Discussion - Screens for 3D Projection - Page 12 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #331 of 346 Old 07-27-2016, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post
Actually the JVC's use active 3D. The downside is the horizontal polarization conflicts with current 3D active glasses. You want a screen that retains NO polarization. If it retains polarization the image will be dimmer, due to how the glasses work. Any decent white screen should work fine.

Warren.
That is not the case.. with JVC glasses and JVC projector at least.

JVC's glasses are horizontally polarized, so in order to get the brightest 3D image from the new JVC projectors, one needs a screen that DOES RETAIN polarization and use JVC glasses.

If you are using cheaper 3rd party glasses, which nearly all are vertically polarized, then yes.. you would need a screen that DOES NOT retain polarization.
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post #332 of 346 Old 07-27-2016, 02:52 PM
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I should have imagined that was true. I was thinking he thought it was a passive 3D system.

Found a good chart for Da-Lite screens.
http://www.projectorreviews.com/home...ection-part-2/

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...C&A=details&Q=

1222 is a bit out of the price hoped for, but a good screen is worth it. It will outlive many projectors.

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post #333 of 346 Old 04-28-2017, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpin3r View Post
That is not the case.. with JVC glasses and JVC projector at least.

JVC's glasses are horizontally polarized, so in order to get the brightest 3D image from the new JVC projectors, one needs a screen that DOES RETAIN polarization and use JVC glasses.

If you are using cheaper 3rd party glasses, which nearly all are vertically polarized, then yes.. you would need a screen that DOES NOT retain polarization.
I know this thread is a little old, so I apologize for bringing it back to life again :-)

I just bought a JVC RS420 projector, and I have an Elite CineTension 2 screen. I'm looking to buy 3D glasses for it, and want to confirm what I understood by reading the first several posts, and the post I'm replying to.

In the first post, it said something about the Elite screen had a 1 on the polarization retention, which was around 15-25%.

Based on the post above, it appears that it would be best for me to use vertically polarized glasses. Is that correct?

xbr75x900E and JVC RS420 with Elite 120" screen
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post #334 of 346 Old 04-28-2017, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Sweetmeat View Post
I know this thread is a little old, so I apologize for bringing it back to life again :-)

I just bought a JVC RS420 projector, and I have an Elite CineTension 2 screen. I'm looking to buy 3D glasses for it, and want to confirm what I understood by reading the first several posts, and the post I'm replying to.

In the first post, it said something about the Elite screen had a 1 on the polarization retention, which was around 15-25%.

Based on the post above, it appears that it would be best for me to use vertically polarized glasses. Is that correct?
It will always be best to use JVC glasses that are horizontally polarized with a JVC projector. But as your screen material doesn't retain much of the polarization, you could get by with the cheaper glasses, and not see as much of a drop in brightness vs the JVC glasses. Yes the cheaper glasses will be dimmer than JVC glasses but with your screen I doubt you'd notice it.
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post #335 of 346 Old 04-28-2017, 11:16 AM
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Must the cheaper glasses be vertically polarized to use with my screen?


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xbr75x900E and JVC RS420 with Elite 120" screen
Receiver - Yamaha RX-A3060/RX-A3000, WXA-50 MusicCast Amp for Zone 2
L/C/R - B&W CM9/CMC2, Side - DS3, Rear - CM5, F/R Atmos - CCM663
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post #336 of 346 Old 04-29-2017, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpin3r View Post
Has there been much progress recently in identifying and categorizing screen material based on their ability to retain polarization?

Looking for a screen that retains polarization to pair with my JVS RS500, which utilizes horizontally polarization for its 3D. Brightest and cleanest 3D image is seen with using the JVC glasses and a screen that retains polarization.

Probably looking for something around 1-1.3 gain.. hopefully under $800
In the last few years, I have tried the following screens with high polarisation retention capability :
- XtremScreen Daylight 0.9
- XtremScreen Daylight 1.1 Reference (original version and the current version)
- XtremScreen Daylight 2.0
- Drapper React 3.0 (it's version 3.0, gain is actually 1.0)

All of them can be considered to have very high polarisation retention for active 3D.
Passive 3D is an other story.

