the big end cabinet for install of the laminate, it was NOT bolted onto the wall yet I thought might need to remove it.


Well, there were some semi-tense moments, but our practice made the job not so bad.
I clamped the edge down first 30 minutes just as precaution, it stuck immediately.


After dry, router the laminate away, then router the wood edge shaped.
Then, attach the completed top to the base cabinets.

Next, make back and side boards.
The short ones I can lay directly on, but the big 8' piece I used dowel rods.


Also, I used 2 1/2" drywall screws as a jig (temp screwed into workshop floor) to align the Formica to the board long wise.


Ya also gotta attach a thin piece on top, and router that....not hard work but everything takes time...then the 2 exposed edges needs its own small piece as well.

Glued the boards to the walls/cabinet side, finally done just before the big 5/14 HEMI meet.



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post #82 of 169 Old 06-18-2011, 06:37 PM
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Man, that turned out really nice. Well done. I'll have to remember the dowel rod trick and practice runs. Sounds like that is what saved you.

Regards,

RTROSE

My (slower than molasses) HT build here.
Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
Enjoying my "almost done" theater.
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post #83 of 169 Old 06-18-2011, 07:15 PM
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great build!

"The main reason Santa is so jolly is because he knows where all the bad girls live." - George Carlin
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post #84 of 169 Old 06-18-2011, 07:39 PM
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I'm bummed I lost track of this thread and missed the viewing, Hopefully you will remember some of your old mountainbiking buddies

"There are only two ways to live your life.
One is as though nothing is a miracle.
The other is as if everything is." Einstein

 


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post #85 of 169 Old 06-19-2011, 12:59 PM
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nice build, 1 question though did you water proof the shower stall before laying the thin-set on the tiles, just asking as if concrete isn't water proofed you will have a hell of a time with water absorbing through the concrete not to mention mold on to that concrete board, wood and batt insulation when the water soaks through since i didn't see any vapor barrier up what so ever...
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post #86 of 169 Old 06-19-2011, 01:40 PM
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Looks great. What software is that that you are using in post 65 for the reflection points.
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post #87 of 169 Old 06-20-2011, 05:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by RTROSE

Man, that turned out really nice. Well done. I'll have to remember the dowel rod trick and practice runs. Sounds like that is what saved you.

Regards,

RTROSE


It's one thing to read about the dowel trick, but I can attest that in real world that simple method works.

Quote: Originally Posted by wingzz

I'm bummed I lost track of this thread and missed the viewing, Hopefully you will remember some of your old mountainbiking buddies


wingzz - anyone who rides is a friend of mine - keep Spring 2012 in mind I'll host another HEMI meet then, updated screen, other stuff by then, will PM you then dude.

Quote: Originally Posted by mystic_sniper28

nice build, 1 question though did you water proof the shower stall before laying the thin-set on the tiles, just asking as if concrete isn't water proofed you will have a hell of a time with water absorbing through the concrete not to mention mold on to that concrete board, wood and batt insulation when the water soaks through since i didn't see any vapor barrier up what so ever...


Yea - good point, fortunately I did add vapor barrier, pict of it was burried on post #43 , https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post16479510
fwiw, this is 2nd bath I did, 1st one was 12' x 12' master bath in early 2002 when building this home, http://mmrosinski.tripod.com/loghome/id20.html
I read 2 books on bath/tile back then (10 years ago), and online research for that project, which in 2001 was not as nice as today's DIY sites - for picts/etc.



Quote: Originally Posted by stockmonkey2000

Looks great. What software is that that you are using in post 65 for the reflection points.


There is a thread here, it was free downloadable software then the guy took it off the server......
https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=822273
some people have re-posted that for download, check that thread

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post #88 of 169 Old 06-22-2011, 08:44 AM
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Thanks for the info -I'm going to check that out. Looks like a great tool. I'm sure my wife will be glad she does not have to hold mirrors against the wall while I point laser pointers around the room anymore.
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post #89 of 169 Old 06-22-2011, 09:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stockmonkey2000 View Post

Thanks for the info -I'm going to check that out. Looks like a great tool. I'm sure my wife will be glad she does not have to hold mirrors against the wall while I point laser pointers around the room anymore.

Ha, even though I had used that simulation software for first reflections, which I then boxed out on the walls/ceiling with the blue painters tape, I had my wife hold a Lowes $6 1' wide x 4' tall mirror to confirm in each seating position coverage to the speaker mid/tweeter
....while confirming the ceiling RFZ's before I made the acoustic clouds she complained about arm fatigue holding the mirror as I went from seat-seat position and moved my head side-side front/back...I'm such a demanding husband....
Still have that mirror in the basement un-attached.....I might use it for other reflection analysis as further tweaking of surrounds and diffusion.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_33107-13535-...3D2&facetInfo=


My lesson learned: Always re-confirm with the mirror, the ceiling location was slightly off from simulation vs mirror - about 4", possibly I changed some of the speaker layout dimensions, still very accurate simulation it gets you dialed almost perfectly for RFZ.
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post #90 of 169 Old 06-22-2011, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

Steve;
John was at the recent hemi meet, so maybe he'll give un-biased feedback.

Monday I'll post freq graphs showing response. I'm 100% satisfied and cannot localize the bass at all.

4 18" drivers should give you plenty of headroom, what size is your ht?

Sorry I missed this question! I will say one thing about your bass, you have a LOT of it. I'm not ready to say it is either good or bad, as:
1) only material with which I am unfamiliar was played
2) only multichannel material was played (I like to audition with 2 channel material also)
3) levels were significantly different (higher) than I would normally listen (Mike I do recall you noted the same)
4) I only sat in one position in the room

BUT, if you want an actual opinion I'd love to have a listening and acoustical testing session there one day.
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