Please help before my head explodes - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 05:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Please help before my head explodes

Fellas,
I have learned so much about so many different aspects of a/v equipment and enthusiasm with the time I have spent on AVSFORUM.
I regard the advice given here to be genuine and intelligent (and expensive.

In 2014 I stepped up to my first "real" home theater and listening equipment (all listed in my sig) I just upgraded my surrounds from the atom monitors and went from a 15" vented down firing sub to to dual 18's. I would like to continue upgrading.
I love 3d and I don't mind the glasses at all. I have blackout shades to cover every source of ambient light in the room. I am trying to figure out what (if any at this point) would make the next logical and valuable step.
I have a respectable collection of SACD's, Bluray audio, and DVD A's. My 3d bd collections is growing as well. Many times it is much cheaper to get disks from other countries with different regions and oppo plays them all.
I really like to be able to put in any disk from anywhere and have it play. I have some discretionary money to spend but just wanna put it where I will see the biggest returns and not create a bottleneck (ie...4k player 1080p tv).

It seems to me that 3D is not going anywhere fast. My (everybody's) biggest fear would be to make a huge investment in equip and have 4k 3D come out or something like that. The more I read the less I see that happening. I also don't wanna tie myself to obsolete equip and media (like I did with cd's) and end up with a room full of worthless stuff.

Given the current situation I can not decide whether or not it is worthwhile to buy a 77,80,84, or 90 tv 2016 model by sony, samsung, sharp, or LG. Coming from a calibrated vizio would the improvement be significant? Of course I do watch 2d movies as well on BD and Apple tv 4k.
Couch is about 12ft away from tv now.

The Oppo is great, but I can't help wondering if the udp-203 (If I can find one for under $900) would make sense given the rest of my set up? I question the authenticity and aggressiveness of the "2 year pledge to support and firmware upgrades" of a company that has decided to completely leave a market.
I would love to have a region free universal player so I can take advantage of the international pricing on 3d media.
Is the Cambridge audio a viable upgrade considering my system? I don't use analog connections.

Part of me says "If you like 3d you had better make a move soon" and wishes I would have 2 years ago for a tv and 6 months ago for the oppo 203 from the factory instead of the options available now.
The other part says "you enjoy what you have now, and maybe by the time something NEEDS to be replaced technology will have improved for 3d"

I just think a projector would be too complicated for me, but love the idea of 120" screen.
My room is 20.5ftx16.5 with open doorway in back left corner.

Regards,
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post #2 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 05:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Or is it too late, and I am already a dinosaur that should stop now with SACD, DVDA, bluray audio and 3d and just save up for a nice big OLED 4k and stream everything?

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Anthem MRX 510, MiniDSP 2x4HD/WI-DG
Oppo 103d, Apple TV 4K, GIK MBT Panels
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post #3 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 07:52 AM
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Well, you've got a problem. There are no (almost none) 3D TVs being sold these days. The last were 2016 models as you state. You might find one, but they are expensive. If you have a link to one that you are considering, that might help others respond. There are some that pop up on Amazon now and then. I see a few there now--2016 4K 3D TVs. Some used, some new old stock. There have been passive 3D misalignment issues with some of these TVs, so that might be why some are showing up used--make sure you can return it, but that alone will be a nightmare.

If you enjoy what you have, I'm not sure you will find the newer ones any better. Maybe the OLEDs with HDR will impress you, but it's all subjective. You can go the projector route--about the only way to get something bigger. But it's a minefield to find the right projector, and if you want to go 4K and 3D, then you are limited to only a few options like the Benq HT2550, TK800 (brighter) and the Optoma UHD51A. Best to read the forum threads for these if you are interested, but there is a learning curve.
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post #4 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Sure thing 3D Bob, I’ll link to them when I get home from work.
Duh, that was a rookie mistake...hard to determine value when you don’t have the price

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post #5 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3DBob View Post
Well, you've got a problem. There are no (almost none) 3D TVs being sold these days. The last were 2016 models as you state. You might find one, but they are expensive. If you have a link to one that you are considering, that might help others respond. There are some that pop up on Amazon now and then. I see a few there now--2016 4K 3D TVs. Some used, some new old stock. There have been passive 3D misalignment issues with some of these TVs, so that might be why some are showing up used--make sure you can return it, but that alone will be a nightmare.