All of them can be used for passive 3D but they behave very differently : they all have a very similar polarisation retention in absolute terms (same brightness of the crosstalk for the same source) but the visual result changes dramatically due to the gain difference. The extinction ratio works like a contrast : the brighter the signal image is displayed (due to gain), the lesser the impact of the same amount of crosstalk.

The higher Xtremscreen with 2.0 Gain looks just as good as any good silverscreen with low enough crosstalk for any movie to be perfectly enjoyable. I bought one for my passive 3D setup.
The lower gain screens are barely acceptable for passive 3D. They work... but there are lots of scenes in most movies where crosstalk is very visible and annoys me.
I used the XtremScreen 1.1 for a while, and I'd say this is my tolerance limit for passive crosstalk (it's an amazing screen for 2D or active 3D though).
I would not use the Draper React or Xtremscreen 0.9 for passive 3D.

I can't say about prices. You'll need to ask each manufacturer/reseller for a quote. They tend to be expensive (especially the XtremScreens since they have an excellent reputation and are a market leader in my country)

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)


Last edited by BlackShark; 04-29-2017 at 01:50 PM.
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post #337 of 346 Old 01-14-2018, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackShark View Post
In the last few years, I have tried the following screens with high polarisation retention capability :
- XtremScreen Daylight 0.9
- XtremScreen Daylight 1.1 Reference (original version and the current version)
- XtremScreen Daylight 2.0
- Drapper React 3.0 (it's version 3.0, gain is actually 1.0)

All of them can be considered to have very high polarisation retention for active 3D.
Passive 3D is an other story.

All of them can be used for passive 3D but they behave very differently : they all have a very similar polarisation retention in absolute terms (same brightness of the crosstalk for the same source) but the visual result changes dramatically due to the gain difference. The extinction ratio works like a contrast : the brighter the signal image is displayed (due to gain), the lesser the impact of the same amount of crosstalk.

The higher Xtremscreen with 2.0 Gain looks just as good as any good silverscreen with low enough crosstalk for any movie to be perfectly enjoyable. I bought one for my passive 3D setup.
The lower gain screens are barely acceptable for passive 3D. They work... but there are lots of scenes in most movies where crosstalk is very visible and annoys me.
I used the XtremScreen 1.1 for a while, and I'd say this is my tolerance limit for passive crosstalk (it's an amazing screen for 2D or active 3D though).
I would not use the Draper React or Xtremscreen 0.9 for passive 3D.

I can't say about prices. You'll need to ask each manufacturer/reseller for a quote. They tend to be expensive (especially the XtremScreens since they have an excellent reputation and are a market leader in my country)
I'd like to go with the XPAND X105-RF-X1 for my new JVC DLA-RS 440 projector and from this thread (as well as the 'Consensus best 3D glasses / emitter for JVCs?' thread, I understand that I "would need a screen that DOES NOT retain polarization."

Has anyone tried a STR-169120-WAB with the JVC and XPAND X105-RF-X1 combination with good results?

Thanks!
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post #338 of 346 Old 01-14-2018, 09:32 PM
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You may be able to test your screen with polarized sun glasses. If turning your head sideways 90 degrees results in no additional light loss you may be okay.

I would only order glasses that you can return or exchange just to be safe.
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post #339 of 346 Old 01-15-2018, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daquint View Post
I'd like to go with the XPAND X105-RF-X1 for my new JVC DLA-RS 440 projector and from this thread (as well as the 'Consensus best 3D glasses / emitter for JVCs?' thread, I understand that I "would need a screen that DOES NOT retain polarization."

Has anyone tried a STR-169120-WAB with the JVC and XPAND X105-RF-X1 combination with good results?

Thanks!
It depends on the projector and glasses combination.
I do not know the details from this particular projector and glasses. There are the 3 scenarios :
  • If the projector outputs non-polarized light : the screen characteristics do not matter.
  • If the projector outputs polarized light in the same direction as the glasses : a polarization maintaining screen will be a benefit (brighter image : best case scenario : almost the same brightness in 3D than in 2D)
  • If the projector outputs polarized light in a different direction from the glasses : a polarization maintaining screen will be a drawback (darker image : worst case scenario total black image if wearing the glasses)
Manufacturers don't publish polarization output characteristics, but from users reports JVC's DILA projectors have a reputation for outputting polarized light, however there is no guarantee all models do the same. The base technology of liquid crystals relies on polarization but the end result entirely depends on what type of optics and filters used by the manufacturer in the light path after the LCoS engine.
In order to know the characteristics of this specific projector, you'll need to try one and put a polarizer in the light path (3D glasses, any technology, any brand, some polarized sunglasses, or a photographer's polarized filter) and see what happens.