If you enjoy what you have, I'm not sure you will find the newer ones any better. Maybe the OLEDs with HDR will impress you, but it's all subjective. You can go the projector route--about the only way to get something bigger. But it's a minefield to find the right projector, and if you want to go 4K and 3D, then you are limited to only a few options like the Benq HT2550, TK800 (brighter) and the Optoma UHD51A. Best to read the forum threads for these if you are interested, but there is a learning curve.
Here are a few....

http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...ml?refid=gshop


http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...ml?refid=gshop

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Samsung-UN8...nc&_dcat=11071

http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...info_137.html?

refid=gshophttp://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product/detailinfo_716.html?refid=gshop

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-XBR-84...from=R40&rt=nc



I got this message from a udp-203...I got out bid on on ebay:

eBay eBay sent this message to Chad Gelderloos (chadg1516).
Your registered name is included to show this message originated from eBay. Learn more.
Lucky you. Here's a second chance to buy the item you recently lost.
You can be sure a Second Chance Offer is legitimate when you see it in My Messages with the subject line, "You have a second chance offer". If it is not, it's fake. Do not respond to the sender or complete the transaction. Outside of eBay offers may be fraudulent and not covered by buyer protection programs. Learn more
Lucky you, Chad! The seller has offered you a second chance to buy this item. The second time can be a charm.

OPPO UDP-203 Ultra HD Blu-ray Disc Player 4K 3D High Resolution Dolby Vision
OPPO UDP-203 Ultra HD Blu-ray Disc Player 4K 3D High Resolution Dolby Vision
Current price:
$550.00
Buy It Now price:
$550.00Buy It Now
Expiration Time: Aug-03-18 17:48:37 PDT
Message from seller:
Seller:
ahmadwaahmad-0 (3)
100.0% Positive Feedback
Member since Jul-07-18 in Malaysia
View Item | Ask Seller A Question
Act now to make it yours

Vizio m801d ISF calibrated
Anthem MRX 510, MiniDSP 2x4HD/WI-DG
Oppo 103d, Apple TV 4K, GIK MBT Panels
Paradigm studio 20 v5, cc 490, 4 monitor surround 3 v7, PSA V3601 & 2 V1811

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post #6 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch-boy View Post
Or is it too late, and I am already a dinosaur that should stop now with SACD, DVDA, bluray audio and 3d and just save up for a nice big OLED 4k and stream everything?
I was pretty much in the same position you find yourself in a couple of years ago. Big 3D fan, with a large collection of SACDs, DVD-As, and Blu Rays and I wanted to upgrade only to see TV manufacturers eliminate 3D from their feature sets. I wanted to go from a 55 to an 85 inch tv which are all now UHD sets. I also have the Oppo 103 player and the 95 BDP in the home to play back all the various disc formats.

You already have an Oppo player and a nice, large 80 inch Vizio to display your 1080p and standard definition content. The question to ask yourself is whether getting an OLED UHD (with 3D) in a size that won't make you miss your Vizio, is worth the effort and considerable expense. Will 4K be worth it to you at your viewing distance? You may not see a discernible difference in resolution from 1080p unless you are sitting close enough to notice individual pixels. HDR may be the main reason to upgrade to a brand new tv set and of course, then it would be reasonable to obtain a new UHD blu ray player. However, since you already have an Oppo 103, that could be used for the SACDs, DVD-As, etc., and you could purchase a more reasonably priced UHD player from say, Panasonic for a couple hundred dollars. Just a suggestion.

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post #7 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch-boy View Post
Here are a few....

http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...ml?refid=gshop


http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...ml?refid=gshop

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Samsung-UN8...nc&_dcat=11071

http://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product...info_137.html?

refid=gshophttp://www.tvsdailydeals.com/product/detailinfo_716.html?refid=gshop

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-XBR-84...from=R40&rt=nc



I got this message from a udp-203...I got out bid on on ebay:

eBay eBay sent this message to Chad Gelderloos (chadg1516).
Your registered name is included to show this message originated from eBay. Learn more.
Lucky you. Here's a second chance to buy the item you recently lost.
You can be sure a Second Chance Offer is legitimate when you see it in My Messages with the subject line, "You have a second chance offer". If it is not, it's fake. Do not respond to the sender or complete the transaction. Outside of eBay offers may be fraudulent and not covered by buyer protection programs. Learn more
Lucky you, Chad! The seller has offered you a second chance to buy this item. The second time can be a charm.

OPPO UDP-203 Ultra HD Blu-ray Disc Player 4K 3D High Resolution Dolby Vision
OPPO UDP-203 Ultra HD Blu-ray Disc Player 4K 3D High Resolution Dolby Vision
Current price:
$550.00
Buy It Now price:
$550.00Buy It Now
Expiration Time: Aug-03-18 17:48:37 PDT
Message from seller:
Seller:
ahmadwaahmad-0 (3)
100.0% Positive Feedback
Member since Jul-07-18 in Malaysia
View Item | Ask Seller A Question
Act now to make it yours
Malaysia with (3) feedback responses. Sounds like a great price of course but make sure it plays region 1 if you're in the U.S. Are the 3 feedback responses as a seller or as a buyer?
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post #8 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 02:51 PM
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My two cents for your dilemma:

3D is a very expensive endeavor, even risky. Most of the people I know from the US have to import their 3D releases, sometimes in addition to buying the 4K. But of course you already know that.

If you have the disposable income to invest in 3D equipment and you really like it, then do it. Being able to do something you really love is a blessing.

If on the other hand you really fear for your investment, then don't do it. There's life without 3D, and who knows, maybe 3D will come stronger later at some point. There's no warranty when it comes for the future of technology. I've been hearing for quite a long time that 3D is dead. And there it is.

In the end, it's a matter of running the risk or not, and having the means to do it. I don't care for 3D nor have the means for it. So, the answer in my case is very simple.

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post #9 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 03:26 PM
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See, I told you, a couple of links will pull in the others.... Paypal has a not as represented policy so I always use them, never go direct to the dealer--just sayin'. I have a sense of "go for it, life is too short" so take that into consideration...
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post #10 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 05:18 PM
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So the daily deal links and elves and the bonanza deals in google are fakes. They don’t really have them. I’ve bought 2 on eBay and 1 on amazon recently. They come up and then sell so you have to look all the time. Don’t forget the OLED65e6p and C6p models.

But keep looking. In the past month I have bought a(nother) OLED65G6P and 2 x OLED77G6P for a project. I’m not hoarding. $3000 $11,000 $7000 respectively. The 65 on eBay with 1200 hour, the 2 77s are new but on one the sounbar is all dented up but works and the other had a 3” pretty deep scratch bottom of center screen. Looks terrible off but you cant see it when it’s on and I’ll figure a way to polish it down. They are out there.
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post #11 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 07:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks fellas.

This is what I was afraid of and did not want to believe. getting to the next (or half) level up would be a lot of money spent on a obsolete technology.
I keep reading how huge it is in Europe and Asia, and they keep coming out with 3D versions of blockbusters...Dr. Strange, Thor Rangarok, Rampage, and the Avengers.
I was hoping to find the truth here, and I did.

I just watched "Legend of the Gardians the owls of GA'HOOLE" with my 7 year old niece in the third dimension...she thought it was the coolest thing ever.
Last week I watched Lichtmond 3D and was blown away by the sound and visuals.
At $30 a pop for US new releases...I think I'll just keep what I have and when the time comes move on.

I just found out that you can stream 3D from netflix...but I only have iTunes.

As it relates to SACD and DVDA's and bluray audio:


Is this true?
I mean, that is yet another thing I really did not wanna know after the money I have spent.
The guy seems legit.