edit : corrected obvious mistake, JVC projectors do output polarized light (DILA = JVC's brand of LCoS light engine)

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)


Last edited by BlackShark; 01-19-2018 at 12:09 PM.
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post #340 of 346 Old 01-15-2018, 09:26 AM
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JVCs put out heavily polarized light. A screen that retains polarization must be matched with glasses whose polarization matches. I know this from painful experience.
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post #341 of 346 Old 06-18-2018, 11:24 PM
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I just upgraded to a JVC RS520 projector and still using RS-MaxxMudd screen paint that was recommended in the DIY Screen forum for my previous projector. I was considering buying 3D glasses now but I see there's a lot of talk about screen polarization. Will 3D even work with my screen paint?
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post #342 of 346 Old 06-19-2018, 11:52 AM
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Active 3D works with any screen material. The question is : will you get any brightness boost/drop due to polarization ?
I do not know the characteristics of this projector, nor the characteristics of your DIY paint.


Just put some polarized filter in the light beam and an other in front of your eyes. Then rotate the filters, turn them around, try various combinations and see if weird things happen to the image.
Any type of polarized filter will do : you can use cheap polarized film, you can use polarized sunglasses, you can even use the disposable RealD3D glasses from cinemas.
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Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)

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post #343 of 346 Old 06-23-2018, 05:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterclones View Post
I just upgraded to a JVC RS520 projector and still using RS-MaxxMudd screen paint that was recommended in the DIY Screen forum for my previous projector. I was considering buying 3D glasses now but I see there's a lot of talk about screen polarization. Will 3D even work with my screen paint?
Since the MaxxMudd paint mix includes some silver paint and/or metal flake paint (depending on which version of the MaxxMudd mix you are using), my guess is that it will retain some of the polarization. However, as mentioned in the post above the best way to be certain as to just how much this may impact the viewed image brightness is to actually test it using polarized filters. JVC projectors have horizontal polarization while 3D LCD TVs, and many other brands of projectors, used vertical polarization, as did just about all non-JVC brand active 3D glasses. I use a gain 1.0 matte white screen with my JVC RS600 and since my screen retains virtually no polarization I'm able to use many of the RF active 3D glasses originally sold for use with LCD/LED 3D TVs. I'm current using Panasonic glasses, and also have a couple other brands still here that also work.
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post #344 of 346 Old 06-24-2018, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post
I use a gain 1.0 matte white screen with my JVC RS600 and since my screen retains virtually no polarization I'm able to use many of the RF active 3D glasses originally sold for use with LCD/LED 3D TVs.
Great to know, thanks. I haven't purchased glasses yet and was wondering IF it would even work. I guess I'll find out just HOW well it works when I buy them. At least I'm confident enough now to make the purchase.
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post #345 of 346 Old 09-12-2018, 08:46 AM
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As I'm afraid that finding a used and larger High Power 2.8 screen here in Europe (my current one is only 70' wide) will rather have characteristics of finding the proverbial needle in the haystack, I'm considering reactivating my old Draper rear projection tensioned screen.

Revisiting this thread I've not been able to read user reports regarding the pros and cons of such a setup, i.e. using a rear projection screen for 3D projection. Surely the picture must be a lot brighter than with a front projected screen, but what are the inevitable compromises that go along with such a solution?


UPDATE: Figured that out myself last night with an old Draper rear projection fabric. Strangely enough it 'absorbed' image resolution although the projector's focus was a sharp as could be, several 3D Blu-rays looked like DVDs.


I wouldn't exclude the possibility that modern rear projection fabrics are better, but would recommend actual testing.

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Last edited by Frank714; 09-26-2018 at 08:00 AM.
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post #346 of 346 Old 09-17-2018, 08:03 PM
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So if I’m understanding the posts above, you would not recommend a JVC projector for someone who is using a Vutec Silverstar screen?
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