Does this mean she could not tell the difference between SACD and iTunes recording?

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post #12 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Morgus1 View Post
So the daily deal links and elves and the bonanza deals in google are fakes. They don’t really have them. I’ve bought 2 on eBay and 1 on amazon recently. They come up and then sell so you have to look all the time. Don’t forget the OLED65e6p and C6p models.

But keep looking. In the past month I have bought a(nother) OLED65G6P and 2 x OLED77G6P for a project. I’m not hoarding. $3000 $11,000 $7000 respectively. The 65 on eBay with 1200 hour, the 2 77s are new but on one the sounbar is all dented up but works and the other had a 3” pretty deep scratch bottom of center screen. Looks terrible off but you cant see it when it’s on and I’ll figure a way to polish it down. They are out there.
Those OLED77G6P's must be nice
and
Thanks, I will follow your advice.

Vizio m801d ISF calibrated
Anthem MRX 510, MiniDSP 2x4HD/WI-DG
Oppo 103d, Apple TV 4K, GIK MBT Panels
Paradigm studio 20 v5, cc 490, 4 monitor surround 3 v7, PSA V3601 & 2 V1811

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post #13 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by snpanago View Post
I was pretty much in the same position you find yourself in a couple of years ago. Big 3D fan, with a large collection of SACDs, DVD-As, and Blu Rays and I wanted to upgrade only to see TV manufacturers eliminate 3D from their feature sets. I wanted to go from a 55 to an 85 inch tv which are all now UHD sets. I also have the Oppo 103 player and the 95 BDP in the home to play back all the various disc formats.

You already have an Oppo player and a nice, large 80 inch Vizio to display your 1080p and standard definition content. The question to ask yourself is whether getting an OLED UHD (with 3D) in a size that won't make you miss your Vizio, is worth the effort and considerable expense. Will 4K be worth it to you at your viewing distance? You may not see a discernible difference in resolution from 1080p unless you are sitting close enough to notice individual pixels. HDR may be the main reason to upgrade to a brand new tv set and of course, then it would be reasonable to obtain a new UHD blu ray player. However, since you already have an Oppo 103, that could be used for the SACDs, DVD-As, etc., and you could purchase a more reasonably priced UHD player from say, Panasonic for a couple hundred dollars. Just a suggestion.
The 103 plays all region disks or is it locked on 1/A?
I do see some aftermarket kits to make them region free, and then a guy could save some money on 3d anyway.

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Anthem MRX 510, MiniDSP 2x4HD/WI-DG
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post #14 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch-boy
Is this true?
I mean, that is yet another thing I really did not wanna know after the money I have spent.
The guy seems legit.

Does this mean she could not tell the difference between SACD and iTunes recording?
The issue regarding audio quality it's a matter that has been discussed thoroughly, and there's nothing conclusive about it. Science has "proved" we cannot tell a difference, where others swear they can hear a difference. The question is, what do you think? I think I, sometimes, can hear a difference. My family or friends cannot. That's why they listen to mp3s through their phones speakers/cheap headphones, or watch movies through TV speakers, and I have invested in a HT, even if low budget.

I love my CD audio and my FLACs and my 24 bit/48khz DTS/Dolby tracks for movies. But sometimes I can live with 192 kbps mp3s, or 5.1 Dolby digital mixes. If I have a choice, I choose the best quality possible, but I don't lose my sleep about it. If you have invested a lot in audio equipment and you're happy with it, keep enjoying it.

This hobby is supposed to bring us joy, not worries. Do what you feel is best for you.
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post #15 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 08:59 PM
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Most of the audio test results I've seen, they end up no better than 50/50 whether they can tell the difference. Over 320kbps it gets pretty tough.

For getting into 3D, yeah it's expensive. Displays, content, glasses. It really comes down to how much you really love it and how much money you have to work with. For displays, I would say if you can't find anything used locally on craigslist or elsewhere or if the prices are higher than you're willing to go, I would look into going with a projector. You can still get new models.

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post #16 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Dutch-boy View Post
The 103 plays all region disks or is it locked on 1/A?
I do see some aftermarket kits to make them region free, and then a guy could save some money on 3d anyway.
I use an external modification kit to enable the player to be region free. Works great.
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post #17 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 09:42 PM
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I have gone thru so many tech changes its disgusting for a non tech human...when I think back on all my old must haves it was just cause I had money to burn and none of the crap I bought means anything today.
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post #18 of 36 Old 08-03-2018, 10:36 PM
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-SIGNATUR...from=R40&rt=nc

$18.5K. OLED 77 passive. Like new. Now or never. You won't regret it.

LG 77G6P/OPPO 203 REGION FREE
LG 65G6P/OPPO 203 REGION FREE
LG 65C6P/OPPO 203
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post #19 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 02:09 AM - Thread Starter
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-SIGNATUR...from=R40&rt=nc

$18.5K. OLED 77 passive. Like new. Now or never. You won't regret it.
Oh wow.
Thanks wildbill.
18 large for used just makes for an easy decision for me. I mean, when I do have that kinda budget for A/V It will probably go for projector and roll down screen.
I am sure that TV is beautiful and a pleasure to watch, but that is out of my league.

Is Abes of Maine legit?

https://www.abesofmaine.com/LG_OLED7...V_1031529.html


btw...how did you get your 203 region free?

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post #20 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 02:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks:

AmerCa - understood.

tomtastic - I will check every now and again for a opportunity, or wait until my TV no longer functions, or my next case of upgrade-itus becomes unmanageable and then consider PJ I guess.

snpanago - is this the one you went with? http://www.220-electronics.com/regio...ation-kit.html did you install it yourself? or this one: http://www.bluraychip.dk/product.php?id_product=31


torii - Well said, and ditto here.

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Anthem MRX 510, MiniDSP 2x4HD/WI-DG
Oppo 103d, Apple TV 4K, GIK MBT Panels
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post #21 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 02:56 AM - Thread Starter
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The issue regarding audio quality it's a matter that has been discussed thoroughly, and there's nothing conclusive about it. Science has "proved" we cannot tell a difference, where others swear they can hear a difference. The question is, what do you think? I think I, sometimes, can hear a difference. My family or friends cannot. That's why they listen to mp3s through their phones speakers/cheap headphones, or watch movies through TV speakers, and I have invested in a HT, even if low budget.

I love my CD audio and my FLACs and my 24 bit/48khz DTS/Dolby tracks for movies. But sometimes I can live with 192 kbps mp3s, or 5.1 Dolby digital mixes. If I have a choice, I choose the best quality possible, but I don't lose my sleep about it. If you have invested a lot in audio equipment and you're happy with it, keep enjoying it.

This hobby is supposed to bring us joy, not worries. Do what you feel is best for you.
Could not have said it better myself, AmerCa. I was in a place of self doubt for a while.
I also enjoy the process of finding exciting titles in multi-channel, I enjoy looking at SACD, even opening and closing them. Most of all I like the added immersion and pleasure it gives me to sit back relax and listen to what I consider the best sound possible (given my budget).

occasionally showing my system off is kinda cool too.
until you do it to someone who "just doesn't get it" lol
example: any female
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post #22 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 06:24 AM
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Check out VUDU for streaming the latest 3D movies. Search for 2D/3D for combos and 3D for just 3D. You'll find them. Price is pretty good. I have many of them in my VUDU library--you can rent and buy. I have found the streams to be excellent visually and audio-wise.
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post #23 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 07:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Check out VUDU for streaming the latest 3D movies. Search for 2D/3D for combos and 3D for just 3D. You'll find them. Price is pretty good. I have many of them in my VUDU library--you can rent and buy. I have found the streams to be excellent visually and audio-wise.
Thanks for the tip 3DBob
I will check them out when I get back home tonight 👍

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post #24 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Dutch-boy
...until you do it to someone who "just doesn't get it" lol
example: any female
Lol. This is so true that it hurts.

We all have our periods of self-doubt. But when we find something we truly love, the "truth" always prevails. I've never listened to a SACD, but I guess it must sound pretty great. You have very nice system as well! That PSA sub is legit.

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post #25 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 10:28 AM
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So this is a good deal on new 65 inch OLED LG G6P units. He has a few. I bought one here. You can use CC or Paypal

https://www.facebook.com/commerce/pr...2551037483626/
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post #26 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by 3DBob View Post
Check out VUDU for streaming the latest 3D movies. Search for 2D/3D for combos and 3D for just 3D. You'll find them. Price is pretty good. I have many of them in my VUDU library--you can rent and buy. I have found the streams to be excellent visually and audio-wise.
Man, for some reason I hadn't considered streaming 3D until your post! Thanks! Streaming 3D with some titles in Atmos (lite) is awesome! Some 3D titles I only want to watch once rather than own. Other than that, I'll continue to gladly purchase collectible 3D titles via Amazon.UK.
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post #27 of 36 Old 08-04-2018, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by snpanago View Post
Man, for some reason I hadn't considered streaming 3D until your post! Thanks! Streaming 3D with some titles in Atmos (lite) is awesome! Some 3D titles I only want to watch once rather than own. Other than that, I'll continue to gladly purchase collectible 3D titles via Amazon.UK.

My experience, exactly. In fact, VUDU sometimes has the 2D/3D available a month before the actual 3D release in US and UK, so I will download it there, and still buy the Bluray when it comes out from Amazon.UK. Best of both worlds.
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post #28 of 36 Old 08-06-2018, 11:42 AM
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Projectors do still have the ability to do 3D and you can get a picture size that no flat panel can approach. The better OLED sets will have better overall contrast and HDR, but a good projector in a well sorted room gets very close. If you can visit someone local that has a projector/4K setup do it. That will tell you whether the investment and setup needed for a projector is worth it to you.

DVDA and SACD in my experience can be improvement depending how much time was taken with the mastering and engineering. I wish there was still a niche audiophile disc format that didn't succumb to the loudness wars. I just don't have the desire to go down the vinyl rabbit hole and enjoy the multi-channel efforts some artists undertake.
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post #29 of 36 Old 08-07-2018, 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Dutch-boy View Post
Oh wow.
Thanks wildbill.
18 large for used just makes for an easy decision for me. I mean, when I do have that kinda budget for A/V It will probably go for projector and roll down screen.
I am sure that TV is beautiful and a pleasure to watch, but that is out of my league.

Is Abes of Maine legit?

https://www.abesofmaine.com/LG_OLED7...V_1031529.html


btw...how did you get your 203 region free?
Got them from Bombay Electronics. Unfortunately they sold out of these months ago.

I have not dealt with Abes of Maine, but they seem to be one of the older on-line stores. Lot of bait and switch with many of the these on-line stores. And read their return policy very carefully. Not sure you can return this tv back to them if there is a problem.

We may get some good deals on the 75 inch Sony z9d(active 3d) soon; then no more 3d flat panels.

LG 77G6P/OPPO 203 REGION FREE
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LG 65C6P/OPPO 203

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post #30 of 36 Old 08-07-2018, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Dutch-boy View Post
Oh wow.
Thanks wildbill.
18 large for used just makes for an easy decision for me. I mean, when I do have that kinda budget for A/V It will probably go for projector and roll down screen.
I am sure that TV is beautiful and a pleasure to watch, but that is out of my league.

Is Abes of Maine legit?

https://www.abesofmaine.com/LG_OLED7...V_1031529.html


btw...how did you get your 203 region free?
Make sure it's really the 2016 model that has 3D and not the 2017 model, which doesn't. Read their return policy--return in original condition, non-open box in 14 days with 15% restocking fee. If they don't accept it, they will send it back to you. Basically, if you take it out and test it, they will not accept it back. Definitely buyer beware. If you are going to spend that kind of money, you probably need to go to the store and pick it up directly. And, I'm guessing this was a display model or open box to begin with...just sayin.'
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